The Future of Langar after Coronavirus - things will never be the same again

[Premi5]

On 3/19/2020 at 3:41 PM, Guest London jwaan said:

ur source.

 This is a retired Gp talking utter bukwaas. Comparisons with the flu are idiotic for many reasons 1) no one yet knows how many people will die from the corona virus 2) with corona virus People’s breathing becomes massively impaired with a significant population requiring ventilators to breathe. And as for talk of falling down the stairs as a comparable, y.....

 The fact of the matter is, if you’re interested in medicine that’s great. go to medical school and learn about pharmacology, physiology, anatomy and the rest. If you can’t get in well frankly you should have worked harder in school.

 But refrain from *DELETED* of polluting this forum with irresponsible “advice” from your google enabled medical knowledge trying to brainwash people to gamble with their health because of your *DELETED* conspiracy theories. It’s not only *DELETED* but potentially very dangerous.

*DELETED*

 Lastly, dismissing a global pandemic as a vitamin deficiency is so disrespectful of the people who were dying. How would you like it if Italians described 1984 riots as a “mild disagreement”?

It’s extremely difficult to get place to study medicine. There are always plenty who get good enough grades who cannot get a place

[Guest London jwaan]

13 hours ago, Premi5 said:

It’s extremely difficult to get place to study medicine. There are always plenty who get good enough grades who cannot get a place

Sure I don’t disagree. 
but that doesn’t mean the ones who didn’t get in should start “treating” “patients” with baseless mumbo jumbo, trying to encourage them to reject scientific recommended treatment. They are unqualified people with no right to influence people’s health and treatment.

[Not2Cool2Argue]

On 3/21/2020 at 9:56 AM, Guest London jwaan said:

That’s a really interesting reply. If I haven’t touched anything whatsoever. My spoon isn’t touching anything and neither are my hands, explain how it’s Jhooth?

 And while you’re at it, explain how, perversely, the dudes khooli Dari waving around the daal isn’ta concern?  Why are there no small measures there? 
 

and if you want to invent small measures, surely all sevadars should be wearing masks and gloves even when there is no virus.

This is the problem. People need to understand scientific hygiene. Not imagine they are in the jungle fighting aurungzeb.

We dont need masks or gloves when cooking the food. As the heat will kill the germs when we cook.

And washing hands is better than gloves. Because ppl will touch everything with the gloves. 

And as for masks. Hazooriye r good enough.  

[Guest London jwaan]

5 hours ago, Not2Cool2Argue said:

We dont need masks or gloves when cooking the food. As the heat will kill the germs when we cook.

And washing hands is better than gloves. Because ppl will touch everything with the gloves. 

And as for masks. Hazooriye r good enough.  

Your reply makes no sense.

Even if the heat kills germs while cooking, when serving surely there should be masks if the logic of the small measures is to be meaning full.

 And full open Dari waving around food is never going to be akin to research lab standards is it?

 If washing hands is better than gloves, Joe do you know each person a) has washed theirs and b) has done so properly?

 What’s hazooriye?

[Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh]

It's all become very scary and even more real.  I know alot of Consultants and NHS Directors because in my capacity in Diversity and Inclusion I have given a lot of them some workshop sessions and I spoke to one of them just this afternoon. Now, I'm no doctor so I can only interpret what said from the viewpoint of a layman: He said we should no longer be looking at a cough as one of the key symptoms as most of the people that are testing positive in UK hospitals these last few days showed no signs whatsoever of a cough. He said gastro symptoms, such as diarroeh seems to be most common but it could really be anything. What he basically said was that this virus had mutated over the course of the last week or so and was now far different and far stronger than what it was a few weeks ago. It is now a totally different animal. This is becoming even scarier than we thought. And we always knew it was scary. 

[Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh]

Are Gurdwara Granthis properly prepared ? - Are they undergoing appropriate training right now ?

We're learning more and more - we in the UK know what's coming our way from what's happening in Italy and now starting to happen in Spain....and America and Canada needs to follow closely what's happening here in the UK and Europe because it will come their way soon enough. We know the virus has mutated - We know it's a far different, far stronger and altogether a different animal to what it was a few weeks ago. It has adapted. We need to adapt too.  We know the authorities and experts are as much in the dark about it as we are. We now know we were wrong to look for signs of the 'cough' as a symptom because most of those dying in the UK of the virus don't have any cough at all - They have other symptoms of which gastro type symptoms seem to be quite common.

We know the official advice of keeping elders safe by not going to visit them takes no consideration at aall to us.....as we live in households with 3 generations under one roof. There is no guidance for our families. Therefore, we know our elders are at far more risk of dying than white British elders. (this partly explains the extremely high death rate in Italy as Italians also have the same national culture as us in the sense that they do not move out of the family home and elders live with their married sons, daughters and grandchildren).  We know that once Sikh elders start to get ill their children will not be allowed to visit them as they lay dying. We also know that no funerals will be allowed. We know that each city of district will have an appointed representative of each faith who will conduct the last rites on the dead body in private.  And here's the thing with that last bit :   What are we doing right now to ensure that the Granthis are being properly trained to administer last rites to our elders with upmost dignity ?   What is about to come to our community is based on trust. So far, in my life, granthis have done nothing that would fill me with trust. 

[Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh]

Coronavirus is a racist, sexist, ageist pig

I had this strange dream about Sars-COV-2 (you might call it Coronavirus or Covid19 or if you work for the American Government and therefore a racist the "Chinese Virus" or "Kung Flu")....anyway, I had this dream. Well no, of course I didn't actually have this dream but it's always nice to start something with the words "I had this strange dream" so.........I had this strange dream last night about a tiny little microscopic thing that is just 125 nanometers wide, i.e. 800 of them could fit into the width of a human hair and this tiny little thing wanted to go on a killing spree. Like all serial killers it had to choose it's target. In my strange dream (that never really happened) this tiny thing (lets call it coronavirus) looked at the Equality Act 2000 after viewing re-runs of 1970's TV comedies like Alf Garnett and Archie Bunker and decided it would become a sexist, ageist and perhaps racist pig. One by one, it started picking off targets from those in the list of protected characteristics according to the Equality Act. But, like all racist, sexist, ageist bigots....it's a damn fo0l so gets things wrong. First, hating minorities, it went after Chinese people. It killed so many Chinese people that white people started saying it served the Chinese right. But the little virus decided it didn't like the taste of Chinese so went to Europe and started killing more people in Italy than it did in the whole of China and then more Spaniards than Chinese. But, as with all bigots, there is no limit to it's bigotry. Being a little bit racist wasn't quite enough so it went full-throttle on Age and Sex. Being well ageist it decided that elderly people must die and so killed them off at a rate about 10,000% higher than young people. And then what does this ageist racist do ?   It turns into a full-blown Sexist that's what it does. It infects everybody but, just as it did in China, Italy, Spain and now the UK it kills the men FAR more than it does the women. About 80% more. This is sexism in reverse but, like I said, bigots are by nature always damn fo0ls. So don't worry too much about your grandmother....she'll be safe....but look after your grandfather well.....there's a damn f0ol mixed up killer bigot on the loose trying to kill him.

[Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh]

On 3/16/2020 at 12:20 PM, Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh said:

Thank you for your comments Guest Singh. Before I address your general hygeine points however, let me tell everyone here a story about a city in Iran.

Once upon a time (actually just a few weeks ago) there was a holy city in Iran called Qom. Members of the Shite faith used to go there from all over the world to pay their respects and touch holy relics. Much like our city of Amritsar, businessmen - on their way home from foreign trips - would make a point of going to that holy place before going home after landing at the airport. One such businessman had just come back from a business trip in Wuhan province in China. He picked up something in China. In Qom, he did what everyone else does and touched something as he prayed. Whatever he had from China was now on that relic he touched in Qom. Now everyone else who was visiting Qom started getting that something too. They started getting sick and dying. The religious leaders reminded peope that Qom is a holy site of god and would cure and protect them from such illnesses. So even more people visited and even more got sick and died. So.....from one single businessman and the misinformed advice from one group of religious leaders we reached a situation where Iran, per population, has by far the world's biggest coronavirus problem. 

What I'm trying to illustrate with that story is that it is very VERY important to separate faith from science. Faith can and indeed should be blind but science never can be. 

 

^ I said the above on this thread on March 16. Today, March 27, Sikh religious leaders in Punjab are telling Sikhs that they should all visit Sikh Gurdwaras in large numbers because Waheguru will protect them from science. It would seem the religious leaders in Qom have twin brothers in Amritsar. Only the ones in Amritsar are even worse because they want to repeat the same mistakes made in Qom even after they know what the results were. 

[Guest Jigsaw_puzzled_singh]

On 3/26/2020 at 8:32 AM, Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh said:

Coronavirus is a racist, sexist, ageist pig

I had this strange dream about Sars-COV-2 (you might call it Coronavirus or Covid19 or if you work for the American Government and therefore a racist the "Chinese Virus" or "Kung Flu")....anyway, I had this dream. Well no, of course I didn't actually have this dream but it's always nice to start something with the words "I had this strange dream" so.........I had this strange dream last night about a tiny little microscopic thing that is just 125 nanometers wide, i.e. 800 of them could fit into the width of a human hair and this tiny little thing wanted to go on a killing spree. Like all serial killers it had to choose it's target. In my strange dream (that never really happened) this tiny thing (lets call it coronavirus) looked at the Equality Act 2000 after viewing re-runs of 1970's TV comedies like Alf Garnett and Archie Bunker and decided it would become a sexist, ageist and perhaps racist pig. One by one, it started picking off targets from those in the list of protected characteristics according to the Equality Act. But, like all racist, sexist, ageist bigots....it's a damn fo0l so gets things wrong. First, hating minorities, it went after Chinese people. It killed so many Chinese people that white people started saying it served the Chinese right. But the little virus decided it didn't like the taste of Chinese so went to Europe and started killing more people in Italy than it did in the whole of China and then more Spaniards than Chinese. But, as with all bigots, there is no limit to it's bigotry. Being a little bit racist wasn't quite enough so it went full-throttle on Age and Sex. Being well ageist it decided that elderly people must die and so killed them off at a rate about 10,000% higher than young people. And then what does this ageist racist do ?   It turns into a full-blown Sexist that's what it does. It infects everybody but, just as it did in China, Italy, Spain and now the UK it kills the men FAR more than it does the women. About 80% more. This is sexism in reverse but, like I said, bigots are by nature always damn fo0ls. So don't worry too much about your grandmother....she'll be safe....but look after your grandfather well.....there's a damn f0ol mixed up killer bigot on the loose trying to kill him.

OK let me translate my message above into something many here will be able to understand....basically what I'm suggesting is this...and it is a very powerfull and revolutionary suggestion:   I am suggesting that the NHS hospitals make a conscious decision to only admit men and let the females recover on their own at home. That way there will b enough acute beds and ventilators etc. This thing (Coronavirus) likes killing men. It doesn't like killing women as much. More than 80% of the people it has killed have been men. In theory, we should consider the fact that men are at a far higher risk ?

It's just a theory......I have lots of theories. Like you I'm sitting at home thinking of theories and I've come up with a few. None of them are proven science and mean nothing at this point but as theories from a layman let me tell you a few:

Sikhism

• In China and then Italy and Spain.....it killed people who smoke more than it did non-smokers
• The non-cutting of hair :  Could the fact that Guru ji told us to leave our hair uncut mean that their hair in our nose etc could potentially partially protect us from particles entering our respiratory system ?

[Guest Jigsaw_puzzled_singh]

On 3/26/2020 at 8:32 AM, Guest Jigsaw_Puzzled_Singh said:

Coronavirus is a racist, sexist, ageist pig

I had this strange dream about Sars-COV-2 (you might call it Coronavirus or Covid19 or if you work for the American Government and therefore a racist the "Chinese Virus" or "Kung Flu")....anyway, I had this dream. Well no, of course I didn't actually have this dream but it's always nice to start something with the words "I had this strange dream" so.........I had this strange dream last night about a tiny little microscopic thing that is just 125 nanometers wide, i.e. 800 of them could fit into the width of a human hair and this tiny little thing wanted to go on a killing spree. Like all serial killers it had to choose it's target. In my strange dream (that never really happened) this tiny thing (lets call it coronavirus) looked at the Equality Act 2000 after viewing re-runs of 1970's TV comedies like Alf Garnett and Archie Bunker and decided it would become a sexist, ageist and perhaps racist pig. One by one, it started picking off targets from those in the list of protected characteristics according to the Equality Act. But, like all racist, sexist, ageist bigots....it's a damn fo0l so gets things wrong. First, hating minorities, it went after Chinese people. It killed so many Chinese people that white people started saying it served the Chinese right. But the little virus decided it didn't like the taste of Chinese so went to Europe and started killing more people in Italy than it did in the whole of China and then more Spaniards than Chinese. But, as with all bigots, there is no limit to it's bigotry. Being a little bit racist wasn't quite enough so it went full-throttle on Age and Sex. Being well ageist it decided that elderly people must die and so killed them off at a rate about 10,000% higher than young people. And then what does this ageist racist do ?   It turns into a full-blown Sexist that's what it does. It infects everybody but, just as it did in China, Italy, Spain and now the UK it kills the men FAR more than it does the women. About 80% more. This is sexism in reverse but, like I said, bigots are by nature always damn fo0ls. So don't worry too much about your grandmother....she'll be safe....but look after your grandfather well.....there's a damn f0ol mixed up killer bigot on the loose trying to kill him.

OK so let me just fill you guys in on what the current situation is. Me and the wife wanted to do our bit so registered as volunteers with a couple of west london hospitals. So many people did the same there wasn't really anything immediate for us so I got in contact with a Director of one of the NHS Trust's I had done a session for and he arranged for the both of us to guard an entrance of a major university hospital ensuring only staff enter. The entrance is for an acute medical unit from where coronavirus patients are filtered from the Emergency Department and kept for a night or two while they are tested and then upstreamed to another dirty ward full of positive patients. We've been doing it for 3 days now and this is situation as it stands : 700 dead last night, about 579 the night before and 500 the day before that but in the hospital ED and Acute areas it is amazingly quiet. Not the scenes we're seeing on our screens from New York. Up on the intensive care wards and the wings of the hospital now dirty zones there are plenty of people dying but on the ground it is extremely quiet. Many that are tested positive and discharged home....either to die comfortably or recover...and the nurses are simply the most noble and bravest souls you will ever encounter. English, Filipino, Spanish and Portuguese........they know they either have it, have had it in the last few weeks or will get it....but they are in work en-masse. For me and you. Smiling and happy.  I'll tell you one thing;they are strict about the mask. Not for themselves but for you and me. They and the doctors told me that the mask is a psychological thing in that it can only help a tiny little bit when it comes to protecting you from coronavirus but it can help a hellava lot in stopping you from giving it to a vulnerable person. But....people are dying. It's just that they'e dying in quiet dignity up on the wards that they're supposed to die in. We're seeing none of this chaos down on the ground in A&E (Trauma - Emergency Room) and the Acute Units. 

You know....I was on the phone with family in Canada just a few minutes ago trying to explain the situation. With them having a total of about 87 deaths in a country 30 times the size of England they couldn't get their heads around the fact that we have 700 deaths plus per 24 hours here in England. To them it was surreal. And it is surreal. What we're finding out about ourselves, our country and our national health service is surreal. I'll give you an example: I love talking to people and struck up a conversation with a Viroligist as she was coming out of the ward. The coffee shop in the hospital was giving free coffee and snacks to staff 24 hrs so we went for a coffee togther. This lovely Italian lady told me that any virus - such as this coronavirus - is as intelligent as us in that it wants to live....not die. I did explain on previous posts on this thread that it is mutating but she explained that it would eventually realise that it is not to it's benefit to consistently kill it's host (you and me). She said it will mutate into something that lets us live because that way it also gets to live. The coffee, by the way, was of really poor quality but I'll save that conversation for another day.

So what did I lean since Wednesday ?  Well.....we read in the news about big corporations donating millions to the NHS but each day I was there there were no pizzas and gifts from the big multi-nationals. Each day I was there I witnessed local independent Pizza, Chicken and Kebab shops......drop of masses of boxes of food for free for the nurses. In some cases it would amount to an entire month's profit. Today, a local family owned florist and his family went round the entire wing of ED to give the most beautiful bunch of flowers you have ever seen to every nurse, cleaner, housekeeper or doctor. So what I learned these last few days is this: There is equity in love and death. Not in life...as my '$h1tt that white people do' thread constantly proves but there is equity in love and death.