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Equality during Anand Karaj


Guest manjeetayjagjeet
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6 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

I really am making a conscious effort to adjust my frame of mind so that I'm not viewing reality from a purely masculine and patriarchal perspective, but reading 5hit like this hammers home the absolute futility of it all. 

We know what she's going to come back with: "Sikhi is outdated / sexist / patriarchal / anti-female" and we're all pendu b**tards who wants to ruin her special day.

Totally agree.

But if the OP is from Toronto I understand where she's coming from. We are first generation Sikhs/Punjabis and there's a "boys over girls" mentality here. 

Hopefully she got the answer she was looking for.

 

 

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Guest London jwaan
On 2/24/2021 at 5:24 PM, Guest manjeetayjagjeet said:

Sat sri akal, everyone!

I'm just having some trouble wrapping my head around Sikh society. As a woman, I am proud to be Sikh because it advocates for equality among the genders. However, my faith has been suffering due to societal thinking, especially here in Canada. My fiancé and I are getting married next year and we are having a lot of trouble finding a raagi jattha. Why? Because both of us (and our families) want us to walk beside each other instead of the traditional bride behind groom way for the lavaan. People are simply unwilling to do it and those that can, are crazy expensive.

Our traditions have been heavily borrowed from Hinduism but without all the fuss. We have even changed the way we think about Sikh marriage, as the bride and groom get married together to God. So then why do I have to walk behind him? To make things worse, I have heard some really sexist things from some of the raagis who explained why I must walk behind him. I am so disappointed in our people.

I guess I wanted some more opinions on this. Am I missing some pertinent information? But if anyone has more information about this or raagis who are more open minded, I'd love to hear about it!

Thank you!

I think that you are better off not having an anand karaj. It is probably better suited for both of you to have a registry wedding and whatever celebration you choose.

I am a man and I disagree with any kind of gender discrimination, yet I don’t think I can think of anything worse than militant feminists looking for gender discrimination where there isn’t any. 

Especially given the equality of women explicitly denied as our pillar of our religion, no Sikh would look to change a blessed ceremony created by our gurus based on 21st century misandry.

Why not get nine of your girlfriends together so that you can declare yourselves gurus 11-20 as it must be gender discrimination as none of our gurus were women?? Or maybe speak to the akal Takhat about banning male Granthis unless 50% appointed are women and the numbers levelled up?

Or just go the whole way, and make a retrospective claim that guru gobind Singh ji must have been a woman?

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Guest Signs

Some of the signs of a rough marriage to come:

The bride wants to walk in front or beside during lavan. The bride wants to wear heels during lavan( yes it’s been done before...to look taller)....she was confronted after and fully denied it although all the ladies sitting behind her saw. The bride throws a fit because the Ramala does not match her lengha(happened before).  Bride thinks it’s a blessing that her parents didn’t put Kaur in her name. Couple thinks it’s ok to have some wine in the parking lot. (The it’s only wine excuse).

Like other posters said, just get a court marriage and move on with your lives.

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Guest Bibliophile

Op, I think you're asking a pertinant question but in the wrong place. Take a look at some the other threads on this board and you'll see that the Sikhs here put tradition above everything. They want to go back to the old days where we all went to the loo in the fields and women died in childbirth. 

Sikhs on reddit are much less condescending, well educated and likely to give a balanced view. I'd ask there. 

 

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Guest guest
On 3/1/2021 at 3:23 PM, puzzled said:

This symbolises that your father is now passing you onto your husband and that you are now a part of your husbands family. The grooms father does not pass the brides chunni into the grooms hand, it is the brides father that passes the grooms pala into his daughters hand.  Your sons will also be a part of your husbands family and take their fathers name. 

Just how Guru Gobind Singh ji narrates the history of his family, the Sodhi clan, the clan of his father Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji.  Just how Guru Nanak Dev ji is described as being born into the Bedi clan, the clan of his father Mehta Kalu. Just how Bhai Santokh Singh ji describes that when Guru Nanak Dev ji is born the BEDI ladies(aunts) come around to see Baby Guru Nanak. 

Guru Gobind Singh ji's hukkam is that a Sikh man should get his daughter married into a house where Sikhi is practiced, why ? because its the bride that is marrying into the grooms family, hence a father should choose a home for his daughter where Sikhi is practiced.  

Just like that the father of the bride passes the grooms pala into the brides hand, symbolising that she is now a part of the grooms family and their kids will also be part of the grooms family. We have been getting married like that for centuries, its our tradition. If you don't like it, then like others have suggested you can have a registry marriage. 

 

i'm a firm traditionalist and a male.  however even i would find this explanation demeaning if i wear a woman.  

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Wonderful replies here by the sangat ??.

A small point to note; if you walk side by side, one of you will stand closer to the Guru and have to walk a slightly shorter distance, while the other will have to stand a little further away from the Guru and walk a slightly longer distance. Who will it be? And how do you decide who gets to stand closer to the Guru?

This is what happens when you start splitting hairs. As sangat have mentioned, if you don't like the Anand Karaj, you are more than welcome to get "married" in any other way you see fit...

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