jkvlondon

Very True, the problem isn't really in Sikhs(in my view a Sikh is someone who takes Amrit), the problem is Punjabi culture and even the by-products of waxing because it is wrong and this issue will remain until people realize a Sikh isn't by birth it's by actions and deeds.

It is tragic but our 'SIkhs' pride themselves on being IGNORANT of just what sikhi was, is and should be ...they think by copying the Godless, Faithless cynics of this world they are being MODERN ...

Dear people think about it you are aping people who think nothing of watching the pain of others and passing by, they have no compassion or empathy and that is the basic requirement for being part of the Human race , even the apes and monkeys being lower beasts have more compassion and relations with those around them than these modern creatures.

Do you need to be less than human to be accepted in this world ? do you need to be less than a beast?

If so , doesn't that tell you that there is something majorly wrong going on in the world ?

Become a fully functioning human , become a Khalsa be a part of the solution NOT a part of the problem. Encourage others to recognise what they truly are ... get them to open their eyes and their hearts.

In the UK, very few, if any Gurdwaras in my experience are willing to make such provisions, as they firstly deem it unnecessary and secondly wouldn't want to fund it.

I don't know any Gurdwara in the UK, that is prepared to pay a proper Gurmat Sangeet teacher to hold a weekly class, never mind paying someone to teach self-defence/martial arts.

The only way you will see this happening is by making it happen, and that is by either getting the sangat on your side, or even better joiing the committee and making it happen.

But it's something that should happen. Along with kabaddi and wrestling. Long-term horse-riding and archery.

Why rely on committees who have other agendas ...there are many masters of different arts out there why not create a knowledge net for sikhs to plug into so that we can learn as much as possible from all the martial arts places..I wouldn't mind paying for outside classes if I knew they were quality. Plus if we hire spaces for our akaras no committee politics will interfere with our job of learning. It is obvious GOI wants SIkhi warrior spirit to deflate and die that's why their agents here infiltrate and mess with our sangat's learning and actioning these skills even teaching dasam bani arth.

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh,

I grew up in the East end of London during the Seventies and lived on a council estate (projects for the americanos) when I was newly Amritdhari we used to have gangs of skinheads roaming the estate intimidating the small group of coloured faces , from what I remember they homed in on the quiet asians as opposed to the more belligerent Black community . Of course at school we would be the meat in the racist sandwich , getting it from whites and Blacks (not being prejorative just using lingo) .

Because I was the eldest and also in a family of dastaar wearing amritdharis back when it was rare to see a punjabi family let alone Sikh one I was singled out at home on the estate and in school , thankfully on the estate I just had to keep my nerve stay solid in my view 'I am meant to be here, I am meant to be a Gursikh, My Guru doesn't make mistakes ' and something would happen the skins would not get physical, but at school things were different, boys and girls would gang up on me to physically attack. Now I didn't want to go home and cry about it to my Mum and Dad as I felt they had enough on their plate plus I knew that my ancestors didn't shirk from defending their right to exercise their faith so I took them on physically. It took a fair few fights but because I stood my ground my younger siblings had little to no aggravation at the same school or in the neighbourhood .

My advice is like the others pick your fight, don't go all 'Marty Mcfly' if someone is huffing and puffing let them bark... but once they graduate up to touching you and your dastaar give them a sound seeing to. Like Mehtab veer ji says carry yourself like a warrior and develop a 'don't mess' face and most peeps back away but always educate people about you and your faith because the root cause of all this is IGNORANCE. Once that is gone, strangers will defend your honour

without you saying a word (true life experience) . Be careful as you can be reported to the police and get arrested nowadays even at school , keep the rehit, do the abihaas and remember Waheguru's got your back.

VJKK VJKF

HAHA! He's taking steriods to get himself bigger?!?!? And he calls himself an amritshari sikh?

The old Nihang Warriors never would do this. They were all natural. Guru SAhib was all natural.

Tell him that. Ask him you want to get strong from a drug? Or you wanna do it like guru sahib, the warrior way, all natural?

VJKK VJKF

Waheguru ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh

there are plenty of vegan bodybuilder, ultramarathoners,MMA guys and triatheletes out there who have written books on how to build muscles without bulking up first so cuts the process down and save megabucks on supplementation ... the power comes from the green stuff ...green leafy veg and broccoli protein without the fuss and muss . Look up'vegan bodybuilding' on web ...Waheguru ne sare kamm vaste perfect kurahk banaiya te dussia ...fruits, veg, and grains/starches bus don't need meat or powders or injections or pills.

why screw up your temple like body ?

one other thing the rapid hypertrophy of muscles with steroids intake mean that the the tendons haven't had enough time to catch up and may be more at risk of damage/rupture ...not worth the risk of a massive tear under stress ...just taper down with medical help and go natural.

I have recently become amritdahri last yr, I have a very busy scheduled lifestyle... I work at many different places and look after my nephew too.

although this may sound funny to many people but it is a problem for me, as In the mornings I have to spend roughly an 1hr/2hrs on nitnem I've lost the extra time I could spend in the bath, so in the mornings I just have a very quick 5 min bath and brush my teeth etc.... I also have to be at work very early so everything is very tightly scheduled...

so getting to the point, I feel like the 'mael'/dirt of my body isn't coming off very well due to the short amount of time I have in the bath I don't have enough time to rub and scrub, even in the evenings I have to look after my nephew and then back off to work ...

my face is ok but my arms especially feel like they look darker than before, i'm worried because I like my skin as it is....

can anyone help me out with what I can use to do so that I can feel fresh and clean and still stick to my timetable....

use a shower with exfoliating shower gel or soap (dove exfoliating is good) mintan da kamm skintan'ch... :biggrin2:

so much cruelty. These people are like Jamdoots.

These guys are Australians who just travel farm to farm on shearing season and are paid per fleece cut so want to do it quickly and without to much timewasting so take their frustrations out on the poor beasts . That's why I prefer to buy from small holdings on the scottish isles as they are more invested in their flock's health and happiness. Bought my last batch on the isle of Mull when on hols .

LOL every groom comes to the wedding wearing a turban with a kirpan so hard to prove.

A lot of women prefer non turbaned 'sikhs' these days but banning them from the anand karaj is perhaps a step too far as then they will say why is the other person allowed to get married in the Gurdwara who is amrit dhari but eats meat and then the meat debates start etc etc LOL.

I think the real issue is not that all sikhs are allowed to marry at the Gurdwara but that many girls prefer guys that are non turbaned. If girls prefered turban guys they would all be tying turbans.

I went to Singapore on my honeymoon and the Muslim friends I have there took me to Gurudwara Sahib there where it is specifically displayed that no NON-SIKH person can get married by Anand Karaj at that site , obviously people being manmatti they would find a way around by trying to take prakash to marriage hall by the committee at that time would refuse to allow it to happen . I don't know how things are now but I was impressed.

I propose that we stop our sisters looking at Bollywood guys images by replacing them with positive good looking turbanned Singh and Singhian as promoted on Singh and Singhni FB page , also gaining more media coverage e.g. like the Gap and GQ photos . There is a section of PARENTS who say they wouldn't want there daughters to go into an Amritdhari household as it would be too challenging restrictive of their daughters, and there is the old prejudices that a turbanned skh can't be a success in the world blah blah blah.

I also propose that all turbanned sikh men promise to honour their Gurskh counterparts and try to find and accept an amritdhari girl and to kill the whole daaj thing dead. Guru Gobind SIngh said his sons would never ask such a thing so prove it ...and gain the respect that is due a Gursikh

Don't wait for the girl to want a turban before tying it , tie it with confidence all of you then she will be swayed

you need to calm down, before sgpc screwed up everything

muslims and hindu's and singhu's did kirtan and katha at harmandir sahib also

this guy is probably singhu

and that's Akali baba Prem Singh ji jathedar of Chalda vaheer budha dal panth

if he see's this guy fit for katha he is doing it.

baba ji knows more then you and me , so calm down lol

i recognised that latter , that all katha was done by that hindu uncle ji , but the daily sikh updates might have put , the wrong heading

Veer ji,

i am aware that Rababi veer di kirtan katha vichar and also other shardaloo of Guru ji not a problem to me ...what is , is the lack of context given from Guru ji alongside to clarify Guru ji position on true aarti, I know Baba ji didn't speak bcos it was all Guru ji's Bani but normally don't we read bani fully to give full message ? I watched fully because I didn't go by title because there are plenty of stirrers out there , I was glad to see sangat joining in instead of being quiet ... but still it felt strange that Bibekhi sikh would not be giving sangat benefit of his advice on such matters.

Only akal takhat and keshgarh sahib follow sgpc all others dont. Specially hazur sahib and chalda vahir

That is their mistake ....now you are getting your gurudwara hijacked by Hindu apologists to confuse the sangat into thinking Dasam bani tells us to do dev devi pooja or arti like they shown but the true arti is going on a cosmic level as spoken of in Kirtan Sohila, even they have cherry picked the aarti shabads if they did the full arti aarta they would get the answer 'Nam tero aarti majhan murare' i.e. Naam japo.

My feeling is get the true message of dasam bani out to our sikh brethren in all languages so we don't get hybridisation

very strange things are happening ,

Reallyvery strange happening in sad badal . /1- the party has submitted constitution to Election Commission- and a different version to Shiromni gurdwara Judicial commission , which holds gurdwara elections. another retired Sikh DGP has quit the party ( joined BJP) while non sikh ppl are joining & given such prominent positions ..This is not the dDAL which fought for Rights of /sikhs . Actually it can be defined as Shiromani Badal Party only .As they do not any agenda for the welfare of sikh Community

what happened to the Gurudwara land grab and sale that happened recently ? is this to give to rhisvatghor Badal and co? stealing from Guru ji and feeding the Dhokis of the panth? we shall have to see if Punjabs sikhs will wake up now and stop voting altogether for this party.

Only akal takhat and keshgarh sahib follow sgpc all others dont. Specially hazur sahib and chalda vahir

so far I've watched one hour and no Katha from Baba ji just the Mona guy speaking ...finding him a bit much ...not so sincere

wahegurujikakhalsa wahegurujikifateh

NEW BUDDHA DAL JATHEDAR DID KATHA WITH NONSIKH WHO TWISTED BANI

http://dailysikhupdates.com/new-buddha-dal-jathedar-katha-nonsikh-twisted-bani/

I'm sorry but I don't read hindi text who is the Mona guy and is why is reading shabad??/leading the sangat I thought SGPC rules state that only amritdhari dhadhis or kirtanis can take to the stage ? Also it seems the shabad is placed on the floor next to him because he keeps referrring to it .

I'm fully behind you sister, despite being in the UK.

But to those others who advocate violence...what the hell are you going on about?

Use a kirpan, fists....

That is SOO anti-Sikhi.

There is no need to use violence first.

There is never need to use violence unless we really have to.

So in this case, go seek advice from your elders, be it parents or others within the Gudwara. But don't let the views of some on this forum that call for such actions as the 9 inch kirpan confuse you. THERE IS NO NEED to carry or even think of using it under these circumstances.

Remember where you are, in the presence and building of Maharaji.

keep you faith in him and no-one can come near you.

But don't under any circumstance use violence in the Gudwara, or anywhere for that matter, and don't think ill thoughts of this man. Just keep your faith in Maharaji and do NOT follow your mind = maya...rather follow Maharaji, your one and only guide.

sorry veer ji

You seem confused Sikhs are not christian pacifists or Jains , if trouble comes calling we stand our ground and fight ..not apologise for existing. Given the current climate of elders abusing their trusted status to abuse our youths and girls, being aware and proactive is the best policy , having a kirpan on may be deterrent enough , but pepper spray and personal alarm is a great first step for personal safety when on the street. Truth is too many times our girls have been in serious trouble and tried getting help from their elders and been told to not to create a problem or have been hushed up to avoid 'bezhathi' , what is the real bezhathi is Kaurs are being made into weaklings mentally, emotionally and physically by people with attitudes like yours ...she has a right to slap away a hand that grabs at her or even give a slap if he is emboldened enough to try to physically assault her no matter where. If he is not respecting Gurdwara and 'par-naree maa dhi bakhana' he deserves to be put straight whether it is by rebuke or stronger. Think about Mata Bhag Kaur ji would you even have the guts to spout such an opinion to her ? if not then don't tell her daughters to become sheep.

I c where your coming from, but all im saying is, that rather than all these boring deep,preet, jeet, pal, inder etc ending names how bowt being bit more creative ang go for something different, but at the same time with some meaning and purpose. Also it has nothing to do with competition. Also whats wrong wrong in being a bit different with names and wanting to stand out, but in a good way? Thats the whole point of having an identity in the 1st place. Cheers

My daughter is called Isher Kaur which is unusual because most people associate with Singh , remember Sikh names are not gender-specific

my nieces are Rameiya Kaur and Akaljyot Kaur different but dharmic

could go to Jaap Sahib and get inspiration e.g.

Razak Singh, Rahim SIngh

or our Guru ji NIhal Kaur, Nirvair Singh etc etc good luck with your search

Well wat wud b the point in just naming them after sikh warrior names, wen really thats my whole point of being bit different with kids names?

Thing is, sikhs have alot of names which dont even have anyfink 2 do with sikh dharam. Names like alamghir, iqbal, tanvir, ram, even hanuman r names that come frm other faiths, yet they r acceptable, so y not names of famous non-sikh warriors?

Names such as sikander (alexander), kamal (kamal mustafa attaturk), jujhar (sahibzada) r the 3 names that i was thinkin of. Even hari (nalwa). Obviously every name has to be taken into special consideration, i mean if an apna names their kid joshua/muhammed/moses/joseph/hailie/mazda etc then that wud be takin it too far.

Wat do u say?

what is your aim ? is it to give a name which will inspire the kid to become a great gursikh and jodha or is it to be 'individual' 'unique' blah blah compared to other sikh kids ?

if it is the former then you need to focus on the meaning of that name i.e. is it a quality of Akal Purakh or a name referring to Akal Purakh so that the convention of reading the child's name makes sense ... Singh /Kaur of /belonging to /having the attribute of .... e.g. Dayal Singh can be read as Singh of Dayal (the compassionate one) or Singh who is Dayal (compassionate)

However if you are doing for 'competition' of creating something new and different have a deep think on it, why would you saddle a trainee Gursikh with a name that has no real connection to his/her roots? I have known parents who have done this and found that their kids have grown away from their faith and culture as they have been influenced by others that they are something other than sikh ...

Warriors that you have mentioned apart from Sahibzada Jujhar Singh ji do not stand up to the ideals of a sikh warrior, in fact they were bloodthirsty in creating a name for themselves not being righteous ...is that what you would like your kids to be like ?

PLEASE, I HUMBLY REQUEST THAT WE KEEP THE TOPIC OF MEAT OUT OF THIS DISCUSSION AS IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY QUESTION.

IF I MAY REPEAT MYSELF, I AM ASKING THE VEGETARIAN COMMUNITY AS TO WHETHER THE TREATMENT OF CATTLE IN THE INDUSTRIALIZED WEST VIA DAIRY FARMING IS ACCEPTABLE, AND IF NOT, SHOULD WE BECOME VEGAN? OR IS THERE AN ALTERNATIVE ANSWER?

THANK YOU.

I agree the standards of piare and compassion the average singhni or singh show their dairy cattle nobody here could match that's why I will only buy milk from Yeo valley as I know they get organic green fodder only, not cowcake (which is often adulterated with non food elements to bulk it out) , they are treated with medicines only when absolutely necessary not for growth modulation, even with these methods I'm trying to cut down on consumption.

I will make 'almond and sesame milk' in my blender as a substitute for cereals as I have found that cow's milk seems to increase mucus production in the body. I went pure raw vegan for about six months and I can honestly say I felt so much better and dropped loads of unwanted weight, my throat seemed less croaky when trying to sing kirtan so that's a big plus, slept less but deeper, had loads of energy, the mind was calm and emotions mellow after the initial toxic offload :biggrin2:

If we go by Guru ji's advise to NOT eat/consume things which cause pain discomfort to the body/mind I would say going vegan would be OK but got to keep an eye on B12 supplementation if not consuming much raw veggies or fruits.

The question of protein people keep bringing up is a bit of a misunderstanding when we have had the most growth bodywise within the first year of life we only consume breastmilk which has max 6% protein yet we double weight in the space of a few months which is flesh, blood and bone not just fat, so we don't need huge amounts to maintain or grow. Our bodies also dismantle ingested proteins to amino acids and reassemble to the required protein structure in the body , if one has a variety of amino acids in diet the body can produce flesh no matter where they come from . If we cook protein it denatures a large proportion of it , so if we can eat sources of protein in raw form the body'd processing of the proteins will be easier....that where leafy greens, especially cruciferous vegetables help loads . There are plenty of healthy MMA athletes, ultramarathoners and Bodybuilders who use this diet knowledge and are blasting away the competition.

"Each zamindar... from the Attock... to the gates of Delhi lets his beard grow, cries Wah Gorow, eats pork, wears an iron bracelet, abominates the smoking of tobacco... sets up immediately for a Seik Sardar" - Major Polier to Colonel Ironside [1776]

"...They consider Halali meat as... forbidden... and eat the jhatka meat, that is the meat of any animals slaughtered by the sword" - James Skinner, Tashrihu'l Aqwan, 1825, quoted in Sikh history from Persian sources, p.218

"The Akalee is a grim and truly formidable looking person... partly [due] to the habitual use of intoxicating drugs [sukha]" - J.F. Watson, The People of India [1868-75]

These were the Akalis, a priveleged sect and too powerful and too numerous to be restrained by the government of the King of Lahore... no one dares to touch them" - A. Soltykoff, Voyages dans I'Inde [1858]

"These demoniacs possess an awful influence over the people, being regarded as demi-gods, and when any public emergency arises, a convocation of Akalees is held at Umritsur, what ever they decree is... acted upon with universal enthusiasm" - James Coley Journal of the Sutlej Campaign of 1845-6, p.104

have you heard of gurudwara sidh vatti sahib?

Did I say they didn't eat maas ? Did I say you can't ? I said we are advised it's better not to...as the price is too high for most... we do minimum abihaas but try to claim it's enough to mitigate this cost. It's not , proviso for jhatka like bhang is in war situations when need is matter of survival not tastes ... sorry to disappoint

He is the type that is just here to stir trouble, rather than approach the matter like an intelligent academic, or just a decent human being with manners. It is best to just ignore such people.

kadde kadde ehegey nu siddha vi karna penndha nahin ta hor vi galat gallan kehen di haunsala mil jandey eh.

I hope you did not understand what I meant. I completely respect your opinion on the matter and I am glad you have shared it, as that is exactly what I was looking for. I thank you for that I may have misinterpreted your comments as pushing aside valuable information, if that was not the case then accept my apologies!

Nah you're cool I understood , just making clear that I do appreciate the wider context that Sikhi was born and developed in ...while King Henry was busy killing and divorcing wives Our Gurus were spreading Nam and Sach throughout the world.

None. Cause I use non-animal tested products, so.. useless comments that offer no intellectual worth to this discussion are even more hilarious. Cute.

veer ji is a little shy to answer actual point ...parde likhe sikh jo mile

Lol veggie lovers are hilarious

You use make up? I wonder how much your products were used on the poor animals you keep harping on.

naaaah you're definately going off onto a tangent ...

If I may jump in - as a historian myself it is wonderful to come across such sources that provide insight into various scholarly viewpoints. You should not feel compelled to have to believe the view of another historian/scholar, or offended by what they say, but I hope that you will at least enjoy the intellectual & academic worth of such sources! Guruji after all was a teacher & student himself Such content encourages further education and deeper understanding of the matter - I for one am glad it was posted! :biggrin2:

No quibble about alternate sources of historical matter from me, Rome's archives helped to confirm Guru Nanak Dev ji's audience with the Pope, sandy's Travels confirmed the possibility of non muslims visiting Kaaba, Mecca and Medina. What I am saying is rehitvan Gursikhs have all been given advice by Guru ji via Hukamnameh over time, and also have been told that it is preferable not to indulge in flesh foods as Gurbani shows us there is a high price to pay , it is hard enough for us to get janam da mael off before even adding to our karmic load , if we do as much bani and naam abhihaas as Guru ki Ladli Fauj then maybe one would eat to save life to serve others as is noted in histories of our sieges. But average Joes and Janes need to put some serious naam kamai in and that is why Nihangs advise to stay clear of the whole thing . Yes daya is the primal source of SIkhi then comes Dharam that will lead and steady us in terms of warrior aspect...

Many person became his disciples. Nanak believed in the Oneness of God and in the way that it is asserted in Muhammadan theology. He also believed in transmigration of souls. Holding wine and pork to be unlawful, he had [himself] abandoned eating meat. He decreed avoidance of causing harm toanimals. It was after his time that meat-eating spread amongst his followers. Arjan Mal, who was on of his lineal succesors, found this to be evil. He prohibited people from eating meat, saying “This is not in accordance withNanak’s wishes”.

Later, Hargobind, son of Arjan Mal, ate meat and took tohunting. Most of their [the Gurus] followers adopted his practice

.

Mobad’ Dabistan-I Mazahib 1645-46

so what you are saying is I believe a Muslim historian above hukamnama of Guru ji ? besides Allah of Islam is same God of Abraham a much more emotion-driven entity then Nanak's vision of Akal Purakh who is limitless.

I love meat and will always love meet

Don't push your veggie views as sikh views cause they are not!!!!!

when you can execute your own jhatka by your own hand then talk ...else do what is advised if you can't do the time don't do the crime stay veggie...any nihang would say the same. . The maas you eat is not jhatka ...if you are not doing the deed yourself and if it was not a clean kill with one stroke . Besides now so much halal meat has been snuck onto the market you cannnot trust the labelling.

A Sikh is supposed to be in control of him/herself at all times and not lead around by their desires like a bull with a nose-ring ...so I would suggest more paat less maas

6th and 10th master hunted for sport. So why on earth would they magically become vegetarians and vegans? Seriously?

Guru Har Gobind ji actually put first edict on vegetarian lifestyle to Gursikhs in his lifetime where he advised SIkhs to stay away from maas macchi and aindey ...so yes , it is reasonable to suppose they would still maintain that rehit