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Ancient Punjab


puzzled
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Even thus, O Salya, the young and old, among the inhabitants of Sakala, intoxicated with spirits, sing and cry. How can virtue be met with among such a people ? Thou shouldst know this. I must, however, speak again to thee about what another Brahmana had said unto us in the Kuru court, There where forests of Pilus stand, and those five rivers flow, viz., the Satadru, the Vipasa, the ravati, the Chandrabhaga, and the Vitasa and which have the Sindhu for their sixth, there in those regions removed from the Himavat, are the countries called by the name of the Arattas. Those regions are without virtue and religion. No one should go thither.
 

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They ate meat as well, you can see why people from Punjab were considered unorthodox. 

 

Alas, that (Vahika) maiden of large proportions, dressed in thin blankets, is thinking of me, her Vahika lover that is now passing his days in Kurujangala, at the hour of her going to bed. Crossing the Sutlej and the delightful Iravati, and arriving at my own country, when shall I cast my eyes up- on those beautiful women with thick frontal bones, with blazing circlets of red arsenic on their foreheads, with streaks of jet black collyrium on their eyes, and their beautiful forms attired in blankets and skins and themselves uttering shrill cries ! When shall I be happy, in the company of those intoxicated ladies amid the music of drums and kettle-drums and conchs sweet as the cries of asses and camels and mules ! When shall I be amongst those ladies eating cakes of flour and meat and balls of pounded barley mixed with skimmed milk, in the forests, having many pleasant paths of Sami and Pilu and Kariral When shall I, amid my own countrymen, mustering in strength on the high-roads, fall upon passengers, and snatching their robes and attires beat them repeatedly !```

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I guess most of India was forest in those days, yeah a lot of the diversity we see in Punjab today wouldn't of been present in those days. Khatris are natives of Punjab and Punjabi Brahmins are decendants of Saraswat Brahmins. Most Punjabi Dalits have migrated from central India and South India. Jatts though many say come from Sindh imo is a myth, the genetics/DNA just doesnt match up with that region, they likely came from present day Haryana. 

 

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3 hours ago, puzzled said:

I guess most of India was forest in those days, yeah a lot of the diversity we see in Punjab today wouldn't of been present in those days. Khatris are natives of Punjab and Punjabi Brahmins are decendants of Saraswat Brahmins. Most Punjabi Dalits have migrated from central India and South India. Jatts though many say come from Sindh imo is a myth, the genetics/DNA just doesnt match up with that region, Jatts and Sindhis score differently on harappa, they likely came from present day Haryana. 

 

 

I wonder how accurate this depiction is of Punjab more that 2000 years ago.

I know Punjab has been conquered and invaded many times, but there is there is one thing that remains undefeated in Punjab

Diarrhea!

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Seems Brahmins never have really held high social status in Punjab, and communities that would of traditionally been considered low in other regions of India were not necessarily low in Punjab. Explains why Punjab has more of a Biradari system rather than the Varna System and order. 

Theres to be a lot of getting drunk and dancing around, even the women.

Other than that it seems Punjabi women had a bit of a reputation even back then!

Very interesting stuff though 

   

 

 

“that (region) where these five rivers, emerging from the mountains flow, this Aratta (country) is called Balhika where the Arya should not stay even for two days”.

"But on seeing the dharma practiced in the land of the five rivers, the grandfather cried, "Shame!". They are outcasts. They are born from servants. They are the performers of wicked deeds. That is the reason the grandfather condemned the dharma in the land of the five rivers. Though they followed their own dharma and that of their varna, he did not honour it."

"Having gone to the Bahlikas, I learnt the following. There, one first becomes a brahmana and then becomes a kshatriya. Thereafter, one becomes a vaishya, a shudra and finally a barber. Having become a barber, one once again becomes a brahmana. Having become a brahmana there, one is once again as a slave. In every family, there is only one virtuous brahmana. Everyone else follows one's desires. The Gandharas, the Madrakas and the Bahlikas possess limited intelligence."

A foremost one among Brahmanas, venerable in years while reciting old histories, said these words, blaming the Vahikas and Madrakas, One should always avoid the Vahikas, those impure people that are out of the pail of virtue. I remember from the days of my youth that a slaughter-ground for kine and a space for storing intoxicating spirits always distinguish the entrances of the abodes of the (Vahika) kings. On some very secret mission I had to liv e among the Vahikas. In consequence of such residence the conduct of these people is well known to me. There is a town of the name of Sakala (Sialkot), a river of the name of Apaga, and a clan of the Vahikas known by the name of the Jattikas. The practices of these people are very censurable. They drink the liquor called Gauda, and eat fried barley with it. They also eat beef with garlics. They also eat cakes of flour mixed with meat, and boiled rice that is bought from others. Of righteous practices they have none. Their women, intoxicated with drink and divested of robes, laugh and dance outside the walls of the houses in cities, without garlands and unguents, singing while drunken obscence songs of diverse kinds that are as musical as the bray of the <banned word filter activated> or the bleat of the camel. In intercourse they are absolutely without any restraint, and in all other matters they act as they like. Maddened with drink, they call upon one another, using many endearing epithets. Addressing many drunken exclamations to their husbands and lords, the fallen women among the Vahikas, without observing restrictions even on sacred days, give themselves up to dancing.

In days of yore, when the eternal religion was reverenced in all countries, the Grandsire, observing the practices of the country of the five rivers, cried fie on them. Fie on the Arattas and the people of the country of the five rivers !

Beginning with the Matsyas, the residents of the Kuru and the Panchala countries, the Naimishas as well and the other respectable peoples, the pious among all races are conversant with the eternal truths of religion. This cannot be said of the Madrakas (Madra/Madrakas are a frontier tribe of Aratta, centered in North Punjab) and the crooked-hearted race that resides in the country of the five rivers.

The Vahikas resent beneficial counsels ; as regards the Madrakas there are none amongst those. Thou, O Salya, art so. Thou shouldst not reply to me. The Madrakas are regarded on Earth as the dirt of every nation. So the Madra woman is called the dirt of the whole female sex. They that have for their practices the drinking of spirits, the violation of the beds of their preceptors, the destruction of the embryo by procuring miscarriage, and the robbing of other people's wealth, there is no sin that they have not. Fie on the Arattas and the people of the country of the five rivers. Knowing this, be silent. Do not seek to oppose me. Do not let me slay Keshava and Arjuna, having slain thee first.'

The regions are called by the name of Arattas. The people residing there are called the Vahikas. The lowest of Brahmanas also are residing there from very remote times. They are without the Veda and without knowledge, without sacrifice and without the power to assist at other's sacrifices. They are all fallen and many amongst them have been begotten by Sudras upon other peoples' girls. The gods never accept any gifts from them. The Prasthalas, the Madras, the Gandharas, the Arattas, those called Khasas, the Vasatis, the Sindhus and the Sauviras are almost as blamable in their practices.

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13 minutes ago, Ranjeet01 said:

 

I wonder how accurate this depiction is of Punjab more that 2000 years ago.

I know Punjab has been conquered and invaded many times, but there is there is one thing that remains undefeated in Punjab

Diarrhea!

Do you think he would of been able to invade the entire subcontinent? Porus had quite small empire. After defeating Porus they would of had face the mighty Nanda dynasty who were far bigger than what Porus had, Nanda dynasty later became the Mauryan Empire, biggest empire South Asia has ever produced.  I guess we would never know. 

Yh Punjab would of mainly been forest in those days.

Its hard imagine what Punjab was like before the invasions because the culture of the invaders had such a huge influence on the current culture.

But from these ancient txts we can say that Punjabis were quite unorthodox not very dharmic, a rowdy bunch  lol  

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