ThunderousDominator

Could you take Amitabh's alleged comment in context?

Could you take Harbans Lal Khuranas comment in context?

Could you take the actions/words of Tytler and Sajjan Kumar in context?

Could you take Indira's comments in context?

huge false equivalency but since you said your time on this forum is done i wont get into it good luck in the future with whatever you do hopefully it benefits humanity

Harjinder Singh (sic) alias Jinda who was convicted and later hanged for the murder of the former Army Chief, General A.S. Vaidya was no ordinary man. He was arrested twice by the Delhi Police during my tenure as Commissioner of Police, Delhi. This self-confessed killer was not just a ruthless killer. He had another side to his personality: he could be charming and humorous even when injured and battling for his life. When I met him after his arrest by the Delhi Police he seemed anything but a psychopath. He had psychological traits which made him and extraordinary person, but these did not make him mentally unsound.

First Arrest

Jinda was first arrested by the Delhi police in 1985, more by chance than owing to any previous knowledge that he was an active terrorist. A spate of bank robberies had taken place in Delhi and the Delhi Police was under criticism for its inability to stop them. I was daily being taken to task by the Union Home Minister and the media. Till Jinda’s arrest there was no evidence about any possible link between these bank robberies and terrorism in Punjab. Jinda fell into the police net on the basis of a low-grade information about the theft of a car. Only on the day after his arrest when during interrogation, Jinda started speaking about Pakistani plans for shootouts at public places and killings of Hindus to create Hindu-Sikh riots, that that the police realized that they had a big catch in their hands. The acting Additional Commissioner of Police Crime, RK Sharma rang me up in my house on a Sunday morning to inform me about his arrest.

Interrogation

I decided to go to the Crime Branch Interrogation Centre to talk to this very ordinary looking man for over one hour and was fascinated by not only what he told me but the way he narrated his story. He had no fear and no remorse. He rather enjoyed talking about his many escapades in which the police, like in the Bombay films, did not come out very well. Here a young man from Amritsar had actually succeeded in getting the better of the entire Delhi Police force and that was something which gave him tremendous satisfaction. He underplayed his role as a terrorist in the cause of achieving Khalistan, perhaps intentionally but had no hesitation in boasting about his daring bank robberies in broad daylight in the heart of Delhi. He insisted on calling Delhi “Rajdhani” and obviously derived immense satisfaction from taking on the police in Delhi. Even at that stage though we did not know much about his terrorist antecedents, he talked in terms of “them” and “us”. It struck me even then that he was more forthcoming and almost friendly with me, because here he was talking to a head of the Delhi Police on an equal footing. He had no hesitation in telling me about his unhappy childhood and his petty crimes in Amritsar.

He was later transferred to Gujarat from where he escaped while being escorted from the jail to the trail court. After his escape he started committing even more daring acts of terrorism. He became a feared terrorist and was well-known both in Delhi and Punjab. We learnt about his involvement in the killing of Lalit Makan the Congress MP and Arjun Dass, a close Sanjay Gandhi associate.

Second Meeting

He was arrested for the second time by the Delhi Police in August 1987, in an encounter in the Civil Lines area in which he was seriously injured. He was taken to the Civil Lines Police Station before the arrival of an ambulance. This time there was no doubt that the Delhi Police had scored a major success. His capture was the result of close cooperation between the Delhi Police and the Intelligence Bureau. I learnt about the encounter on my wireless set and rushed to the Police Station within a few minutes. Jinda was being moved into the ambulance on a stretcher when he saw me. He immediately recognized me and greeted me with a big smile. He must have been in terrible agony, but that did not stop him from joking. “Mubaraq ho. Ab to app ko bahut bari taraqui milegi. Delhi Police ne mujhe pakar liya hai” (Congratulations. Now you will get a promotion-Delhi Police has been able to arrest me). Here was a man almost on his deathbed and yet he had the audacity to poke fun and laugh. I could see that he was enjoying the thought of not only making the supreme sacrifice for the cause in which he believed, but of being able to be one up on the Commissioner of the Delhi Police.

He was take to the Army Hospital in the cantonment, because of security considerations, and miraculously, he responded to the treatment after a successful operation. I went to see him along with DCP Crime, this time not to interrogate him but to see someone who had earned my respect. I must confess that then my feelings for this man were not that of professional police officer for an outlaw but were mixed with some warmth and admiration.

Ideology

It is important at this point to say something about our system. Here was a known killer of the former Army Chief being treated by the army doctors, who performed nothing short of a miracle in saving his life. When I entered his room he was lying on the bed as the lower portion of his body was completely paralysed. The doctors could not say at that time whether he would ever be able to use his legs again. On seeing me he again greeted warmly and apologized for not being able to get up. He thanked me for coming to see him. He behaved as if he was talking to an old friend. He was in a talkative mood and this time told me all about the terrorist movement in Punjab and their ultimate goal of Khalistan with Pakistani help. He bragged about his escape from Ahmedabad and had absolutely no fear of death. He was certain that his end was not too far off and tauntingly told me that this time the Delhi Police would not make the mistake of handing him over to the Gujarat Police. When I told him that we would not hand him over to the Punjab Police as he suspected but to the Maharashtra Police to face a trial, he could not believe it. We later did hand him over to the Maharashtra Police. He was tried in the Pune Jail for a protracted trial and later hanged.

Terrorism gave Jinda a cause to live for. There was no question of diverting him from the path which he had chosen for himself. He justified the most heinous of his crimes in the name of the “Panth”. It is the combination of political factors and such traits in their personality that attracts people like Jinda to the terrorist movement. The sole aim of his life became commission of terrorist acts, which he firmly believed would in the end succeed in achieving their goal of “Khalistan”. There is no scope for any negotiations with such men. But such personality traits are seen only among the hard-core terrorists. There are of course other types of person among terrorist their supporter and sympathizers who are more amenable to negotiations and compromise.

Ved Marwah Uncivil Wars: Pathology of Terrorism In India p. 16

I dont believe anybody said he never said it just that his words were being taken out of context I didnt watch the above video yet but is that the one were he explains exactly why he said what he said the explanation being he didnt say it out of gusa but to prove discrimination against sikhs: countless peacefully protesting sikhs can be killed and the government will do nothing but make a mere threat towards hindus and the government immediately takes action(proof of this is that not one single hindu was harmed in that hour) or is it just some badly edited attack video.Another thing conveniently ignored by indians is that sant ji helped any hindu who came to him for help I guess it doesnt fit in with the rabid hindu hater picture they try to paint of him

Back to my point. Do you have AK-47s in western temples as well, or do you carry them around in Europe, Canada or America? Probably not because you would probably get arrested faster than you could say your name.

From what I've read all the arms carried by sant ji and his followers were licensed by the indian government I will try to dig up the source also did you get a chance to read the short piece written by subramanian swamy I posted in another thread

thank you so much

for more information read the book "5 vices and 4 eras"

amandeep have you read this article written by Dr Subramaniam Swami

about sant ji and operation bluestar

June 6, will be remembered as a landmark in modern Indian history. On that date, the indian armed forces took control of the Golden Temple complex after destroying the Akal Takht and killing Sant Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale. The nation, on the whole, expressed releif. A few of us, however, expressed sorrow and felt that Operation Bluestar, as the action was called, was horrible blunder which would aggravate the problem of "terrorism", not contain it. Since then, the problem has, indeed, been aggravated. New crusaders for the Sikhs have now surfaced.

To put the record straight, Ram Jethmalani - the new Galahad - was not one of those who had opposed Operation Bluestar. Today he may pose at a defender of the underdog, but on June 6, 1984, he expressed satisfaction with goverment's ation.

This is said not, of course, to defend the BJP in sacking Jethmalani. The BJP is wholly communal. As long as Jethmalani was defending Haji Mastaan, the alleged smuggler king, Varadarajan Mudaliar, Jaspal Singh (of the CIA espionage case), and the Sarda case murders in Pune, the BJP was at peace with its principles. But the moment Jethmalani decided to defend the two alleged comspirators in the murder of Mrs Gandhi, the BJP expressed great revulsion. This revulsion is due to the fact that the BJP is once again wooing the vote-bank in North India which laid the foundations for Pakistan. Besides, the BJP is now busy trying to make Khalistan inevitable. The forces behind this vote bank are actively trying to polarise Punjab. The BJP, thus, is aspiring to be the agent of the "silent terrorists" - the Hindu communalist' - Jethamalani is merely the fly in the ointment.

The Jethmalani issue is typical of the machinations that have created the present situation in Punjab. Various actors in the drama have indulged in posturing without regard for the consequences on their histrionics. First, there was Mrs Ghandi, who described the Akali Dal's 41 point economic and social demand charter as "secessionist" in a effort to win the communal Hindu vote. There was nothing separatist about these demands. Then came her son, Rajiv Ghandi, who maintained that the Anandpur Sahib Resolution was antinational. There was nothing unpatriotic in this resolution - if one cared to read it. He also raised the alarm on the Sikh's use of words like "quam" and phrases like "Raj Karega Khalsa" and on that basis denounced the whole community as Khalistanis - all by clever innuendos. "Quam" is no more unacceptable that the "desam" in Telugu Desam or "nadu" in Tamil Nadu. And "Raj Karega Khalsa" is roughly, the equivalent of "Satyameva Jayate". And yet Sikhs were made to feel traitors for using these words .

Arguing the counter-point on the Punjab issue, all discussions must ultimately zero in on Bhindranwale, about whom there is so much disinformation that this column is insufficient to remedy the situation. In fact, i am writing an account of the Punjab tragedy in the form of a book in which Bhindranwale figures objectively - warts and all. I hope, my book will inspire a future government to set up a special commission to find out the true story of what happened. My first hand knowledge of events in Punjab also lead me to say the following about Sant Bhindranwale.
He never advocated Khalistan even when the indian army laid seige to the Golden Temple.
He was a strict moralist, totally against liquor, drugs and promiscuity. Hence, i totally disbeleive any rumours about pregnant abducted women kept as his prisoners, which were only spread to malign him.
He was stance anti-communist, and had broken the hold of the Naxalities and pro-soviet communists on the youth of Punjab.

It was Bhindranwale's anti-communist stance that activated the Russians and the KGB lobby in Mrs Ghandi's camp to spread disinformation and thus discredit him. A few days before Operation Bluestar, Pravda wroted that Bhindranwale had a direct telephonic link with the CIA in Langley, Virginia, the headquarters of the agency. That was untrue, but leading dailies in New Delhi published wire service reproductions of that article. Who organised this negative media blitz?

A large number of the murders committed in Punjab brought swift condemnation from him, but these were never published. Such were the maneuvers of the goverments media mafia. In my presence, Bhindranwale had condemned the massacre in which Hindu's travelling in a bus were segregated and shot. He sent money to the affected Hindu families. But this was never published in any newspaper. When Dr V.N Tiwari, MP, was shot dead in his house in Chandigarh, Bhindranwale wrote to his wife expressing his sorrow and called the murder an act of cowardice.
But there was such as frenzy in the country at the time that no one was willing to listen. The government encouraged the rumours and disinformation. Even i, who never said anywhere that there were no arms in the Golden Temple, was quoted as having said so by Rajiv Ghandhi in the 1984 monsoon session of parliament. When i challanged him to produce just one news report from a reputable paper as proof, he was unable to do so. All this is part of the Lok Sabha proceedings which we can refer to and yet, from Kanyakumari to Kashmir, wherever i went, the statement that i had never made was quoted again and again to discredit whatever else i would say about Punjab. Who arranged this publicity? The same people who finally murdered Bhindranwale?

hindus love pulling the pakistan card but its such a stupid point pakistan and hindustan are enemies its in pakistans interests to support movements that destabilize there enemies but to act as if pakistan was the cause of the whole conflict is as disingenuous as you can get the role hindustan played in the formation of bangladesh is a million x bigger than the role pakistan played the khalistan conflict

Why hasn't this hindustani clown been banned yet? Its obvious he is anti Sikh and he has been exposed in numerous threads.

as long as he doesnt say anything insulting i dont think he should be banned

The moral of the story dont start fights you cannot finish. If you had continued the path of non-violence you would have gotten what you need eventually. Instead, people like yourself nearly destroyed punjab. It still has not recovered.

Actually if we continued the path of non violence we would have gotten shot while we were peacefully protesting, we wouldve gotten police agents infiltrate the peaceful protests and commit acts of violence in order to justify the use of force to stamp down on the protests and we would have gotten tens of thousands of youth tossed in jail with no charges. Do you know how I know this ? BECAUSE THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED Are you damn blind to all the non violent means that were pursued from 1947-1984 during the punjabi suba movement, during indiras state of emergency during the dharam yudh morcha look at what we got in turn . Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.

and that makes it perfectly ok to kill them, burn down there churches, rape there nuns and parade them naked throughout the streets right? you see christians distributing the same propaganda against sikhi but you dont see sikhs go out and murdering them like hindus do even though there propaganda is more dangerous to our faith than it is to yours because of our much smaller population

im all for remembering our pre sikh history for knowledge and educational purposes but what does that have to do with the british creation called india?

are you proud of that steaming pile of dog tatti on your front lawn?

bhai rajoana shouldve been made jathedar long ago

ron bandharjee

not surprising

No.

jathedar sahib has nowhere near the power and authority that badal does

this amandeep1378 guy is a hindu not being paranoid just look at his post history you will see for yourself as soon as he signed up he made countless posts attacking muslims and a couple denouncing khalistan and now the bs hes posted in this thread