PaGaL_KuRi

149204[/snapback] i guess one more thing we have to remember is that many sikhs have come from hindu backgrounds and old habits are hard to break just like how sikhs belive in jagaas(holy tombs) etc they get that influence from islam. At our khoo(well) in punjab my baba's brother's family made a jaga(place) cause his wife had a fream in which some baba told her to make a jaga there for good luck...thsi kind of stuff is very prevalent in punjab right now, everyone and there mama has a "jaga" where people bow to..... 149266[/snapback] I know what you mean about Hindu upbringings. Even in my pind we have a 'Jaga' and I have to go there every time I go to India and do Matha Tekh, but I only do it for the happiness of my family.. that's something I won't be doing when I go in March. Thanks a lot. :TH:

humble_kaur I completely agree with your views and understand where you're coming from. You said that it's difficult to explain to people that it shouldn't be happening but if you can prove it to 1 person.. a kind of 'trend' could occur in which other people think 'oh look, that gurdwara doesn't do it, why do we?' if you understand what I mean. However, I completely understand you and would like you thank you for your views. Fateh

If you don't worship it, what's the point of it?

I don't mean to sound rude - and I'm sure what I'm about to state wasn't your attention. I'm about to say this for everyones benefit. (Guru Ji - refering to Guru Granth Sahib Ji) If Guru Ji said, don't cut your hair, you cut it - DISRESPECT If Guru Ji said, respect your parents, you disrespected them - DISRESPECT and IF GURU JI SAID, DO NOT DO IDOL WORSHIP, you did it - what is it?? DISRESPECT How many of you believe 'pics are nothing but a way to show respect to the Guru' are you ok?! I mean - they're totally against the whole idea themselves so how on earth is that showing them respect??? You're completely doing the opposite!!! They say NO so you go and do it? How does that work?? It's like your father saying don't smoke, you smoke, they find out, you get told off because you went against them, disrespected them. Respecting him would have been to follow what he stated! Bhul Chuk Maaf

Symbols are NOT God/Guru. I'd like to make this very clear Symbols (Ik OnKar, Khanda Sahib) are NOT.. NOT God/Guru It is a Nishaani, if you seriously believe that - then why do you wear a Kara (if you do) or keep your hair??? Wouldn't that also class as God if symbols do? Of course not! Bhul Chuk Maaf

I completely disagree with your opinion You're saying that we're coming up with defined rules - we're not doing such a thing. I've been taught that if you want to follow Sikhi, follow it properly and not just to a certain extent. I'm trying to understand why things are happening the way they are in our religion. There can be serious consequences if people are taught incorrect things. I completely understand where you are actually coming from yet still disagree. The truth about Sikhi can be gathered from one source and one source only - Guru Granth Sahib Ji and I'm sure you'll agree with me on that. Books written by other authors may be full of a load of bakwaas, but Guru Sahib is the only source we ought to follow and believe. If in Guru Sahib it says 'no idol worship' - why do Gurdware especially keep photographs as in my view - it's literally the same. Guru Ji's didn't want to be classed as anything special - by making photographs of them and refering to them as God. I mean, when someone asks you 'who is that?' pointing at a pic of Guru Arjan Dev Ji - what will be your reply? I'll be honest, I've told them that that's a Sikh God and I'm sure many of you have too. If this keeps happening - more confusion will develop. Gurdware should be the places disencouraging things as such, they shouldn't be following a 'trend' or however you'd like to portray it - they should be setting the right example but they're not and I personally feel this to be wrong! Bhul Chuk Maaf

You have a very strong opinion on this topic, I'm glad someone understands where my question actually came from. I'd just like to add onto the above quote. Not long? Haven't you been to 'Methi Wala' Gurdwara in India? On entrance there is a huge statue of Guru Gobind Singh Ji on his horse. Along side, you have statues created of the Sahibzade and other historical events. Doesn't this say it all? Now is the time to stop it... if things get any further, then think of the consequences: - The next generation could form a sort of 'mandar' at home in which the photographs are kept and they bow down to the photographs instead of going to a local Gurdwara... - Sikhi will no longer exist!!!! - Think about it, worshipping Guru Nanak Dev Ji's photograph and other photographs yet not listening to Gurbani etc - is that really going to be Sikhi?? I don't mean to be rude or anything, I mean even I have pictures of them up around the house, but thats due to my parents believing more into culture than religion and it's something I don't have control over.. Just think about it!

Fateh Ji I've taken in note the points you have made. The one point that has bugged me is the above quote. I'm not fussed over whether the portraits/pics/photos are real or not, I'm just concerned of the effect. People have started worshipping photographs, y'know 'matha thek de aah.' I personally believe that it shouldn't happen. It doesn't make a difference whether the picture is real or not - it's the influence. Bhul Chuk Maaf

Kharkoo4Life: Thank you for the amazing historical background. I wasn't aware of any of that - it's helped me a lot. So basically, photographs shouldn't be kept in Gurdware hunna? Gurdware are suppose to emphasise the importance of Gurbani and not visual images (which can be gathered by connecting with Gurbani) Thanks again.

Kharkoo4Life: Thank you for the amazing historical background. I wasn't aware of any of that - it's helped me a lot. So basically, photographs shouldn't be kept in Gurdware hunna? Gurdware are suppose to emphasise the importance of Gurbani and not visual images (which can be gathered by connecting with Gurbani) Thanks again.

Fateh Khalsa Fauji ji, thank you for the comment. I'd like to say, how you say that most Gurdware have pictures of Shaheeds up, the ones I go to, have a mixture of both. Inspiration? I can understand using inspiration as an excuse in homes, but when entered into a Gurdwara the sound of Gurbani is inspiration - so is there a need for them? Do they really serve any purpose in Gurdware? Bul Chuk Maaf

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh I've been working on the following question for over 3 days today, and I need to find an answer. I haven't been able to find one yet though and now have registered for this as I have heard great things about the Gursikhs using this. I will appreciate it greatly if anyone could give me an opinion, facts or anything that could help me reach a conclusion. The question: If Sikhs aren't suppose to worship statues or photographs, why are there photographs/pics of Guru Ji's up in Gurdware? Answers received so far: - "Photographs help people gain knowledge on who the Guru Ji's were so I believe they are necessary" - Sanveer - "I disagree with photographs as people make Calandars and other things using them but in the end they're thrown away or ripped up or just destoryed - no respect is shown for them so there is no need" - Kulvir - Well it’s true. Why put pictures up of Baba Ji in Gurdware if you can’t worship them? Doing an ardaas in front of Baba Ji’s picture, in my opinion, is as good as doing it in any Gurdwara as long as you do it from the heart (mean it). - Gully My opinion Guru Ji's have stated not to worship statues or photographs, so is there a need for them? The only thing in my opinion a photograph/picture can provide anyone is is with a visual image - does that make you a greater Sikh? I believe it doesn't. Guru Granth Sahib Ji has everything required that you need to or should know about Sikhi. If you are determined to learn about your roots, then you could easily pick up a book, listen to Paath, speak to someone that knows what they're talking about. I believe photographs/pictures aren't required on calandars either as a reminder of who your Guru Ji's are and to remind you what Sikhi is. We have a Kara, Kesh, Kashera, Kirpan and Kanga to do this. We have Guru Granth Sahib Ji, Kirtan, Shabads and so on. In conclusion, I myself believe that there is no need for pictures/photographs up in Gurdware and I also believe that having them up in langar halls or where shoes are taken off is utter disrespect so wouldn't it just be better to not have them in the first place? I do not intend to disrespect anyone. I just am very interested in a answer to this question. Everyones opinions are welcome, if any facts are known please feel free to share them as any bit of advice,factual info or opinions could help! Guru Ji Rakha PaGaL_KuRi