superkaur

14 hours ago, Kira said:

Didn't you already make this thread? like a year or so ago?

yeah seems weird he seems to have had racism problems with two different managers or the same one but they changed genders? I'm confused too

21 minutes ago, BhForce said:

Yeah, just as expected, it's the one-man propaganda team of Ron Bandarjee (sp.). I think he's a Bengali. I think he must think "who are these turbanned and bearded people from Punjab?" And hates us just because we are foreign to him (as a Bengali). Perhaps Sikhs in Canada should work to get a parliamentary declaration against "Hindu apartheid" (the caste system). Use the term "Hindu apartheid" for maximum effect.

Good idea if you got ways to implement it, there needs to be more people politically aware of canada based hindu extremists. I'm sure canada must have some laws against hate speech and calls to violence all which ron bannerjee has advocated against Sikhs in the past. I'm amazed no canadian Sikh group has got the authorities to take action against him and his racist hindu jewish group of nutjobs.

This one man group + a handful of canadian jewish extremists + social media / internet can be quite powerful if you spread hate against your victims to violent ignorants.

Remember hitlers mein kemp and views was just that. It was all in the head of one deranged man until he spread his hateful views about jews and others by his book and speeches and soon there was mayhem against minorities in 1930s germany.

Ron bannerjee is a very ugly mentall ill hindu bengali extremist but dangerous also because of his ability to spread  evil the calls for violence and hate against sikhs, muslims and others.

29 minutes ago, SinghG said:

And there are Hindu Govt. undercover agents in canada, usa and other western countries who are working tirelessly against sikhs to damage our image as a community in front of western world. Recent examples are the attempts being made to spoil the leadership campaign of Jagmeet Singh.

 

True, so the question is how are we going to implement real life real world consequences for these  western / canada based hindu indian extremists let them know Sikhs will not tolerate this abuse any more. Its time for that fight back that push back to smash the face of indian hindu extremism and hindu terrorism as a collective group.

They need political outlawing and legal consequences for their hate advocacy against Sikhs and our faith.

Majority of Hindus are good people and often pro-sikh however there is a particular nasty fringe far right minority amoungst them that really hate Sikhs and Sikhi with a passion. The handful of canadian based Indian Hindu extremists were exposed before in this website.

So how do we combat the menace of hindu indian extremism especially in canada where they are openly targeting Sikhs online with anti-sikh propaganda especially on youtube, twitter and facebook. Are Sikhs not clever enough to create counter anti-hindu material and anti-hindu propaganda videos? Why does it seem majority of Sikhs especially in the west so tolerant of being abused online and offline..

Are Sikhs being lame sitting ducks again like 1940s and 1980s where their leaders preach love, co-existence and peace while their faith is getting slapped around and their paghs ripped off by evil hindu extremists and their allied Canadian racist jewish and "white" nationalists?

Check the links below this is just a handful of anti-sikh material by american and canadian based hindu extremists. And these propaganda pieces have real life consequences for innocent sikh civilians as they influence deranged people to attack our brothers and sisters.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4BF9fVygQckE1SjNXHiRzg

http://vancouver.mediacoop.ca/newsrelease/5748

http://www.risecanada.com/meet-senior-advisors/

http://www.sikh24.com/2013/08/19/exclusive-canada-a-safe-haven-for-anti-sikh-lobbyists-and-goi-agents/

Sikhism Exposed - YouTube

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:mJqgXA_a2cEJ:frontlinepunjabiyouth.blogspot.com/2008/04/hindu-man-wants-1984-to-happen-in.html%3Fm%3D0+&cd=15&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl

14 hours ago, TejS said:

And I'm not saying we should ignore what they're doing. All I am saying is we need to first know what is a Sikh, which most of our population does not know. You will find many so-called Sikhs agreeing with Rajiv Malhotra's claims, due to their lack of knowledge on Sikhi, so when our own stand divided, how can we combat these foreign forces as one united group. We can't stop these people from talking unless we combat it as a united force. When one Sikh will deny any relation to Hinduism, ten other Sikhs will stand up saying we are connected to them - so in the end, the struggle becomes useless and futile. We need internal reform, before we can combat these type of people.

And regards to the like of Sakshi and her anti-Sikh sentiment, well it isn't a new thing at all. It's always been present (think of Gangu) however with the rise of the BJP and Hindu nationalism in India, more and more people like her are becoming vocal about it. The reason we have to endure this, is because of the mistakes our elders made in not securing a separate country during the Partition. But our generation of Sikhs aren't any better, for we too are making similar mistakes as our elders. 

I'm sure Sakshi will be slammed with hate speech charges, perhaps a Sikh lawyer in India can get on this and escalate this case, although I think they're dealing with it: http://news.statetimes.in/police-probing-conspiracy-to-break-hindu-sikh-unity-search-for-sakshi-bhardwaj-intensified/

You are right

However this is not our fault as a people, this is the fault of external pressures from hindutva groups and SGPC our so called leadership they are happy to be subservient to RSS and New Delhi to avoid the troubles of 1980s 90s. And through lack of firm action and standing up for Sikhi they have created a generation of confused hindunised Sikhs which is exactly the thing they were trying to avoid in when they drew up the ill thought out rehit maryada to force all Sikhs become Khalsa's and pushing Sehajdhari Sikhs into the camps of Hindu punjabi Hindutva groups which in turn lead to troubles in punjab. The brahmin sena and shiv sena grew their hair long and beards wore turbans became fake khalsa's and killed Sikhs and innocents to give Sikh Seperatists a bad name in punjab. One way or another they will enforce their rule on us until we are truly free of them.

The brahmin and hindtuva groups will never stop trying to pull Sikhs and Sikhi into the fold of hinduism either through military and terrorist means as they did in 1980s 90s. Or through buying off or infiltrating Sikh orgs with keshdhari hindus posing as Sikhs like they have done in ancient past and do so presently.

Sikhs need to recognise this reality as fact first before we can move to a better future

2 hours ago, Big_Tera said:

Gurinder chadha master minded the whole thing

explain

2 hours ago, YOYO29 said:

This is pretty harsh word to use for him.Your leadership did not have many options at that moment.Siding with India was best available option back then.Loss of innocent lives is no doubt a tragedy but partition was the only way and Sikhs benefited from it to a great deal.

 

Imagine if there was no partition there would have been no Sikh majority Punjab today.You should also keep in mind that it was because of partition that for the first in the 500 years history of Sikhs that there is a state with Sikh majority.And master Tara Singh played a huge role in securing that state as it is evident from his interview with journalist Paul R Brass;

"1967, however, Master Tara Singh, whom I interviewed then and who was the principal political leader of the Sikh community 20 years earlier, said to me in words I have never forgotten: “We took the decision to turn the Muslims out.” By this, he meant the decision to attack violently the Muslim population in East Punjab to force them to migrate west so that the entire Sikh population in West Punjab would be able to migrate east to replace them and take their lands and property in exchange for what they would lose in the west"

Benefited how? by becoming majority in 1/3 of already halved punjab (between india and pakistan) and enslaved in the hindu majority Indian Union? Genocided in 1980s 90s. Golden temple attacked, books destroyed and looted. women raped, kids killed? What benefit?

And If his actions of drawing the sword infront of a crowd of baying mob of Muslim nationalists rallying for pakistan in 1940s is not the actions of a fool and is not an act of aggression then I dont know what is.

9 hours ago, jkvlondon said:

the first things they did was note then promptly destroyed the organisation and free education resources in each village, giving controlof the disadvantaged to their favourite bootlickers i.e. bahmin/musley ...whilst murdering the nihangs and custodians of the seena baseena knowledge of warfare, itihaas, sikh traditions. 

They then diminished our Maa boli's use , gurmat sangeet by introducing the missionaries' harmonium, victorian sensiblities and teadrinking (which they sold to us at exorbitent prices). WHen they packed up shop they made sure that they  handed over to trusted hands i.e. english educated yes men  ....did you not find it strange that all three were close , Jinnah, Nehru and gandhi- all had same profession: lawyers all went to england for their 'educations' ?

these yes men completed the task of making sure the working classes didn't think let alone become Sikhs , I mean they were the last to be conquered in the subcontinent and the first to rebel against control: with that kind of pedigree sikhs were dangerous to Bahmins and mullahs alike in turning the masses' heads against their flimsy mental reins of superstition and servility 

Totally agree. This is how they impose their culture their ideology their way of life on various peoples of the world they wanted to enslave and control and still do to this day with threat of economic sanctions or warfare.

11 hours ago, JSinghnz said:

Mind your language. Master Tara Singh was not a fool. He was a very strong and selfless leader.

It was Baldev Singh who was the traitor and sold the interests of Sikhs.

What do you mean mind my language? would you say the same thing if i had posted gurbani verses that mentions fools?

Besides whats wrong with calling Master Tara Singh a fool he was more than a fool he was a maha gadar fool. Every Sikh knows this except a few who havent studied what actions he did that led to catastrophe for not only his own family but the Sikh kaum as a whole.

Sikhs were an after thought and never in the equation of the British to be given independence and were expendable pawns to be used and abused for military adventurous-ism for the British empire in the chess board.

Its important to conclude and remember so that all those Sikhs who suck up to the racist british establishment and thinking they would have granted a separate Sikh nation had it not been for the foolishness of master tara singh (who was a fool) and the leadership do not realise what the British game plan was. Had they really wanted to they could have made exceptions for the Sikhs regardless of their population sizes in various area's of west punjab and given back the sovereignty they had stolen from them.

38 minutes ago, proactive said:

Very true even the western politician are well known to go back on promise so the Sikh leaders holding out any hope in the promises of banias like MK Gandhi and Bahmans like Nehru was the height of folly. 

With regard to British machinations it would have been easy for the British to sabotage so-called independence by giving the hundreds of native states the right to become independent. This would have left both India and Pakistan with huge areas of land out of their control and with their communications disrupted. 

The British if they required a foothold in South Asia could have easily made a deal with one the many native states when they took the decision to stay independent rather than join India or Pakistan. Look at the image below, all the yellow areas were native states 

 

Good point about letting native states becoming independent, however that was what happened a few of the states did not want to join india or pakistan. The most contentious of them being kashmir,  hyrderbad and sikkim where the Indian army was used to invade, dethrown the native leaders/maharajahs and force the states to join the Indian Union.

So the game plan of the British was to have a finger in many pies. Pakistan would become their main base and hub to conduct operations in south asia. India was going to be treated as a neutral or enemy state especially when the USSR soviet union had started to help Indian congress party govt in energy infrastructure and other development projects. And the native states that were outside the control of new delhi were going to be used as another convenient trading posts for British goods and commerce.

3 hours ago, Ranjeet01 said:

I have followed Rajiv Malhotra for a few years on social media.

He is clearly  a very intelligent man, accomplished in his field made a lot of money out of it before moving onto his Hindu pursuits. 

His main bone of contention is the western influence on Indian thought. His claim is that many institutes are anti-hindu.

He has a big problem with Christian missionaries. 

His method is to use purva rakshah  (or something very similar to that term) which means reversing the gaze on western intellectualism and do critical analysis on the west.

If you you-tube ,he has this presentation on the west with power-point and slides from an indic point of view. It is really quite insightful.

However,  even though his type have this intellectual arrogance where everything that came from India was the best and correct. The irony is his critique uses a western based framework to "reverse the gaze".

He calls himself an intellectual kashtriya. 

He is right about laying alot of the blame to the door of the British who left India in a mess and stolen all its resources and manpower only for UK's economic benefit.

However his response for religious minorities like us Sikhs wanting our own political autonomy or independence in the form of Khalistan is to say its only backed by pakistan or by the British in order to cause problems for Hindu India is wholly wrong. When the fact of the matter is Sikhs are a distinct religious group, who had their own sovereign kingdoms and an empire. And who are not safe or truly free in hindu dominated India where our concerns are not heard or taken seriously and enacted upon.

We also faced genocides and destruction to our places of worship under Hindu majority rule without justice or readdress of our grievances so it is legitimate for our community to have our own nation to safeguard our needs without Hindu / Indian nationalists like Rajiv and others complain that its all external entities (Pakistan or the UK/west) that are funding or propagating Sikh nationalism and separatism.

1 hour ago, Dsinghdp said:

The Muslim population were ready for partition and sharpened their axes to kill Sikhs and Hindus. The Sikhs and Hindus were saying there will be no Pakistan and only leaved the place when they heard the order on the speakers, for them to leave Pakistan.

Not really, it was the Sikh leadership that reluctantly wanted partition of punjab because Jinnah insisted on taking all of Punjab for pakistan. Yes the muslim mobs did start off the killings first possibly aided by the British in covert plans we may never know. Sikhs wanting political power, security and safety for their community were in an impossible position with terms imposed on them by the British. The Sikh masses and the Sikh military generals along with Sikh maharajahs of princely states of jind, nabha, faridkot were very against the idea of partitioning Punjab and losing their homes, holy gurdwara's, land and businesses in west punjab.

It was the Indian independence seeking leadership (master tara singh, akali dal's baldev singh and Bhupinder Singh the maharajah of patiala) that finally sided with indian national congress party to split punjab and join their lot with indian union rather than take up jinnahs offer of keeping the punjab unified under pakistan rule but with autonomy for the Sikhs. Congress also promised the Sikhs similar terms if they joined the Indian union they would get an area in northern india for autonomous rule and we have seen how they have gone back on their word and committed many genocides and massacres on Sikhs ever since.

The point is the mischief makers in all the mess of partition of punjab were the British establishment back in england because they knew exactly what they were doing in causing such catastrophe for the Sikh nation.

I was watching gurinder chandha's documentary recently where some interesting points where made about how jinnah had met winston churchill before partition where they had quite warm words exchanged in letters and held secret meetings with each other. Winston churchill hated the Indians especially brahmin hindus in his documents and overall opposed and hated the idea of india for wanting to leave the British empire. He also hated Muhammadans and Islam as he had stated it in documents yet when he talks to jinnah in letters he is said to have said warm words about Islam. Maybe he was lying to hide churchills real feelings towards both communities and get jinnah on his side.

So I'm wondering did churchill along with the British ruling classes (including royal family) deliberately get cripss to draw a line to divide punjab deliberately dividing nanakana sahib and amritsar knowing it would cause mayhem in the Sikh community enough for them to resort to take up armed resistance to resist the split of their homeland. Meaning violence would have been the deliberately objective by the british enough for it to be wide spread it would either:

1) Prevent the British leaving as Indians would be begging the British administration and army to stay on longer to control the violence and continue its governance.

or

2) Splitting the united india into two countries would be a parting revenge shot to the Indian's for their insistence of the British leaving. Also having pakistan as a base to continue their efforts in south asia would be handy since the Indians had enough of the British raj.

Churchill knew the Sikhs are a martial faith community, he know most of them come from punjab, he also knew they would fight to stop their holy places and land being left in muslim hands. It seems having known all these things the unforgivable act of partitioning punjab was a deliberate policy to ensure Sikhs were  used in the evil game plan.

1 hour ago, Ranjeet01 said:

Funny how we are a Sect of Hindus when it suits them and then we are massacred we are not. 

Have you seen any other sect of hindus treated like this. I don't see Sai Baba devotees given this treatment or Vaishnavites or Shaivites for that matter. 

True, we also didn't see Tamil hindu's massacred or discriminated against when Rajiv Gandhi was assassinated by a LTTE tamil tiger suicide bomber woman.

The RSS Hindu and congress mobs only went after Sikhs because they saw our people as "the other" and enemies of their hindu rasthra nation.

4 hours ago, TejS said:

Let him, or anyone for that matter say whatever they wish about Sikhs.

What truly matters is what we, as Sikhs, believe in. Do we truly believe that we are a sect of Hinduism, who uphold the caste system, do pointless rituals such as pilgrimages/fasts/idolatry, or do we believe none of that and follow only what's written in the GGS, and go about living life according to it? Because there are many so-called Sikhs that adhere to the caste system and conduct those mentioned pointless rituals, you can't help but see that our own people are agreeing indirectly through their actions to what Rajiv Malhotra is saying. However, if you are the latter type, then you should not be hazed by comments coming from such insignificant people and should stay firm in your way of life. 

The Hindus name-call us a sect, because they see us doing exactly what they do. Until our Sikhs don't follow the guidance of the GGS, such people will always exist. It is not their fault, it is ours. Let's not give them a chance to call us out on practicing their pointless rituals/caste-ism. When most of the Sikh population itself believes that Sikhs are very much a part of Hinduism, then why does it matter if an outsider says so. We need to change ourselves first, in order to change others.

I dont really care what him or other hindu's have to say about the status of Sikhi being hindu sect or not. But what I do care about is these anti-sikh influencing figures with a large social media following who then influence others to have anti-sikh thoughts as we have seen his posion has spread to that woman saskhi bhardwaj and other dumb hindu youths.

We cant bury our heads in the sands and think these guys dont matter cos they do, what they say does impact on how other hindus treat Sikhs and how they write about Sikhs on social media it does have real life consequences. He is like the piped piper that gossips and spreads rumours and entrances and enables others to have anti-sikh feelings.

8 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

The Islamic fallacy or the response? 

The whole article, seems like quite a studied and detailed response. So was wondering what the sources of it was.

On 8/30/2017 at 7:30 AM, S1ngh said:

yes! We sure do need a few active moderators. The reason why we don't keep new moderators is because in waaay past, we seen them deleting stuff because of their biased viewpoint. 

But it it's better to have a clean forum. We will contact few folks. Thanks for recommending some..

Yeah that was another issue that ruined the forum when there was too many Mods with their own biased options and drastic actions who kept deleting quite interesting threads or letting trolls abuse the topic enough for the topic to get closed down rather than the troll to be banned and their posts deleted.

I think the best way is to deal with this is if a Mod finds a topic controversial it should be moved to a controversial category so that it isn't locked down or deleted but can still be discussed in separate area. And it can always be moved back to general category if other Mods think its not that controversial and needs wider participation from users.

Who wrote this article? got a link to it?

I was watching some videos on youtube the other day and came across this old hindu guy called Rajiv Malhotra he seems to be influencing the younger Indian generation towards hindu nationalism. Evil Sakshi Bhardwaj the anti-sikh infamous hindu extremist who recently made highly offensive videos against Sikhs and Sikhi is a follower and admirer of this guy.

https://twitter.com/RajivMessage/status/5808820218718