stopsingh

EDITED

Admin note : This is your first and last warning and this reply will be deleted by morning!

Deleted for what ? Is there anything offensive in my post ? NO. Read it !! This is funny but yesterday a veerji on another thread wrote about censorship and him not being allowed to use jago wale in a broadcast. Here we have admin not allowing debate and threatening to delete a reply. There is nothing offensive in the reply as far as I can see. If telling people to change passport pictures is offensive then I apologise. Also I have not even had a first warning so whats with the premature last warning ?

Admin Note : Veer ji Your id is under moderation now. If duplicate id appears, your ip will be put on ban list. Thank you

What for ? Would be nice to know what forum guidlines I have broken and then it would be nice to apply these to everyone.

Mod Note : contact@sikhsangat.com. If more question raised in public forum, ip will be put up in ban list. Thanks

I so wanted to smack him but gurukirpa i kept my cool.....anyways is it written properly...i just wanted someone to check it out and make it better :wub: ........Mr Mehtab Singh...can u do the honors......

oh and on a lighter note.........u guys been posting stuff about me on t he other posts..... ....im gonna deal with ya in a few days

Maybe you should have smacked yourself for not getting your passport picture changed.

It is advisable to get a picture changed if your have become a GurSikh.

It is plain stupidity to not do so and expect no problems when flying.

I saw a similar (opposite event) at IGIA Delhi several years ago where a Indian student flying from the US had cut his kesh and not changed his pic

ture. The immigration wale at Delhi would not let him leave the airport.

Listen boy, i been to punajb too, i spoken to people too, do they want khalistan.. perhaps not particularly...

do they want a return to violence... not really....

do they want more of their sons to be killed and daughters to be raped.... nope....

do they still seek justice deep down in their hearts ... YES

are they still upset and furious about the way they were treated and murdered.. YES

would they like to see people guilty of crimes against sikhi bought to justice... YES

Do they know what happened?!?! Be it pro-sikhi and khalistan stance or even the government stance!??! NO!!!

These people know nothing!! all they know or remember is the sight of the blood of their children staining the sand before their houses. The youngsters know nothing of the reasons of the struggle, why it ahppened, or what happened to those who participated in it. Most simply do not talk about it.

Do not confuse this with 'people do not want khalistan, or people do not want justice'. Iv heard so many people like u saying the same rubbish, people dnt want it, iv been there and spoken to them... did u speak to everyone in punjab then? cus thats what ur claiming, that NOBODY wants it!

Yeh perhaps we should go there and say it... guess what people there do say it! When 10,000 people marched in delhi trying to save the life of prof davinder singh bhullar, they were shouting it!!

<

br>At the same time there were 100 people only indian embassy in london, while 50,000 went to a gurdwara opening down the road on the same day. So if we going to work with numbers, india and delhi wins!

Think boy, before independance is achieved, education is essential. Look at cuba one of the essential qualities of the revolution was the education of the fighters and those in villages and towns. If we want independance we must educate, if we want justice we must fight the cases.. in india in either case you die. Have you forgotten the human rights activist who was threatened on live tv in india just recently?

Talk of liberation and justice does not need boundries, it is precisely because the voice of justice cannot be raised in punjab, that it must be raised outside. If we do not, then nobody can or will.

Anyway, even when the morcha first started there were many majority of people who said it was wrong and just trouble making...later they seemed to join in... when sant ji said sikhs should carry arms as guru ji has told us, in case later wen we need them we cry because we have nothing, plenty of people said he was causing trouble.. yet when the police came to their village and took away their unarmed men and boys then they too changed their minds!

Dont worry about it, not all animals in the jungles are lions! Our lions have roared and their voice still echoes in our ears, you have chosen to close yours, well thats your choice and your life, the rest of us will carry on. Whether you like it or not!

My response to this was censored and deleted. Not too worry typing it again will only take up a few minutes.

There 555,602 Sikhs in Delhi according to the 2001 census. 10,000 is less than 1.8% of this. Also the people were protesting about the death sentence against Bhullar and not for Khali-stan or Sikhistan.

I suggest you speak to people like Wassan Singh Zaffarwal (one time KC

F chief)next time you are in Punjab and find out from him the actual truth about what was going on both sides during the 1980s and early 1990s. Wassan Singh Zaffarwal pronounced Khalistan from Akal Takht on April 29, 1986. Ups Zaffarwal is one of those who became dissillusioned with the concept of Khalistan after the ISI wanted his militant/terror outfit to undertake blatent acts of terrorism so I guess people like you will brand him a GOI agent. Its not to hard to find village Zaffarwal in Gurdaspur district.

Veer, read the post:

"This is a list of 24 names that we know of, from a list of thousands we're yet trying to discover... but everything in Panjab is okae."

As I mentioned, these are just a FEW from the thousands, if you would like I can arrange to show you thr paperwork collated by Khalsa Human Rights together with Amnesty International... _ These are NOT the only names we have, these are a small fraction I wished to acquaint you with, would you like me to send you the paperwork listing the thousands of names? If you would, I would be more than happy to do so... Would you like to know the goings on after 1999? That too can be arranged, I wouldn't be able to list them all here, but I am sure we can arrange for you see the database of THOUSANDS of names, addresses, letter from distraught mothers who've godhi is now empty, thousands of fathers who held their sons hands whilst growing up and lost them forever as adults...

Lets not forget the long list of names Sardar Jaswant Singh Khalra took with him when approaching the GOI - are we to deny all these exist???

What beats me is why people like yourself continue to deny that such things are going on in India...

This is not my only basis for our need of Khalistan, of course not - but it is a big enough reason - 250,000 innocent sikhs have been tortured, GANG raped, murdered in fake police encounters and the like - yet this is not a good enough arguement??

r>

And don't you worry - you think the Khalistan movement is dead, keep watching my dear, cos for the Khalistan movement to be dead you've got to kill a damn lot of us - albeit in the West - and your no hope rubbish about no one in Panjab wanting Khalistan, come on, come with me, I will go with you to Panjab, take you in the the little huts that my mothers and fathers live in, and see the fear in their eyes, the fear the worlds LARGEST democracy has put in their hearts... Lets go, and ask that mother who still awaits her son to return home, if not alive, then at least in a body bag so she can go through his final rights.... lets ask her is everything is okae in Panjab hey??

This isn't just about Khalistan, this about seeking justice for those silenced victims, for they say they have no voice, so long as they have people who believe in their rights for freedom and justice, they will continue to have a voice!

As for how many people have died in police custody in the UK - seeing as you know so much about it, and are unwilling to accept what goes on with your own people, you may as well kick start the rights campaign for those - instead of criticising those who want to fight for the freedom and justice of their brothers and sisters.

Go on go to Punjab then instead of hiding in Europe advocating these things. Whats up you chicken ? I have been had a look spoken with people and they do not give two hoots about the issue. I have seen how the sham organisations set up to look after children of shaheed are really more interested in taking money than looking after the kids.

Simarjeets Mann Akali Dal which advocates a Sikh homeland is as popular as the Monster Raving Looney Party. The Dal Khalsa is even less popular. Guess what he freely expresses his views and apart from an old TADA case against him no new criminal cases have been filed against him for his views.

Come on all your Khali-stanis, w

hy you hide in the west, go to Punjab and advocate your views and see for yourselves how people hate your ideas.

As for the West Midlands deaths, as a Sikh you should be concerned and campaigning for an independent Khalistan, Sikhistan (or whatever other names you want to call it) in Smethwick or Leicester.

LIST OF DEATHS IN POLICE CUSTODY

w.e.f. JANUARY 1997- TILL JUNE, 2001

1997

1. March 14, 1997: Kashmir Singh, a Youth of village Pandori Rukman near Hoshiarpur, was abducted from his house in the village alongwith his father Ajit Singh by a police party headed by Sub-Inspector Gulzar Chand, SHO of Police Station Taran Taran(City) and after dropping his father, killed him in fake encounter. Later on the Sessions Court at Hoshiarpur held it to be a fake encounter and sentenced the accused policemen to life imprisonment for the dastardly act. Similarly, the National Human Rights Commission awarded a compensation of Rupees five lac to the next of kin of the deceased.

2. April 7, 1997: Paramjit Singh, son of Pritam Singh died in Police Custody of P.S.Dakha, Ludhiana.

3. April 17, 1997: Ravi Kumar Verma, a migrant labourer of Ludhiana died in Police custody of P.S.Division No.4, Ludhiana.

4. May 28,1997: Jagsir Singh(25), a resident of village Bilaspur, District Faridkot died due to Police torture in P.S.Bilaspur.

5. June 30, 1997: Narinder Singh(18), a resident of village Fetahpur, District Amritsar was beaten to death by the police of P.S.Amritsar.

6. July 20, 1997: Jaggar Singh of Kotduna village in District Sangrur, died in Police Custody of P.S.Dhanaula, District Sangrur.

7. July 21, 1997: Baljeet Singh (24) son of Nahar Singh, a resident of village Burj

Dhilwan, District Bathinda was killed in Police Custody of Police Station Maur, District Bathinda.

8. August 15, 1997: Satnam Singh alias Satti, a resident of Jalandhar district, died in Police custody of P.S. Adampur.

9. August 30, 1997: Pala Singh, son of Gurcharan Singh, a resident of village Bhai Bakhtaur, District Bathinda was killed in Police Station Kot Fatta, Distt.Bathinda. He allegedly by consuming poison kept in the Police Station. The Punjab State Human Rights Commission awarded an interim compensation of Rupees fifty thousand to the next of kin of the deceased.

10. September 1, 1997: Jagan Nath alias Jagnoo son of Ranjha Ram, a resident of village Pasla in Jalandhar district was killed in Police custody of P.S. Guraya, Distt. Jalandhar. Painfully, the Punjab Human Rights Commission, dismissed the complaint into his death for no valid reasons.

11. September 5, 1997: Sham Lal son of Banta Singh, a resident of village Ajnali, District Fatehgarh Sahib was beaten to death by a police party of P.S. Gobindgarh. Ironically, this Complaint also met the same fate in the Punjab State Human Rights Commission.

12. September 12, 1997: Babu Ram(25), a resident of Malerkotla was killed in Police Custody of P.S. Ahmedgarh, District Malerkotla.

13. September 21, 1997: Kala Singh, a resident of village Shadipur Mommian, District Patiala was killed in police custody of P.S.Patran, District Patiala.

14. October 3, 1997: Manfool Ram, a dalit of village Dakha, District Ludhiana died in Police custody of P.S.Mullanpur Dakha, District Ludhiana.

15. October 24, 1997: Bhagwan Singh,(35 ) a resident of village Jhuge Lal Singh, District Fazilka died in Police custody of P.S. Fazilka (Sadar).

16. October 26,1997: Bhola Singh, a resident of village Matti in District Mansa died in Police custody of P.S. Mansa.

1998

17. April 7, 1998: Paramjit Singh, son of Pritam Singh, a resident of Ludhiana died in police custody of Ludhiana police.

18. April 25, 19

98: Dr.Om Parkash Jail, an eye-specialist of Ludhiana died of heart attack due to Police beating at his residence by an Assistant Police Inspector of CIA Staff, Moga.

19. August 22, 1998: Karnail Singh(60), a resident of village Jagatpura in District Taran Taran died due to beating by policemen in P.S. Chabal, Taran Taran.

1999

20. January 26, 1999: Jasbir Khan(25), a resident of village Sohana, District Ropar was beaten to death in Police custody of P.S.Sohana.

21. August 15, 1999: Lakhbir Singh alias Lakha (35), a resident of village Ratoke in District Taran Taran was killed in police custody of P.S.Sarhali, District Taran Taran.

22. September 18, 1999: Devinder Singh alias Bhola(21), a resident of village Hassanpur in District Ropar was tortured to death by policemen of CIA Staff, Ropar The three policemen responsible for the gruesome killing have been sentenced to life imprisonment by the Sessions Judge, Ropar.

23. September 26,1999: Jagdish Rai Jain(49) a resident of Bathinda died in Police Custody of P.S. Paras Ram Nagar, Bathinda.

24. December 11,1999: Gurbhej Singh(21), a resident of Amritsar died in police custody of P.S.Amrtisar.

This is a list of 24 names that we know of, from a list of thousands we're yet trying to discover... but everything in Panjab is okae.

You can only come up with 24 names for such a large period ? You also ignore similar numbers killed in other Indian states which are majority Hindu !

What happens after 1999 ? Read your own post and killing numbers 1 and 22 disprove your theories about the judicial system.

If that is the basis for seeking Khalistan then perhaps you should start doing something similar in the UK because :

Figures from the Home Office show that between 1 April 2002 and 31 March 2003 there were 104 custody deaths, compared to 70 the previous year.

The highest number of custod

y deaths took place in the Metropolitan Police Force area where 17 people died, followed by the West Midlands with 11 deaths.

Wow 11 deaths in police custody in West Midlands perhaps you can start a campaign for independence in the West Midlands.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

i totally agree with what YSL penji is saying...

stop singh veer ji do you even know anything about our fight for khalistan? because i have come across people who dont want khalistan and they dont even know anything about it...

khalistan isn't our want its not our need its our RIGHT

our RIGHT to FREEDOM.

our RIGHT to JUSTICE.

imagin if that was your mother and your sister RAPED infront of you....

your father burnt alive...or beaten to death....

would you want revenge for it? would you want to seek justice for it?

i think you would...!!!!!!! so khalsitan is our way to get justice for those people's mothers fathers sisters and brothers.

khalistan is the way to get justice for all those people who died for what reason?

and nothing is ok in punjab! not until we seek justice ! ! !

You want it go fight for it. the movement is finished. No one wants it Punjab so declare it in the West Midlands or wherever you live.

You people sit in your homes in Europe and talk about Khalistan but do not have the bottle to go back. Go on get up off your backsides and go back to Punjab to discover the truth or are you chickens ?

Zaffarwal, Chohan etc all big time charlies in the Khalistan moveme

nt are happily living in Punjab NOW. They do not give two hoots about Khalistan anymore and Zaffarwal even admits the Pakistan ISI were getting him and his mates to undertake acts of terrorism.

where have i protected baba mohinder singh? infact i hope to question him on this matter of kar seva soon, the main point is that both GNNSJ and the SGPC have done many bodge jobs in the past and are continueing to do so, cheap toilet tiling, gloss paint everywhere, and total disgregard for structual integrity of buildings. both parties are in the wrong and people who do know about preservation of heritage such as gurmeet rai are being shut up and pushed a side by pendus at the top

Whatever the case is with GNNSJ and the kar seva by baba mohinder singh, whether he knew about the dodgy gold, plastered marble etc etc is another matter, it seems that people have found a target to take the punishment and will continue to take his name through the mud. I aint saying that he did know about the dodgy kar seva or if he didnt, but people need to think.

If that is not going on the defensive then I do not know what is. Using examples of other bodge ups to defend the Soho Road wale is being defensive in my book. No one is taking his name through mud. His own attitude in denying the bodge up is doing more than enough damage to his reputation without others trying to tarnish it.

As for Singh's in India filing law suits... what against the GOI?? Please don't tell me you actually believe this could happen? Sikh's who challenge the Indian Govt don't last too long... Which is why we, out in the west - in Smethwick, or wherever the mass of Khalistan backers live must use all the powers we have, to use the democratic society in which we live, the freedom of speech and expression which we have, and these damn good degrees we walk away with - cos if even just one person from that burning Panjab is eased by it, then you've at least tried to keep the dream of Khalsa Raaj (albeit 'Khalistan') alive somewhere.

Yes Sikhs are allowed to file lawsuits and have done so even against the GOI.

As for the Rob Marris story. Ever asked the people why they were approaching him. They proabably wanted India taken off the list of safe countries so they could claim asylum in the UK. Just visit a legal clinic at a Gurdwara near you to find out what people are prepared to do to claim asylum. Flowing beards at the time of claiming asylum soon become trim beards when the asylum claims are refused and the claimant then tries other methods to stay in the UK.

Whatever the case is with GNNSJ and the kar seva by baba mohinder singh, whether he knew about the dodgy gold, plastered marble etc etc is another matter, it seems that people have found a target to take the punishment and will continue to take his name through the mud. I aint saying that he did know about the dodgy kar seva or if he didnt, but people need to think.

The SGPC have been doing dodgy kar seva for ages, gurdwara baba atal is a prime example, the kar seva of the akaal takht is nothing like the original, in fact the roof is leaking and resulted in the damage of an handwritten saroop of guru maharaj. frescos and minakari on the walls have been systematically whitewashed with GLOSS PAINT, so even the best experts in the world cannot recover them, is baba mohinder singh responsible for this? course not, everyone says "open your eyes sikho", but it seems that peoples eyes are only half open :wub:

Bhai sahib was not an illetarate village bumpkin with very little education. He has lived in the west for a long time so unlike the SGPC he should have been more sensitive to the ideas of restoration/preservation than the sgpc wale.

Just becasue the Akal Takht has also had a bodge up job don

e it does not make the Darbar Sahib gold plating seva right. the SGPC has not had experts working on the Akal Takht rather than experts who are willing to do the work and reconstruct old frescos etc the SGPC has been inclined to take a Soho Rd type approach and not consult experts and get Kwik Fit painters in to do a bodge up job.

Where is the taking of his name through the mud. OK if he did not know he has been told about the dodgy seva on more than one occassion, is he big enough to stand up admit it was wrong and do it again ? NO. OK if he does not want to do that let him hire his own experts and get a professional opinion on the gold plating job.

Appears to me that peopel will try and protect the job he did to the hilt without any consideratio of the damage done to the Darbar Sahib.

Jeevan veer ji,

I cannot argue with your point, at the same time, I would like to stress that by no means is Khalistan the top item on the agenda of Young Sikhs - it is one of the issues - of course it is - and one of the issues that has great importance and requires a lot of thought, as proven by your post - this is one of the reasons it is on the agenda.

There has already been so much talk about Khalistan, not just over the past twenty years, but far longer... it's about time Young Sikhs had this on the agenda, to discuss the real possibilities, and the practicalities.... if not anything by way of land, at least Young Sikhs will realise the needs for Khalistan, and the requirements, before just shouting for it.

We have to learn for ourselves the points that you have made, and then work on these points, but if we don't keep these thoughts alive through these organisations, it will remain too distant a dream...

Just my thoughts.

Bhul chuk Maaf.

Agree with most your points but I would go even further and say Khalistan is a non issue. From extensive visits to Punjab I have not met one person who wants it.

If people in the west want it tell them to set it up in Smethwick or wherever the mass of Khalistan backers live.

There are more real pressing issues like the decline in the number of Sikhs in Punjab, the mis

suse of Sikh religious symbols i Punjabi pop videos (all very well demonstrating outside theatres but how about demonstrating against Jazzy B and Mika etc who wear large Khanda whilst dancing around half naked girls etc.), the destruction of our heritage by kar seva wale.

As for the points raised by Singh Shriomani about the lies about Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji in Indian text books what have the Sikhs in India done about it ? Very little. They could easily have filed a few lawsuits to put a stop to this.

Q. Was I and the millions of other Sikhs there when the Thanda Burj at Sirhind was clad in cheap white marble by Kar Seva wale and who criticise this bodge up seva ?

A. NO.

:wub: @ @ @ ä

Stop Singh!

You've made a wonderful post and show how big losers we are who don't ever care about our heritage being ruined by bulldozer baba.......

bhull chukk maaf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fa

teh!!

Thing is we now have to be careful as the "bulldozer" baba want to do seva on Gurdwara in Pakistan.

Just a few months ago we had the Sarna and co of the DGPC wanting to demolish Gurdwara Janamasthan Guru Ram Dass. They said the old structure was not sound. Funny that as when I went last April the structure looked more than sound to me and only required some restoration. No doubt some kar seva wala has now started job of cladding it in cheap white marble. I hope someone would clad some of these kar seva wale in cheap white marble.

The gold plating job is a bodge up whether you like it or not. If it is not ask soho Road wale to hire wold reknown heritage/restoration experts to disprove people like me !! :wub: ))))

Q. Let me ask you. Did the soho rd wale consult with experts before undertaking the seva ?

A. ANSWER IS an emphatic NO

Q. Have experts raised doubts over the seva after looking at the methods used to carry out the bodge up ?

A. Emphatic answer is YES.

Q. Does marble need room/space to breathe ?

A. YES

Q. Has the method used by Soho rd wale followed the old method for fixing the gold top the inner marble structure thereby allowing the marble to breathe ?

A. Emphatic answer NO.

Q. Could the bodge up method used lead to the marble beginning to crumble away and discolour ?

A. Emphatic answer...... YES

Q. Do Soho Rd wale know that experts have criticised the methods used ?

A. Emphatic answer .....YES

Q. Have they done anything to remedy the bodge up ?

A. NO.

Q. Did renovation/restoration experts raise doubts over the methods being used prior to and during the bodge up ?

A. Yes

Q. Was I and the millions of other Sikhs there when the Thanda Burj at Sirhind was clad in cheap white marble by Kar Seva wale and who criticise this bodge up seva ?

A. NO.

people, this is a site where youlearn, not cause fights or parcipate in fights, because that builds up alot of krodh in one, and are we here to build krodh or lose krodh?

point being ji, people have their beliefs, others have theirs, stopsingh, even some of the most light hearted jokes can cause offence, even if you think they are not offensive. because for all you know, someone could use this "joke", even perhaps to make someone give up rehat. from what i have seen here, it has caused offence, and once again admin has let something as such drag on and on and on, when the source of the offensiveness should have been deleted and the site could have progressed on other things.

gustaphi maaf

Read what I put and if you got to the bottom it clearly states :

"Only kidding, please do not try this on anyone as it is an evil thing to do "

Now if people are going to get their kachere in a twist over a joke then let them do so as I do not really give two hoots. The issue of meat is not a clearly defined and as such my post is not harmful.

Nothing to this dual nationality. It is not even proper dual nationality. The GOI has given the whole thing the name of Indian Overseas Citizen (IOC). You cannot hold 2 passports instead the GOI gives you a certificate which allows you to do everything an Indian passport holder can apart form vote in elections or stand as a candidate.

The only difference between this and the Person of Indian Origin card scheme is that IOC is for life and allows you to hold agricultural land.

Doubt it will lead to large inward investment into India as the bureaucracy is still there and makes doing business a total pain in the behind.

WJKK

WJKF

Who does the represent exactly?

Does the Sikh Federation (UK) represent ALL Sikhs i.e. Amritdharis, Kesdhari, Sahajdhari, Kesdhari, Patit, Ramgharias, Ravidasi, Balmiki, Ramdasia, Mazhbis, Bhatras, etc.?

What procedures have the  the Sikh Federation (UK)  put in place so that ALL Sikhs in the UK could be represented fairly and equally by them.

Your thoughts and views please.

No they dont represent everyone just a small minority. This is shown by the actual number of members they have and the small numbers who attend their annual convention where very little is actually discussed. They are a marginal organisation with no real backing.

Rather like the Dal Khalsa and SAD headed by SS Mann.

dued i dnt give a flying ................. if ur joking thats messed up...... learn to respect others and their beliefs.... i dnt care if ur jk'in ... this shouldnt have crossed ur mind and u shouldnt have posted it

Oooh ahhh, its great to wind people up and see them get their underwear in a twist. Being vegetarian is now a belief, did not know that. I suppose Jhatka is also a belief then.

As for giving flying ..........., at least my post was a light hearted joke and not a message with obscene/vulgar intentions conveyed by putting ............. to mask your vulgar language. I hope you have now washed your mouth out with soap. :wub:

....the bottom line is kashmir deserves its independance........and india has refused to allow kashmir to be heard peacefully......thus leading to increased militancy......sound familiar?

fateh!

Not very easy thing to get when Pakistan has on hand been asking for referendums then flouting the underlying principles of these referendum by giving away large areas of Kashmir to China and setling non Kashmiris in Pak Occupied Kashmir.

Indian diplomats have openly said implement the UN resolutions etc fully and the Kashmiris can have a referendum. Pak will no budge and it gives the GOI a good excuse to not hold a referendum.

waheguru ji ka khalsa, waheguru ji ki fateh!

i didn't want to post - i'm trying to cut down my posts - but this had to be said

firstly, those kashmiri sikhs were killed by the Indian Government, not by kashmir citizens

secondly, a kashmiri person is a kashmiri person - they have a right to fight for their country's independence from the terrorist fascist regime of the Brahmin Indian government (and at the same time remaining independent from the Fanatic Jihadist Fake-Muslims in Pakistan)

lastly, if you can support a khalistan liberation activist, why not a kashmiri liberation activist? essentially, all sikhs should be activists for the liberation of oppressed nations worldwide including kashmir, tamil nadu, nagaland, tibet, palestine, and khalistan.

just my two and a half cents.

waheguru ji ka khalsa, waheguru ji ki fateh!

I suppose you was there and took positive ids of the people involved in the brutal murder of the Sikhs that day that makes you so sure they were GOI agents. It is people like this who claimed that the GOI had destroyed the Sikh reference library but now claim it was stolen and with the CBI.

As for Kashmiri people being Kashmiri people, I suggest you go and preach that to the Kashmiris and the cut throat mercenaries/terrorists they host under the guise of freedom fighters

. Listen to what the JKLF have been saying for years about the terrorists operating as Kashmiri militants.

Any issue anyone, any Sikh would like to add is welcome, anyone and everyone is welcome.

So you going to add these to your agenda for the meeting ?

Young Sikhs Birmingham

A Humble Request To ALL Young Sikhs In Birmingham

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa!!

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!!

Guru Roop Khalsa Ji the General Meeting of “Young Sikhs” Birmingham will be held at Guru Nanak Gurdwara Smethwick (High Street, Smethwick), on Saturday 29th January 2005 at 7.30pm in the Tea Hall (Hall no: 1).

Issues:

· Self determination for the Sikh Nation (Khalistan)

· Establishment of State funded Sikh schools

· India’s Hidden Genocide - Campaign for Truth & Justice

· Promotion of the Sikh identity & the Panjabi language

Forthcoming YOUNG SIKHS/PANTHIC Programs

Young Sikhs works for the Chardi Kala and Unity of The Khalsa Panth. This is an important meeting in which issues regarding the Panth will be discussed, Issues discussed in this Meeting are issues that affect the Panth and every Sikh and Not Just one single organisation, anyone willing to join the federation is requested to come to the meeting.

Refreshments Will Be Available After The Meeting.

Any chance of adding a few topics which are of more importance at the present time eg :

The destruction of Sikh heritage by kar seva wale (including the bodge up gold plating job on the Darbar Sahib by Soho Road wale )

The need for a UK equivalent of SMART.

The need for young Sikhs to join mai

nstream political parties.

This is a great joke to play on people who are vegetarians.

If they come round make some normal sausages and serve them. As you are eating them make comments like "oooh these Linda Mcartney sausages tase like the real thing"

Or make egg purji and then say "oh that egg free powder really is good"

Only kidding, please do not try this on anyone as it is an evil thing to do :wub: ))))

The way i see it that quote doesnt justify eating meat, but it does say arguing about it over and over will lead to fruitless discussions and is pointless.

no it doesnt, it means that it doesnt matter if you dont do your paath/simran, it wont make a difference it you eat meat, or if you dont eat meat.

How doesnt it matter if you eat stuff like gelatin and glycerin? Meat is meat, if it comes from an animal it is meat. The animal was killed, and you are eating a part of the dead animal. There is no difference between eating pork or chicken, or eating another part of an animal that was made into glycerine or gelatin. How can you justify eating an animal in one form, and than justify why you dont eat it when its in another form? Is it really that big of a problem to read the ingredients on a package once in a while?

And yes, plants are alive too, but they dont feel pain like animals.

Can you prove that plants do not feel pain ?

Maybe scientists have no way of measuring pain to plants. :wub:

shoot that's embaressing-

i voted the odd time :wub: to say the least...

peoples... i'm the laziest person on the planet but that only took 3 seconds to vote (each time) and we would've got a much needed voice in the media

oh well... back to gorae and asian chumchae chattin ssssssssssssssugar about us as usual

Thats trouble with most apne people, to damn lazy to be bothered to press a few buttons in a web browser.

Then they complain they have no voice etc. Well if you want a voice you have to get off your behind and make your vote count.

Great stuff :TH:

Might as well stick to raw vegetables, dal and fruit. Avoid aubergines, I saw the rubbish they put down with the seeds and it is a deadly chemical.

Stopsingh, You have to stop attacking the SGPC as much as you do. Sure, the people that are running it are reeeeeeally screwed up. Granted, the maryada isn't the best, but they still should be (most of the time) obeyed. And Mahavir, Sikhnet is really messed up. The stuff they've been recommended isn't good at all.

No thank you. I will continue to write againt the SGPC until they reform it.

There is nothing Panthic anymore about the SGPC and as such it has lost the respect it once had. :wub:

The sGPC has for years been taking the crores of offerings from Gurdwara in Pakistan and Haryana and doing zilch for the people there. The Sikhs of Haryana have already raised a banner of revolt against the sGPC. Most of those elected to the SGPC were pro establishing a Haryana SGPC.

Open a new thread. Stay on Topic

If you want to carry on thinking the draft Rehat Maryada issued by the sGPC is pucca then you do that.