ParwinderSingh

its hard to say where to draw the line, its up to the parents to teach us our values etc. I used to feel like you are portraying up until about 18 years old, n used to hate my parents whenever they told me off. But now im happy they did, becos it kind of helped me in the long run, but each family is different.

but sometimes parents can get into a habit and not realise that they take out the anger and stress on their kids. Best thing to do is tell her on a good day how much it hurts you when your being told off and that shud make em think about it more............

iv got some family friends, weve known them so long that i call em my cuzins. They are chamar, but go to gurudwara n do basically the same things as us, but they dont think they are sikhs or hindus.....they want to be something in between. But you cant have each foot in two boats cos youl fall of. so the decision needs to be made. Then follow your path................ all paths lead to the one God but we need to have a path

thats what i dont understand!! they have Sikh practices but want 2 b something inbetween??? there is no "inbetween" sikhi n hiduism cant merge ... ye they need 2 decide what path they want 2 follow n giv it their full dedication. u cant be hinu n go 2 worship at the gurdwara...9well u can tachnically!1 gurdwara is open 2 all...but u no wat i mean!)

they call themselves the *sumthin* brotherhood" ... sorryy... i dun pay attention! lol, will try n find out tho :wub:

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thing is , true hindus wont accept them and true sikhs wont accept them, yea its like ther own brother hood. If someone went to their house you would think they were sikhs, until you questioned them or brought up a convo regarding their beliefs and even then you kinda get confused. we get along really well its a bit weird come to think of it ...............

GuruFateh!

I was also bought up believing that I was a Hindu but deep down inside I knew that my family did not follow the Hindu way of life and religion so how were they Hindu? Everyone in the family got married in a Gurudwara. Till this day, there are many people in my family who believe they are Hindu. My classic response to them was 'if you are a Hindu, why didn't  you get a bedi wedding (around the fire) in a mandir with a pandit? why did you get married in the Guru's Hazoori?'

I'm also from Wolverhampton and have been to the Ravidass Gurudwara's on Dudley Road and Union Row, Handsworth. But I've stopped going to those Gurudwara's because I feel that they have clearly sectioned themselves away from Sikhi. In those Gurudwara's, the Jaikara is 'Bole So Nihaal, Shri Guru Ravidass Maharaj Ki Jai' and also when the Ardass is done, they have changed the 'Dohira' and there is not mention of 'Raj Karega Khalsa.' I now attend the Gurudwara's on Sedgley St, Cannock Rd and the Wednesfield Gurudwara as they fully follow Sikhi.

I say the best way to combat these people (I had them in my family) is to make sure your Sikhi knowledge is great and you have great knowledge and respect of Gurbani and so you can quote passages from the Guru Granth. Out of my whole family (including massars, massis etc), my Baba and Daddi (grandparents), my brother and myself are the only ones who say we are Sikh. The thing is I know sufficient Sikh knowledge and Gurbani to quote to support my stance as a Sikh but in the game of life, I do not know enough. With Waheguru's kirpa, this can be done and hopefully, I will become an Amritdhari.

On a final note, I will quote Shaheed Jarnail Singh Bhindranwala:

'Hindu pakah Hindu baneh, Musalman pakah Musalman, te Sikh pakah Sikh baneh'

So if people believe they are Hindu's, they should follow Hinduism in a full manner not half and half i.e. go to Gurudwara's, get married in a Gurudwara and then say we are Hindu. I think Bhindranwala hit the nail on the head with that statement.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

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fateh ji

Im so proud of you. yes that quote by bhai jarnail singh ji is very true. its important you have a path to follow, and that you stick to it

time to take action?

DONT use gel, it looks horrible!!!!!

use oil and comb it like twice a day and that does the trick.

woops i just realised iv already posted ......... soz

realistically.. it'll be hard for a coutnry to survive witout taking part in the vast business opportunities out there. These days, interdependence is at a high, and let's not kid ourselves..khalistan will probably start off as a relatively poor coutnry... yes...sikhs, in general, have lots of money, but then we're depending on rich sikhs (who usually aren't devout sikhs) to return and live in khalistan, support khalistani businesses, give up their moneys that they earned working hard in american, canadian and british economies, and sacrifice it in a huge risk (the khalistani economy). 

If you wanna look at it practically, it would be hard for Khalistan to succesfully accomplish communism, i think. Communist countries are so so tight about external influences. That's why mcdonalds had such a rough time getting into russia... which, yeah, tha's a good thing on one side, but then on the other, it sent the Russian Ruble tumbling beyond belief....no one wanted to touch russia, and no one cared that you could get 300 rubles for 1 dollar canadian, cuz russia had nothing to offer anyways.

A functional Khalistan would need to have a pretty high degree of dependence on other (probably neighbouring, too) countries. anyways, that's just my opinion on the financial part of it.. i'm sure i'll somehow rub somene the wrong way, so enjoy

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i think your right about the communism thing

i think khalistan needs to focus on capitalism, otherwise we are gonna go through the same phases and russia, easter block, china and other countries which have now had to chagne to capitalism. Pratically communism doesnt work unless everyone follows the rules if you get me,(yes i know that there were times where soviet unions industry was booming but that didnt last long and paid its toll), otherwise it falls apart. SO we should learn from all those countries which lost 100years+ of development for going down the communism road.

there is nothing wrong with capitalism and some regulation by the government so that we can still be in control of what is going on in the economy. dont you think?

dont take this the wrong way either guys

hes being convicted of some sort of identity fraud according to some website. but i dont really know..................... and i dont really know if anyone deserves to have their kesh cut and where to draw the line.

but one thing i know is that this is gonna be a really bad blow on sikhs if they go ahead with it,

but sikhs in america have alot of support from ppl in the gov so hopefuly it will b ok

im sorry to say you're just talking in riddles and in circles....

please don't get philosophical..

thanks

time has come to ignore him and not reply to this thread, im sure many of us will agree.

SEE MY POST AGAIN

1993: Human Rights World Conference, Vienna

AND did you know what Manmohan Gandhi said at this conference?

"there are no human rights abuses in Punjab"

i think some of us have a false sense of pride

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thanks for bringing it to my attention again, i dont know why you said read it again lol, i read it the first time, but i will read it again if it makes you feel better.

He certainly sarificed sikhi for his own benefit.

Is there anyway we can get a copy of this speech, so i can show those who do have a false sense of pride.

bhul chuk mark karna

fateh ji

or it cud be

nanak ayvai jannia sabh apay sacheaar

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakal!

Dear Parwinder Singh Ji!

You wrote "you keep asking about the 'name' of the holy 'scriptures'

and you said you didn't know it yourself, so answer my question, what makes you think there is a name being 'hidden'?"

Every Jeev or a thing that comes to existence in the universe receives a name. Human beings may not come to know all.

The Gurus sang and compiled God's message by writing it. Can you imagine that they never referred this?

I feel the Gurus might have surly addressed or referred the holy Granth with a call or name.

In your next post you asked "but you said lessons, what are the others, im here to learn."

You seem to be a true Sikh.

The next lesson is "hukam rajaa-ee chalnaa naanak likhi-aa naal."

Strange some guys feel that Balbir Singh is not God's Hukam but their preachers.

**************

Dear Singh Comradz Ji!

You responded to Tera Ji's words "Is this actually going anywhere?" and wrote "lol i dont think it is, the guys just talking in riddles"

For all those who try to eat a mango by reading the book on mangos are today also waiting for a wonder in life.

Without experiencing truth of Naam everything is a riddle.

Ask yourself if the riddle is solved.

You are seeking answers. Are those not available in shops run by your preachers?

I don't think one can buy those in any shop.

Balbir Singh

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haha , your a funny guy you come out with the weird and wonderful.

but,

Why arent you contempt with the name, 'Guru Granth Sahib Ji', obviously you will know that some things are not for us to know, Guru's told us all that we need to know, the rest is not for us to know, or will be revealed.

whats the next lesson?

is it amrit vela sach naao, vadee aee vichar? was i close?

fateh ji

Basically this was about a guy hu loved god so much that god decided to test him ..... so god came down to earth in a human appearence and went to visit his worshiper to see if he would be able to recognise his lord. At first he didnt recognize hu he was talkin to so he starts off by asking mahraaj questions lyk hu are u n stuff ...... but eventually he regonises mahraaj and gets happy and praises mahraaj. i think this is a sakhi from before guru nanak ji's tym.

das about it i fink sorry if i made any mistakes or offended any1

vjkk vjkf    :TH:

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Ok paji thanks

Above poster can you:

Please read the  section that this has been posted in, we thought it was to do with religion.

And the point we were making in case anyone missed it was that he has achieved nothing (Manmohan Singh) if he can not be a good Sikh.

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that is true this is important, we shudnt sacrifice religion for education or jobs, does anyone know anything about manmohan singh and whether he has any gyan or does Paath etc, or is he just a showcase ?

awesome

Is this actually going anywhere?

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lol i dont think it is, the guys just talking in riddles

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i think your right

Quote >>>What are the original lessons of sikhi that you refered to earlier? <<<

The first and original lesson is JAP.

**************

but you said lessons, what are the others, im here to learn.

"Don't you think it would be great to know the name, the Gurus used to call the holy scripture?"

"We Sikhs want to show the rest of the world that we are something specials. But we do not know the true name of our holy scripture."

"The question here is about the true name of the holy scripture. The Gurus have named it."

Balbir Ji

you keep asking about the 'name' of the holy 'scriptures'

and you said you didn't know it yourself, so answer my question, what makes you think there is a name being 'hidden'?

your last quote does not go with the other quotes, because you said you dont know the true name and then you are saying the Gurus named it. Where did you find that they have named it?

if they have named it then what is it?

i apologise for my lack of english. please give the question(s) another go. I'm not sure what your intentions are.

FAteh ji

BOSS UK i think is run by sevadars, maybe they are really busy and thats why it takes so long. either that or they use the punjabi clock , so you will get it by christmas. Little bit of customer service and PR is required by the look of things.

Balbir Ji

you keep saying what the true name for the guru ji is, and you said you didn't know it yourself, and you are saying why are the 'preachers' hiding it?

So how do you know there is a name being hidden, what makes you think this and why?................ Also could you explain why you think the term orthordox is becoming usual with sikhs?

What are the original lessons of sikhi that you refered to earlier?

Please answer these questions

WJKK WJKF!

Can anyone explain this shabad to me.........

iqlMg nwmdyv jI(727-16)

tilang naamdayv jee.

Tilang, Naam Dayv Jee:

hly XwrW hly XwrW KuisKbrI ]

halay yaaraaN halay yaaraaN khusikhabree.

Hello, my friend, hello my friend. Is there any good news?

bil bil jWau hau bil bil jWau ]

bal bal jaaN-o ha-o bal bal jaaN-o.

I am a sacrifice, a devoted sacrifice, a dedicated and devoted sacrifice, to You.

nIkI qyrI ibgwrI Awly qyrw nwau ]1] rhwau ]

neekee tayree bigaaree aalay tayraa naa-o. ||1|| rahaa-o.

Slavery to You is so sublime; Your Name is noble and exalted. ||1||Pause||

kujw Awmd kujw rPqI kujw my rvI ]

kujaa aamad kujaa raftee kujaa may ravee.

Where did you come from? Where have You been? And where are You going?

dÍwirkw ngrI rwis bugoeI ]1]

davaarikaa nagree raas bugo-ee. ||1||

Tell me the truth, in the holy city of Dwaarikaa. ||1||

KUbu qyrI pgrI mITy qyry bol ]

khoob tayree pagree meethay tayray bol.

How handsome is your turban! And how sweet is your speech.

dÍwirkw ngrI kwhy ky mgol ]2]

davaarikaa nagree kaahay kay magol. ||2||

Why are there Moghals in the holy city of Dwaarikaa? ||2||

cMd^ØI hjwr Awlm eykl KwnW ]

chandeeN hajaar aalam aykal khaanaaN.

You alone are the Lord of so many thousands of worlds.

hm icnI pwiqswh sWvly brnW ]3]

ham chinee paatisaah saaNvlay barnaaN. ||3||

You are my Lord King, like the dark-skinned Krishna. ||3||

Aspiq gjpiq nrh nirMd ]

aspat gajpat narah narind.

You are the Lord of the sun, Lord Indra and Lord Brahma, the King of men.

nwmy ky sÍwmI mIr mukMd ]4]2]3]

naamay kay savaamee meer mukand. ||4||2||3||

You are the Lord and Master of Naam Dayv, the King, the Liberator of all. ||4||2||3||

maybe our own homeland is the answer?

lol im sorry , this shud be in the news section , n i double posted ........ marf karna

To the person who at the beginning of this thread who said make friends an get to know some singhs...like I said firstly that is a step towards the bf/gf situation..which I dont want to get in to and plus most of these 'just' friend making  attempts have ended up also quite hurtful.

I used to go gatka here in Southall with my bro and cousin bro's. What I found there was even more strange. Most singhs amritdhari....some supposedly looking chardiklaa in their apporoach to gatka learning and practise.......

I'd smile and maybe look their way to make conversatiuon and they'd turn their backs, loook past me or just give me a strange look like I was just some outsider...basically just not 'cool'........ Anyway........I was getting quite good and had learnt all the different pedra steps and was going on to do the salaami....

For some reason they never (the singh teachers...young guys) let me progress and kept me doing the pedra even when I had perfected it. They spent more time amongst themsleves chatting and doing others saashtar practises.

i rEALLY Really wanted to learn and be just as good as them....and am a sport loving person since always. But their atitude made me give up my gatka training....

which is quite sad and has left me feeling like>>>Singhs!?! made me drop out of gatka..the Sikh Martial arts...and me being a Singhnee...it was heartbreaking not to be able to learn what Guru Gobind Singh Ji had wanted us all to learn and enjoy ( :wub: ). Ive decided to try and start classes for bibiyan some day...are there any at the moment?? (someone PM me if there are pleaseeee).

So these are some more things that singhnees like me are dealing with. My cousin sisters also started gatka one or two yrs back and dropped out because of this same reason. So we have singhs not helping in any way at all to let their sisters

Keep their rehit....

Be happy in their rehit....

and... Progress.....Vaheguru!?!

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sis ,

i think you and your cusins should go and express your veiws to the teacher, if thats not appropriate at least to someone who has authority at the gatka lessons. Last think you wana do is drop out, we should not give up, you have a right, if your cusins are willing to help stick up with you then thats better. Is there no alternative classes held by different people?

We had a bad experience with a gatka group from down that end a while back, we asked them to do an event, and then we had cancelled it a few days before becos we werent goin to have a big sangat, but some ppl turned up on the night after the sikhi event had finished, they were totally high on drugs and forced the sevadars and bibi to pay them nearly over a hundred quid and would not leave otherwise.

These ppl are not the Singhs of Guru Gobind Singh, they use sikhi to hide their dirty ways and they shud hav no place in the panth.

anyway sorry to hear whats happened , punjabi culture comes into these things and women are seen as lower class citizens, only the youth , next generation can fix that, the older people will never change

Im not sure what he has done, but this shoudn't be allowed ....we need to sign this petition!

Sikhs protest against forced removal of prisoner's hair

By SSNews, timesofindia, Sikh Coalition

Mar 31, 2006, 19:02 Email this article

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In a massive campaign to safeguard the religious rights of a Sikh prisoner in the US, Sikh organisations worldwide have lodged their protest against the jail authorities' move to cut his hair against his will. The Sikh Coalition, a US-based organisation initiated the move, and a petition has been addressed to Florida Governor Jeb Bush, secretary department of corrections, James McDonough and deputy secretary of corrections, Laura Bedard, to stop federal authorities from forcibly cutting Satnam Singh's hair and removing his turban.

Satnam Singh (pictured) who is currently in a federal jail may have to face having his hair forcibly removed after he is transferred to the Florida State System Jail on April 9.

The Florida Administrative code notes, "Male inmates shall have their hair cut short to medium uniform length at all times." The section further states that "All inmates shall be clean-shaven, provided, however that an exemption from this requirement shall be granted on the basis of a medical diagnosis."

If an inmate refuses to adhere to these grooming standards, even for faith-based reasons, the officer in charge "shall direct staff to shave the inmate or cut the inmate's hair", the rules state.

As an adherent to the Sikh faith, Satnam Singh’s most fundamental religious belief (rahat) is being violated by the Florida Administrative Code. Should he be forced to cut his hair and part with the most important aspect of his religious identity, this would be a large blow to Sikhs all over the world.

The petition and more details can be accessed at:

http://www.sikhcoalition.org/petition_florida.asp

Please ask your local Gurdwara and other organizations (both Sikh and non-Sikh) to co-sponsor this petition. To add an organization as a co-sponsor, we need the following information:

Name of the organization:

Address:

Contact Name:

Phone:

Email Address:

Fax:

Please return the information to:

The Sikh Coalition

P.O. Box 7132

New York, NY 10150-7132

Email: satnamsingh@sikhcoalition.org

Web: www.sikhcoalition.org

Time is of the essence on this matter. It is now critical that we act swiftly and launch this campaign without further delay as Satnam Singh is to be moved to the Florida prison on April 9, 2006.