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Throwing flowers on wedding


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i absolutely hate that     how can they throw flowers over irrelevant mortals in the presence of Guru sahib      this really drives me up the wall     this is why i dnt go to weddings anymore   because i know i will get frustrated because of these fckrs     bet you its the females that came up with this idea    

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This tradition was fairly common back in the day but more or less fizzled out at some point. I believe it carried over from when people used to get married with Bedi, which is actually how many Sikhs conducted marriages until the modern day Anand Kaaraj was formalised.

Marriages were not actually performed on a large scale in front of SGGSJ, if at all - there was no mass printing of Saroops and obviously wasn't a large number of handwritten Saroops either.

I'm pretty sure they were still performed with a fire even after Guru Ram Dass Ji composed Laavan. Prior to that people still went to Pandits.

I read a Sakhi attached to Laavan Bani in which a poor Sikh wanted to arrange a wedding but he didn't have enough money to pay for the services of the Pandit. So he went to Guru Sahib and related his issue after which the Laavan were composed, and Guru Sahib said to the Sikh you will no longer have to rely on Pandits and pay any fees.

Which is ironic because Anand Kaaraj today costs like £5-600 lmao. But also this Sakhi sheds some light on how people used to get married and one can also deduce they still continued to use fire.

Of course people find this all very hard to accept, like they do with much of our history.

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2 hours ago, puzzled said:

i absolutely hate that     how can they throw flowers over irrelevant mortals in the presence of Guru sahib      this really drives me up the wall     this is why i dnt go to weddings anymore   because i know i will get frustrated because of these fckrs     bet you its the females that came up with this idea    

why do you have to always blame the girls? the men are equally as stupid for allowing this to happen, regardless of who's idea it is. on top of this, it's on a beach and they has a kund/ghoonghat infront of maharaj. blood joke. should have just had a hindu wedding. 

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17 hours ago, MrDoaba said:

This tradition was fairly common back in the day but more or less fizzled out at some point. I believe it carried over from when people used to get married with Bedi, which is actually how many Sikhs conducted marriages until the modern day Anand Kaaraj was formalised.

Marriages were not actually performed on a large scale in front of SGGSJ, if at all - there was no mass printing of Saroops and obviously wasn't a large number of handwritten Saroops either.

I'm pretty sure they were still performed with a fire even after Guru Ram Dass Ji composed Laavan. Prior to that people still went to Pandits.

I read a Sakhi attached to Laavan Bani in which a poor Sikh wanted to arrange a wedding but he didn't have enough money to pay for the services of the Pandit. So he went to Guru Sahib and related his issue after which the Laavan were composed, and Guru Sahib said to the Sikh you will no longer have to rely on Pandits and pay any fees.

Which is ironic because Anand Kaaraj today costs like £5-600 lmao. But also this Sakhi sheds some light on how people used to get married and one can also deduce they still continued to use fire.

Of course people find this all very hard to accept, like they do with much of our history.

so are you suggesting that circumambulations around fire and 'hindu type' weddings actually happened till very late into sikh history ?

and who used to come to perform the wedding ? pandit or granthi ? and what did they recite when the couple moved around fire ? soohi mehalla 4 or Rig vedic verses of marriage ,or both ? 

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18 hours ago, MrDoaba said:

This tradition was fairly common back in the day but more or less fizzled out at some point. I believe it carried over from when people used to get married with Bedi, which is actually how many Sikhs conducted marriages until the modern day Anand Kaaraj was formalised.

Marriages were not actually performed on a large scale in front of SGGSJ, if at all - there was no mass printing of Saroops and obviously wasn't a large number of handwritten Saroops either.

I'm pretty sure they were still performed with a fire even after Guru Ram Dass Ji composed Laavan. Prior to that people still went to Pandits.

I read a Sakhi attached to Laavan Bani in which a poor Sikh wanted to arrange a wedding but he didn't have enough money to pay for the services of the Pandit. So he went to Guru Sahib and related his issue after which the Laavan were composed, and Guru Sahib said to the Sikh you will no longer have to rely on Pandits and pay any fees.

Which is ironic because Anand Kaaraj today costs like £5-600 lmao. But also this Sakhi sheds some light on how people used to get married and one can also deduce they still continued to use fire.

Of course people find this all very hard to accept, like they do with much of our history.

Nothing to say Gursikhs can't do marriages at home in a gursikh's home  who has Guru ji parkash  , no fees, and no fanfare  just simple anand karaj in Sangat. That's how I had my Mangni in Guru ji's presence at a Guru ji's presence .

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56 minutes ago, AjeetSingh2019 said:

so are you suggesting that circumambulations around fire and 'hindu type' weddings actually happened till very late into sikh history ?

and who used to come to perform the wedding ? pandit or granthi ? and what did they recite when the couple moved around fire ? soohi mehalla 4 or Rig vedic verses of marriage ,or both ? 

Agni phere were discarded by Guru ji when Anand Karaj was introduced , I would find it credible if Early Singhs did parkash of shastars in place of Guru Granth Sahib ji to which they did matha tek , if would be feasible that they would read Anand Karaj  in same way , when not in area with did not have a Darbar nearby.

The dehdhari Gurus of Namdhari mat do phere of agni devta ....and that is where they differ to standard Sikhs in terms of Anand Karaj maryada .

 

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54 minutes ago, AjeetSingh2019 said:

so are you suggesting that circumambulations around fire and 'hindu type' weddings actually happened till very late into sikh history ?

and who used to come to perform the wedding ? pandit or granthi ? and what did they recite when the couple moved around fire ? soohi mehalla 4 or Rig vedic verses of marriage ,or both ? 

Please don't get in a tizzy lol. I'm not saying Sikhs are Hindu, or that we should change Anand Kaaraj etc. It's just perspective.

Yes I'm suggesting, and telling.

Pre-Laavan Bani - according to the Sakhi people went to Pandits, we can assume this would've been the Vedic ceremony.

Post-Laavan Bani - I used the word "deduce" specifically because one can come to the logical conclusion that fire remained but the hymns changed. The sakhi alludes to just Sangat performing the whole ceremony themselves, without the service of any Pandit or Granthi.

Later in Sikh history - there was lack of Sikhi so many people simply got married by the Vedic ceremony. If your grandparents are around or some bazurg ask them. It's highly probable someone in your own family got married this way. This is a well known fact. Some of my great-grandparents got married this way but they were still Sikh.

Further in Sikhi history - Mass printing of Saroops began, certain traditions were changed and formalised. I believe Anand Karaj as we know it today was created by Nirankaris (not the manmukh sect, the old ones). Now phere are done around SGGSJ. This is the current system and it works fine. I am not proposing we change it, but the history is still interesting nonetheless.

 

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5 minutes ago, MrDoaba said:

Please don't get in a tizzy lol. I'm not saying Sikhs are Hindu, or that we should change Anand Kaaraj etc. It's just perspective.

Yes I'm suggesting, and telling.

Pre-Laavan Bani - according to the Sakhi people went to Pandits, we can assume this would've been the Vedic ceremony.

Post-Laavan Bani - I used the word "deduce" specifically because one can come to the logical conclusion that fire remained but the hymns changed. The sakhi alludes to just Sangat performing the whole ceremony themselves, without the service of any Pandit or Granthi.

Later in Sikh history - there was lack of Sikhi so many people simply got married by the Vedic ceremony. If your grandparents are around or some bazurg ask them. It's highly probable someone in your own family got married this way. This is a well known fact. Some of my great-grandparents got married this way but they were still Sikh.

Further in Sikhi history - Mass printing of Saroops began, certain traditions were changed and formalised. I believe Anand Karaj as we know it today was created by Nirankaris (not the manmukh sect, the old ones). Now phere are done around SGGSJ. This is the current system and it works fine. I am not proposing we change it, but the history is still interesting nonetheless.

 

older sikhs wouldn't do lav around Guru ji just stand to hear reading and singing of Anand Karaj , I could imagine sangati roop reading singing of the Gurbani would be considered same as being in presence of Guru ji blessings wise .

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19 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

Nothing to say Gursikhs can't do marriages at home in a gursikh's home  who has Guru ji parkash  , no fees, and no fanfare  just simple anand karaj in Sangat. That's how I had my Mangni in Guru ji's presence at a Guru ji's presence .

I'm not suggesting the contrary, just speaking from a historical perspective. I'm personally in favour of simple weddings.

12 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

Agni phere were discarded by Guru ji when Anand Karaj was introduced , I would find it credible if Early Singhs did parkash of shastars in place of Guru Granth Sahib ji to which they did matha tek , if would be feasible that they would read Anand Karaj  in same way , when not in area with did not have a Darbar nearby.

The dehdhari Gurus of Namdhari mat do phere of agni devta ....and that is where they differ to standard Sikhs in terms of Anand Karaj maryada .

Shastar Maryada was not around till far later and you know this yourself. There is no suggestion of what you're saying.

See why does it have to be "Agni Devta"? I don't think Namdharis actually believe in Agni Devta lol. It's just a fire. Again from what I've heard when the the current Anand Kaaraj was being formalised, Namdharis had representation. They just decided to retain the fire.

One is left wondering why Namdharis don't do phere of their Baba or his picture.

FYI for the most part, Namdhari Maryada is actually very similar to Hazoor Sahib; very strict. Not excusing their other beliefs however.

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older sikhs wouldn't do lav around Guru ji just stand to hear reading and singing of Anand Karaj , I could imagine sangati roop reading singing of the Gurbani would be considered same as being in presence of Guru ji blessings wise .

Perhaps. I've heard this being the case as well. But again it makes you wonder why four Laavs if one is just to stand.

 

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