hawk13

Click Here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolowali_Encounter:_KAF_against_Indian_Armed_Forces

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rataul_Encoun...an_Armed_Forces

5 Singhs against 12,000

7 Singhs against 1,000

In Rataul fighting more than 100 troops dead one was major, and 2 other officers it is cosisdered as the most difficult gunbattle ever fought.

Could someone from the sangat help me with a question I've been wondering about for some time.. Was Sant Harchand Singh Longowal a traitor or martyr?? I know he was Dictator of the Dharam Yudh Morcha and President of Akali Dal at that time..But why did some Singhs kill him??Did Sant Longowal also surrender during Operation Bluestar?? Some Singhs I know regard him as a traitor for betraying Sant Jarnail Singh Khalsa Bhindranwale..is this true??

Any info and comments will be highly appreciated!!

Bhul Chuk Maaf!!

He was the biggest traitor of the panth on the one hand he was leading the morcha on the other hand he was also planning the killing of BHINDERAWALE SANT JI, he knew about the army action before hand and used to call sant ji as chambal da sant. He is not alone others fake sants also sided with invaders.That is why he was taken out safely along with tohra.

^^Did you even watch the video hawk13??

Its a video on 'Bana and Sikh Identity' and i don't know what 1santkhalsa is on about. These people aren't chelles of ashutosh.

No brother I did not watch the video but I have seen and watched the khali wife interview in ZEE NETWORK in INDIA 2 weeks back where there were pictures of KHALI with noormehalis and when he won the title the noormehalis garlanded him. Here I want to mention one very interesting fact that 4 years back at PHILLAUR Punjab Police training school, the some of the trainers used to carry recruits to the noormehal dera and some of the policemen were involed in first attack on a sikh preacher in Phillaur who was thrown into burning flames in 2002 or 3 along with his wife I do not know the year. After this his chelas used to distribute the literature but some sikh recruits resisted the anti sikh propaganda and a armed clash was averted by the officers by shifting some pro noormehali trainers this was repoted in INDIAN EXPRESS in 2004 and officer incharge DIG also admited it.during the same year a AMRITDHARI SIKH was beaten to death in a village near TARNTARN VILLAGE but police hushed it up by calling it a case of sucide but a close relative of the victim a NIHANG SINGH caught the main person behind the gresome killing in village bus stand and choped off the head of that guilty man who also worked as RAGI in SGPC run GURDWARA such is state of panthic affairs this incident was reported in small columbs so none took note of it.

click hereeeeeeeee

The mahasa by the id name of pappi bharmin and rahul along with lahoria is spreading hatred and disgracing the GURU JI . God forbids if these mahsas come accross true sikhs they will know taste of khalsai teghas

Noormehalias r spreading their poison they r not only have political leaders as their chelas but celebrties like WWE WRESTLER DALIP SINGH RANA KNOWN BY RING GREAT KHALI is also his chela his wife openly admitted in zee t.v and same channel has shown pictures of khali with Autoush along with his wife.his wife is also diehard follower of noormehilas. noormehlia preacher also confirmed it.

Actualy about Bhagat Singh what Mann said was right but way of saying was very crude this is not fault of Mann as he spoke like a police officer even entering politics he acts like a policeman this is the fault of Mann. Why Bhagat Singh is more glorified when others sikhs like Banta Singh and Santa Singh of Babbar AKALIS made more sacrifices. For example SAnta singh ESCAPED from Port Blair jail 7 times in that jail even in 24 hours spirit used to be broken and indian prisoners used to become touts of british this happened with sarvakar. Bengali extremists like Surya Sen , Khuddi Ram role model was banda singh bahadur this was in the book writen by R.C MAZUMDAR TITLED FREEDOM MOVEMENT OF INDIA IN 4 volumes . The bhagat Singh was glorified as he cutt his hair. Why Bengali fighters were ignored.

Police is denying burning of effigy but THE TRIBUNE HAS CONFIRMED IT Police say they just burned the photos of sant jee and identified them as Gagan dip singh gogi others as harish singla and Rakesh atwal although they were 12 . News headlines is shiv sena leaders held. in 2004 and 2005 these hooligans blankened the posters of sant jee during GALLUGHARA WEEK IN JUNE in BANGA and PATIALA PAWAN GUPTA IS THEIR LEADER A SUPPORTER OF BADAL GROUP.

O n12th decmber at 2.30 12 shiv sainiks burned photograhs of SANT JARNAIL SINGH BHANDRAWALE in RAJPURA ROAD OUTSIDE THE HANUMAN MANDIR. This is direct threat to sikhi this news was in tribune .3 of them r arrested others r still at large.

can you please tell us what pangti it was? . . .so we know what we are apparently ment to be arguing over? thanks

VEER JI they just first stated the one line from GRANTH SHAIB WHERE THE EXAMPLE OF RAVAN IS GIVEN BUT RAMCHANDER IS NEVER GLORIFIED. THEN THEY STARTED KIRTAN IN SIKH Raga FORM THAT VACHAN DI KHATTER RAJ THUKRAYA after this they stated glorifying ramchandera while quoting gurbani cleverly concealing their manmat in very very clever manner that during dusshera is another big manmat . but unfortunately some members started defending the ragis instead cotradicting me.tell me on hindu festivel glorlifying a methlogical individual is manmat or not. Apart from this on festival of karvachauth katha from GURDWARA WERE DONE TO KEEP FAST ON KARVACAUTH ALSO MANY GURSIKHS HAVE RAISED OBECTIONS. I HAVE ALREADY THE MENTIONED THE MANMATS. ANOTHER BIG BEADBI OF GURGHAR IS DONE IN KOLLKOTTA DURING DEVALI THAT BEADBI IS A MODEL OF DURBAR SHAIB IS MADE AND THEN A IDOL OF DURGA IS PLACED INSIDE THE MODEL THIS PRACTICE IS DONE SINCE2003 AND IS GOING TO BE DONE ON THIS DEVALI ALSO. SEE KIRTAN IN PRAISE OF RAMCHANDER IN THIS PRESPECTIVE THEN IT IS CLEAR FANATIC HINDU BODIES ARE IMPLEMENTING THEIR AGENDA FEARLESSLY WE WILL NOT BE SURPRISED IF IN FUTURE WE WILL IDOLS INSTEAD OF GRANTH SHAIB IN DURBAR SHAIB.

SORRY i missed some words from the last line it was we will not be surprised if in futre we will idols in DURBAR SHAIB INSTEAD OF GRANTH SHAIB. AND IN MANY GURDWARAS IN PUNJAB ON EVE OF KARVACAUTH GRANTHIS TOLD THE SANGAT THAT LADIES SHOULD KEEP FAST FOR LONG LIFE OF THEIR HUSBANDS.

can you please tell us what pangti it was? . . .so we know what we are apparently ment to be arguing over? thanks

VEER JI they just first stated the one line from GRANTH SHAIB WHERE THE EXAMPLE OF RAVAN IS GIVEN BUT RAMCHANDER IS NEVER GLORIFIED. THEN THEY STARTED KIRTAN IN SIKH Raga FORM THAT VACHAN DI KHATTER RAJ THUKRAYA after this they stated glorifying ramchandera while quoting gurbani cleverly concealing their manmat in very very clever manner that during dusshera is another big manmat . but unfortunately some members started defending the ragis instead cotradicting me.tell me on hindu festivel glorlifying a methlogical individual is manmat or not. Apart from this on festival of karvachauth katha from GURDWARA WERE DONE TO KEEP FAST ON KARVACAUTH ALSO MANY GURSIKHS HAVE RAISED OBECTIONS. I HAVE ALREADY THE MENTIONED THE MANMATS. ANOTHER BIG BEADBI OF GURGHAR IS DONE IN KOLLKOTTA DURING DEVALI THAT BEADBI IS A MODEL OF DURBAR SHAIB IS MADE AND THEN A IDOL OF DURGA IS PLACED INSIDE THE MODEL THIS PRACTICE IS DONE SINCE2003 AND IS GOING TO BE DONE ON THIS DEVALI ALSO. SEE KIRTAN IN PRAISE OF RAMCHANDER IN THIS PRESPECTIVE THEN IT IS CLEAR FANATIC HINDU BODIES ARE IMPLEMENTING THEIR AGENDA FEARLESSLY WE WILL NOT BE SURPRISED IF IN FUTURE WE WILL IDOLS INSTEAD OF GRANTH SHAIB IN DURBAR SHAIB.

Hawk - i will have to disagree with you.

To state that Guru Nanak Ji was revolutionary in that he believed in one God is incorrect.

Jesus, Moses, Allah and even Hindus believe in one almighty God. So this thought was not new to Guru Nank Ji.

Kabir, Farid and other bhagats believed in ek aunkar and they lived prior to Guru Nanak Ji.

The Guru's recognised this, hence their writings were included in the Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

I might question a lot of things but not the Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Dear brother do not take just one perspective that other messengers also believed in one god where did any one of them have mentioned the ekonkar secondly there message was more religious and they fellowed their own evil customs did not dare to change it as they feared that they may loss mass apeal, for example why did Ramchander first asked for agni pariksha of sita why did not he himself gave the same secondly he was so weak that he has to leave his wife in advanced stage of pregnency so to appese the people who were wrong another example of sanatan cotradiction was a incident when siva cutt off the head of ganesh why did parvati threatened to destroy the world why did had to kill innocent people. u r again wrong why there is worship of shivling and loni u call it worship of god? even Prophept Mommamad did not dare to change the arbian custom of slavery of human beings. paticularily sexual abuse of women in event of war just legalised children born out of this sex abuse u can go through the muslim personal . Farid, kabir did not try and attemped to create the new and free social order yes ravidass did give the concept of BEGUMPURA. GURU NANAK DEV JI NOT ONLY CHANGED SOCIAL ORDER BUT DESTRROYED THE EVIL CUSTOMS LIKE SATI, SLAVERY AND ALSO ADVOCATED FOR FIRST AND GLORIFIED DIGNITY OF LABOUR BY THE TERM OF KIRAT KARO, WAND CHAKO,AND INTRODUCED LANGAR SYSTEM BASED ON EQUAITY HE DID AND SUCEEDED IN CREATING CIVILISED SOCIAL ORDER . DID KRINSNA ASKED HIS WIVES NO TO COMMIT SATI IN EVENT OF HIS DEATH answer is no. SO SIKH GURUS ARE FIRST AND FREEDOM FIGHTERS AND TRUE REVOLTIONARY IN PRACTICAL MANNER.

HAWK 13 bro Im glad we have brothers like you who see sense and understand what I have been trying tell people here,it gives me great pleasure to see another brother with brains who understands the RSS ideology and how they train and kill.

thanx A LOT BROTHER but the problem is most of the sikhs r not aware of real danger of RSS and its sister organisations as it has many facea like ABVP the student wing DURGA VAHINI women wing BHARAT VIKAS PARISHAD SOCIAL ACTION GROUP. BHARAT VIKAS PARISHAD is having its branches allover punjab including rural areas this organisation do social work to gain popularity and gets funds from the common sikhs on the name of social work once I got their megazine it was full of disgraceful writings about the sikh gurus.Many serving and retired officials and judges r its members among them r KPS GILL, RS BEDI air marshall, P.C DOGRA, among others. P.C Dogra even advocated raising of hindu terorrist gangs to kill sikhs and muslims.

hawk13, how can you be so sure that what they sung was not bani? do you all of guru granth sahib jee kanth?

I do take regularily take the hukum yes I DO NOT READ GRANTH SHAIB KANTH but I CAN MAKE OUT WHAT IS IN granth shaib. BUT CAN DO NITNEM OF MOST BANIS KANTH.

The best place on earth is a mandir - the HariMANDIR.

Slowy the fascits 'Sikhs' - ( they are not even Sikhs) want to change the name to Darbar Sahib - to escape from Hindu associations.

Soon they will want to change the writings of the Guru Granth Sahib Ji and take out all references to Hinduism like RAM, HARI, etc -

If Sarpanch and other fascists do not like Sikhis association with Hinduism - and if Islam is so attractive to them - they should convert to Islam and go to Pakistan.

People like Sarpanch are an embarrassement to Sikhs.

All they spew out is anit- Hindu hatred.

- The name is Harmandar Sahib ( Not Hari Mandir). I have noted on the other-hand, that it is the “Hindu” media are the ones which mis-spell Harmandar as “Hari Mandir”

- Every gurdwara has a Darbar (Darwar) Sahib. Darbar Sahib comes into being when, on a specially prepared place, the parkash of Siri Guru Granth Sahib is done. SachKhand part of the Harmandar Sahib complex is not the only place where Darbar Sahib is in the complex. There is also a Darbar Sahib in the Akal Takht within that complex. However, it so happens that because of the importance of the Harmandar Sahib to Sikhism , the place has also come to be known as “The” Darbar Sahib. Calling Harmandar Sahib as “the” Darbar Sahib is in no way related to the association or dissociation of Sikhism with Hinduism.

-Theology of Sikhism is different from that of Hinduism. It has been so right from Guru Nanak. So articulating it clearly as different from Hinduism should not make you so nervous. Sikhism did not come out of Hindu “thought”. Sikhism is based on that which was “revealed” to Guru Nanak. ( By the times of Guru Nanak the Hindu thought was fully developed. So what would have been the purpose of God to reveal the Hindu thought again ). Sikhism is not a midpoint between Hinduism and Islam either. Neither it was a “movement” to reform Hinduism. Sikhism is based upon the revelation to Guru Nanak of the “Truth” about the universe and how Human being relate to Formless entity (Nirankar). It totally rejects that deities are being gods and it rejects “Human gods” like Ram of Ayudhia.

Guru Nanak wrote in the terminology of religion that was being used in those days to convey his message. The reference to Ram in Siri Guru Granth Sahib appears many times to point out that Ram of Ayudhia is not “God” and that if one insists on calling Ram as God it should be thought as the same entity as is Narankar ( formless) not that Ram who lived in Ayudhia. That Ram died like all other human beings and therefore is “NOT GOD”. So don’t get too worried about it either. Sikhs are not going to remove that reference to Ram as it is there to remind people that the theology of Sikhism is different from that of Hinduism.

Thank you for your reply Mohan Singh.

Guru Nanak Ji's thoughts and beliefs were prevailent prior to Guru Nanak Ji's times as well.

Tha Bhakti movement can be traced hundreds of years priro to Guru Ji.

That is why we have bani's of Farid Ji, Kabir Ji and other bhakats in the Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

These bhagats were around prior to Guru Nanak Ji.

Guru Nanak Ji togeter with his own revelations put these thoughts together and set in motion what is Sikhism.

Re Ram, Hari etc.

I know these words refer to the one God, not to ramchandar or other Hindu characters.

My point was that these are words undoubtedly have Hindu connotatitions - and it seems that today anything associated with Hinduism is demonised and in fact insulted.

Soon these Sikh extremists will want to change the names of Guru Arjun Ji, Guru Ram Das Ji, Guru Har Krishan Ji, Guru Gobind Singh Ji because they all refer to Hindu historical characters.

Re Harimandir or Harmandar.

Even if we take the latter spelling

HAR means God

Mandar means ? please tell me

To me it does not matter if we call the Golden Temple - Harmandar, Harimandir or Darbar Sahib.

As we all know some say ram ram and some kudha - all the same.

Fateh.

Dear brother first I want to correct u regarding BHAKTI MOVEMENT . Guru Nanak dev ji had no link with bhakti movement as it was a reforms movement. Guru Nanak Dv Ji created a new thought and new order.I t is true some selected banis of bhagats have been included not whole writings the reason is sikhism believes in ONE ALMIGHTY EKONKAR.Guru Nanak Dev ji was a REVOLTIONARY IN PRACTICE AND FIRST FREE DOM FIGTER IN HUMAN HISTORY. As hindu minded scholars call it bhagati movement falsely. Why guru ji was a freedom fighter and revolnary the answer is guru created a new order changing social structure and seeked and got freedom from social, economic and culutral freedom and paved the way for political freedom.Leftists calls MARX as a revotionary but he in practice was quite oposite was a paper tiger that is one of the reason for failure of communist regimes.Guru Nanak dev ji freed the people from religious slavery also.Bhagati movement seeked reforms only not the change. As far hindu link r concerned first find the true meaning of word of hindu .It was writen in hindu texts that vishnu raped the wife of king jalandhar then fell in love for her who commited sucide and saligram was created in memory of this shameful act. Same vishnu is called hari by brahmins and worshipped if u r referring to it then u r going againist sikhism as sikhi teaches respect to women even she belongs to enemy camp.

Hawk 13 i was not aware of the one liner. As stated when i listened to the kirtan i can distinctly remember hearing the shabad i quoted. If the case is that some other kavita outside of gurbani that the breaks the code of only gurbani being quoted in harmandir sahib and as you stated this should not be condoned and somehow should be taken up with the authority of the akaal takhat

See brother it is not the first time sancity of DURBAR SHAIB has been violated. 2 years back some scientists removed branches from DUKHBHANJANI BERI and studied it and strated growing same tree in the new mandir at vellore and at tripati. Apart from this some water from SARVOVAR was also shifted to hindu mandir ponds as trree and SAROVAR was found to contain some extraordinary healing properties during lab tests this was reported in HT last year THE SGPC was feeling proud of it.

Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj tells us about the Nirghun and Sarghun qualities of the Avatars like Ram etc, further more Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj stated that there is no Muslim or Hindu…..He did not go on to state there are only Sikhs. Guru Ji message was a simple one; it was not about religions and territories but about the brotherhood of humanity and the awareness of Satnam Vaheguru!

GURU JI was againist avtarvad and further GURU JI held position of sikhs even superior to HIMSELF there r many incidents from GURU NANAK DEVI TO GURU GOBIND SINGH JI where sikh was given higher position than the guru. GURU NANAK DEV JI GAVE GURGADDI TO LEHNA A SIKH and GURU GOBIND SINGH TOOK AMRIT FROM PANJ PYRAAS apart from it there r many examples . Why we keep KARAH PRASAD FOR PANJ PYRAAS ANSWER IS GURU GOBIND SINGH JI HAS GIVEN SOUL OF GURU TO GRANTH SHAIB AND PHYSICAL FORM TO GURU PANTH. So GURU GRANTH AND GURU PANTH R INTEGRAL TO EACH-OTHR.SIKH MEANS DISCPLINE OF ALMIGHTY IDENTITY IS KHALSA WHICH IS AKAL PURKAKH KI FAUJ.

The best place on earth is a mandir - the HariMANDIR.

Slowy the fascits 'Sikhs' - ( they are not even Sikhs) want to change the name to Darbar Sahib - to escape from Hindu associations.

Soon they will want to change the writings of the Guru Granth Sahib Ji and take out all references to Hinduism like RAM, HARI, etc -

If Sarpanch and other fascists do not like Sikhis association with Hinduism - and if Islam is so attractive to them - they should convert to Islam and go to Pakistan.

People like Sarpanch are an embarrassement to Sikhs.

All they spew out is anit- Hindu hatred.

First tell the members whether hindu word exists in old hindu text or not and true meaning of hindu rather the hindu fanatics r the biggest fascist organisation in world known as RSS only one to follow hitler idelogy. Sikhs cannot be fascists rather SARPANCH like a true sikh is fighting the fascists.GURU NANAK DEV JI refused to wear zanue and rejected karamkand associated with marriageand introduced seperate ceromony of marriage will u call THE GURU JI ALSO FASCIST. See before 1920 hindu minded Mahants who was managing the GURDWARAS used to exploit the sikh women instead of keeertan during BAISAKHI in amritsar lewd songs used to be sung according to state police reports this festival used to be festival of anti-social people.and idols of hindu gods used to be worshipped in every histroric place before harping on hindu sikh link go through the history of akali morchas.Do u want same practice to be reintroduced. badal and co is doing the same thing.

“Hindu python is trying to swallow the Khalsa”

V'S

There’s no competition, not in my eyes anyway.

But now they have modern arms and they (rss) exibited in Ludihana during election of their president of punjab unit and organised training camps where ex army officers ex dgps took part and exhorted youths to form terorrist gangs to kill minorities . Such camps were organised in MUKKSAR SHAIB GURDWARA in 2005 ,NANGAL SHAIB GURDWARA in same year besides hundreds of such camps organised 1998-2006 in which SUCH punjab leaders like MUKANDI LAL GARG balram ji dass tandon and mukandi lal took part. during 2001 badal announced 10 crore aid for their student wing ABVP.Which was used for anti-sikh propaganda only in MOHALI such propaganda was stopped boldy by gursikhs who threatened armed opposition. iN madya pradesh RSS EXHIBITED RIFLES AND AK-47S.Unlike nihangs who keep weapons for showpiece.In tehlaka tapes of gujarat riots clearly shows how rss prepared for ethnic cleasing if we ignore it then prepared for another genocide killings of84

If what veer ji is saying is true Sikhs have become a total joke,You would never see this kind of stuff in mecca,they stick to their faith ,unlike Sikhs who go all over the place.

To Jassa Bhai Taru Singh Gurdwara never got taken over do a search on the forum,it has been proved by me and also Panthic.org that all that news was lies by Media and Indian agents,I even proved it with a picture taken a few days after the co called takeover,so stop spreading your Hindu agenda here!

Maybe you should stop the anti-Hindu agenda.

Plese do not take it as anti hindu agenda I have more nonsikhs as friends but reality is that fantic hinduism had taken over holiest places of buddhhists like BADRINATH, which have no link with hinduism I will describe in details about it in another topic soon.Hindu python is trying to swallow the khalsa .

can you please quote the shabad you state was manmat or provide the clip?

Is the shabad in question from the bani of Guru Sahib?

The Shabad i heard was this one

sloku mÚ 1 ]

salok ma 1 ||

Salok, First Mehla:

shMsr dwn dy ieMdRü roAwieAw ]

seha(n)sar dhaan dhae ei(n)dhra roaaeiaa ||

Branded with a thousand marks of disgrace, Indra cried in shame.

prs rwmu rovY Gir AwieAw ]

paras raam rovai ghar aaeiaa ||

Paras Raam returned home crying.

AjY su rovY BIiKAw Kwie ]

ajai s rovai bheekhiaa khaae ||

Ajai cried and wept, when he was made to eat the manure he had given, pretending it was charity.

AYsI drgh imlY sjwie ]

aisee dharageh milai sajaae ||

Such is the punishment received in the Court of the Lord.

rovY rwmu inkwlw BieAw ]

rovai raam nikaalaa bhaeiaa ||

Rama wept when he was sent into exile,

sIqw lKmxu ivCuiV gieAw ]

seethaa lakhaman vishhurr gaeiaa ||

and separated from Sita and Lakhshman.

rovY dhisru lµk gvwie ] ijin sIqw AwdI faurU vwie ]

rovai dhehasir la(n)k gavaae || jin seethaa aadhee ddouroo vaae ||

The ten-headed Raawan, who stole away Sita with the beat of his tambourine, wept when he lost Sri Lanka.

rovih pWfv Bey mjUr ] ijn kY suAwmI rhq hdUir ]

rovehi paa(n)ddav bheae majoor || jin kai suaamee rehath hadhoor ||

The Paandavas once lived in the Presence of the Lord; they were made slaves, and wept.

rovY jnmyjw Kuie gieAw ]

rovai janamaejaa khue gaeiaa ||

Janmayjaa wept, that he had lost his way.

eykI kwrix pwpI BieAw ]

eaekee kaaran paapee bhaeiaa ||

One mistake, and he became a sinner.

rovih syK mswiek pIr ]

rovehi saekh masaaeik peer ||

The Shaykhs, Pirs and spiritual teachers weep;

AMiq kwil mqu lwgY BIV ]

a(n)th kaal math laagai bheerr ||

at the very last instant, they suffer in agony.

rovih rwjy kMn pVwie ]

rovehi raajae ka(n)n parraae ||

The kings weep - their ears are cut;

Gir Gir mwgih BIiKAw jwie ]

ghar ghar maagehi bheekhiaa jaae ||

they go begging from house to house.

rovih ikrpn sMcih Dnu jwie ]

rovehi kirapan sa(n)chehi dhhan jaae ||

The miser weeps; he has to leave behind the wealth he has gathered.

pMifq rovih igAwnu gvwie ]

pa(n)ddith rovehi giaan gavaae ||

The Pandit, the religious scholar, weeps when his learning is gone.

bwlI rovY nwih Bqwru ]

baalee rovai naahi bhathaar ||

The young woman weeps because she has no husband.

nwnk duKIAw sBu sMswru ]

naanak dhukheeaa sabh sa(n)saar ||

O Nanak, the whole world is suffering.

mMny nwau soeI ijix jwie ]

ma(n)nae naao soee jin jaae ||

He alone is victorious, who believes in the Lord's Name.

AaurI krm n lyKY lwie ]1]

aouree karam n laekhai laae ||1||

No other action is of any account. ||1||

you hear the katha of it by Sant Jarnail Singh Ji. I dont believe their is any praise of sri ramchandar in the bani of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Ramkali Raag quoted above?

Only bani can be sung in Sri Harmandir Sahib and not any other sort of poetry (kavita) from outside of Sikhi.

Another thing. You might want to turn the CAPS LOCK off

No veer ji it is not the vani FROM GRANTH SHAIB as I regularily take HUKAM and I am also a AMRITDHARI that is why I got the shock I could not record it . IT was ramchander AYODHA raj tyagya apne mat pita de kehen utte then cleverly Ragis quoted from the GRANTH SHIAB just one line about Ravana then Ramchandera was called GOD RAMA . CAN ANYONE JUSTIFY IT they r misinterpretating it . As I come from family who has served the indian army and intelligence agenciesI have more knowddge about the cheap tactics done by these agencies RAW and INTELLIGENCE BREAU ,Punjab intelligence r subverting the sikhs in bigger way than we think, So in counter it we have spend some amount on study of sikh history. I did not get a chance to record it but I did try to contact some sikh leaders on phone but all were evasive. It is not for the first time many occasions verses and kacchi Bani is done from not only from DURBAR SHAIB but from other GURDWARAS also.If it was from the BANI from the GRANTH SHAIB I would not written any post here.

u must have seen there is a mandir at ponta sahib ... why it is their ??? same way there was a puratan mandir at chamkaur sahib ... even puratan then the gurudwara sahib .... and nihungs have just got it repaired .... their is also a mandir at hemkunth sahib ... and its rakh rakhav is also done by hemkunth sahibs trust ... and whats bad in repairing 400 - 500 years old asthan ...

if some one in pakistan tries to control gurdwara of bhai taru singh its bad becuase it belongs to sikhs ... but if its mandir singhs should break it ....

broaden up ur mind ...

and regarding kirten ... in harimander sahib only kirten can be done is from guru darbars and other approved bani ... if some thing else kirteen was their ... it should be in head line in news paper ... specialy in rozana spokesman who is alwys eyeing SGPC ....

It is not the news of spokesman but I PERSONALY HEARD IT AS I LISTEN TO KIRTAN REGULRILY RATHER NONE OF THE MEDIA REPORTED IT. See my friend do not compare MANDIR with GURDWARA ,MASJID AS IN SIKH AND MUSLIM PLACES ARE THE ONLY ONES WHERE THE PRAYER IS DONE TO ALMIGHTY AND ONLY STRICT CODE OF CONDUCT IS THERE. STRUCTURE OF GURDWARA AND MANDIR SPEAKS A LOT. WHILE STRUTURE OF GURWARA AND MASJID ARE ROUND WHILE STRUTURE OF MANDIR IS RECTANGULAR WHY? ANSWER IS ROUND MEANS A RETURN TO SPECIFIC POINT THERE BY MEANS ALL PATHS REACHES TO ALMIGHTY. RECTANGULAR MEANS NARROWNESS AND FIXED TO ONE INDIVIDUAL AS IAM VERY LOW TO U SPIRITUALLY. BUT NIHANGS ARE BEING TAKEN FOR A RIDE JUST AS BUDDHISTS WERE FOOLED AND THEIR HOLIEST PLACE OF BADRINATH HAS BEEN CONVERTED INTO A TEMPLE SAME SHOULD NOT HAPPEN TO THE SIKHS. I have seen GREAT NIHANG SINGHS IN MY CHILDHOOD WHO WERE VERY PERFECT IN REHIT I WILL DESCRIBE IN MY NEXT POST PERHAPS U MAY BE HAVING SOME KNOWDGE ABOUT THEM.

Another thing - who cares if the Sarbat Khalsa pronounced declared something in 1986.

Sarbat Khalsa don't represent me or the majority of the Panjabi population.

Do they represent the Panjabi Hindus?

Do they represent the Panjabi Muslims?

Do they represent the non-amritdhari Sikhs?

So who are they to declare Khalistan?

They just represent a minority of views and should be ignored as they have been all these years.

Yes u r then devoid of practibility these leftists are biggest failed peoplle they need to thrw their books on MARX AND LENIN IN DUSTBIN LIKEWISE THEY DESERVE THESAME. During one of the meetings ZINAH WAS OFFERED ONE VILLAGE JUST BUT STILL HE DID NOT DIVERT FROM HIS GOAL OF PAKISTAN . U LIKE LIVE IN SLAVERY AND GENOCIDE NOT THE TRUE SIKHS AFTER JEWS SIKHS HAVE FACED SUCH GENOCIDE . SO KHALSTAN LEKE RAHEKE ENEMIES OF KHALSA LIKE FASCISTT HINDUS ,AND LEFTISTS HAVE TO LIVE NOT THE JUSTICE LOVING HINDUS AND BHAYIAS HAVE TO GO. FFTER THE KHALSTAN INDIA WILL CEASE TO EXIST .

SORRY FACSISTS HINDUS AND BHAYAIAS HAVE TO LEAVE BUT NO HARM WILL BE DONE TRUE HINDUS . KHALSTAN ZINDABAD

Another thing - who cares if the Sarbat Khalsa pronounced declared something in 1986.

Sarbat Khalsa don't represent me or the majority of the Panjabi population.

Do they represent the Panjabi Hindus?

Do they represent the Panjabi Muslims?

Do they represent the non-amritdhari Sikhs?

So who are they to declare Khalistan?

They just represent a minority of views and should be ignored as they have been all these years.

Yes u r then devoid of practibility these leftists are biggest failed peoplle they need to thrw their books on MARX AND LENIN IN DUSTBIN LIKEWISE THEY DESERVE THESAME. During one of the meetings ZINAH WAS OFFERED ONE VILLAGE JUST BUT STILL HE DID NOT DIVERT FROM HIS GOAL OF PAKISTAN . U LIKE LIVE IN SLAVERY AND GENOCIDE NOT THE TRUE SIKHS AFTER JEWS SIKHS HAVE FACED SUCH GENOCIDE . SO KHALSTAN LEKE RAHEKE ENEMIES OF KHALSA LIKE FASCISTT HINDUS ,AND LEFTISTS HAVE TO LIVE NOT THE JUSTICE LOVING HINDUS AND BHAYIAS HAVE TO GO. FFTER THE KHALSTAN INDIA WILL CEASE TO EXIST .

Your title says 'kirtan in praise of ramchander'

Kirtan is Gurbani, say no more

It was in same sikh RAGAS AND TOO IN HOLIEST SIKH SHRINE. THEN IT IS BIGGEST MANMAT.

It was not Kirtan in praise of Ram Chandar. It was Gurbani from Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. If you do not like bani from Guru Sahib i am afraid you are on the wrong forum.

The shabads were such as Sanssar Daan De Indar Roiya - all these shabads are from Gurbani and all you can do is complain. Next you'll want complete silance on the telecast from Sri Harmandir Sahib then you might be happy

What u r quoting is not done by SOCALLED RAGIS have u listened to the verses sung by ragis then u reply verse at 7-45 sung by was RAMCHANDRA LEFT KINGDOM FO THE SAKE OF HIS PARENTS AND IF RAGIS HAVE TO QUOTE THEN THEY MUST QUOTE FULL STANZA. U SAY IAM ON THE WRONG FORUM IT IS U WHO R DEFENDING MANMAT NOT ME. THESE RAGIS R AGENTS OF HINDU FASTIST FORCES SOME OF DARBAR SHAIB RAGIS R ALSO DOING KIRTAN IN RESPECT OF GANGA THAT TOO IN SIKH RAGAS DO U LIKE DEFEND THEM?U CAN SEE CLIPPINGS OF THE SAME TIME7-45-8 AM