Ranjeet

After all that happened in Harrow, it turned out there were only about 20 EDL/SOIE and about 1000 Islamist/UAF, they fell into their trap as it was these left-wing loonys and muslims who are made to look bad, clashing with the police. If you watch what Anjem Choudry has to say about the likes of UAF/Respect Party, you can see the Islamists true colours, you have to wonder why the UAF (supposedly anti-fascist) are siding with these islami-fascists. You can see the Casuals/EDL/SOIE are growing in confidence and this is only going to increase Next riot Manchester.

Having spent alot of time in Canada, with half my family living there....and observing how the Toronto Sikh community have the same low levels of crime and drug abuse as UK Sikhs....I have seen with my own eyes how the Vancouver problem is simply about money. Money corrupts....and it can corrupt any group of people from any background. The fact is the Americans can't get enough of the locally grown cannabis of Vancouver called BC Bud and are prepared to pay top dollar for it. That makes the BC Bud industry worth more than the Columbian cocaine industry. I think the UN valued it at $8 Billion. Trouble is, because most people imagine Canada to be a boring place with ice and polar bears and maybe a few eskimos....but no roads or towns, very few of us can understand the sheer amount of money that is involved with the drug trade there on the west coast. Once we do, the extreme levels of violence start to make sense. You are absolutley correct, there is a big drug culture in Lower BC and it is a massive industry, apparently it is one of best places grow Marijuana, I have heard that Snoop Dog has a place in Vancouver. Even though the Vancouver area is more spectacularly beautiful than say Toronto, from my observations that there is far less job opportunities in Vancouver compared to Toronto or Calgary and the drugs business is one of most lucrative ways to make money. Have you ever past through the Hastings area in Vancouver, you can see a lot of Junkies there.

What is happening is inevitable, there is eventually going to be a backlash against the Islamists. What makes things worse is that we have the far left (UAF) who are siding with the islamists. However, the likes of the EDL/Casuals United (and whoever their backers are) are getting smart. They got a bloody nose the first time around in Birmingham, however they were better organised this time and they will get better organised when they demonstrate in next town (whether that will be Luton,Manchester or Bradford - apparently there have been riots in Luton for the past couple of weeks, but the media have kept this hush hush). The game that these guys are playing is to act as bait to bring out the Pakistanis/Muslims, they have learnt how to press the right buttons and know how to wind them up. In one way it seems like agood thing,because the Pakistani thugs have got too big for their boots for too long and are due their comeuppance, which will come eventually. There is going to come a time, when the street level violence and attacking individuals in great numbers is going to backfire on our Pakistani friends and they will get a good beating at a large level, it will be a big shock to their system from Luton to Slough to East London to High Wycombe to Bradford to Manchester to Birmingham. What is protecting them at the moment is an emasculated police force, who are too scared to do anything in case it gets deemed as racist and the left wing. If this was the late 1970s or early 1980s, these Muslim thugs would get such a hiding from the National Front and an unpolitically correct racist police force. This is the thing that gets me, my fear is that once the Muslims in this country are put in their place, who will they come for next? There is still a lot of racial undertones in the UK, but at large the indigenous white community keep it hidden as they do not want to be seen as racist. However, what is happening is that this is unravelling and what may happen is to combat the islamists, the racist undertones will come to the fore and it will set Race Relations back 30 years.

You'd be suprised! If you honestly think that the bibian of 40 years ago didn't get up to sinful ways even back in Punjab, you'd be sadly mistaken.There was a documentary once about girls in Punjab (back in the olden days), where there were girls who had pre-marital sex and getting pregnant at the age of fifteen), I confronted my mother about this, as I was quite shocked and she begrudgingly admitted these things like this did happen. The thing about living in the West is that everything is more in the open,especially today (does not make things right though), things in those days were brushed under the carpet. I don't want to say this but I have heard there are numerous Sikh ladies who work in the Heathrow Airport area who go to the gurdwara in the morning and then go off with boyfriends afterwards and a lot of these ladies are from India.These things were happening even 15-20 years ago. The thing is if there are mothers can do these kind of things, what hope for the daughters?

I think is unfair to tar all Sikh girls with this running away with muslim men brush, there are a lot of good decent Sikh girls there too (WE SHOULD NOT FORGET THIS FACT TOO!). It would be interesting if someone can provide some statistics or some survey, go to a college or something find out what the percentage of Sikh girls are going out with Muslim boys. The biggest problem (more so than lack of knowledge in Sikhi in my opinion), is that the lack of strong female role models for our Sikh girls. There is an old Punjabi saying ,"When you see a girl for marriage, always look at her mother, it will tell you a lot about what the girl will be like" The thing is that this has been going on ( I am too old now to know what is going on these days)for at least twenty years ago. For example (it is just an example,just a hypothetical situation) back in the late 1980s a Sikh girl in some Birmingham College about 17-18 years was involved in a relationships with several muslim boys,soon after that her parents get her married and she has a couple of kids, her daughter is now around 17-18 years of age and goes to the same college. Now what kind of values is the mother going to teach her daughter? In my opinion, in a lot of cases, the apple does not fall far from the tree. How does one expect a 17-18 year old Sikh girl in this country (UK)to be not westernised,when her mother is also westernised. We as a Sikh community for some reason think that some how we are going to have the same values as when we left Punjab back in the 1960s (I assure you this girls going out with boys was going on even those days too,let's not think that there was some kind of golden generation) I know of Sikh women in their forties (born and raised in the UK) who go out drinking with their daughters. The question is of example, what kind of example are the mothers setting for their daughters? One may say that at least the daughter is not doing things behind her parent's back and if boys can do these things why can't girls? The question is about the values and morals of Sikh girls,is the fact Sikh girls born and raised in the West are going to have Western values whether we like it or not, a lot of Amritdhari Sikhs born and raised in West are going to be westernised too (it's not as if they are going to be like the Amritdari Sikhs of 1699). The question is that are all Western values bad? Sikh girls like the rest of us are affected by the environment they live in and will be affected by the norms of wider society, are we going to prevent that? If dating is seen as the norm, the question I have this if they find the Sikh male is so repulsive they run in to the arms of the muslim male. If they are so desperate to date, there are so many other males they could go out with (White males, Chinese males, black males, aborigne males, Japanese males) why do these girls all run to the Pakistani Muslim male. The other question that irks the Sikh male is why does the Sikh girl run to the Muslim male, we have seen this thread appear so many times in so many forums and it keeps appearing again and again. I cannot buy the story that the Sikh girl is treated badly by the Sikh male (shifting the blame on the Sikh male), I think that is pile of BS. Does any Sikh male that may have been told to naff off by some Sikh girl going to fall into the arms of a Muslim female? I think not! Why do we not fuss over why the Sikh girl is going out with a White Male? The question is that we know the girl will not lose her identity by going out with a White or Chinese male but she potentially can by going out with a muslim male? On the whole, we as Sikhs have a natural instinctive understanding of this! It's a shame that we do not have enough Sikh females to give a viewpoint on this,this has all to do with the Sikh female psyche, so if there are any Sikh females on this website lurking, please join and give your views (please do not use the Sikh male excuse)

For those of us in the UK, must have heard in the news about Harry Patch passing away at the age of 111, he was the last remaining WW1 Veteran in the UK. People talk about him being the last in a generation. Does anyone have any information about our Sikh World War Veterans, how many of them are still alive, they too would be the last of a generation,a Sikh generation. They say lest we forget about their bravery and sacrifices. My great grandfather fought in the trenches and I am sure many of your grandfathers and great grandfathers too.

There is a big difference between Jews and Muslims. The problem is that the Muslims want to impose their way of life on everyone else and when it affects the wider society, we will get impacted too. I would also prefer just to live a normal Sikh life, but eventually it will begin to impact us as well. THe Sikhs in the USA were going about their business pre 911 too, but Islamic terrorism has impacted them too.

Inshallah very soon UK will become part of Dar-Ul-Salaam instead of Darl-Ul-Harb!

But he did was necessary particularly against the Pashtuns, he had to be ruthless. Unfortunatley there a certain kind of people do not understand the word compassion, they see it as weakness.

...Are these the Lebs (that's what they are called in Aus isn't it) that live in the Lakemba area of Sydney Didn't they get beat up by the White Australians in the Cronulla Riots?

If a drug dealing pimping Muslim and a Pious "Abraham Lincoln bearded", 5 time a day praying Muslim can stick together when it counts, why can't we? A lot of pious muslims consider actions that other muslims do as unislamic, they probably called each other "kaffirs", but when it comes to the matter of the ummah, they all stick together. To all the Amritdari Sikhs out there, if a mona sikh (some of you wouldn't consider them Sikhs) or non Amritdhari turbanned Sikh is in trouble and he needs a brother to help him, would you or would need to find out about their credentials first before you do. In the UK, we have quite diverse community of SIkhs with particular difference, we have Sikhs from Punjab, Afghanistan, East Africa, Singapore and Malaysia, of all different backgrounds, they all have different quirks and nuances, there are Sikhs of Bhatra origins living on the coasts of the UK who have their own particular quirks. These Sikhs all their own types of turbans, the Sikhs of Afghanistan are Khatri that speak Pashto and their own unique turbans, we have Kenyan Sikhs who mix up Punjabi and Swahili and have their own particular types of turban. We have mona of Sikh background (in case calling them Sikh offends whichever particular jatha), however you can tell the difference between a Mona of Sikh background from a Hindu Punjabi, they have something about them, a vibe (not just the kara), you will always tell who are your own. If we all these groups of people and they all squabble, the moment someone comes out with the Guru Granth Sahib do we all not stand up and pay our respects after we are all Sikhs aren't we? I don't care which particular Jatha you belong to, and what particular Jatha tells you how to matha thek, how to eat, how to drink, how to sleep, what type of food to eat, what kind of utensils you should eat with, how to run, which baba to beleive in etc etc, beacuse you are all Sikh to me. When an outsider attacks my quam, my people (and that is all of you) whether you are Jatt,Tharkan,Khatri,AKJ,Amritdhari,Mona, Kenyan,Indian,Punjabi ,Mona etc etc my rage is the same. After all does the outsider care what our differences are when they attack us, are they going to look at you and decide whether you are Amritshak or a Mona or whether you are belong to some particular Jatha before attacking you? They don't care!

Muslims have infiltrated the media, so that if anything is said about muslims it is deemed as Islamaphobia. The British media is very careful not to mention Pakistani youths, for example there would be an attack on a white youth, the headline would be "ASIAN YOUTH ATTACK WHITE!", however in most cases that would be mean Pakistani Muslim youths, but the media will use the term "Asian", which means all South Asians in the UK, so all Indians whether Sikh or Hindu are tarred with the same brush. The other problem we have in the media, is that media elite generally seem to the socialist leftist variety especially the BBC /Guardian and these guys are very outspoken about "Human Rights" of particular people more so than others, these guys are very chummy with the Muslim lobby, of course they are "Useful Idiots". There is a term that used for media like this, it is known as "Dhimmi Media" - Dhimmi in islamic circles means people who taken 2nd class citizenship in Islamic Society (like Jews and Christians who have to pay Jaziya tax). THe other problem is that the Sikh lobby in the UK (if actually exists) is no way like the Sikh lobby in Canada, you need a strong, effective ,influentialassertive,cohesive lobby. We need media-savvy people, we need lawyers and more politicians who understand how the system works inside and out. The problem we already have these people and we are perfectly capable but for some reason we cannot be bothered. What happened in Coventry at large is a good thing, however the fact that those 5 boys may have criminal records is what frightens most Sikh youth in the UK as they feel that they would have something to lose. What you find is that most Sikhs in the UK who end up in prison are on these GBH/assault charges usually after some fight, most Pakistanis in prison tend to be in for drugs charges (most of the heroin comes from Afghan-Pak border). For a Sikh to end up in prison is a devastating thing as when they come out, they will find it hard to find a job (since we are largely a law abiding community). For a Paki it's nothing as they have nothing to lose, as they come out, they are going to go back to their benefit claiming, mini cabbing, drug dealing, pimping/prostitution ways since they work outside the system (they only work in the system if they can find a way to scam it)

there is an Arabic saying: "I against my brother; my brother and I against my cousin; I, my brother, and my cousin against the stranger". We as Sikhs may have to adopt something similar to this, ie to put our petty differences to one side and do what's best for the quam

The biggest injustices to Sikhs is done by ourselves, we do injustices to ourselves. We Sikhs are our own worst enemies, we cut our nose to spite our faces, we would help an outsider but will backstab our own without a moments notice, there is no trust within our quam. If there is no trust, there can be no unity. If I see a Singh get attacked, I will help my brother, but will he help me if the situations are reversed?

You have to admit though Pakis are more fanatical about cricket than Indians in the UK. It means more for Pakistanis to beat India than the other way around.(though it is quite good to see the Pakis get beat just to get that smug arrogant look of their faces) I rememeber back in one of the world cups, and I had a Pakistani aquaintance from Birmingham who told me that the part of Small Heath in Birmingham was like a ghost town when India beat Pakistan. My cousins play cricket to quite a high level and expect him to play at top level when he is older, my uncle is trying out for a one of those ECB coaching badges. I am sure that there are lots of Indians that play cricket but I bet the proportion of Pakis that play is far higher, like I said in the Asian community, cricket is more of a Paki's game than an Indian one. Some of my cousins watched the recent 20/20 game between India and Pakistan, however in my biased prejuiced opinion most Indians that go and watch cricket coz its a good day out, a bit like the prawn sandwich brigade at Old Trafford.