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Big_Tera

Funny incident - Black Christian

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I was recently at a Sikh event. Where I handed out some basic of Sikhi leaflets afterwards that I had on me.  

Most people were more then happy to take the leaflets. I even had a good chat with a white gentlemen. Who was knowledgeable about Sikhism and Sikhs. Apart from one ignorant black American Christian woman. Who approached me and said some abnocious things. 

She first asked me what Sikhs believe in. I said I have limited knowledge and she should go on the basic of Sikhi website to find out more. I was not there to preach or teach as that is something that a qualified person can do. Hence I was just handing out the leaflets. So even though I had a lot of knowledge I did not think it was worth it and was something that basics of Sikhi parchaar team can do. 

Anyways after she inquired more and seemed quite interested and wanted to know more. I said Sikhs believe we all believe in the same God. But we just have a different way of praying. I said Sikhs believe all faiths lead to God. She then said. One faith has to be right. They can't all be? She seemed aware of belief that many Sikhs hold that all paths lead to God. 

I was not really out there to get into some long debate. As I was just handing leaflets out as a bit of seva. I then said Sikhs don't believe in converting. This leaflet is just about explaining Sikh beliefs and raising awareness of Sikhs ect. I said Sikhs believe their religion is true and we should let all people believe in what they like and not be discriminated against. To which she seemed to agree. She then finished off by saying Christianity is the only true religion and can only lead God. 

I just said okay if that is your opinion and laughed at her comment in a sarcastic way.  I did not bother to reply to what she said or argue. As people like this are not worth engaging in conversation with. 

But now I think maybe I should of said something back. She did take the leaflet though and said she would have a read.

I was taken aback however with what she said. Was not expecting someone to come out with that and say such extreme things over a leaflet. It seemed like she was insecure and needed to reaafirm her beliefs. 

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On 2/8/2020 at 1:03 PM, Big_Tera said:

I said Sikhs believe all faiths lead to God. She then said. One faith has to be right. They can't all be? She seemed aware of belief that many Sikhs hold that all paths lead to God. 

She was being sly, by implying that our faith specifically and all others are wrong and only hers is right but she wouldn't come and say that directly to your face.She wants to you come to realize that for yourself. It sounds like some passive agressive <banned word filter activated>. She didnt come there to learn something new it sounds like.She made her statement and left it in the open for all around to hear. She's basically saying "I believe this" and your belief doesnt match mine, so what's wrong with your belief. She was there to undermine our faith. You could've responded in some way like :

Well if one faith has to be absolutely right then it is ours. Then come up with some examples from her own religion to really throw her off.

1. Christ said on the cross according to the bible that My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” (Matthew 27:46, KJV)

 

In comparison our 5th Guru read the following shabad when they were giving shaheedi: 

ਤੇਰਾ ਕੀਆ ਮੀਠਾ ਲਾਗੈ ॥

Your actions seem so sweet to me.

 ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਦਾਰਥੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਮਾਂਗੈ ॥੨॥੪੨॥੯੩॥

Nanak begs for the treasure of the Naam, the Name of the Lord.

You could also bring up 10 patshah doing ucharan of mittar pyare nu after fighting nonstop for days and watching their sons and beloved sikhs at chamkaur sahib give shaheedi.

Then you could bring up things that makes sikhi so much more complete than christainity.

examples

1. No avtar,prophet has sacrificed their whole family like 10th patshah

Abraham who is like a patriach figure for christainity, judaism and islam.

God asked Abraham to sacrifice his own son for him through akash bani, but at the last moment with knife in hand to his own son's threat he backed out. He couldn't do it.  Only 10th patshah was able to send his own sons into battle by giving them permission when they asked.

2. No avtar prophet has given themselves for shaheedi for the sake of saving another religion like 9th patshah/

3. 200+ years of history where God himself lived in form of human body through every experience common to us today, so we could look back and learn directly from them and their lessons through history. Whereas Jesus lived for 30 years and so the time frame is shorter.

You could've went on and on and kept going deeper and deeper into sikhi, if she wouldn't interrupt you at every word or leave first.   

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OP - you handled that situation with grace, respect to you for that.

In terms of "giving an answer", this involves knowing your own religion (which I'm sure you do), but also knowing their religion and (unfortunately) poking holes in it.

Studying a philosophy/religion/spiritual path with the sole intention of finding its faults is a fruitless waist of time and gives you no peace. However, studying with the intention to find similarities and understand differences gives a greater reward (speaking from experience).

The thing about giving someone like that an answer is you first need to know what denomination of christianity she follows. If she's one of the outliers (LDS, 7th day Adventist etc.) then it's easy to put her down. But if she's a hardcore Baptist (or even a Methodist), then it requires more homework on your part ("knowing your Bible", so to speak). And from what you've described, chances are she's a Baptist. 

Ultimately, it will end the same way i.e. neither of you will change your faith. But with a little homework, the next time something like this happens, you'll be ready with an answer or two (if needed).

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On 2/11/2020 at 11:05 PM, DarshaPyasi1984 said:

 

She was being sly, by implying that our faith specifically and all others are wrong and only hers is right but she wouldn't come and say that directly to your face.She wants to you come to realize that for yourself. It sounds like some passive agressive <banned word filter activated>. She didnt come there to learn something new it sounds like.She made her statement and left it in the open for all around to hear. She's basically saying "I believe this" and your belief doesnt match mine, so what's wrong with your belief. She was there to undermine our faith. You could've responded in some way like :

Well if one faith has to be absolutely right then it is ours. Then come up with some examples from her own religion to really throw her off.

1. Christ said on the cross according to the bible that My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” (Matthew 27:46, KJV)

 

In comparison our 5th Guru read the following shabad when they were giving shaheedi: 

ਤੇਰਾ ਕੀਆ ਮੀਠਾ ਲਾਗੈ ॥

Your actions seem so sweet to me.

 ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਦਾਰਥੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਮਾਂਗੈ ॥੨॥੪੨॥੯੩॥

Nanak begs for the treasure of the Naam, the Name of the Lord.

You could also bring up 10 patshah doing ucharan of mittar pyare nu after fighting nonstop for days and watching their sons and beloved sikhs at chamkaur sahib give shaheedi.

Then you could bring up things that makes sikhi so much more complete than christainity.

examples

1. No avtar,prophet has sacrificed their whole family like 10th patshah

Abraham who is like a patriach figure for christainity, judaism and islam.

God asked Abraham to sacrifice his own son for him through akash bani, but at the last moment with knife in hand to his own son's threat he backed out. He couldn't do it.  Only 10th patshah was able to send his own sons into battle by giving them permission when they asked.

2. No avtar prophet has given themselves for shaheedi for the sake of saving another religion like 9th patshah/

3. 200+ years of history where God himself lived in form of human body through every experience common to us today, so we could look back and learn directly from them and their lessons through history. Whereas Jesus lived for 30 years and so the time frame is shorter.

You could've went on and on and kept going deeper and deeper into sikhi, if she wouldn't interrupt you at every word or leave first.   

Yep that was her intention. To undermine other faiths and say that Chrsitians believe theirs is the only way. While at the same time trying to say all other faiths are wrong. Chrsitians are taught that theirs is the only way to salvation ect. She came across as though she was almost upset that Sikhs were handing out leaflets. As though that is something christians only have a right to do and Sikhs should not do it.I think she so it as a threat against her own faith.

She was suprised to see a Sikh leaflet as that is something that we never do. I regret not saying anything back to point out issues with her own faith. But As Sikhs that is something we are taught not to do. Also I should not have said all faiths lead to God? As makes out Sikhs believe in everthing and anything.

 

 

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On 2/11/2020 at 11:05 PM, DarshaPyasi1984 said:

 

She was being sly, by implying that our faith specifically and all others are wrong and only hers is right but she wouldn't come and say that directly to your face.She wants to you come to realize that for yourself. It sounds like some passive agressive <banned word filter activated>. She didnt come there to learn something new it sounds like.She made her statement and left it in the open for all around to hear. She's basically saying "I believe this" and your belief doesnt match mine, so what's wrong with your belief. She was there to undermine our faith. You could've responded in some way like :

Well if one faith has to be absolutely right then it is ours. Then come up with some examples from her own religion to really throw her off.

1. Christ said on the cross according to the bible that My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” (Matthew 27:46, KJV)

 

In comparison our 5th Guru read the following shabad when they were giving shaheedi: 

ਤੇਰਾ ਕੀਆ ਮੀਠਾ ਲਾਗੈ ॥

Your actions seem so sweet to me.

 ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਦਾਰਥੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਮਾਂਗੈ ॥੨॥੪੨॥੯੩॥

Nanak begs for the treasure of the Naam, the Name of the Lord.

You could also bring up 10 patshah doing ucharan of mittar pyare nu after fighting nonstop for days and watching their sons and beloved sikhs at chamkaur sahib give shaheedi.

Then you could bring up things that makes sikhi so much more complete than christainity.

examples

1. No avtar,prophet has sacrificed their whole family like 10th patshah

Abraham who is like a patriach figure for christainity, judaism and islam.

God asked Abraham to sacrifice his own son for him through akash bani, but at the last moment with knife in hand to his own son's threat he backed out. He couldn't do it.  Only 10th patshah was able to send his own sons into battle by giving them permission when they asked.

2. No avtar prophet has given themselves for shaheedi for the sake of saving another religion like 9th patshah/

3. 200+ years of history where God himself lived in form of human body through every experience common to us today, so we could look back and learn directly from them and their lessons through history. Whereas Jesus lived for 30 years and so the time frame is shorter.

You could've went on and on and kept going deeper and deeper into sikhi, if she wouldn't interrupt you at every word or leave first.   

I'm sure there are plenty of things I could have mentioned to criticise her faith of Christianity such as what you mentioned. But that is something I did not feel comfortable doing as that is not what Sikhs are rightfully told not to do. 

It was a catch 22 situation. If I would criticise her faith or come up with reasons why her faith is wrong this could give the wrong impression of Sikhs. So was not sure how to react and respond to her comments. To be honest I was also not prepared to get into a religious debate as I have not done this before. 

Sad thing is that there's certain people of other faiths that will try and say their faith is the only way to try and slyly convert others. She took my comment and tried to use it against us that Sikhs believe all faiths lead to God. 

Anyways. I hope I did good and had a great response from most people who I gave leaflets to. So not worried about this <banned word filter activated>. lol

I think she was just jealous and full of hate to see non Christian parchaar on the streets of London. She was not even British but some nutcase American who thought she would stick her nose where it did not belong. 

It's to be expected that your gonna get haters like this out there who are envious of Sikh growth in the UK.

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On 2/12/2020 at 7:33 AM, Koi said:

OP - you handled that situation with grace, respect to you for that.

In terms of "giving an answer", this involves knowing your own religion (which I'm sure you do), but also knowing their religion and (unfortunately) poking holes in it.

Studying a philosophy/religion/spiritual path with the sole intention of finding its faults is a fruitless waist of time and gives you no peace. However, studying with the intention to find similarities and understand differences gives a greater reward (speaking from experience).

The thing about giving someone like that an answer is you first need to know what denomination of christianity she follows. If she's one of the outliers (LDS, 7th day Adventist etc.) then it's easy to put her down. But if she's a hardcore Baptist (or even a Methodist), then it requires more homework on your part ("knowing your Bible", so to speak). And from what you've described, chances are she's a Baptist. 

Ultimately, it will end the same way i.e. neither of you will change your faith. But with a little homework, the next time something like this happens, you'll be ready with an answer or two (if needed).

Truesay.

I did try to handle it as best as I could even though she came out with her BS. I could have easily have refuted her statements.But the thing is I did not go to argue and try and disprove other faiths. That is something that we don't really do. 

It's more about focusing on the good aspects of Sikhi and raising awareness of the faith. But she took it as if I am trying to convert others which is wrong. Sikhism is only about teaching. If people want to convert off their own volition that is up to them. 

But it's comments like hers that just p1ss you off. I do feel a bit guilty as now I feel I should have said something back instead of just brushing of her comment. I should have really confronted her and told her that is narrow minded ignorant belief she has. 

She was a little specky woman that obviously come from the black Americanised christian denominations. 

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