confused10

Question: Master ji, we all know that it's very crucial to abstain from the eating of meat because this increases our karmas, but can you explain in more detail the reasons for becoming vegetarian?

Thakar Singh: We should not increase our burden of karmas as you have already said. There is karmic value in every kind of thing we use in this world. The air we consume, we have to pay for. The water we use, we have to pay for. The light of the sun or moon is also not free for us, and this green grass is also to be paid for - nothing is free. Depending on the "Jun" (life-form), there is a price to be paid. Lower life forms have a lower price to pay. Plants have a lower spiritual price than animal life forms. So why take the higher burden?

If you are to construct a house, you don't make it with gold or silver or jewels. If you can, you make the house with stone - Stone is very strong and cheap -- So, why don't you make your house with stone and bricks instead of gold? This body is like a house. Build it with material that is spiritually cheap and strong. Fruits and vegetables are spiritually cheap and they can make you spiritually and physically strong. Higher life-forms are expensive - and you will have to pay a higher price!

In the same way, if we can maintain a simple life style, with a spiritually lower cost - with this greenery, fruits, etc - then why attract so much burden and payment of karma by consuming higher life-forms? God did not really say that it is "burden-less" or it is all free. He has never explained it like this, but He has allowed us to have these lower forms because with our meditations we can release ourselves very quickly and easily and therefore we will not "over-burden" ourselves for a long time.

This is also the case with people who eat animals. Their nervous systems have been seriously disturbed and shaken. Even if you look at an animal that has been killed you will be emotionally affected; your nervous system will be disturbed and you will lose so much peace; you will not feel good and your heart will be affected by it. Look at a dying fish. It is out of water and if you look at it, for one or two hours or even some days your heart will not feel good. You will think of the condition of that fish and it will feel horrible and your heart and mind will be in some kind of perturbed state.

For months even this state of mind will continue. Maybe after a long time you will forget this scene and its effect will be gone from your heart and then perhaps you cannot remember it - still it has its effect. If just looking at a dead fish causes this then what will be the case when we eat it and all these negative vibrations enter into our system. So many diseases will come up and our mental systems will be disturbed.

But when we eat some greenery or fruit everything is wonderful. The plant produces the fruit for consumption by an animal so that the seeds can be transported to new places. In fact by eating the fruit you are doing a favour to the plant! - the fruit is a bait for the animal to do a function that the plant desires - That is the function of a fruit. If you look at fruit that is ripe the colors tell you so wonderfully that it is ripe. A fragrance is also available and when you smell it you enjoy it and even when you remember the smell you feel good. Your heart is also enjoying and your mind and body are at peace.

Q. Flesh-eaters often say to vegetarian Sikhs, if you eat only vegetables you are also taking life. What, then is the difference between taking the life of, say, a pig and that of a vegetable?

A. All the difference in the world. Does a potato cry out when it is taken from the earth the way a calf does when it is taken from its mother? Does a stick of celery scream in pain and terror when it is picked the way a pig does when it is being led to slaughter and is having its throat cut? And how sad, lonely, and frightened can a head of lettuce feel?

We don't need a polygraph to demonstrate that plants have consciousness of a sort, but this consciousness is obviously of a rudimentary kind, far different from that of mammals with well developed nervous systems. Nor do we need tests to prove that fowls and pigs and sheep experience pain to the same degree as human beings, for it is common observation that animals wince, howl, wail, and show terror when abused or injured and make every effort to avoid pain.

Actually many fruits and vegetables can be picked without killing or even harming the plants. These include berries, melons, legumes, nuts, seeds, pumpkins, and many other vegetables. Potatoes are taken from the ground after the plant has died. Most vegetables are annuals, harvested at or near the end of their natural life.

In fact, there is considerable scientific evidence that the human physiology, like that of our closest living creatures - the great apes, is vegetarian in design. The structure of our skin, teeth, stomach and bowels, the length of our digestive system, the composition of our saliva, stomach acids and urine, etc. are all typically vegetarian. There is also a mountain of evidence proving that a meat-based diet contributes to a whole range of diseases. Many scientists now concede that fruits, vegetables, nuts, seeds, and grains appear best suited to the human body.

Finally, we know that we cannot subsist for long without food, and all food is matter that was once alive. But since we can subsist well and even thrive without meat, why take animal life in addition to the plant life we need to survive?

Among certain spiritually oriented persons one will often hear this strange rationalization: "Sure, we eat meat", they say, "what of it"? What is most important is not what enters the stomach but what comes out of the mind! Although it is true that ridding oneself of one's delusions, breaking out of the prison of the ego-I into a life of sympathy with all sentient beings is paramount, how can we establish a sympathetic rapport with non-humans while we are feasting on them?

"Do not cause pain to any creature, Go back to your Home with honour." (Sri Guru Granth Sahib, pg 322)

Story of Bheesham Pitama

In accordance to Hindu mythology, Draupadi asked the saint Sant Bheesham Pitama, why he had not come to her rescue when she was stripped of her clothing in Duryodans court. She queried him, saying that if he was a saint, why did he not raise his voice when evil was going on before his very eyes in Duryodanas court. He started to cry and said, Daughter, I shall tell you the truth; my mind became clouded by darkness as I had eaten in Duryodans house.

Therefore, this shows how the love of God breaks away from a being as their mind becomes clouded by filth and prevents them from performing good deeds.

Thank you paaji this has helped me out a lot. It was a question asked by one of my students so hopefully I'll be able to explain this to my class!

Thanks once again

waheguru ji Ka Khasla Waheguru Ji K Fateh

waheguru is in every living thing and soul- mahraj jis hukam is that we shouldn't eat animals but plants also contain life and a soul so why can we eat that?

Can anyone give insight to this please

Has she also had all the necessary tests done from the doctors for any defiencies?

Penji yea she has had all tests done ... She has polycystic ovarian syndrome which is very common and hence why I said her bad acne was hormonal ... She has been trying meds for almost 4/5 years now and nothing has helped her

It really depends on the Rehat she was given by the Punj Pyare, she could ask them for assistance if they're available, but until then she could use the product? Your not eating anything technically.

Gurfateh Ji, I have asked my friend and she said there is nothing in her rehat that prevents are from using it but she is just a little cautious about the egg part of it

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji K Fateh

I wanted to ask something as I am not sure about it and was hoping someone can shine some light or knowledge on my question.

Basically, I have a friend, who has really bad acne prone skin- like the acne she gets is really big, angry, painful, and if they do shrink in size (eventually) they leave massive dark scars that stay for months on end , sometimes possibly years! She has been trying so many natural skin products and cleansers but nothing has worked, but somewhat made it worse... diet is not an issue as she has a very strict and healthy diet (apart from the few cheat days everyone is allowed) and drinks plenty of water... her bad skin is a hormonal issue... she has even tried medication which didn't work either.. so basically everything she has tried hasn't work... this girl is now in her early 20's and is not confident with her appearance at all... whilst researching, someone in a similar situation, recommended a Lush skin care product (for anyone that doesn't know- Lush products are all made from natural ingredients so no chemicals and no animal testing), which worked a miracle for this person... reading all the reviews and going in store to find out about it, my friend has come to the conclusion that she wishes to try it, however, the only problem is that, the product contains egg in it and my friend is amritdharee. Egg is supposedly very good in skin care products but she and I are both unsure about whether it would be right or wrong to use this product when she is amritdharee keeping in mind that she isnt eating it but just applying it on her face.

Can anyone please advise us on what would be right?

Many Thanks.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji K Fateh

What you are going thru is normal. After taking Amrit, most ppl are happy and their motivation and enthusiasm are boundless, and they keep good rehit. But after a time, all the motivation and enthusiasm and energy goes away and most ppl get into a slump. Where r mind tries to take us back, to make us fail. This is a hard stage. We have to keep going up and do more Seva simran and gurbani but if this is hard , u have to stand firm where u r and don't let ur self go down slippery slope. Also it is easy to follow sikh when it's easy and u want to but it's hard to follow it when you don't want to. Be strong.

I have a similar story: my dad always wanted to take Amrit but his family was against it. He finally got to take it when he got married. He also came to America then. At first everything was good and he kept his rehit but then he became discontented. All his friends went to Gurudwara and did paath but they weren't amritdhari so they went to parties and drank. My dad started thinking it's not fair they get to do all the good stuff and the fun stuff too. Why did I take Amrit I'm stuck. Then he went alone and cried and complained to guruji it's not fair why do the get every thing and I'm stuck.I have a boring life and it's all ur fault.I came to America and still I cant enjoy anything.what do,u have to give me? Nothing but restrictions. While he was crying, he said this. Then he says he felt the greatest thing ever, the best feeling. It was like he was on top of the world. He says he never questioned or strayed after that. And now all his family and extended family are amritdharis.

Just stick in there. U will get past it. As for feeling free go do other things, hang out and do rollar skating, ice skating, parks, carnivals Etc. places where putting ur hair down and putting makeup isn't needed to have fun unlike at parties.

Not2cool2argue lovely story of ur father.

Yup other activities one can do without the distractions. Are u ok confused 10? Hope ur feeling better.

wjkk wjkf everyone!

I can't be more happier whilst saying this that i'm so glad that i turned to the internet and more importantly this forum page for help.... I feel so much more better and guided after reading everyones views and advice, and from the bottom of my heart I honestly thank everyone who posted here for not judging me but treating me like their sister or daughter and guiding and advising me in the right way (this is something I've found very hard to find in the "real" world) so thank you....

Thank you for allowing me to see that what I am/was feeling and wanting was just a "weak" phase I am going through and yes! i have to keep strong- Mahraj is testing me.... when I am sitting an exam at uni and begin to find the paper hard, I don't run away from it, I find a way to tackle it and succeed, so why should this be any different? I knew from day one that going on this path, more than anything is going to be the most difficult challenge ever, but somewhere down the line, i think i forgot who am was... someone who was never afraid of challenges and someone who succeeded at every challenge... when you fall down, you have to get back up and try again and I thank you all for showing me my real self again... it really means a lot to me knowing that mahraj does have people out here to help people like me without judging us HARD OR EASY..... THE PATH THAT INVOLVES MAHRAJ AND ONLY HIM IS THE ONLY PATH I WANT TO BE ON !

Thank you once again to everyone here for allowing me realise that and apologies to anyone I may have offended

wjkk wjkf x

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

Agreed with the above - Sangat is very important. First question to ask yourself is what type of Sangat you are keeping. if they are not maintaining a similar level of rehat or higher than you, then you may not have Sangat of Gursikhs who can inspire you upwards and may be dragging you downwards. While outer Rehat is important, understand that Gurbani itself is a Rehat - it advises you to fix your life and walk the narrow path that is Gursikhi inwards and outwards. If you believe that dancing is premitted in Sikhi, please read Gurbani and see what is said about dancing. If you think makeup is ok for Sikhi, think about for who you are applying makeup (look up Gurbani verses related to shingaar and you will get your answer).

Bhenji, you need to get better Sangat and understand the beauty of Sikhi. You reference point is with other girls who may not be the best examples of Gursikhs. This is not my statement, this is what Gurbani says. If you can read one Shabad from Gurbani to test this, read "Gur Satgur Ka Jo Sikh Akhayiae" - which explains that the duty of a Sikh is to be attached to the Guru at all times and not waste a single breath away without contemplating the Almighty. Nobody is expecting perfection and the embodiment of Gurbani is days from any Gursikh - but the Sikh's job is to try and move forward, not take examples from others who could possibly drag you down. You must ask yourself why you are not getting the satisfaction that Gurbani describes will make all other pleasures feel faded and inferior to the Anand of Simran and Gurbani paath/keertan. If they are giving to this Anand, then ask why you are looking at those who may not be experiencing the same. Do Sangat of those who feel the same and are trying to excel to the higher spiritual stages.

Gurfateh ji!

Thanks for your reply... I don't think its always about the sangat....I hang around with the right sangat,... I have never been associated with anyone who does wrong things including drinking, smoking etc... everyone I mingle with are either amrithdharees or people from well respected families who practice sikhi but arent amritdharee ( they are living the best of both worlds without doing wrong things- if that makes sense)... Again, like i mentioned before, the society of sikhs i live in is very small... everyone can admit that the world we live in today, half the amritdharees, who claim to have higher mentality than a low selfish person like me and claim to be good role models, aren't... which clearly goes to explain why I have turned to the internet, to express myself.... I know that anyone or any amritdharee i talk to here will do nothing but judge me and look down on me rather than give me true advise....

in connection to dancing, i personally don't feel its wrong- yes I have read the gurbani line related to it but when i talk about dancing i don't mean, dancing in clubs, amongst boys, or any of the negative stuff people automaically associate it with,.. what i mean is that, when you are brought up in a family where there is not only religion but also culture you should be able to adapt- when t talk about dancing i mean enjoying amongst family... not getting drunk etc and making a fool of oneself..

talking about makeup.... what about those who aren't confident with their appearance? I for one amen't ... I have a lot of insecurities ... we live in a cruel world and everyone is different.. we all have different ways of dealing with a situation....

With all honesty, hand on heart... i want to stay in the path I have chosen, and that is guru ji's path.. but i'm scared of going ahead and making a massive mistake that i may regret... i'm scared of upsetting guru ji... i'm scared of disappointing my older brothers and sisters, who are proud of the decision ive taken.... i'm scared of becominh a bad person

U need to communicate with amritdhari girls of ur age, then u can share ur experience with them.

Don't think Guruji are not listening, they are hearing u, but u have to ask urself why are u missing the old u. It's probably because u now feel alone and different. Don't focus on being perfect or so strict with urself. U are free but somehow u are putting barriers in front of ur soul that it is feeling u have distanced urself from the world. It's not easy being around friends when they only talk abt makeup etc, u feel jealous and left out. It's only a cover,the real beauty is within.

But why? Break down the barriers first and start loving yourself and see yourself in a different light.

Gud luck.

Bhenji, if you went back to the old appearance you'd quickly realise that it's empty. I've been there - I've missed my "freedom", half gone back to it before realising it was an empty pursuit and thinking, is THIS what I wanted? Is this ALL? The mind will do that to you, seeing a world full of appearance obsessed people will do that to you.

VJKK VJKF

I don't know how well I can help but my past is somewhat similar - I'm from a family of non-practising Sikhs (who are slowly getting into things).

From personal experience I can say that because you did have a past that was a lot different, you will go through moments where you begin to miss your old life. It's maya trying to pull you back. Best you can do is do ardas daily to maharaj asking for more and more love for them. Every time you do ardas just beg them to help you develop more love. The previous lives that a lot of us had may look nice on the outside but they are only going to destroy us in the end. The goal of our life is to meet Waheguru and nothing else. Never let your mind fall into maya and forget that goal.

Once you start climbing the ladder spiritually, you'll start to experience things that bring you more sukh than your older days ever brought.

But to work on ourselves spiritually - we must step up the amount of simran we do or we will fall into dukh and doubts.

Start watching katha as well or do anything that would help increase your love for maharaj.

Personally I enjoy two things - watching mysimran.info katha and basics of sikh shabad hazare katha

So basically all I'm getting at is find what sparks your love for maharaj and do it a lot. Spend lots of time in sangat and most importantly do as much simran as possible (specifically saas giras simran) and make sure you clear your mind from thoughts + focus on the sound of your voice.

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

आसा महला ५ ॥

Āsā mėhlā 5.

Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:

ਭਈ ਪਰਾਪਤਿ ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥

भई परापति मानुख देहुरीआ ॥

Bẖa▫ī parāpaṯ mānukẖ ḏehurī▫ā.

This human body has been given to you.

ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਮਿਲਣ ਕੀ ਇਹ ਤੇਰੀ ਬਰੀਆ ॥

गोबिंद मिलण की इह तेरी बरीआ ॥

Gobinḏ milaṇ kī ih ṯerī barī▫ā.

This is your chance to meet the Lord of the Universe.

ਅਵਰਿ ਕਾਜ ਤੇਰੈ ਕਿਤੈ ਨ ਕਾਮ ॥

अवरि काज तेरै कितै न काम ॥

Avar kāj ṯerai kiṯai na kām.

Nothing else will work.

ਮਿਲੁ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਭਜੁ ਕੇਵਲ ਨਾਮ ॥੧॥

मिलु साधसंगति भजु केवल नाम ॥१॥

Mil sāḏẖsangaṯ bẖaj keval nām. ||1||

Join the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy; vibrate and meditate on the Jewel of the Naam. ||1||

Waheguru ji Ka khasla waheguru ji k fateh

thank you for your replies... it means a lot to me that there are people out there who will take their time out to help a total stranger!

I agree with everything you three have said, and from day one I always kept it in my head that its not going to be an easy path but a tough one... i always knew that... I do simran almost everyday... if not do, I atleast listen to it through out the day every day,.. this is the one and only thing I ask mahraj everyday day, morning and night in my ardaas to help me, increase that love and help me to keep myself strong.. i have faith in mahraj and I probably know that He is testing me but what does someone falling weak and short of hope in themselves do? I feel so crappy that i don't have that strength to look positive with my apperance amongst all those girls who are like the old me? Don't get me wrong,. i always loved my dastar, do love my dastar and always will love wearing it and am so proud to be a girl who can walk with her head held high wearing one... but my confidence is breaking ... why?

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji K Fateh

I am a young, 19 year old amritdharee female. I am born and raised in a typical punjabi family, however, we all do paath and are well into learning about Sikhi. I am the only daughter in the family, I used to be the girl who was into her, makeup, hair styling(i've never cut my hair) and basically all the usual girly stuff a typical girl is interested in. From a young age I have been attending gurdwara, sikhi classes and doing kirtan on the vaja. In 2013, we had our annual dastar day, where I tied the dastar for the first time and I fell in love with it. When I told my parents that I was considering wearing the dastar full time, they weren't against the idea (both my brothers have worn a keski since birth but aren't amritdharee) but objected by saying it was just a phase I was going through and I would change my mind. I few months later, in January 2014, we had a jatha come for a week and on the last day they were holding an amrit sanchar. During the second last divan, something in what they were saying me touched me so much that, almost 12 hours before the amrit sanchar I decided to take amrit. I am someone who never in my life even considered the idea of taking amrit but I don't know why, but I just felt that I was ready and had to take the leap of faith. I felt sitting in the darbar sahib that night, it was either take it now or never. So next day, I take amrit. I AM THE ONLY AMRITDHAREE IN MY FAMILY AND EXTENDED FAMILY.

Now almost year and a half on, I do my paath (timing is an issue - but something that can be worked on), follow my rehat, wear a dastar etc. The first full year, I was convinced fully, and also told others who asked me, that me taking amrit suddenly was the best decision ever and I would never look back, I feel so blessed to be on this path. HOWEVER, for the past few months my confidence has shattered. I can't stop my mind from falling weak to think that maybe I have made a quick decision- one which perhaps I should have thought about more carefully. I do my paath - I love doing paath, kirtan... I wouldn't be able to live without it... sikhi is my identity and one I'm so proud to be a part of BUT! My appearance.... I love my dastar but for the past few months I really miss the old me... the girl who was free spirited, carefree, girly,.. I MISS MY HAIR.. I MISS LETTING IT DOWN .. I WAS IN LOVE WITH MY HAIR!!! (I've never touched alcohol, cigarettes, drugs and I'm a strict vegetarian and have never entered a club apart from wedding functions with my family). I feel so weak when I say that I go to bed crying most nights these days because I feel so guilty that Mahraj knows what I'm wishing for.... to be free. I see other girls who are like the old me, who like to dance, wear makeup, style their hair etc but still keep intact with their sikhi, do their paath, learn about their dharam etc but aren't amrithdaree... I wish I took time to think about it and maybe today I wouldn't be sitting here crying whilst typing this up.

My family and friends and my community are so proud of me for the step I took a year and a half ago but what do I do now??? I literally feel that I have no one to pour my heart out to that would understand what I am going through.... I talk to Mahraj about this but I feel like I'm trapped... no matter what I do I'll only bring badness... If i continue the way I am, I'll never be a good gursikh, and if i go back to the old me, I'll dishonour and bring shame to my family- HOW WOULD I FACE THE WORLD... I have never done anything wrong up till date and don't intend to. But when I look at my family, my sisters, my cousins, I see the old me in them- The happy me!

I really need someone to advise me, I can no longer sit here with all this bottled inside me... I don't want to be depressed any more... PLEASE someone help me!

Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji K Fateh!