TavPrasad Singh

RST have released a statement to cover their tracks and pretend that they have been talking with the Satkaar Sevadars. Its amasing how they feel they are being bullied to follow maryada! That means they want to be free to do manmat....following Akal Takht Sahib Maryada is like being bullied. http://www.rstbirmingham.com/ "Important - Satkaar Sewadars further threaten Maharaja Jassa Singh Hall and RST Members by sending out SMS Messages for a demonstration at Gurdwara - have your say to oppose this bullying. Maharaja Jassa Singh Hall Update Dear Members and Sadh Sangat Ji, The Gurdwara would like to inform you that a body called Satkaar Sewadaar have been putting immense pressure on the Committee in regards to the Hiring of MJSH and that it should not allow certain foods and drinks. The Committee have suggested a meeting date to discuss this but it seems that an email went out and posts on websites that ths was not the case. The Committee advised them that the decision will be made by the members of RST (especially as they implied it was the local sadh Sangat members who had complained)and a meeting for Mid January was proposed as key individuals from the Committee were abroad and the regular Members and Sadh Sangat needed to be consulted and also we need to establish who they represent and whether they represent as this is still unclear.. Satkaar Sewadars sent out an email stating we were unwilling to meet them, which is untrue. They have emailed again requesting another meeting yesterday. We would like your views on this and would welcome responses to info@rstbirmingham.com"

This is the segment of the Panth Time programme (broadcasted on Sikh Channel - 4th December 2010) where Sri Akal Takht Sahib Jathedar Gyani Gurbachan Singh Ji expands on the 2006 Sandesh:

The messages are correct and should be followed by others. The committee stops these sweets in the Gurdwara but allow meat and alcohol in the adjoining hall. They have the Rehit Maryada on the website but instead they have activity decided not to adhere to it. This info should stay if the Committee decide to accept and adhere to it, otherwise its hypocrisy. The Gurdwara Committee are refusing to even discuss the issues, please read the threads. They dont have a leg to stand on and blatantly continue the beadbi of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji on a week basis. It is all our duty to stop this....

I feel affliation will work better if there was a definition of the type of issues that will be handled by SCUK.It looks as if they are dodging any Sikh issues in the name of setting up. Right now it looks that if you have a panthic/maryada issue then SCUK will not help you and if you have a racial/discrimination case then also SCUK will not help. Both issues I have highlighted are opposites of the Sikh spectrum. Where within this spectrum will SCUK sit? Only asking for clarity.....

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!! I was watching the Panth Time Special about Sikh Council UK a couple of weeks ago on Sikh Channel and dont really understand what their core agenda is. They will not involve themselves in Rehat/Gurdwara Maryada issues (however they want Akal Takht to ask them before issuing Hukamnamas) and they fobbed of Ricky Reel's mum and her appeal to help get her son's case re-opened. They want youth to get involved but do not really clarify what this involvement entails. All I can see is people are congratulating each other for potentially forming this body. Very confused.. :6 ..some clarity please....

This happened at Watford where there was a fall out with the Gurdwara committees and the split faction set up a monthly diwan at the local community centre. This situation mainly arises due to splits in the local community, Guruji is just a tool for them to set up diwans to spite each other...

Spreading rumours is all RST can do now. The only thing stopping them to shut down the party hall is their own ego and reluctance to accept their wrong doing. People like Bhogal come on Sikh Channel talking about Khalistan, they can't even create Khalistan in the Gurdwara where they are General Secretary!

What is really surprising it all the coverage from Non-Sikh media has overall been really positive. Even BBC Asian Network, who never have a good thing to say about Sikh issues, was siding to the fact that it is wrong to allow meat and alcohol to be consumed on Gurdwara property. However as usual its not so easy to convince our own community members that this is wrong.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI Fateh!! I found this video on YouTube discussing the UK Sangat's concerns about Gurdwaras who allowing meat and alcohol on Gurdwara Estate "This report was shown on Sunrise TV (Litt on Sunday 5th Dec 2010) highlighting those UK Gurdwaras who are not adhering to Akal Takht Maryada and allowing meat and alcohol to be consumed on Gurdwara Property for the sole purpose of monetary gains. Hard hitting comments from Harmander Singh (Sikhs in England) and Gurmukh Singh (Sewa UK)"

The only thing that will clean things up is losing the attitude that someone else will fix the problems. There's no fun in clouding issues by identifying other issues. And there's no fun in challenging others to fix something we all have to fix collectively. If the Gurdwaras start to practice what they preach then I'm sure Sikh Society will change for the better. Work on strengthing the roots.

Has was just creating smoke screens and claiming victimisation. At the end of the programme he said that the biggest killer disease within Sikhs is liver sclerosis! Very confused person.... He really has shown how panthic he really is.

So to prove your gurdwara is not a hypocrite, tell the gurdwara committee stop the meat and sharab at the hall. It will be good for you to do your research first. Ramgarhia Birmingham is not adhering to Akal Takht Maryada! Not interested in your view of the State of Sikhi etc. Gurdwaras have rules which represent Gurmat, the gurdwara are following their own manmat for their own personal gains.

Fateh Mental Singhji, Dr Bhogal doesnt like u (hope you saw Panth Time programme?!)

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh I'm amazed at the hypocrisy shown by Ramgarhia Gurdwara Bham on their website: Ramgarhia Gurdwara Bham Website RST Bham.pdf On one hand they have a link where you can download Sikh Rehit Maryada document, making someone think they are really Panthic while on the other hand they refuse to even accept that this maryada includes no meat, alcohol & tobacco along with no parties anywhere on Gurdwara owned property, i.e Maharaja Jassa Singh Ramgarhia Hall. They are fully aware that they are not adhering to the Sandesh issued by Akal Takht Sahib. On top of this they are advising their sangat that certain chocolates and biscuits shouldn't be brought to the Gurdwara as they contain egg! This is a ridiculous attitude, Ramgarhia Bham are allowing gross beadbi on a weekly basis however they continue to put on a Panthic act.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!! Just received this text: "Gurfateh! Sukhwinder Singh Ji died as a national hero on the corner of Victoria Road & Uphall Road, Barking. Benti to local Sikh Sangat to lay flowers down on the site in memory of the Singh's bravery. Dhan Guru Dhan Guru Pyaray!" Please take some time out, I saw only one bunch of flowers there. We need to show how proud we are of this Singh!

No one laughingly gives up their life, I am sure if given the choice they would have preferred life to death. Hey Satwant and Beant Singh's had a choice they could have preferred to live.. But when Harmandar Sahib was attacked knowing the future of their Families and that they would be achieve Shaheedi they still gave up their lives to take revenge of our sacred shrine and our 11th guru Sir Guru Granth Sahib.. Which was shot and burnt... I doubt they regretted that.... Wouldn’t you call that laughingly but anyways how am I to compare such guru dey payare.. Sant Jarnail Singh Je Kahlsa knowing Harmandar Sahib was going to be attacked swore to defend it as ordered by our Gurus.. He had a choice he could have fled but he laughingly accepted Shaheedi.. Every Gursikh who swore to seek revenge knew their future.. Wouldn’t you call that laughingly or were they sad and didn’t want to fight.... Was their anything forcing them???? I don’t understand why there is much glory in two armed men killing a women what ever her crime, which directly caused the murder of innocent people. Indra Gandi would have had to face justice for her crimes. The whole world would have known her true agenda instead she was made a national hero, a martyr and Sikhs were branded terrorists a stigma we still can’t shake off. Today we can only make allegations against her and we will never be able to prove how much she was involved. It could very well be that there are others who shared equal blame but because of our dumb foolery, ignorance and the fantasy we dwell in we are never going to be able to succeed. All we do is praise ourselves by slapping our own backs, if you visualise the action as pathetic as it appears there is a macabre reality to it. These Shaheeds replayed Sikh History. Those who attempt to destroy Harmandar Sahib seal their fate. To categorise Sikh reaction to the atrocities of Indian Govt as dumb foolery shows only ignorance on your behalf. Actions of Bhai Satwant Singh and Bhai Beant Singh have been accepted by the whole Khalsa Panth. The killings of Sikhs by Govt funded Hindu mobs were a racist and prejudice act. Those killed in Delhi were not part of Ghandi’s assisnation; however the Racist Hindu Govt killed anyone with a Sikh identity. The Sikhs of Delhi were also citizens of India. Those Singhs were not as stupid as you might think. They had Naam Kamaai and a clear vision of what they needed to do. Look up to them or not is up to you. However it is easy to assess the aftermath and say what you think should have happened, but like everything thing in life things don’t happen how we want.

Alot of egos have been bashed on this thread. if people have other ideas then it doesnt mean that they are personally attacking your beliefs. We need to stop putting our guards up and actually discuss a way forward. The issue has not been resolved. We need to look beyond getting Justice for the young boy whose's kesh were killed. We need to look at the issue from a Panthic angle and how Sikhs educate wider communities and combat such problems. No doubt this cannot be resolved in one afternoon. More has to be done. Thats a fact. Now lets get on and do it.

http://www.panthic.org/news/124/ARTICLE/2893/2006-11-15.html Gursikh Preventing Guru Ghar Beadbi Given Guilty Verdict Wednesday 15th of November 2006 Panthic Weekly News Bureau Coventry (KP) – On Thursday November 9th 2006, a respected Gursikh was given two years probation by the Coventry Crown Court. Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ubhi was charged for taking action against men caught red-handed sitting inside the building complex of Leamington & Warwick Gurdwara Sahib and who disturbed the sanctity of the Gurdwara Sahib by opening bottles of liquor and serving meat at a drinking party organised by the Gurdwara Management Committee in celebration of Bandi Chhor Diwas and Guru Nanak Sahib jee’s Gurpurb last November in 2005. A Gursikh recognising the importance of Gur Maryada (the Guru’s tradition) and the holy sanctity of Guru Nanak’s House was delivered punishment by the court of the land. However, those who violated the sanctity of the Gurdwara Sahib, opened beer barrels and liquor bottles in the Gurdwara complex and served the meat of dead animals in the Gurdwara premises on the ‘happy occasion’ of celebrating a Gurpurb were let go scot-free. Due to some poor media reporting and a Gurdwara Management Committee unwilling to shoulder any responsibility, the Leamington Gurdwara situation became highly charged. The situation could have been resolved in better way but dialogue between the Gurdwara Management Committee responsible and the Sikh Sangat who attend the Gurdwara Sahib broke down. Everyone involved has a huge responsibility to ensure everyone pays the utmost respect to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji to avoid this type of situation in the future. Fortunately, the committee did eventually decide to listen to frustration and concerns of the Sikh Sangat over the gross laxity and disrespect happening in the Gurdwara premises and passed a resolution by the Sangat, declaring the Gurdwara an alcohol and meat-free zone. It is the widely publicised failing, not only of the Sikh community, but also of the media, the legal system, the Gurdwara Management Committees and indeed society at large, that people who run a religious establishment can get away with such sacrilege. Ignorance is no defence. As a result of these failings in court, the importance of Maryada in Sikhi and the high regards given the sanctity of the Guru and the Guru’s House were not effectively communicated and Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ubhi was put on probation for two years and ordered to carry out 200 hours of community service and to pay £7,500 compensation as well as £500 in court costs. We must ask ourselves that though the application of the letter of the law was followed but was the spirit of the rules and legislation considered? Were all those responsible made accountable? Was one person truly to blame for the entire situation in Leamington Spa or was somebody made a scapegoat to cover up the failings of others? Sikhs from throughout Coventry, Warwickshire, Midlands and across the UK packed Coventry Crown Court and outside to show their support for Bhai Jaswinder Singh. A benti to the Sarbat Sikh Sangat that anyone who wishes to contribute to the £7,500 fine that Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ubhi is paying on behalf of the Sikh community to kindly email: covkhalsa@gmail.com. Everyday we read in our daily Ardas: “Think of and remember the unique service rendered by those brave Sikh men as well as women, who sacrificed their heads but did not surrender their Sikh Religion, who were cut to pieces joint by joint, who were scalped, who were tied and whose bodies broken on large wooden wheels, who were cut by saws, who were flailed till dead, who sacrificed themselves to upkeep the dignity of the Gurdwaras, who did not abandon their Sikh faith, who kept their Sikh Religion and kept their long hair intact till their last breath, utter WaheGuru (Wondrous God)” All historical Sikh movements came about for one purpose only and that was to maintain the sanctity of Sikh Maryada. For this reason, we have been blessed with countless Shaheeds (martyrs) and Gursikhs who have given sacrifices for their Guru Ghars. Bhai Jasvinder Singh Ubhi and his family are a prime example of the passion of Sikhi, which needs reawakening in our nation and people. Editors can be reached at editors@panthic.org

Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Well Lane. Its true!!!! Tav dont make me laugh you was the same guy that pulled out of seva when moslty needed. U cant even stand up for the truth forget about fighting for it. Besides stop preacing to others when u cant do seva yourself..... truth hurts Hmm...why reduce Guruji's seva by taking digs at people? Well Singh Ji I am no saviour of the Panth. Maharaj TAKES seva from Sikhs. Guruji is in control with or without me. The bigger picture is Wednesfield Gurdwara allow meat & Sharab onto Gurdwara premises, does the issue suddenly become irrelevant because someone feel's I am incapable of doing Seva? Just like Leamington, look at the bigger issue and dont keep bogged down with meaningless digs. Guruji is important, the issue is important, how the issue is handled is important, not whether you think someone is worthy or not.

Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Well Lane. Its true!!!!

Easy to say my friend. When the time comes I hope you practice what you preach.

BUMP!!! The issue cannot fade away.......Bhai Jaswinder Singh took the fall on behalf of many. Its up to the UK Sangat to pay the fine off

Benti to Edmonton Singhs and Singhnias - Control the situation now before it gets out of hand. Tell the granthi not to do this again and get support for the local Gurdwaras that Maharaj's saroop must never go to hotel, clubs, bars, banqueting halls....

Alcohol is a big no no for Sikhs. Meat at the Gurudwara again a big no no. However, the conduct of people like Ubhi and co, is a big no no TOO! Vote them out. Use democratic means. ........to resort to violence and beat up old men is out of order. Why can't these brave Singh's stand up to outsider's when they make fun of their turban's, and attack them? Then they run like cowards. Many lessons have been learnt. Everyone went to stop beadbi, not vote the committee out. The court have sentenced Ubhi. End of story. But its up to the Sangat to sentence the committee for their actions. No UK court of law will do this.

Hopefully its stop. The committee passed a resolution after Sangat pressure http://www.panthic.org/news/124/ARTICLE/2015/2005-11-20.html