whyhellothere
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Posts posted by whyhellothere
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I think one day he should visit and be made welcome and asked to stop killing innocent civilians and people in the name of oil and to stop allowing bigshot businessmen rule America and it's decisions.
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Right mate, now if we take leather shoes off surely we can be bothered enough not to wear leather jackets if possible, out of respect?
Imagine if someone took a pair shoes in a bag into Darbar Sahib by accident. Do you think they would just leave them in the bag or take them out asap? Even though the shoes are not being worn I think there's still an element of disrespect bringing slaughtered animal parts into the gurdwarra when it could be avoided mate.
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My grandparent had a religious tattoo and the reason for it was that every time they saw it they remembered babaji. I likened this to the fact that whenever I look down and see my kara I think of god or something to do with sikhi, and anything that reminds us of Babaji and leads us to his meditation can't be that bad seeing as in this age it is so rare of one to think of God.
A sikh tattoo in an indecent place is another story though and would be pretty ridiculous and weird not to mention evil!:wacko:
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I agree with you about VIPs.
English has become the defacto second language for everyone on Earth to trade with. It is taught worldwide. The plan is to have 3 languages though.
Regarding your strange view of "history"... The marble on the parkarma is brand new becuase the SGPC wanted to erase all history of the "militants"
The walls of the buildings? NEW. The paint is white wash over actual historical art.
The gold was added against the wishes of the panth.
The Bungas were destroyed and replaced with high walls. Darbar sahib was actually supposed to be open to all.. the 4 doors thing is NEW..
And lastly, history gets made somehow.. in 50 years, these screens will be called historical value to the complex. Its what you make it. I for one am very inspired by this.
You cannot be serious! Do you realise you sound insane?!!!
Screens adding historical value LOL, and you just added reasons they shouldn't be installed. Nothing as major as this should happen without the backing of the panth, knowing all of the things not approved by the panth you seem willing to add another thing to the list.
You really have a nerve coming on here backing a project you know the majority of the panth will oppose, your feeble attempts at backing this completely outrageous project will not stand against the panth.
You obviously do not believe in democracy or true worship, if you did you would not want to ruin the sacredness and peace of the holiest place on earth and that makes two of you, Indira Gandhi and yourself.
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^^^I take my shoes off before sitting in the gurdwarra out of respect and I don;t wear leather to the gurdwara out of respect.
p.s Try sitting in a gurdwara with shoes on and see what happens to you mate.
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You brought up the Sant bit, and now you want others to do work that has already been done. Sants agree with Guru's way. It's that simple. Again for the third time it does not take a Sant to figure this out.
What's stopping you from not saying it, when you already don't go with Guru's way on the langar practices.
You won't agree with me! When did i voice my opinion. I present the Guru's way and you got mad and started slandering the Guru's way. Your love for Guru Sahib is your business and your words for his respect speaks for everything your about.
Whatever mate, I've said what I had to say, goodbye.
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Then contact a Sant and see what they say. Again it does not take a Sant to figure out, we need to follow Guru's way. A five year old can tell you that. Again no insult intended.
paranoid because i asked for proof? You must have been hopped up on some medication on this whole discussion then. Even a baby doesn't whine as much as you did. This is not a big issue on the sense of being addressed from everything else that needs tp be addressed first, which is being done. But it is a big deal when you refuse to accept the reality of this discussion and it's Guru's way, which you speak against. So i and others addressed it.
Okay so guess I won;t be getting many z's tonight. No I will not contact a sant, you're the one with the serving problem so you have the honour. Paranoid because you went on about 'next you'll be saying this, next you'll be saying that' when I most certainly will not. I still don't agree with you and never will but I'll always love the guru and nothing you say will ever change that. But I'm actually very tired of talking to you now so go make the change you want to see in gurdwarras instead of talking to me about it okay.
Goodbye, rab rakh.
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Thats your own opinion. Please read the defintion of opinion here. it will help you to understand what is being said when it's Guru Sahib's system.
If you can't accept history and our Sikh practices then there is no point on going any further with you. Next you'll say it is not written in stone(Guru's hand) for to sit on the ground in Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji Maharaj Darbar. Next your say it's not written in stone to put a man infront of the woman in Anand Karaj. These are our Guru's ways and history tells us they are. If you are so eager to find out, because I already know, then look into it yourself. The fact you want to present an argument without looking into the topic yourself and this causes you to not take Sikh history into consideration shows the lack of knowledge on the issue, on your part. The fact you cannot even acknowledge we Sikhs lower ourselves in the mind and body to recieve Guru Sahib's gift shows your lack of knowledge.
There are bigger issues the Sants are dealing with. Why don't you talk to a Sant and see what they say about the queue system. No Sant will agree with it, but one thing they would say is picking an arguement for this system is a foolish mistake. It does not take a Sant to figure this one out. Not insulting you.
Can you provide history of your assumptions. Why would a elder person have to do anything other than sit in the sangat and partake of the langar. It's up to the sevadaars who are able to do it. And if a elder had that much love for Guru Sahib where he is barely able to do the task, but still wanted to do it, he will serve in the Guru's sangat in the Guru's way. That's the beauty of Sikhs, they do whatever it takes to hold Sikhi higher than their own welfare. It would be good if you read the history of the old man Sikhs who gave their lives for Sikhi.
Lol now you're just being paranoid, next I won't be making silly proposals. I know very well the traditional way of serving langar and I also know there have been exceptions. A sant would uphold the honour of his Guru no matter what, so don't give me rubbish about a sant not bringing this up if they opposed it.
Also you seem to believe it IS a big issue and worth arguing about or we wouldn't be having this (very tedious) conversation. If you believe that I and others are doing nindya by serving this way surely you'd want to do something about it and at least bring the issue up in the gurdwarra, it wouldn't be a big deal.
Like I said go for it, noones stopping you, if it's so wrong, make it right and go and stand up for what you believe in. In your eyes the Gurus wishes are being dishonoured so go and make a change.
p.s goodluck and goodnight! I'm off to bed and really hope thats the last of our convo seeing as we'll never see eye to eye and I'm sick of posting now.
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What an opinion. What are you trying to prove by saying thats fine you can believe that, nobody was asking for your approval. Heres a difference for you, unlike Islam, SIkhi is not a missionary religion, we let people come to dharma we do not try to shove dharma down peoples throats. Try and debunk that one.
ummmmmmmmmmm.................................. ok! :huh:
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I feel sick!:o
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AAHH just be careful because most people would associate a fallen angel with the christian devil lucifer (satan) an angel who fell from gods grace in chrsitian beliefs!
from wikipedia:
A fallen angel, in Christian theology, is an angel who has been exiled or banished from Heaven. Often such banishment is a punishment for disobeying or rebelling against God (see War in Heaven).
lol sorry just thought I'd write that for future reference and if you meant to use the term in this way just ignore me!
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I would avoid wearing leathers to the gurdwarras but if it was worn in form of a jacket or something, leave it at the door with the shoes I'd say out of respect. One big thing are leather handbags, I'm not sure how that issue could be avoided as elderly ladies also carry leather handbags. And then there are belts.....
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I would say the twelve signs are the signs of astrology, astrologers were around during the gurus times and this is the state of someone whos mind is not attached to the signs of astrology.
duAwdis mudRw mnu AauDUqw ]The Twelfth Day: One whose mind is not attached to the twelve signs,
du-aadas mudraa man a-uDhootaa.
Aihinis jwgih kbih n sUqw ]
remains awake day and night, and never sleeps.
ahinis jaageh kabeh na sootaa.
jwgqu jwig rhY ilv lwie ]
He remains awake and aware, lovingly centered on the Lord.
jaagat jaag rahai liv laa-ay.
gur prcY iqsu kwlu n Kwie ]
With faith in the Guru, he is not consumed by death.
gur parchai tis kaal na khaa-ay.
AqIq Bey mwry bYrweI ]
Those who become detached, and conquer the five enemies
ateet bha-ay maaray bairaa-ee.
pRxviq nwnk qh ilv lweI ]15]
- prays Nanak, they are lovingly absorbed in the Lord. ||15||
paranvat naanak tah liv laa-ee. ||15||
duAwdsI dieAw dwnu kir jwxY ]
The Twelfth Day: Know, and practice, compassion and charity.
du-aadasee da-i-aa daan kar jaanai.
bwhir jwqo BIqir AwxY ]
Bring your out-going mind back home.
baahar jaato bheetar aanai.
brqI brq rhY inhkwm ]
Observe the fast of remaining free of desire.
bartee barat rahai nihkaam.
Ajpw jwpu jpY muiK nwm ]
Chant the unchanted Chant of the Naam with your mouth.
ajpaa jaap japai mukh naam.
qIin Bvx mih eyko jwxY ]
Know that the One Lord is contained in the three worlds.
teen bhavan meh ayko jaanai.
siB suic sMjm swcu pCwxY ]16]
Purity and self-discipline are all contained in knowing the Truth. ||16||
sabh such sanjam saach pachhaanai. ||16||
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Because the true teachings of Sikhi are lost in the queue system. When we present ourselves before Guru Sahib we lower ourselves down. When standing in line for langar people are recieving the gift of Guru Sahib's langar at equal levels and this is disrespect. Have you ever seen a sevadaar tell a Sikh to get down before he recieves langar. It's not a formality but way to kill the mind's ego.
Waiting patiently in turn for the gurus langar is also a way to kill the minds ego. People on here have been talking about waiting in turn like it is such a bad thing but a humble person would never even see this as an issue. You assume that serving a sitting sangat is the only way, and yes it is an assumption because it was never written in stone, I have asked you to come up with stable evidence it has been and you have not.
I don;t see any sant babas or brahm gianis complaining about it or true saints that it is wrong so please excuse me if I don't listen to you only five. The gurus lived in difficult times and I am more than certain that langar was not served in the traditional way at some point perhaps during war, on the go or when an elderly person wished to serve but was not able to bend down or walk too far.
If this subject stirs up such great emotion in yourself why not consult a saint/ brahmgiani or a gurmukh. Why not do something about it? I'm not standing in your way nor is anyone else here, I may not agree with you but that is irrelevant because you believe you are right. There is most certainly no way on earth you will ever change the way I feel so go and do what you have to do and fight for what you believe is right.
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^Surely not when it hurts to walk and bend over and serve food, and to take it easy is what the doctor prescribed.
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Hi there, I did a search and found this page on Sikhiwiki.
http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Soul
Also found these exerpts:
-The Sikhs believe in the evolution of the Soul and the principle of reincarnation. The soul is believed to be a tiny spark of God’s light "detached" from the Almighty. This spark is separated from God and wants to become pure so that it can "reunite" with God. For this to happen, the Soul has to evolve and purify itself so that this reunification with the Supreme Soul can take place.
And:
Sikhism believes in the immortality of the soul. The devotee has no fear of the pangs of death. In fact he welcomes death, because it gives him a chance for the merger into Divinity. The evil person, however, dreads death. For him, it will lead to the unending cycle of birth and death. After death, man comes to the next birth according to what he deserves. If he has been wicked and evil, he takes birth in the lower species. If he has done good deeds, he takes birth in a good family. The cycle of birth and death keeps the soul away from Divinity. It can merge with God, only if the individual, by spiritual effort, has amassed the capital of the Name(the Holy spirit as understood by Christians) and thus lives with the Holy Spirit.
Guru Arjan in the Sukhmani dwells on the sad plight of the soul which is not endowed with the Name. The soul in its lonely march through darkness can only find sustenance in the word of God. Otherwise it feels the weariness and pain of isolation.
The soul, Jiva, is a part of God. It is deathless like Him. Before creation, it lived with God. After Creation it takes bodily forms according to His Will. The soul is, however, nourished by virtue and meditation on "The name". The transmigration of the soul can come to an end by meditation and divine grace.
Hope it helps.
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appitite , only people with a certain vision can see that, this was why Guru Nanak went to Mecca walking all the way with great difficulty and back , just to
experience that spritual bliss.
No Satguru Nanak went to mecca to try and make some of the deluded muslims there understand that god is not contained within the Kaaba as many thought at the time. Just as Hindus in India had thought their gods and goddesses were contained in statues and pictures etc.
you people have opened the Langar , Isint that a Charitable feast , In the gurudwara whole day long you chant the verses from the grant sahib and sing the
Gurbani swinging the flywisk over the grant sahib, isint that retualistic chants and asture self dicipline,Else explain me why did Guru Nanak go to Mecca, he
didnt go there for tourism purpose but rather it was a pilgrimage.
Langar sends a message of equality, love and compassion. It helps the needy and serving the sangat is a very good deed. However a sikh cannot find god just by serving langar, in fact a sikh never has to serve langar a day in their life and still find god through naam jaapna and love for god which is said to be the greatest service to god, above all other service. It is also said that other works are fruitless without the name of god, Naam which is the only boat to take us across the darkness of this age.
Why do you people every year want to go to Nankana Sahib asking the Pakistani Govt for Pilgrimage visas , Why visit the Amritsar Golden temple and make a dip in its pond, when your book says by visiting such places and dipping in ponts etc you cannot find God.You cannot find god by dipping in HOLY AMRIT(not a pond), the ONLY way to find god in this age is through the Naam. Please read and understand gurbani before making assumptions.
Who told you that circumcision alone makes someone muslim, its the practice of the faith in totality that make someone muslim, just by following one or two
rules one dosent become muslim, Do you know that Jews also Circumcise , so have they all become muslims??, what a foolish question is that, circumcison is
goint to places like SisGang Sahib in Chandini Chouk and the Gurudwaras in Sirhind Too. Why are so many Sikhs going there , can you answer me that ??
We go there to have darshan of the Guru, not a tombstone
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they must first eat langar as equals
We do eat langar as equals, sitting on the floor while being served doesn't automatically make you an equal, it's the act of eating with others which shows equality.
Guru Sahib wanted to instill humility and compassion, contentment, love, patience in the sangat and this does not happen when you recieve Guru ka langar at the same level.And that's where our opinions differ, you see I and many others believe it does and that is why langar is served like this in so many gurdwaras. The majority of the sangat who are okay with langar being served at the same level are not crazy, do you really think an act opposed to our gurus ideals and teachings would be allowed in so many gurdwaras?
But like I said if you want to change things around by all means go ahead, put the effort in to make the change you believe in and if it works then that's okay aswell.
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Rather than arguing over the way of doing thing, the "system" as we call it. To me it is some what irrelevant. What we should question is that is the Langar reaching the people that may benefit from it? The poor ? Less fortunate amongst us?
The Gurdwara should reach out to people in society and make them aware that the Guru's Kitchen is for them, not just for Sikhs.
And I totally agree with you. I saw some people a few weeks back in a Gurdwarra who were clearly in need of a free meal and it warmed my heart to see them receiving food from Guru Ji's kitchen. I wish more people like that would come in because that kind of seva is really great.
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Only Five, kindly copy and paste instructions in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji or rehit that backs up your point that I'm doing nindya of Guru Sahib's way of serving the sangat.
Were you there in the 1600's when the sangat was being served? Do you have any concrete evidence of the way in which the sangat was served and whether the methods ever differed.
How exactly is serving sangat in a line going against the principles of khalsa? The khalsa is pure of heart and loves god, how can standing humbly and waiting for holy langar ever change that?
Give me concrete backed up answers then maybe I'll begin to take your comments seriously.
P.s You were being sarcastic, read your post again.
P.P.S If you see a sevadar so close to the food then bring them up on it, don't tell me about it, however the same risk of 'spit' is also posed by sevadars serving the sitting sangat so your argument on that point is pretty weak.
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Yes, when it comes to taking up the Guru's way, then everyone needs to calm down and Guru Sahib's way is unrealistic? You accused another of insulting others, but your doing the best nindak of all, nindiya of Guru Sahib.
Why are you so against the system Guru Sahib put in place for us?
Sarcasm is the lowest form of speech.
And no I'm not doing nindya of Guru Sahib, you however are doing nindya of sevadars and sangat all over the world. The gurus children are a part of the guru so you're the one doing the nindya.
You are overlooking a whole lot, but if you really think you can make it work then go ahead and sort it out, no one's stopping you, there's no point in arguing about it.
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^^take a chill pill mate.
If you think you're right go to southall gurdwarra and get people to sign a petition for the way you think langar should work in the biggest gurdwarra in the UK. When your 'method' is up and running you'll see what I mean. You're being very unrealistic.
p.s don't tell me I'm disrespecting My Guru when you're the one so interested in rituals involved with serving.
You people are the type who ignore devotion and love, the core of our religion and pick on petty irrelevant things.
p.p.s Your anger issues project onto your posts.
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^^^That's your opinion and I have mine. Seva is about love and devotion and sevadars are serving with the same love and devotion.
If you think otherwise and that it's becoming like maccis you are seriously deluded and insulting all that love waiting patiently and humbly for gurujis food and those who serve with love. I find it ridiculous that people are not humble enough to stand in line for the holiest food on earth.
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O humble servants of the Lord, behold the True Guru with your eyes.
Whatever you wish for, you shall receive, chanting the Word of the Lord's Name, under Guru's Instruction. ||1||Pause||
Worship the Guru, the True Guru, as the Supreme Lord God; serve Him constantly, all day and night. ||1||You've been given your answer and have been blessed to have gotten it so clearly!
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"Sikh" Awards
in WHAT'S HAPPENING?
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I agree with you!