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Why was Jathedar Baba Sahib Singh ji Kicked Out?


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57 minutes ago, Jassu said:

No one is saying that the majority of Sikhs were blind or impervious (or did not care) but the vast majority did not know the full extent of what was going on unlike we do today. It’s similar to how nearly most if not all Sikhs were not aware of the full effects and numbers of the 1984 genocide until years later. I once saw a video about the aftermath of 1984 (from western sources) and the Sikhs helping the wounded in the video were small in numbers and looked confused af. Their answers were weird when they were questioned. I’ll try to find it. I refuse to believe that the vast majority of Sikh youth and adult men would not be entirely swayed by the teachings of Sant Ji if they truly kept in tune with everything. I believe there could have been an entire state wide revolution and we would have more luck achieving our resolutions. I would not be surprised if a lot of the people at the time simply lived their pind life and did not keep in touch as much. Knowing mothers they would probably tell their sons to stay out of trouble and lay low. I know it’s a film and not completely accurate/fictitious, but in Punjab 1984, Diljit and his mother knew there were bad times about but only after someone they loved was directly impacted, did they properly tune in. They were living their normal lives before then.

In order to try and rationalise Santa Singh gaddari, Dharmyudh tried to imply that many Sikhs were not even aware of what Santji stood for and considered him a terrorist. This is how this issue came about. 

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Knowing specific facts and figures is not what “knowing” is about. Every Sikh in Punjab and beyond knew about Sant Ji and what was unfolding. There had not been a personality like him who combined the traditional Sant role with a strong Political Warrior aspect that had been missing since Baba Bir Singh. It was the strong comrade influence and congress loyalty in a swathe of our community that resulted in certain propaganda. But you will be surprised even unparh banday knew that SantJi was essentially standing up for our collective izzat.

Another thing, by and large Sikhs unanimously condemned Baba Santa Singh’s actions in rebuilding on sarkari wishes. It’s another story that kids born in the west have developed a mythical reimagining of what role Dals have played in the Panth in our post-annexation history. 

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7 hours ago, Jai Tegang! said:

Knowing specific facts and figures is not what “knowing” is about. Every Sikh in Punjab and beyond knew about Sant Ji and what was unfolding. There had not been a personality like him who combined the traditional Sant role with a strong Political Warrior aspect that had been missing since Baba Bir Singh. It was the strong comrade influence and congress loyalty in a swathe of our community that resulted in certain propaganda. But you will be surprised even unparh banday knew that SantJi was essentially standing up for our collective izzat.

Another thing, by and large Sikhs unanimously condemned Baba Santa Singh’s actions in rebuilding on sarkari wishes. It’s another story that kids born in the west have developed a mythical reimagining of what role Dals have played in the Panth in our post-annexation history. 

Very true. Unfortunately the rewriting of our history and the attempt to exonerate Santa Singh from his role as a GADDAR is mainly being done by diaspora kids who think that he was a Mahapurukh who could do no wrong. There is not an iota of difference between these kids and the followers of fake Babas who any rational person can see are conning the common people but the followers see them as great Mahapurkhs. 

Santa Singh is gone as have a majority of those who with him went against the collective wishes of the Panth. What I write or what anyone else writes about him whether it is pro or anti his actions will not change history and the damage his GADDARI did to the Panth and what he did he will already have been judged for by a greater judge than any of us. 

But knowing the facts of that time is important because if we exonerate a GADDAR from 1984 then when the next time the Panth faces a similar situation in the future then the example of Santa Singh will be important, because the next GADDAR to think of doing GADDARI to the Panth will not have Santa Singh as an example of someone who did GADDARI and who was shunned by the Panth for the rest of his life and who every Sikh generation since condemns as a worthless GADDAR. No the example will be that Santa Singh did GADDARI and underwent a Tankhah and a number of the following Sikh generations since think that he is a Mahapurkh. Now think, will that new GADDAR be more likely to do GADDARI or less likely? 

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12 hours ago, proactive said:

Very true. Unfortunately the rewriting of our history and the attempt to exonerate Santa Singh from his role as a GADDAR is mainly being done by diaspora kids who think that he was a Mahapurukh who could do no wrong. There is not an iota of difference between these kids and the followers of fake Babas who any rational person can see are conning the common people but the followers see them as great Mahapurkhs. 

Santa Singh is gone as have a majority of those who with him went against the collective wishes of the Panth. What I write or what anyone else writes about him whether it is pro or anti his actions will not change history and the damage his GADDARI did to the Panth and what he did he will already have been judged for by a greater judge than any of us. 

But knowing the facts of that time is important because if we exonerate a GADDAR from 1984 then when the next time the Panth faces a similar situation in the future then the example of Santa Singh will be important, because the next GADDAR to think of doing GADDARI to the Panth will not have Santa Singh as an example of someone who did GADDARI and who was shunned by the Panth for the rest of his life and who every Sikh generation since condemns as a worthless GADDAR. No the example will be that Santa Singh did GADDARI and underwent a Tankhah and a number of the following Sikh generations since think that he is a Mahapurkh. Now think, will that new GADDAR be more likely to do GADDARI or less likely? 

I was replying to the few posters above who made it out as if Sikhs weren't aware of what was going on in Punjab. Everyone knew what Sant Jarnail Singh Ji was standing up for. People from all over Punjab and beyond were coming to see him for a reason.

I agree that we need to better gather facts and more field research as this can have massive impact and lead to undeniable credibility for our claims. Case in point is Jaswant Singh Khalra. Otherwise, you get lies repeated ad nauseum like RW Hindus have been doing lately by making up ridiculous numbers of Hindus killed. The fact is that all throughout the 80’s and 90’s there never was an anti-hindu riot/pogrom in Punjab, not even at critical points of 84.

I believe since Baba Santa Singh did eventually ask forgiveness, and as such for Panthic unity we should put things to rest.

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46 minutes ago, Jai Tegang! said:

I believe since Baba Santa Singh did eventually ask forgiveness, and as such for Panthic unity we should put things to rest.

Even if some sikh doesn't want to forgive santa Singh in his heart, it's fine.

But we shudnt hate budha dal and other nihang organizations.

We shud support them so that they can become more involved in panthic matters.

There is no Khalsa panth without Guru Gobind Singh ji' baani.

And nihangs hv preserved both Dasam Granth Sahib and Sarbloh Granth Sahib.

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It's not about forgiving, what's happened his happened but what is annoying are  these diaspora kids trying to JUSTIFY his GADDARI by coming up with BS excuses and making up 'facts'

The whole thread originally was about the rewriting of Sikh history by these same diaspora kids in order to promote the lie that a Nihang Akal Takht Jathedar  had been thrown out of Akal Takht and that the Akalis were so scared of Nihangs that they used women to beat him up. ALL these diaspora kids need to do is to show that he was the Akal Takht Jathedar in 1920, there being plenty of media around at that time which could be used to back up this claim if it were true. They cannot do that because you can make up 'facts' but when you have to provide evidence like a newspaper report from an eyewitness then you can't just conjure one up. 

 

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11 hours ago, proactive said:

It's not about forgiving, what's happened his happened but what is annoying are  these diaspora kids trying to JUSTIFY his GADDARI by coming up with BS excuses and making up 'facts'

The whole thread originally was about the rewriting of Sikh history by these same diaspora kids in order to promote the lie that a Nihang Akal Takht Jathedar  had been thrown out of Akal Takht and that the Akalis were so scared of Nihangs that they used women to beat him up. ALL these diaspora kids need to do is to show that he was the Akal Takht Jathedar in 1920, there being plenty of media around at that time which could be used to back up this claim if it were true. They cannot do that because you can make up 'facts' but when you have to provide evidence like a newspaper report from an eyewitness then you can't just conjure one up. 

 

Sounds like we need some grass roots reform. Across the board. Whelp... How's Hazur Sahib since they burst out of that covid lockdown swinging?

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On 1/8/2022 at 11:53 AM, proactive said:

You don't know what you are talking about. Just because her mother who was 14 didn't know about Santji doesn't mean that most or even a vast minority of Sikhs were unaware of what was going on. Santji had been in the news for over 3 years by 1984 and in 1981 an aircraft had been hijacked to demand is release. You kids think that Bluestar came out of nowhere. What was happening in Punjab was being reported across India and even abroad and yet the Sikhs in villages a few miles from Rode or Chowk Mehta didn't know what was going on. You do know that before social media and the internet people did know what was happening in the state as well as across the world.  You seem to think that the Sikhs were just wearing blinkers for the few years before 1984 and did not see the rise in the paramilitary forces in Punjab and the daily harassment they faced from the CRPF in Punjab. 

 

yeah and what was being reported was biased against sant ji 

sant ji had hundreds of thousands of supporters, hundreds of thousands attended sarbat khalsa 1986 and partook in dharm yudh morcha but millions of common folk arent involved in quami sangarsh and were neutral or more concerned with running a household, do you know about the average person in the late 80s/90s, not everything was revolved around kharku singhs and the lehar (outside majha) even though it had a large impact, there were other cultural phenomenon taking place in entertainment industry that eroded the chardikala spirit of the youth during the 90s 

majority of sikhs/punjabis were gumraah and asleep back then and its only gotten worse or better in some ways today 

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59 minutes ago, NaamTiharoJoJape said:

yeah and what was being reported was biased against sant ji 

sant ji had hundreds of thousands of supporters, hundreds of thousands attended sarbat khalsa 1986 and partook in dharm yudh morcha but millions of common folk arent involved in quami sangarsh and were neutral or more concerned with running a household, do you know about the average person in the late 80s/90s, not everything was revolved around kharku singhs and the lehar (outside majha) even though it had a large impact, there were other cultural phenomenon taking place in entertainment industry that eroded the chardikala spirit of the youth during the 90s 

majority of sikhs/punjabis were gumraah and asleep back then and its only gotten worse or better in some ways today 

Still beating the same drum.

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