sikhiseeker

WJKK WJKFyou have done a very kind deed. May waheguru grant sukh shanti in your house and bless your family! WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF I agree with everything you have said but I believe nothing will happen. If nobody at that particular time stood up to stop this beadbi out of the sangat, nobody will raise the issue after especially ou so called leaders. It's the sangat who should raise this complaint to the channel as it should be condoned and not ignored. Sikhs these days are to worried about arguing in regards to the meat issue, rather than highlighting and condemning this sort of thing. The small amount of contributors to this very post reflects the view of many "sikhs". Many people agree with the sentiments expressed on that stage, only a few dont. Someone soon enough will come and post that you and me are internet warriors and what are we gona do about it lol. However simply by updating the sangat on this forum is actually doing something about it. I think complaints should be made to the channel, the channel what also broadcasts the "sikh" matrimonial show, which is caste based as discussed before. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF Yep I agree, however they tarnish such a large number of people not just people within Ravidassia. So many people have gave shaheedi for sikhi and you still get caste supremacists like this individual on a stage albeit in our gurus darbar, pappi! Shame on him. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF Your mothers sukh shanti will be in my ardas. Try and hold strong on to your faith and as suggested by singhbj singh, listen to the gurus Paath. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF Unfortunately, there is never much of a reaction by sangat on issues like this, as many people still believe in their caste. In the whole gurdwara, nobody had the Akhal to stop this person!? There can be only one explanation to the reason why, because I'm sure I for one would of raised my complaint against this beadbi if I was in the sangat. Maybe we should voice our complaints via the channel and show our condemnation? WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF I understand your point, I also watched the panth time show and find peoples vichar on this particular topic alittle patronising, again due to people having no proper experience within this matter. Like how you said that some person stated 70% of people have mental issues, what about the other 30%, nobody came to any form of solution to deal with this percentage. There is no procedure in place to assist the sangat. In many cases people are unable to listen or do their Paath due to a paranormal possesion which has nothing to do with mental illness. However up until their is a structured procedure in place evaluating the different level of severity of the paranormal to assist the other 30%, the demand and supply for babeh dereh will always exist as our religious leaders and organisations are doing nothing to acknowledge it. I didn't hear anyone then go on to talk about the other 30%, did you? Also the gurbani quotes which you kindly referenced I feel reflect on gurmat and Manmnat, not spiritual possesion. I agree it one thing to quickly state someone's possessed within 5 mins of assessment, however it's another thing to not eventually come to this point, if all other rational, logical and scientific explanations fail. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF Spiritual issues within a household or someones life is not superstition or someone getting "caught up". Superstitions and the Paranormal are two very different issues. Not all cases are of someone having a mental issue. Your right though, gurbani is a form of medication to someone having paranormal experiences, however the only way we as sikhs can stop the supply and demand of dera babeh, is by accepting that the sangat can be affected by such issues and establishing a procedure to support the family, rather than ridiculing them. Also on this sort of topic, I feel someone should have some form of experience within the field, as this issue can be played down by sikhs who do not really have much of an understanding and put it down to superstition. It's like for e.g a male giving a female advice on the best way to go through labour for the first time, I'm sure it's better received if the advice came from a woman who has experienced labour a few times. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF Dear brother, What is a missionary?

WJKK WJKF Dear brother, What is a missionary?

WJKK WJKF Mani 379, nice to see sikhs rallying to raise money for local charities. Hope you get some Harley drivers. What would be great if you did get the Harley group together, would be if you could start the bike ride from your local gurdwara after doing ardas and actually promoting that on your promotional leaflets so that the local non sikh community at the same time, get educated alittle about who you are and what you stand for. Also, many "panjabi" people live a life of the panjabi culture which by large is not gurmat, Atleast brother mani is using his social time to do Sewa and raise money for needy people. Rather than being in a pub, knocking the jd and coke back. Sikhs are very judgemental people, yet we will only be judged by the one and have no right to judge another. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF I am so sorry to hear your bad news. May waheguru bless your mother and you and all your family in this hard time. Do not let go of the name waheguru, hold on strong to this gurmantar, be strong for your mother and steady your soul. My ardas is in thought of you and your family. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF When we go to the gurdwara we eat the gurus prashaad which is a sweet food representing the sweetness of the gurus and Akal purakhs blessing on you, we then eat langar. Both food items have undergone the "bhogh" meaning that they are blessed food items which one should not refuse or waste. When preparing these food items one japs Naam, "Satnam waheguru", "Satnam waheguru", "Satnam waheguru" continuously evoking the blessing of Akal Purakh forward into that food. In the same way, when water has Naam and Paath evoked into it, the Naam and Paath once consumed by the person acts as a spiritual medication for the soul of the person being tormented by spiritual issues. In many instances, people are unable to do or listen to Paath physically, hence why drinking amrit enables the soul to still have blessings of Naam. It's like how Shiri Guru Gobind Singh initiated the khalsa panth with amrit, sweetened water which has had Paath read to it through its matter which once consumed clears that soul and if the rehat is followed, that soul achieves mukhti. Why would guru sahib do this if there was simply not point as we as sikhs do not believe in mere ritual? In the Rehras Sahib, in Mundavnee mohalla 5, we're told: muMdwvxI mhlw 5 ] Mundaavanee, Fifth Mehl: mundhaavanee mehalaa 5 Upon this Plate, three things have been placed: Truth, Contentment and Contemplation. thaal vich thinn vasathoo peeou sath santhokh veechaaro | The Ambrosial Nectar of the Naam, the Name of our Lord and Master, has been placed upon it as well; it is the Support of all. anmrith naam thaakur kaa paeiou jis kaa sabhas adhaaro | One who eats it and enjoys it shall be saved. jae ko khaavai jae ko bhunchai this kaa hoe oudhaaro | This thing can never be forsaken; keep this always and forever in your mind. eaeh vasath thajee neh jaaee nith nith rakh our dhaaro | The dark world-ocean is crossed over, by grasping the Feet of the Lord; O Nanak, it is all the extension of God. ||1|| tham sansaar charan lag thareeai sabh naanak breham pasaaro |1| To me, this validates how Naam can be represented on a plate as food and can be consumed and also recited for spiritual development and the reason why amrit is a big factor in the healing of the spirit if one cannot physically jap/listen to Naam if affected spiritually. In regards to the spirits being scared of the names of "gods", it is not actually the Names of "gods" as their is only the one Akal Purakh, however the Devtas and devi's depicted in the Hindu faith have existed and still exist today, these should be really seen as extra terrestrial beings who can intervene in these matters as they are of a different creation to us humans. Where one becomes physically weak and the soul becomes spiritually drained by supernatural causes, these entities can come to the au of such a person as how a officer of the law would come to someone who has been somehow a victim of crime. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF When our guru Shiri Guru Gobind Singh Ji ordered the Ranjit Nigara to be built and then Dhan Dhan Shaheed Baba Jeevan Singh Ji to beat it, where do you think they got the goat skin from to produce the Nigara, also it was beated upon to celebrate the success in battle, which inevitably saw two opposing sides butcher one another to death or fatal injury, the khalsa thrusting that sword into his opponents body in a fatal blow to quite simply kill him or be killed. The only difference being that the khalsa understanding Compassion, killed with compassion as their bhaugati/chandi/talwar/Shastar was given as a weaopon by our very gurus to fight on wars. The gurus themselves asked for the petah of Shastar and horses to aid in warfare. How do you differentiate from killing a bakra, a mogul or chopping meat in a butchers. Akal Purakh cannot be killed. Spiritual life and physical life never "dies" only moves to the next stage and stops when receiving mukhti. Again, how can one condemn an amritdhari who butchers meat, when at the same time they use animal products I the praise of Akal purak? Kinda contradictory WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF, no need to apologise and your right, nobody has answered it. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKG Whether we as people have leneage back to the Devta ramchand makes no difference if we become khalsa, under the sikh principles set by the 10 gurus. We as humans see the devte as gods however we should really see them as extraterrestrial beings reproducing with humans, then we can see them in the light of which they really are, imperfect as Akal Purakh is the only entity which is fully perfect. Devte/devias are imperfect as they too have to struggle and fight the 5 vices however they are of a higher knowledge and technology and general than us humans. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF I agree with your statement about your grandfather, however I think you have misunderstood my point above about the justification of killing. I meant it as a question to the sikh I posted it to in exactly the way you just wrote back to me lol. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF WOW, so amazing!!! Great Sewa done here by letting sangat know. Thankyou so much WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF When Shiri guru nanak dev ji pressed the roti earned from honest/dishonest earnings blood and milk poured out. Blood from out a roti? Also how do you then justify beating a tabla brought from sangat money to the shabad of gurbani. Is the skin of goats used for our musical instruments any different to the goats meat? Do you think it's justified for those goats to be killed for the production of our musical instruments, aslong as us sikhs dont do the killing and the bad Karam goes on to the killer? WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF I would like to first of all congratulate you on walking the path of sikhi. I wish Akal Purakh showers you with gian. Secondly, I personally don't feel that the particular type or style of turban matters. Obviously certain groups or jathas have certain historical and traditional preferences however, I feel that it is more important for the brother or sister in honouring their turban with the way in which they follow their rehat and hold themselves within public. Any turban is physically and simply cloth, wrapped around the head to honour and protect the kesh in whatever style. The principal and meaning behind this cloth is more important, not the style. The issue you have raise reminds me of Dhan Dhan baba sheikh farids salok: ਫਰੀਦਾ ਮੈ ਭੋਲਾਵਾ ਪਗ ਦਾ ਮਤੁ ਮੈਲੀ ਹੋਇ ਜਾਇ ॥ Fareedhaa Mai Bholaavaa Pag Dhaa Math Mailee Hoe Jaae || फरीदा मै भोलावा पग दा मतु मैली होइ जाइ ॥ Fareed, I was worried that my turban might become dirty. ਗਹਿਲਾ ਰੂਹੁ ਨ ਜਾਣਈ ਸਿਰੁ ਭੀ ਮਿਟੀ ਖਾਇ ॥੨੬॥ Gehilaa Roohu N Jaanee Sir Bhee Mittee Khaae ||26|| गहिला रूहु न जाणई सिरु भी मिटी खाइ ॥२६॥ My thoughtless self did not realize that one day, dust will consume my head as well. ||26|| WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF Whether he is or whether he isn't, bares no importance as what Amitabh Bachan represents is everything else other than guru nanaks sikhi, I will do ardas that maybe he will find some attachment and understanding to the message of our guru, Akal purakhs messenger Shiri guru nanak dev ji and try to sanitise his soul as we all do. This highlights the issues within our own panth too, how people who follow sikhi promote the name "sodhi" or "bedi" in an attemt to claim ancestry of the gurus forgetting the very point our guru said, it's the rehat what's loved by the guru, not the sikh. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF I am surprised that the application has been rejected by the council as I am equally surprised at the decision to have a gurdwara within an industrial area. Like some sikhs have raised the opinion that how far can we as sikhs take an issue like this, will we start complaining if there's a pub down the road or a restaurant serving alcohol and meat which may be halal lol. There was a gurdwara in Wolverhampton town centre which had "adult shops" within the same area, this gurdwara has now moved but not due to the shops. Also, the application took place in Bradford which yes, does have a high population if Pakistani Muslims, many sikhs have slandered this fact on this topic for what reason? Why have you not then slandered Southall or again Wolverhampton, both have a high percentage of panjabi "sikhs". I don't understand the issue as I do not believe the gurdwara would be affected at all with this plant opening. Issues have been raised about smells, screams of the animals and the outright no to a slaughter house next to the gurdwara. However there is no 100% pavitar dharti within the whole world, nothing physical can be pavitar as only a new born child and ones spirit when it reaches Bhram gian. We're getting as bad as vaishnavs. However I do disagree with halal slaughter and unlabelled halal meat on sale and within school meals within the uk. Halal is for Muslims, people should know an have the right to not buy or have their children eat halal in schools being based on religious reasons or not. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF IMHO, you will touch meat every day of your life. You yourself are simply meat. A sikhs life is within gristi. We are not vaishnav. Are you going to refrain from learning the tabla as it's made from goat skin? Are you gona stop purchasing animal by-products like leather? Living beings are everywhere and everything is living. Also congrats for when you accept amrit. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF You hit the nail on its head here. Many people are quick to judge however know and have experienced little within this subject. The usual line of "spirits run away from gursikhs" is all well and good, but not everyone is a gursikh, however this issue is non discriminative and affects many people. Only when you have had a personal experience within this issue and you know it's not a case of a mental disorder as most people suggest, can you fully understand what baba Vadhbag Singh is about and what his shakti still does. But what you have stated has underlined the problem fully. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF The main reason why so many dera are able to be established is due to the fact that there is a demand, rather a need in some cases for help when it comes to supernatural beings. The problem of fake establishments in my opinion would reduce in number if in our gurdware, support for any situation, whether being a case of having a mental disorder or supernatural/spiritual issue. At present, such situations are ridiculed and no such support base is provided, hence why people have to go else where. I'm not sure about the practices of the gurdwara in question, as I have never been there, however I am 100% sure there is a issue with the supernatural which needs to be addressed by all local gurdware in confidence, offering path services around the person/family experiencing any such activity. I also believe in the ridhi/sidhi power Baba Vadhbag Singh was gifted and believe this issue needs to be recognised within the sangat of sikhi. It's similar to the alien abduction experience which is mostly ridiculed, however it is actually a world phenomenon with details of the abductions linking to many, almost all cases throughout the whole world geographically. WJKK WJKF

WJKK WJKF TUT TUT, what a horrible situation. Maybe it would of been an idea for both committees to converse at the views of the sangat and distinguish any flames of krodh within one another, rather than sangat brawling with one another. Ekta within us is a notion we hold and promote to other people and other faiths, but yet not a principal we practice, unfortunately to our own demise. WJKK WJKK