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UK Sikh pledges 500 million pounds to Gurdwarae in Pakistan

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5 hours ago, kcmidlands said:

I think if you're going to use your wealth to support a religious purpose then you need to show where the money's coming from, the amount of time I've seen people launder money through Gurdware is ridiculous.

 

There’s a place for people from all walks of life in our Panth.  Remember Baba Bidi Chand?  Guru Sahib never turned him away.  I’m not condoning money earned from dishonest means but if anybody wishes to share their wealth for the betterment of Sikhi then I have no problem with that.  To flip it if one earns his wealth from honest means but uses it in ways which damage the Panth is that person better than someone doing the opposite by using wealth for good causes?  Also you cannot audit the Golak as it’s open for everyone.  I understand what you are saying but I don’t think a good cause should be shot down.  Money laundering through a Gurdwara is a strict no but I think this is a charitable donation not money laundering.

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On 6/17/2019 at 5:09 AM, BhForce said:

Yeah, if someone wants to spend their own money, whatever.

But don't ask the Sangat to marble the floors of the Gurdwaras in Pakistan. I actually rather like the charm of the old-style construction.

I'd rather touch the same humble bricks which have felt sangat's charan from purataan times

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13 hours ago, TigerForce1 said:

There’s a place for people from all walks of life in our Panth.  Remember Baba Bidi Chand?  Guru Sahib never turned him away.

It's not a matter of Guru ji turning someone away. 

The question is of Guru ji accepting or not accepting someone's money if it was obtained through unacceptable means. Guru ji did turn people away in that sense.

Granted you can't police the one dollar donations in the golak.

But you're telling me that's the same thing as a 500 million pound donation? You can't police that?

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13 hours ago, TigerForce1 said:

 I understand what you are saying but I don’t think a good cause should be shot down.

That would make us (and Guru ji) the exact same as the greedy Brahmins that Gurbani denounces. The Brahmin doesn't care how you made your money. He just wants a cut of it.

13 hours ago, TigerForce1 said:

Money laundering through a Gurdwara is a strict no but I think this is a charitable donation not money laundering.

That's not what he means by money laundering. He's not talking about making a $1000 stolen cash donation (black money), and then the Gurdwara buys $750 of your merchandise from your shop. Now you have $750 of "white money" accounted for before the government. 

And the corrupt Gurdwara committee has $250 in cash plus $750 of merchandise. That's money laundering.

Rather, what he's talking about is earning a bunch of money through illicit means (even if they are legal in the country you are in, they may be against the rehit or spirit of our religion). Then you donate a huge amount of money to a Gurdwara, and you become known as the biggest Sikh on Earth.

That's what he's talking about.

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4 hours ago, BhForce said:

Rather, what he's talking about is earning a bunch of money through illicit means (even if they are legal in the country you are in, they may be against the rehit or spirit of our religion). Then you donate a huge amount of money to a Gurdwara, and you become known as the biggest Sikh on Earth.

That's what he's talking about.

Exactly, I don't care what he does with his money in his own time but if he wants to do good for Sikhi then any money that goes in the pot has to be scrutinized.

 

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7 hours ago, kcmidlands said:

Exactly, I don't care what he does with his money in his own time but if he wants to do good for Sikhi then any money that goes in the pot has to be scrutinized.

 

Harry Baweja had a dream from his early days in film making that he wished to make a movie to tell the story of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s ‘Chaar Sahibzade’ to the audience in India and the wider diaspora.  He took his project to many Producers but was knocked back by all them and was discouraged from making the movie which they said was too risky to finance.  After numerous setbacks Harry Baweja took the project to ‘Ponty Chada’ a well known smuggler in Punjab.  Ponty Chada agreed to finance the Movie without hesitation as he felt this would be a great Seva to his Faith and single handily put up the cash.

 

I have given this example to show that good things can be achieved when we put our prejudices aside work together as a community for the betterment of our Panth.  

 

 

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12 minutes ago, TigerForce1 said:

Harry Baweja had a dream from his early days in film making that he wished to make a movie to tell the story of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s ‘Chaar Sahibzade’ to the audience in India and the wider diaspora.  He took his project to many Producers but was knocked back by all them and was discouraged from making the movie which they said was too risky to finance.  After numerous setbacks Harry Baweja took the project to ‘Ponty Chada’ a well known smuggler in Punjab.  Ponty Chada agreed to finance the Movie without hesitation as he felt this would be a great Seva to his Faith and single handily put up the cash.

I have given this example to show that good things can be achieved when we put our prejudices aside work together as a community for the betterment of our Panth.  

I've come to realise the black and white outlook some Sikhs cling to actually places us at a disadvantage. I'm not advocating criminality and the ends justify the means, but a little cut-throat savvy isn't necessarily a bad thing when concerned with furthering a good cause.

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15 hours ago, TigerForce1 said:

Harry Baweja had a dream from his early days in film making that he wished to make a movie to tell the story of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s ‘Chaar Sahibzade’ to the audience in India and the wider diaspora.  He took his project to many Producers but was knocked back by all them and was discouraged from making the movie which they said was too risky to finance.  After numerous setbacks Harry Baweja took the project to ‘Ponty Chada’ a well known smuggler in Punjab.  Ponty Chada agreed to finance the Movie without hesitation as he felt this would be a great Seva to his Faith and single handily put up the cash.

 

I have given this example to show that good things can be achieved when we put our prejudices aside work together as a community for the betterment of our Panth.  

 

 

It doesn't make it right though, using your dodgy money to fund a religious venture (be it a film or something else) with the hope that you'll be absolved for your sin's under the guise of seva that is.

The thing is sometimes when people do this it can come back and do more damage to them and more importantly the cause they gave the money to. Mine is a personal opinion, stuff like this doesn't sit well with me, for other's it may be more palatable.

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4 hours ago, kcmidlands said:

It doesn't make it right though, using your dodgy money to fund a religious venture (be it a film or something else) with the hope that you'll be absolved for your sin's under the guise of seva that is.

The thing is sometimes when people do this it can come back and do more damage to them and more importantly the cause they gave the money to. Mine is a personal opinion, stuff like this doesn't sit well with me, for other's it may be more palatable.

Guru Nanak Dev ji  told the qazis at Mecca that they shoul not accept war booty/proceeds of paap to cleanse it for the muslim invaders as it does not please Allah . It used to be the practice of such raiders to send a percentage to make the rest halal instead of haram .

Thinking on it never in our history have we accepted donations of dubious means for our gurdwarey because our daswand/bheta has to be from kirit di kamai, that's why we can say without doubt that the bakwas that bahmin are saying abour darshani deor are looted from one of the mandirs in jaganath is laughable

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