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Why do we cremate?


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Best to let the dead go. Remembrance, shrines, whatever, it's not good for those left behind and the departed. It's a form of attachment. There's nothing wrong with looking back on happier times with affection for a loved one who's passed, but anything more is not recommended. I think the Dharmic cultures have it correct on this one. 

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Guest GuestSingh
5 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

Best to let the dead go. Remembrance, shrines, whatever, it's not good for those left behind and the departed. It's a form of attachment. There's nothing wrong with looking back on happier times with affection for a loved one who's passed, but anything more is not recommended. I think the Dharmic cultures have it correct on this one. 

its interesting how panjabi culture in certain aspects seems to do the complete opposite i.e. jagga in the pind.

have read how sum r in the same place as sri guru granth sahib ji.

who do these ppl worship then? their loved one or their true guru?

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20 minutes ago, GuestSingh said:

its interesting how panjabi culture in certain aspects seems to do the complete opposite i.e. jagga in the pind.

have read how sum r in the same place as sri guru granth sahib ji.

who do these ppl worship then? their loved one or their true guru?

People do whatever it is they feel like doing. In all cultures and religions regardless of geography, the disparity between what people say and present to others compared to what they actually believe and do is significant. Put it this way: the contemporaries of Guru Sahibs didn't miraculously see the light and change their ways just coz. Only a relative minority were fortunate enough to cut through the nonsense and realise what was going on. Most didn't realise that truth for themselves but instead took someone else's word as enough to adjust their beliefs for a short while. Others continued doing what they always did according to their pre-existing beliefs and cultural norms because they were afraid of abandoning beliefs that had followed by their ancestors for hundreds or even thousands of years.

Now that hundreds of years have passed since the physical lifetimes of Guru Sahibs, there's obviously going to be a further degradation of the immediacy and urgency of those beliefs; that's not a reflection on the inherent message contained within those beliefs but more of a statement on human nature. Most people revert to their default ancestral or cultural norms if the current belief system itself -- and its most orthodox adjerents -- do not enforce those values and beliefs constantly and consistently. We are creatures of habit after all. This is even more applicable to the practice of religion. The masses can't be trusted or left to their own volition in certain regards, because they either eventually discard those practices through laziness, apathy, or general disinterest, or a competing belief system emerges (or re-emerges) to challenge and compete for attention. That's why I believe an excessive doctrine of tolerance and acceptance of competing belief systems is not of benefit to the Sikh religion. Billion-strong faiths can harp on about interfaith dialogue and bridge-building because they have the luxury of numbers on their side. A religion such as ours that is layered in its beliefs and practices according to the respective rate of spiritual progress of its followers is always going to be "punching up" against naturally "predatory" and longer-established faiths, especially if those religions are backed up, however loosely, by social and political means.

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11 hours ago, AjeetSingh2019 said:

I have always thought abrahamic religions like muslim/christian/jewish have a benefit over us in this sense, because atleast on superficial level , they can visit their dead loved ones by visiting the grave and feeling their dead ones are still with them. 

In Punjab, people still have a concept of 'mitti kaddna' , wherein your surname will have some random samadh which no one surely knows of LOL in some remote part of some farm in punjab and you go there and pull some soil and put some sweets . What utter rubbish I witnessed as a ritual next day after my marriage. And ofcourse , brahmin women still leading our wedding rituals. What was the point of sikhism when the vast majority of people in punjab still continue to live in such utter ignorance, but this is topic for other thread

There's probably more worms and maggots under the grave than your actual loved one. 

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Like mentioned above many punjabis have a jaggah/tomb built for their ancestors. And they worship it. 

Both side of my families have this! They treat it like a living person. Like I winter they spread thick blankets on the floor and they leave wedding invitions there etc. 

I guess this was how some punjabis worshipped before they came into sikhi buy still continued it.  

These places are no different to the muslim dargahs in India. 

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Guest GuestSingh
9 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

People do whatever it is they feel like doing. In all cultures and religions regardless of geography, the disparity between what people say and present to others compared to what they actually believe and do is significant. Put it this way: the contemporaries of Guru Sahibs didn't miraculously see the light and change their ways just coz. Only a relative minority were fortunate enough to cut through the nonsense and realise what was going on. Most didn't realise that truth for themselves but instead took someone else's word as enough to adjust their beliefs for a short while. Others continued doing what they always did according to their pre-existing beliefs and cultural norms because they were afraid of abandoning beliefs that had followed by their ancestors for hundreds or even thousands of years.

u knw it makes u wonder how many sikhs born abroad in the western diasporas actually make the conscious effort or even consider thinking about changing or somehow reprogramming the primary western mindset to a more sikhi-oriented/traditional eastern-thinking one?

n how many r happy to jus keep or revert to their 'go-to' on autopilot in public, at work etc. cuz its easier or cuz its not important for sikhi wen the truth is either little to no time has been spent contemplating the idea or so it doesnt conflict wiv wat weve been bombarded wiv n forced to believe is the only true, righteous n superior way to live in the world.

we already knw wat most of em pick but its a missed opportunity to not suggest it to someone who might actually be capable of making the change themselves for the better.

y is this important? cuz trying to think like a traditional sikh can help u spot certain mistakes in others i.e. amritdharis so wen u mention it to em u strengthen their sikhi in some way. theyre not big faults but little flaws tht help keeps the identity n image more intact.

9 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

Now that hundreds of years have passed since the physical lifetimes of Guru Sahibs, there's obviously going to be a further degradation of the immediacy and urgency of those beliefs; that's not a reflection on the inherent message contained within those beliefs but more of a statement on human nature. Most people revert to their default ancestral or cultural norms if the current belief system itself -- and its most orthodox adjerents -- do not enforce those values and beliefs constantly and consistently. We are creatures of habit after all. This is even more applicable to the practice of religion. The masses can't be trusted or left to their own volition in certain regards, because they either eventually discard those practices through laziness, apathy, or general disinterest, or a competing belief system emerges (or re-emerges) to challenge and compete for attention. That's why I believe an excessive doctrine of tolerance and acceptance of competing belief systems is not of benefit to the Sikh religion. Billion-strong faiths can harp on about interfaith dialogue and bridge-building because they have the luxury of numbers on their side. A religion such as ours that is layered in its beliefs and practices according to the respective rate of spiritual progress of its followers is always going to be "punching up" against naturally "predatory" and longer-established faiths, especially if those religions are backed up, however loosely, by social and political means.

this is y our true numbers will always fluctuate n not actually increase as so many of our lot like to fantasize about.

too many divides, too many 'rules', too many distractions, too many weaknesses, too many precedents etc.

wat ultimately defines us will keep changing for the worse.

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47 minutes ago, GuestSingh said:

u knw it makes u wonder how many sikhs born abroad in the western diasporas actually make the conscious effort or even consider thinking about changing or somehow reprogramming the primary western mindset to a more sikhi-oriented/traditional eastern-thinking one?

n how many r happy to jus keep or revert to their 'go-to' on autopilot in public, at work etc. cuz its easier or cuz its not important for sikhi wen the truth is either little to no time has been spent contemplating the idea or so it doesnt conflict wiv wat weve been bombarded wiv n forced to believe is the only true, righteous n superior way to live in the world.

we already knw wat most of em pick but its a missed opportunity to not suggest it to someone who might actually be capable of making the change themselves for the better.

y is this important? cuz trying to think like a traditional sikh can help u spot certain mistakes in others i.e. amritdharis so wen u mention it to em u strengthen their sikhi in some way. theyre not big faults but little flaws tht help keeps the identity n image more intact.

One of the major problems in the Sikh mindset (whether abroad or back in India) is the perception behind the meaning of being "close" to God. In our people the primary concern for being a loyal follower of religion is the potential for material reward and physical advancement on Earth; the long-term spiritual aspect of it is only really appreciated by a small faction, and even then the propensity for that understanding to strike at the true heart of those many mysteries of existence is barely discovered by anyone but the blessed few. 

 

 

 

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15 hours ago, AjeetSingh2019 said:

I have always thought abrahamic religions like muslim/christian/jewish have a benefit over us in this sense, because atleast on superficial level , they can visit their dead loved ones by visiting the grave and feeling their dead ones are still with them. 

In Punjab, people still have a concept of 'mitti kaddna' , wherein your surname will have some random samadh which no one surely knows of LOL in some remote part of some farm in punjab and you go there and pull some soil and put some sweets . What utter rubbish I witnessed as a ritual next day after my marriage. And ofcourse , brahmin women still leading our wedding rituals. What was the point of sikhism when the vast majority of people in punjab still continue to live in such utter ignorance, but this is topic for other thread

You still want others to believe that you got married to a woman.  You are pathetic.   You are nothing but a drama queen.  What part of the western world do you live in that you are able to use public assistance programs to sit on your but all day on this forum?  

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Cremation in a general place where others cremation happen is the way to go.  This will not allow the worship of cremation grounds of one particular person because many others have been cremated there.  However this is not possible in india because people cremate close by.  You cant fix the whole world.  Focus on your soul and see a life without Naam is sure death.  Many saints stay quiet doing naam simran because that is there hukam from Guru Sahib. Every human beings job is to do naam simran.   Some hear this call and dive into the ocean of Gurbani.   Some hear this call and continue on preaching their manmat like satpal Singh from Nanak naam and many others like him.  The pandits also wore religious robes and gave religious discourses.   But they sunk wearing religious robes.  Following preachers like satpal Singh will also drag you into hell.  There is only one way out of the cremation grounds and graveyards.   Follow Gurbani and the boat will carry you across. Why remember the dead.  They have joined the worms and the dirt.  Their soul maybe in hell being tormented.  Do you think they are remembering you as they are tortured?  They are worrying about their own but.  The one who feeds you and created you.  He is to be remembered.  

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1 hour ago, Akalifauj said:

You still want others to believe that you got married to a woman.  You are pathetic.   You are nothing but a drama queen.  What part of the western world do you live in that you are able to use public assistance programs to sit on your but all day on this forum?  

we indians don't live off govt paychecks unlike u lazy slob westerners. 

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