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13Mirch

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  1. How ‘cut Surd’ has stealthily gained currency among Indian Sikhs

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    3 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

    Not trying to be judgemental of monay , but definitely worth a read

    If any researcher wants to study identity, I recommend s/he choose Sikhs as subject.

    The name Sikh is derived from the Sanskrit word for disciple or learner. Guru Nanak revealed God as a formless, divine intelligence shared by all faiths and agnostics alike. In his world-view, hierarchies of caste, gender, class and religions were delusions.

    Guru Gobind Singh, the last of the living gurus, also described God as identity-less. 

    "Chakkar chehun arr barrn jaat ar paat nehan jeh; roop rang arr rekh bhekh kou keh na skat keh," he wrote, meaning God, or the supreme intelligence, bears no outward features - physical form, colour, dress, symbols or lineage.

    Rationalists then wonder why followers of this philosophy are required to wear their faith on their sleeve if the spiritual force they believe in itself is symbol-less.

    Let me attempt an answer to this question. The turbaned Sikh identity is no imitation of God in the first place. Guru Nanak's God is inimitable.

    Secondly, identity, in a wider perspective, is never a static representation of orthodoxy. On the contrary, it evokes a sense of connection with history and ideals.

    The Khalsa identity, which Guru Gobind Singh in 1699 institutionalised and of which uncut hair wrapped in a turban is the most striking aspect, is a focal point for the Sikhs to navigate something that unites them in the public sphere.

    It's not a certificate of virtue. Definitely not.

    In fact, in one of his writings incorporated in Sri Guru Granth Sahib, Kabir, the great mystical weaver-poet, declared: "Kabir preet ikk sio keeay aan dubidha jaye; bhavaiy laambey kes kar, bhavaiy gharar muddaye (duality and alienation depart when you love God. It's then immaterial whether you have long hair or a shaven head: Kabir)."

    The turbaned Sikh identity, therefore, is not a stamp of spirituality but a corollary of a revolutionary journey from Guru Nanak to the Khalsa of Guru Gobind Singh. It helps Sikhs connect with their history, more so when reading it is not so common.

    But the same Sikh identity remains too glaring for the world outside to accept it readily. If you wear it, you cannot hide it. And when you can't hide it, be prepared for some reaction, especially when intolerance mounts. It happened in 1984. It happened 250 years ago during Islamist invasions.

    turban_081217052933.jpgIf you wear it, you cannot hide it. Photo: Reuters

    And it still happens - from strange looks on the streets of New York or a full-blown assault by some supremacist in some part of the United States.

    Let's admit that this identity is not a fashion although some of us have been trying to promote it on the ramp for a couple of decades now.

    But the Sikh identity is rapidly declining in the heartland of the faith, Punjab.

    Young Sikhs in the region are finding the turban a bother. They feel smarter without it than with a six-metre of cloth wound around their heads.

    I am not sure there's any data, but it's widely believed this rejection of the religious headgear gained momentum in the early 1990s. Many factors contributed to it: alleged police excesses during the Punjab unrest, India's sudden economic boom and growing urge among the youth to merge with the rest of the world, mainly under diasporic influence.

    Earlier, the phenomenon was pronounced largely among college-going Sikh students. They would forego of their "Sikh pride" in order to be more modern.

    But now, the young breed doesn't wait that long. Aided by their parents, many children from the community, especially in rural Punjab, appear to be getting haircuts before 10-12.

    Around 2,40,000 results show up when you Google "cut Surd". That's how potential clean-shaven Sikh grooms are being advertised on matrimonial sites, with additional qualifiers like "handsome" and "smart".

    It seems an identifiable Sikh disappears in Punjab every day.

    But far-off, in Europe and North America, the turban is undergoing a stunning revival.

    Diasporic Sikhs, many of whom can be credited or blamed for setting the "cut-Surd" trend back home, are re-embracing their identity rapidly.

    Perhaps, they have realised the futility of shedding it to play to the white man's gallery. They appear to have understood cultural cross-dressing is no gateway to raising their racial profile.

    People of colour, the Chinese, Mongols, Vietnamese and so forth, earned a place in the western world not by painting themselves white or by undergoing plastic surgery.

    Sikhs also worked hard as much as others did, but many of them compromised their turbans to please their foreign hosts.

    Not anymore. They now know they can stand out boldly, as a powerful lobby, in multinational, multicultural milieus with - and not without - their visible tradition.

    But what about Punjab and India, the cradle of the religion? "cut-Surd" advertisements reflect high levels of acceptance at home of identity-less Sikhs.

    It's a deep cut on the faith's umbilical cord. And that's not cool, man.

    http://www.dailyo.in/variety/sikhism-turban-guru-nanak-intolerance-indian-diaspora-punjab-cut-surd/story/1/18926.html

     

     

    'A corollary...' is this guy an <banned word filter activated> or something?

    0

  2. Can a sikh girl marry a hindu boy ?

    in GUPT FORUM

    Posted

    21 hours ago, jkvlondon said:

    and his complexion is shiny like a perfectly seasoned tawa.Just be aware that all the violence against women and flippant misogyny springs from UP's wonderful soil , just check all Indian news over the past decade.

    Surprisingly, the forum's very own neo-liberals haven't arrived on this thread yet. Their noses blocked or something? 

    0

  5. Can a sikh girl marry a hindu boy ?

    in GUPT FORUM

    Posted

    On 8/7/2017 at 4:08 AM, Guest paiyyani said:

    I am a sikh girl from punjab. My age is 25. I fallen in love with a hindu guy originally from UP but now settled in punjaab. He is really handsom and I love him a lot. But my family is sikh sardar. My boyfriends mother is saying the child will be raised as hindu and all hindu ceremonies will be performed on future son like mundan, ear peircing, janeu. I told my parents. Their parents met my parents and my parents are ok with it. my father and mother is amritdhari still they are allowing me to marry a hindu boy and future son will be hindu without turban. I am ok with it. But my local gurudwara granthi telling me its not good. and some aunties also telling same. I am confused . Please tell what I should do. 

    My other 2 sikh friends have also married good looking hindu boys but I dont know if I am doing right thing although i like him. 

    These posts always crack me up. You will probably do whatever you want to and are only asking this question so you can acquire some sort of moral ratification for your intent. Is this how weak our women have grown now? They will throw away their virsa for those people who were the foremost in opposing their forefathers from day one? 

    2

  6. Who Are Good New Kirtan Ragis For Shabard Kirtan Download

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    On 8/22/2015 at 5:39 AM, morrakh said:

    I want to download shabads from internet and i want to know which ragis kirtan i can download.

    I know these only . There may have cpme new ragis which i may not be familiar with. please let me know

    Bhai Harjinder Singh ji

    Bhai Joginder singh Riar

    Bhai Ravinder singh ji

    Bhai nirmal singh khalsa

    Bhai satvinder singh ji delhi wale

    Let me now more names which are good to hear

    Bhai Balbir Singh Ji Raagi. 

    0
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    Miri-Piri in Sikhi.

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    The Sikh Theory of Dual Sovereignty. 

     

    The three paramount aims of Nanakianism, ab initio, are:

    1.) The reorientation of the individual from a base creature- a creature of the senses- to a spiritually attuned and intuitive being.

    2.) The consecutive reorientation, and arraignment, of societal atrophy vis-a-vis equality and universalism.

    3.) The establishment of a corporate base from whence the downtrodden and oppressed can be made to realize their status as founts of all civic authority and be steeled to resist both socio-political and politico-religious tyranny. 

    Guru Nanak Dev Ji, the initiator of the ethos, openly decried the incumbent powers of his time who continually eschewed the fundamental rights of their subjects. A witness to both Brahminical (Caste) and Shariat (Islamic) totalitarianism, the Guru sundered his acolytes from traditional Indic spirituality which emphasized a quietist attitude towards life and mandated the spiritual seeker to retreat from societal concerns. (1) Via the Guru’s perception, both ruler and the ruled were equally culpable in the atrophy of the socio-political paradigm,

    ‘The emperors be insatiable beasts, their viziers be the curs. The Age is a knife, the kings be the butchers. In such darkness, the moon of morality is nowhere visible.’ (2)

    ‘…the subjects, blind, and devoid of knowledge divine pay bribes to satisfy their overlords’ avarice.’ (3) 

    His was a faith which challenged the individual to offer their head, figuratively and literally, in pursuit of societal betterment and resistance in face of authoritarian oppression. (4) Rejecting the Semitic theory of man’s inherent imperfectness, in toto, the Guru bowed to his acolyte Angad and nominated him as his successor. The ideology of Nanakianism, thus, was identified as being paramount than the corporeal body. Angad who imbued it in full was transformed into Nanak II whilst his predecessor discarded his own mortal coil for the heavenly realms having laid the edifice of a Sui generis faith and nation. It was, essentially, the continuation of a revolution which in time would herald the raising of a corporate entity dedicated to challenging the might of all absolutist states and their pretensions of being the sole focal points of all dedication and loyalty.

    The arraignment and subsequent execution of Guru Arjan Dev Ji, Nanak V, at the hands of the theocratic Islamic Mughal state- far from altering the complexion of the Sikh faith as most modern historians contend- acted as a catalyst for Nanakianism’s rapid evolution. Acknowledging that the times were not conducive for dialogue Guru Arjan advised his successor to arm himself, and after investing himself with sovereign regalia, to raise an army and construct a seat of power. It was in the latter vein that Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji ascended the steps of the newly constructed Akal-Takhat in 1606 A.D. and, after having been coronated  Guru, promulgated the principle of Miri-cum-Piri or dual sovereignty. Nanak Ihad mandated his acolytes to accept the worldly life in full and the responsibilities it entailed. Nanak VI not only renewed this mandate but explicated it in full through the concepts of Miri and Piri. This principle of dual sovereignty, fundamentally speaking, posited that the individual was the fount of all political authority and that he/she must owe their allegiance to truth and morality (5) rather than any political state. The state, as Schulse, contends cannot lay claim to absolutism and divine perfectness without forfeiting it’s right to rule as the very notion of it’s perfectness is imperfect. (6) Such a state would necessarily lay claim to the right to govern not only the bodies but also the minds of it’s subjects exclusively which is a hazardous and Orwellian notion in all respects. The unfolding of Sikh history from the 17th century onwards, then, must be analyzed in the light of the Miri-Piri doctrine in order to grasp the antagonism which the faith-cum-nation has continually displayed towards historic and post-modernist states. 

    The salient facets of Miri-Piri, generically, stipulate that:

    1.) The State is self-limited and cannot lay claim to absolute perfectness irrespective of it’s governing model.

    2.) The government of any State is Primus inter paras rather than potentate as the subjects of a state are the focal points of all civic authority and not the government itself. (7) 

    3.) Truth and morality outweigh political prerogative(s). 

    4.) The State is an expression of power, it’s government the tool to exercise this power. The individual, essentially, is the fount from whence this power originates.      

    Vis-a-vis the Khalsa, the collective body of the Sikhs, the doctrine is more explicit:

    1.) The demarcation between State and Faith must be reflected in the set-up of any political entity qua the Sikhs; faith -in this case- means righteousness and when the State digresses from it the Sikhs are to initiate dialog with the powers that be or ,failing that, resort to the sword. Guru Gobind Singh Ji, Nanak X, aptly sums up this principle in his Zafarnamah:

    ‘When all forms of tolerance and mediation are breached, it is righteous to resort to the sword (force)…’ (8) 

    2.) The Sikhs, as per their own metalegal charter, must be dealt with impersonally i.e. through the aegis of impersonal law rather than arbitrary self-will. (9)

    3.) The State must generically realize that it is a tool and governance is a privilege. The government is Primus inter paras and it should realize that in due course it’s perceptions will clash with those of other civil groups. It cannot lay claim to absolutism, perfectness and/or an individual’s pristine loyalty. (10) 

    4.) The Khalsa- corporate collective of the Sikh nation- being a body of the pristine, has been bequeathed the sovereignty of both the spiritual and temporal realms. When dealing with it, the State cannot atomize it into singular figures vis-a-vis political policy.  (11) 

    Following protracted discussions with Bahadur Shah, the fanatical Aurangzeb’s successor, Guru Gobind Singh Ji initiated the occultist Madho Dass into the Khalsa and re-named him Banda Singh Bahadur. Bahadur, now reformed from his ascetic ways, was dispatched to the Punjab as Commander-In-Chief of the Khalsa forces; his mandate, if put simply, was to avenge the atrocities committed on the Guru’s Sikhs and pave the way for Halemi-Raaj or a just State. Parleys with Bahadur Shah had been blocked by the latter himself who was unwilling to efface his predecessor’s bigoted Shariat policies leading to the realization of the Guru’s above mentioned maxim. (12)

    Banda Singh and the Khalsa vanguard broke the Mughals’, otherwise, tenacious grip on the Punjab through a protracted guerrilla war in which they were supported by the Punjabi peasantry. In 1710 A.D. a coalition of the Khalsa and the peasantry succeeded in annihilating the Mughal bastion of Sirhind and over-running it. Declaring the commencement of Sikh reign, as a result, the Khalsa minted coins with the herald:

    ‘Triumphant, the Khalsa asserts it’s sovereignty in both the worlds seen and unseen.’ (13)

    Weathering a century long persecution, the Sikhs stuck to their guns until they ultimately  succeeded in establishing the Halemi-Raaj envisioned by their Gurus. During the darker days of their existence they were offered many respites by their persecutors. The Afghani hordes, lead by Ahmad Shah Durrani, offered them a treaty on condition of them accepting vassalage. Taking affront, the Khalsa blatantly refused and continued it’s crusade against the foreign aggressors. Ratan Singh Bhangu describes the prevailing  Sikh spirit thus:

    ‘…the Khalsa, then, replied: “who has ever bestowed political power for the asking?” There is no meeting ground between the Turks and the Singhs…’ (14)

    Vassalage was never-and never will be- the Khalsa ideal; full sovereignty is the Khalsa’s aim for the implementation of Halemi-Raaj. The question which naturally emerges, here, is that how does the principle of Miri-Piri correspond with current political setups? Let us analyze the four current political state setups viz the welfare state, the communist state, the modern democratic state and the theocratic state to answer this query.

    The welfare state, as described by S. Kapur Singh, consists of four elements namely:

    1.) Ubiquitous responsibility for providing equal opportunity to all constituents irrespective of prior/present situation(s). (15)

    2.) Ubiquitous responsibility for providing equal financial security for the aged, infirm etc. 

    3.) Ubiquitous responsibility for implementing and collating taxes in order to reduce the margin between the “haves” and “have not’s.” 

    4.) Ubiquitous responsibility for utilizing all available resources.  

    Welfare, as a political principle, however is a welfare state’s main leverage in imposing upon the individual. When one of the aforementioned elements are accepted, the others naturally follow. (16) This model of state, then, posits a quid pro quo formulation where slavery is the price of security. (17) Once this formulation is placed in the hands of the power-hungry, the subjects are logically rendered apolitical. Welfarism, as a political philosophy, is best summarized by Aristotle in his description of tyranny:

    ‘the humility of the subjects; the disunity of subjects, and consecutively, the inability of the subjects to unite…’ (18) 

    Nanakianism, though emphasizing universal welfare, differs radically from the current mode of Welfare i.e. the welfare state. True welfare, on an universal scale, cannot be imposed externally but only achieved via the internal transformation of an individual; (19) for this particular reason, Miri-Piri does not correspond with the welfare state. 

    The communist state, seemingly flawless in theory, posits the supremacy of the state vis-a-vis the individual and the latter’s loyalty. Speaking historically, communist states have continually followed a generic trend:

    1.) The notions of equality and fairness are translated into the daily economic life of the proletariat.  

    2.) Complications arise and a governing group arises which captures power.

    3.) Eventually falling to corruption, the communist government assumes the mantle of the state and vice versa.

    4.) The state-cum-government being the sole master of all economy, all dissent is brutally suppressed. Akin to any other political model, the individual is sacrificed for the good of the government. (20)   

    Owing to it’s swift and logical devolution towards totalitarianism, communism by no means can coexist with Miri-Piri. 

    The modern democratic state, laudable for it’s constitutional principles, is anathema to Miri-Piri as it represents a centralized form of political supremacy i.e. a ‘one man, one vote’ (21) system of governance. Though paying lip service to the rights of minorities, the modern democratic state annuls their very existence by cutting down on their representation vis-a-vis political administration. The recent history of the Sikhs, in independent India, reflects the inherent failings of modern democracy in toto. Outnumbered, the minority is often forcefully subsumed by a bellicose majority with democratic institutions often acting as legal ratifiers of the latter course of action. 

    Owing to it’s basis in the Sikh faith, it is often assumed (mistakenly) that Miri-Piri envisions a theocratic state along the lines of the Islamic caliphate etc. The theocratic state, or political theophany, promulgates the unity of religion as being a prerequisite for the unity and continuity of the state. This unity is achieved on the basis of the motto, cuius regis eius religio or let my ruler’s faith be my faith. (22) Simultaneously, theocracy also emphasizes the salvation of the subject’s soul as it is believed that the true purpose of all political activity is to be found in the next world and not this one. (23) Nanakianism perceives this world as being real thus opposing the very basis of theocracy. Secondly, it does not permit the implementation of cuius regis eius religio as it believes in the freedom of conscience out of which arises an individual’s civic power. The relentless rebellion which the Sikh launched against the Indo-Islamic/Hindu polity, thus, was essentially an attempt at effacing political theophany and undoing the tyranny of the theocratic state.

    Miri-Piri, if it is to be summarized appositely, emphasizes the socio-spiritual freedom of the individual which is constantly in danger of being suppressed by the state. The Sikh aphorism, baagi or badshah; rebel or ruler is essentially the faith’s answer to all such states who coerce the individual into a subtle slavery of sorts vis-a-vis the continuation of power and the extinction of all non-conformity. A proud people, the Sikhs have rarely tolerated state encroachment on their rights. The maxim Raaj Karega Khalsa not only sums up their principle of dual sovereignty but also acknowledges the prime role which polity plays in the day-to-day life of individuals. As such, any atrophy in the political paradigm can only be arraigned if the individual recognizes his true worth; this is why, then, the Sikhs have continually been a thorn in the sides of all powers who have ever had the misfortune to cross swords with them. 

    Sources:

    (1) Sri Gur Panth Prakash, vol. i, S. Gurtej Singh (2015); pg. xx-xxi. 

    (2) ASGGS, referenced in Political Attitude of Guru Nanak, Balwant Singh Dhillon; quoted in Journal of Sikh Studies. 

    (3) ASGGS; quoted by Macauliffe, vol. i, pg. 232. 

    (4) Martyrdom in Sikhism, Institute of Sikh Studies (2004); edited by Dr. Kharak Singh, pg. 61-paper presented by Brig-Gen. (retd) Hardit Singh. 

    (5) Singh K; Theo-political Status of Sri Darbar Sahib. Article accessed from Sikhsiyasat.net.  

    (6) Deutsches Staatstecht, vol. i, sec 16; referenced by Singh K in Theo-political Status of Sri Darbar Sahib. 

    (7) Ibid. 

    (8) Zafarnamah, Sri Dasam Granth Sahib. 

    (9) See Singh K; Theo-political Status of Sri Darbar Sahib. 

    (10) Ibid. 

    (11) Ibid. 

    (12) Habib I; Guru Gobind Singh and the Sikhs of the Khalsa: Reports from Bahadur Shah’s Court, 1707-1710.’ 

    (13) Though different historians provide different transliterations, the essence is virtually the same- the Khalsa rules supreme in both the spiritual and temporal realms as represented by the cauldron (charity/spiritualism) and temporality as represented by the sword. 

    (14) Sri Gur Panth Prakash, vol. ii, transliterated by Gurtej Singh, pg. 921. 

    (15) Singh K; Sikhism for the Modern Man, pg. 74-75.

    (16) Ibid. 

    (17) Ibid, pg. 76. 

    (18) Accessed from http://www2.idehist.uu.se/distans/ilmh/Ren/flor-mach-aristotle-tyrant.htm

    (19) Sikhism for the Modern Man, pg. 75-76. 

    (20) Ibid. 

    (21) Ibid, pg. 78. 

    (22) Ibid. 

    (23) Ibid. 

    Accessed from: https://tisarpanthdotcom.wordpress.com/2017/08/06/of-miri-and-piri/

    4

  8. In Defense of Baba Banda Singh Bahadur

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    9 hours ago, chatanga said:

     

    Is this hukumnama or a translation of it available to read online anywhere? If not a book where it is written?

    Thanks

     

     

    Yes please. Thanks. I heard it a long time ago (poss 10 years) but would rather not have to trawl through all my tapes to find it.

     

     

    I never knew that Baaj Singh survived Delhi. Had always thought he was shaheed. If you consider the sakhi of the Sikh boy who was shaheed (even though his mother protested that he wasn't a Sikh) it seems a little weird that Baaj Singh would prefer to survival rather than shaheedi with his comrades.

     

     

     

    Where are you reading/hearing that 4 of the 5 Pyaras remained with Baba Ji?

     

     

    From what I have been told. at Gurdas Nangal, there was a difference of opinion over tactics. The same scenario at Anandpur Sahib when some Sikhs were of the opinion to leave the Qilla and fight the enemy/escape. Baba Binod Singh Ji was of the opinion to face the enemy and fight whereas Baba Banda Singh wanted to hold out against their seige. Those that wanted to try and escape the seige/fight the turks left with Baba Binod Singh but they were not held back by Baba Banda Bahadur either. He gave all the Sikhs there the choice to remain or chance their luck.

     

     

    Bhai Rattan Singh Bhangu is not the only writer to have written this. BHai Kesar Singh Chibber has written the same in "Bansawalinama".

     

     

    It would be great if someone could. I would like to read them as well. Thanks.

     

    If anyone wishes to listen to ongoing katha of Panth Parkash here is the link:

    http://www.gurmatveechar.com/audios/Katha/02_Present_Day_Katha/Nihang_Giani_Sher_Singh_(Ambala_wale)/Pracheen_Panth_Parkash_Katha/Nihang.Giani.Sher.Singh.(Ambala.wale)--Pracheen.Panth.Parkash.Katha.-.Part.01.-.2014-10-01.-.Sri.Guru.Panth.Prakash.01.mp3

    http://www.gurmatveechar.com/audios/Katha/01_Puratan_Katha/Sant_Jarnail_Singh_(Bhindran_wale)/41_Questions_with_Sant_Jarnail_Singh_Ji_Bhindrawalae/Sant.Jarnail.Singh.(Bhindra.wale)--41.Questions.with.Sant.Jarnail.Singh.Ji.Bhindrawalae.Part.01.mp3

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  9. In Defense of Baba Banda Singh Bahadur

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    18 hours ago, Jonny101 said:

    Yeah and some should post pages of Dr Ganda Singh's book disproving them

    Ganda Singh had nothing substantial. Prof. Puran Singh, Dr. Trilochan Singh and S. Kapur Singh often criticized his shallow reasoning. He attempts to argue, in A Short History of the Sikhs vol. i, that Guru Gobind Singh Ji perceived the Khalsa and Mughals to be parallel in the socio-political field given that both were creations of Sri Akal Purakh Vaheguru. S. Kapur Singh and Dr. Trilochan Singh, both, disprove this nation by analyzing the original verse in the Bachittra-Natak which postulates that those who discard truth and morality often become prey for politico-religious state tyranny. 

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  10. In Defense of Baba Banda Singh Bahadur

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    3 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

    I think there is a big problem with any reductionalist approach.  I think acting like we could know everything is the depth of stupidity myself. History is fascinating and interesting, especially when we find new things out. It also depends on how you use it. Let's take the Banda Singh example:

    Person 1 might say: "Oh, that's disrespectful to Banda Singh, these writers were motivated for x,y reasons. etc. etc."

    Person 2 might say: "Well, we've got fascinating information here, we get to expand our language skills reading this stuff (a continual struggle for the diaspora). It keeps us away from other waste of time stuff like watching BB. Also (crucially) we've got a non-whitewashed example of leadership  during a crisis in the narrative  and we could analyse many of the issues that come up from this and learn from them."

     I'd say people who have problems which such accounts generally do so because they've turned our puratan ancestors into some sort of demi-gods (which I note is post annexation phenomena) and have dehumanised them and in light of this, so now they cannot grasp the importance of the writings because it conflicts with their preconceived notions. The Singh Sabha approach to historiography is largely responsible for this, because many of those people (I imagine through close contact and education with christians and anglos during the colonised period) imbibed their values and worldviews and judged their own ancestors in light of their 'education' or mental conditioning.

    What shocks me is that people don't grasp that if hypothetically today, we had to fight it out as a community, we are pretty much guaranteed to see similar issues of some people not being happy with any leader, and differences arising. This will inevitably lead to fractures ala Bandai and Tat Khalsa. One key thing to take from the narrative, is that despite that, Singhs still persevered. 

    Another key fact that Bhangu's critics fail to recognise is that Bhangu himself narrates how later (after Banda's demise) when the going got super tough with the moghuls, he records how the Tat Khalsa lamented Banda Singh's loss and wailed about how if he was still there, he'd had dealt with the moghuls and they wouldn't have been suffering like they were. 

    There was an Ardass performed for Baba Ji's chardi kala at Sri Darbar Sahib by the Tat Khalsa.

    0

  12. In Defense of Baba Banda Singh Bahadur

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    1 hour ago, Jonny101 said:

    Finally, someone has done a good job in defending Baba Ji. Although I think they could have done even more but even a little bit is good in defending Baba Ji. many snatanis will not like this one bit. It is understandable since they have tried very hard to demonize Baba Ji with lies and pure Nindya. But Baba Banda Singh Bahadur is like the moon. Those who try to spit at the moon will soon regret it when their own spit lands back on their face.

    People do not realize how much Paap they are burdening themselves under by doing Nindya of a Brahmgiani like Baba Ji. We had some Nindaks tried to do the same to Sant Jee but no one listens to them anymore. Same is with Baba Banda Singh Bahadur. Baba Jee is very much respected by the Sikh masses as a spotless Sikh personality. And God willing, Baba Jee's memory and prestige will be enhanced even more in future

    I replied back to you on a similar discussion regarding this particular topic. There, you ran away with your tail between your legs when I put up an audio clip in which Sant Jarnail Singh Ji concurs with Bhangu's perception of Baba Banda Singh. Want me to put it up one more time?

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  14. Sikh king for Britain

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    On 6/30/2017 at 7:55 PM, silverSingh said:

    I too support the establishment of this long awaited section.  I would love to live and share all my fantansies with you lovely and nice people on here. 

    I have a picture in my mind, now, which is freaking me out. For some reason it includes a bath tub and bubbles. 

    2

  15. Sikh king for Britain

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    17 hours ago, Mahakaal96 said:

    How about you send your mum to go get impregnated  by Prince William so your dream of a future Sikh King of the UK can maybe become a reality? 

    Mods can you make a new fantasy/fairytale section on the site for the deluded, low intellect retards that frequent this site?

    Really has got to be my last visit to this site, some of the rubbish on here could induce brain damage 

    I second the establishing of such a section.

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  16. Sikh king for Britain

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    11 hours ago, silverSingh said:

    You forgot to mention the KFCs, MCDs, GJ and the PHs. How can you forget to mention these when we know that almost 99% of the population cannot survive without them.  If we ever mangage to create an independent state for ourselves we will have to rely on all of these otherwise we might as well forget it.

    Most important is Nandos; whoever Nando supports will win. 

    1

  18. Sikh king for Britain

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    11 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

    It's true. What we need is a small governing group (5 would be an ideal number given our heritage). These shouldn't be the usual backward, semi-illiterate peasant types but highly educated, intelligent and independent thinking people, who aren't constrained by weak personalities that can easily be manipulated by outsiders.

    Actually the Constitution of Khalistan suggested this system as well. It was never implemented owing to a split between the Kharkoos. The BKI, KLF, KCF (Sohan Singh faction), Rode and co. supported a settlement with the Indians; the KCF, BTFK (essentially the First Panthic Committee) stood by the concept of full independence. 

    1

  19. Sikh king for Britain

    in WHAT'S HAPPENING?

    Posted

    14 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

    Yeah, and we should NEVER let English people anywhere remotely near power again because they repeatedly abuse it. 

    Look where one-man rule got the Sikhs in the past. King dies, no capable heir and badoom!!!! Another fall from grace.

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