Lion(LK)King
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Posts posted by Lion(LK)King
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I don't think that generall was added to allow polygamy, but to allow those in EXTREME circumstances, where i.e. the wife is being raped, abused etc etc be allowed to divorce and henceforth marry someone else more on the path of the Guru. That is why I think this amendment is a good step, and isn't there to allow polygamy.
Although I am in favour of the 'generally' business, since it allows people in EXTREME, EXTREME situations to divorce and re-settle while the husband is still alive, I don't think the SGPC has the right to modify it right and left however and whenever it feels like it. the Maryada shoudl have been modified with the Panth getting together and making amendments rather than some tom, john, harry making these changes, no matter how much sense they make.
Unbelievable as it sounds there are plenty of 'Gurmukhs' our there who are against divorce and remarriage whilst the partner is alive, even in extreme cases of rape, and phsical and mental abuse. This needs to be stopped. Punjabi mentality needs to be dropped.
Bhull Chukk maaf
If your wife divorces you, she is no longer your wife. THEN it is okay to marry. But from what the altered maryada reads, it seems to allow polygamy. THIS is what I am against. Perhaps it should be changed or amended to mention that polygamy is not allowed?
There is no divorce. in Sikhi. There is no mention of divorce in the rehitmaryada. That is why you 'generally' cannot remarry while your husband/wife is still alive.
I don't think it is a quesiton of polygamy at all. Agree with palamrinder though about SGPC not having the right to do so, whenever and however it wishes to do so.
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Hppy b-day :wub:
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Soul.
That is a good question and is open for argument.
One thing that makes me understand is that, we have a soul (atma in Punjabi)
and there is the Param-atma, i.e. the complete/supreme (not in hierachy supreme, but i hope you understand) soul.
We are all part of that parmatma.
I like to see it in three ways:
The light of the sun comes on all of us. We are seen. There is light coming on us. Are we the sun? No. Are we the light? No But is the light on/in us? it is.
Of an orange. The fat peel is our ego, and the delicate part inside of it is the soul. To reach that soul, that light, thta jyot, we need to get rid of the peel. It is the peel that is preventing us from getting to th delicate.
Going back to the part about atma and paramatma, Gurbani says
Man tu jyot saroop hai apna mool pachan.
Gurbani is so wonderful, so sweet. Let's have a look what it says:
Oh my mind, you are the soul (the light), recognize your origin.
The word mool means origin. Interestingly enough the 'mool-mantar' (description of God), tells me that the word 'mool', not only means origin but also GOD!
That makes a huge difference:
Oh my mind, you are the soul, recognize your origin/God.
Double and wonderful usage of the word Mool by Guru Ji. Not only should we recognize our origin, but also recognize that God IS our origin. We are all part of God, yet our ego is stopping us from meeting that Vaheguru
O my mind, you are the embodiment of the Divine Light - recognize your own origin.O my mind, the Dear Lord is with you; through the Guru's Teachings, enjoy His Love.
Acknowledge your origin, and then you shall know your Husband Lord, and so understand death and birth.
By Guru's Grace, know the One; then, you shall not love any other.
Peace comes to the mind, and gladness resounds; then, you shall be acclaimed.
Thus says Nanak: O my mind, you are the very image of the Luminous Lord; recognize the true origin of your self. ||5||
Raamkalee, Fifth Mehl, Chhant:One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
Friend, my Friend - standing so near to me is my Friend!Beloved, the Lord my Beloved - with my eyes, I have seen the Lord, my Beloved!
With my eyes I have seen Him, sleeping upon the bed within each and every heart; my Beloved is the sweetest ambrosial nectar.
He is with all, but he cannot be found; the fool does not know His taste.
Intoxicated with the wine of Maya, the mortal babbles on about trivial affairs; giving in to the illusion, he cannot meet the Lord.
Says Nanak, without the Guru, he cannot understand the Lord, the Friend who is standing near everyone. ||1||
http://www.sikhitothemax.com/Page.asp?Sour...D=3377&Format=2
Which are these eyes? Are they these physical eyes? No. This is the jyot, the soul. The thing that exists within you, within everyone else on the planet.
Bhull chukk maaf
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'Right path', ins't how our Gurus dscribe it. It is rather: A path
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I don't think that generall was added to allow polygamy, but to allow those in EXTREME circumstances, where i.e. the wife is being raped, abused etc etc be allowed to divorce and henceforth marry someone else more on the path of the Guru. That is why I think this amendment is a good step, and isn't there to allow polygamy.
Although I am in favour of the 'generally' business, since it allows people in EXTREME, EXTREME situations to divorce and re-settle while the husband is still alive, I don't think the SGPC has the right to modify it right and left however and whenever it feels like it. the Maryada shoudl have been modified with the Panth getting together and making amendments rather than some tom, john, harry making these changes, no matter how much sense they make.
Unbelievable as it sounds there are plenty of 'Gurmukhs' our there who are against divorce and remarriage whilst the partner is alive, even in extreme cases of rape, and phsical and mental abuse. This needs to be stopped. Punjabi mentality needs to be dropped.
Bhull Chukk maaf
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There's no point in answering this thread, Since Balbir Singh is only going to end it with 'meditate and find out' when questioned. You prove yourself that your questions are not genuine ones.
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So is the human body made out of clay?
Randip Signh in the other thread quoted a lien from Gurbani saying that the potter has made the pottery (us) out of the same clay, i.e. without distinction of caste, creed etc. That's a perfect example of a metaphor.
eyko pvxu mwtI sB eykw sB eykw joiq sbweIAw ]
eaeko pavan maattee sabh eaekaa sabh eaekaa joth sabaaeeaa ||
There is only one breath; all are made of the same clay; the light within all is the same.
If yo read the Gurmukhi you'll see that it could be translated as all are of the same mould, rather than of the same clay. Be careful with transaltions
Besides, its usually obvious when a metpahor is used, coz the meaning doesnt cahge eevn if it is taken literally. The point of the shabad is to show that no one is better than anyone else coz of ohysical/worldyly details - the meaning would hold whether taken literally or metaphorically.
but look at these shabads
Drmrwie no AwiKEnu sBnw dI kr bMd KlwsI]
dhharamaraae no aakhioun sabhanaa dhee kar ba(n)dh khalaasee||
He asked the god of death, Dharamrai, to relieve all their suffering.
and
iqs no johih dUq Drmrwie ]1]
this no johehi dhooth dhharamaraae ||1||
The messengers of the Righteous Judge of Dharma shall hunt them down. ||1||
If you want to read the rest etc just copy paste the line into sikhitothemax and itll find it for you.
1- THe point being that metaphors are indeed used in Gurbani. As a matter of facts Gurbani uses MANY MANY.
Just read the aarti.
The sky is a plate
Sun and moon are lamps
How scientific is that? Gurbani at that place, was never meant to be scientifi, but Gurbani was metaphorically, making a point. That is my point. Please forgive me for relying on the english translation though (using clay instead of mould)
As for Dharm Raj. There are many references in Gurbani of Dharmraj (or Jamdhoots) draging u with your kes:
ਪਕਰਿ ਕੇਸ ਜਮਿ ਉਠਾਰਿਓ ਤਦ ਹੀ ਘਰਿ ਜਾਵੈ ॥੧॥pakar kays jam uthaari-o tad hee ghar jaavai. ||1||
Seizing him by the hair, the Messenger of Death pulls him up; then, he comes to his senses. ||1||
Ang 408
http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.g...id=18717#l18717
ਮਮ ਸਰ ਮੂਇ ਅਜਰਾਈਲ ਗਿਰਫਤਹ ਦਿਲ ਹੇਚਿ ਨ ਦਾਨੀ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥mam sar moo-ay ajraa-eel girafteh dil haych na daanee. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Azraa-eel, the Messenger of Death, has caught me by the hair on my head, and yet, I do not know it at all in my mind. ||1||Pause||
ang 721
http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.g...id=31025#l31025
ਜਾ ਜਮੁ ਧਾਇ ਕੇਸ ਗਹਿ ਮਾਰੈ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਨਹੀ ਮੁਖਿ ਕਾਲ ਗਇਆ ॥੩॥jaa jam Dhaa-ay kays geh maarai surat nahee mukh kaal ga-i-aa. ||3||
When the Messenger of Death grabs you by your hair, you will be punished. You are unconscious, and have fallen into Death's mouth. ||3||
Ang 906
http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.g...id=38918#l38918
Which hair are these? As far as I'm aware, the physical hair isn't going with you since it's the atma, the jyot that will be going out of the body, and not the whole body (unless you're Guru Nanak Dev Ji where your body mysterically dissappears)
Please let me knwo if the above are also to be taken literally, that the Jam /Dharm Rai will be dragging you with your kes. And what if you're bald, or have a disease which makes no hair come - will the 'messenger of death' not drag you then?
Just a few things to ponder upon.
As I said, I don't have a fixed opinion, and Dharm Rai might just be a literal judge waiting there for me to come and show me what notes 'Chitr and Gupt' have take on my life so far. But I'm not very sure. And Niether do I think it's sometihng we should be wasting life times discussing about either. But we need to be aware that there are many metaphors, and thus not everything should and could be taken literally.
Bhull Chukk maaf
Bhull chukk maaf
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Considering recent scientific research showing that even WATER has a result on it's crystalls when words like 'love' are used, and when 'swearing' is used (Some Japanese researcher had a Zen buddhist say stuff, and some other stuff9 which showed how the crystalls changed according to the vibrations sent by the person. Considering we have quite a lot of water, what woudl the effect of Gurbani be on us?
Although unconsciously it will definetly have an effect on us and our mind, but application of Gurbani is also EXTREMELY VITAL.
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although thats true, im sure i read in bhai gurdas ji ki vars about gurmukhs and stuff like that, i just cant find the translations online.
are there any pankhtees of bhai gurdas ji vars and gurmukhs online anywhere?
im looking for one where he says "i bow to that sikh who does this (cant remeber)" and it carries on saying how he bows to the sikh who does certain things like does amritvela and stuff)
something like that is what i would like right now in this moment in time.
bhaji/bhenji i 100% agree wit what your saying, but either way i still need these pankhtees in regards to gurmukhs and touching their feet ASAP.
bhul chukke muaff
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW siqgur noN iml Awp gvwXw]hauN sdky iqn gurisKW krn audwsI AMdr mwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW gurmq gurcrnI icq lwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW gurisK dy gurisK imlwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW bwhr jWdw vrj rhwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW Awsw ivc inrws vlwXw]
siqgur dw aupdyS idRVwXw ]ö]
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) sathigur no(n) mil aap gavaayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) karan oudhaasee a(n)dhar maayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) guramath guracharanee chith laayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) gurasikh dhae gurasikh milaayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) baahar jaa(n)dhaa varaj rehaayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) aasaa vich niraas valaayaa||
sathigur dhaa oupadhaesh dhrirraayaa ||a||
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, meeting the true Guru have lost their ego.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, while living amidst maya, remain indifferent to it.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, in accordance with Gurmat concentrate their mind on the feet of the Guru.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, imparting the teachings of the Guru make another disciple meet the Guru.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, have resisted and bounded the outgoing mind.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, while living among hopes and desires.
Remain indifferent to them and learn steadfastly the teaching of the true Guru.
http://www.sikhitothemax.com/Page.asp?Sour...D=5817&Format=2
This Shabad is by Bhai Gurdaas Ji in Vaars Bhai Gurdaas on Pannaa 12hauN sdky iqn gurisKW siqgur noN iml Awp gvwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW krn audwsI AMdr mwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW gurmq gurcrnI icq lwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW gurisK dy gurisK imlwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW bwhr jWdw vrj rhwXw]
hauN sdky iqn gurisKW Awsw ivc inrws vlwXw]
siqgur dw aupdyS idRVwXw ]ö]
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) sathigur no(n) mil aap gavaayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) karan oudhaasee a(n)dhar maayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) guramath guracharanee chith laayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) gurasikh dhae gurasikh milaayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) baahar jaa(n)dhaa varaj rehaayaa||
hou(n) sadhakae thin gurasikhaa(n) aasaa vich niraas valaayaa||
sathigur dhaa oupadhaesh dhrirraayaa ||a||
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, meeting the true Guru have lost their ego.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, while living amidst maya, remain indifferent to it.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, in accordance with Gurmat concentrate their mind on the feet of the Guru.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, imparting the teachings of the Guru make another disciple meet the Guru.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, have resisted and bounded the outgoing mind.
May I be a sacrifice unto those Gursikhs who, while living among hopes and desires.
Remain indifferent to them and learn steadfastly the teaching of the true Guru.
http://www.sikhitothemax.com/Page.asp?Sour...D=5817&Format=2
hauN iqs Gol GumwieAw gurmiq irdy grIbI AwvY]hauN iqs Gol GumwieAw pr nwrI dy nyV n jwvY]
hauN iqs Gol GumwieAw prdrby nUM hQ n lwvY]
hauN iqs Gol GumwieAw prinµdw sux Awp htwvY]
hauN iqs Gol GumwieAw siqgur dw aupdyS kmwvY]
hauN iqs Gol GumwieAw QoVw svyN QoVw hI KwvY]
gurmuK soeI shj smwvY ]ô]
hou(n) this ghol ghumaaeiaa guramath ridhae gareebee aavai||
hou(n) this ghol ghumaaeiaa par naaree dhae naerr n jaavai||
hou(n) this ghol ghumaaeiaa paradharabae noo(n) hathh n laavai||
hou(n) this ghol ghumaaeiaa parani(n)dhaa sun aap hattaavai||
hou(n) this ghol ghumaaeiaa sathigur dhaa oupadhaesh kamaavai||
hou(n) this ghol ghumaaeiaa thhorraa savae(n) thhorraa hee khaavai||
guramukh soee sehaj samaavai ||a||
I love him deeply who cultivates humility through Gurmat, the wisdom of Guru.
I love him deeply who does not go near another’s wife.
I love him deeply who touches not the other’s wealth.
I love him deeply who becoming indifferent to the backbiting of others detatches himself.
I love him deeply who listening to the teaching of the true Guru practices it in actual life.
I love him deeply who sleeps little and eats little.
Such a gurmukh absorbs himself in the equipoise.
http://www.sikhitothemax.com/Page.asp?Sour...D=5815&Format=2
Bhai Sahib Bhai Gurdas Ji, one of the greatest Gurmukhs who have EVER placed the feet on this planet, have showed soo much humility. They have called thmelseves sacrifice to Gurmukhs, Gursikhs, those who follow the Guru and Vaheguru. With such a sense of humility, would this greatest SIkh ever allow anyone to touch hisfeet? would he EVER allow anyone bow to him?
You have only above read about what he says about other Gurmukhs, you have yet to read about waht he considers himself as.
Utmost humility can be seen from Bhai Gurdas Ji's Shabads
The Rehit is clear on the issue. It's just about people quoting out of context and making the Shabad mean like they want it to. Bhai Gurdas JI is clear how he himself is a sacrifise to those Gurmukhs, and what he considers himself as - would he ever allow anyone to bow to him?
Would he ever want anyoen to bow to him? It is onyl recently that people ahve begun accepting other people to bow to them by quoting Gurbani out of context.
You cand many many quotes of bowing to the 'sant' (which Guru Arjan Dev ji refers to Guru Ram Das Ji in the:
"Bhag hoa Gur-sant milaya" (Shabad Hazarey)
Bhull chukk maaf karni
Vaheguru JI Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh
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So is the human body made out of clay?
Randip Signh in the other thread quoted a lien from Gurbani saying that the potter has made the pottery (us) out of the same clay, i.e. without distinction of caste, creed etc. That's a perfect example of a metaphor. I, in that case disagree with him that Gurbani doesn't include metaphors, since Gurbani includes many metaphors. (if I understood what you said, He said that there are NO Metaphors, but if I misunderstood you, and you meant no metaphors in the description on afterlife, then i do not have any response).
I do not have any opinion on dharm raj being metaphor or not at the moment
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I've been thinking about that quite a lot as well, and although I havn't made any fixed opinion, it is plausible that Dharm Raj is a metaphor used in Gurbani (I believe it's roots can be found in Vedic literature)
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I personally don't think the spotlight that Sikhs got in that movie was too good. Already people know very little about Sikhs. Now people thin we acknowledge and worship pics of Guru Nanak Dev Ji
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There are many you will find, but most of them refer when quoting out of context. Ideally we should only be matha teking of Guru Granth Sahib Ji, SInce Guru Gobind SIngh JI and All Rehitnamey tell su to say: VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH! When meeting another Gursikh. No-where in the Khalsa Rehit are we told to touch anyone's feet, but we are told to greet the other Gurmukh by saing the Fateh (and I believe) by embracing them.
In Gurbani you will find many quotes about 'niv niv lago pao jeeyo' (which will say exactly what you want, but quoted out of context)
but as I understand them, is that Guru Sahib is basically telling us that
We should have much humility when meeting another Gurmukhs, but as Guru Gobind SIngh ji emphasizes, this should be in the form of the FATEH
Bhull chukk maaf
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Sikhs are not against others wearing janyoo. Sikhs do not acknowledge the Ritual. BUt since you (Balbir SIngh) have already recieved all answers from Naam (since you seem to constantly say that through Naam you will find out, when being questioned) - what's the point of posting the question?
I have a feeling the question is not a genuine one.
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While reading Gurbani, you will understand more and more. You will be picking up new words if you focus and do paath slowly.
Tomeh Chad koi avar na tyao.
Man Jitay Jag Jeet
etc. It is onyl when we focus and listen to the paath we cna understand (which to be honest, I don't always (or generally) do)
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Give your advice. Let your friend go on the path they want to. SImple as that. You can only recommend and suggest, and not impose.
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That's so nice bhainjee/bhaji!
The picture is great and looks like an authentic old picture of the Darbar Sahib :lol:
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*shoot* The website don't work
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eyku ipqw eyks ky hm bwirk qU myrw gur hweI ]
eaek pithaa eaekas kae ham baarik thoo maeraa gur haaee ||
The One God is our father; we are the children of the One God. You are our Guru.
'e' Again :lol:
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Since the last letter in the above post is actually a 'hahha' h
I'll start from h :lol:
hm pwpI qum pwp KMfn nIko Twkur dysw ] rhwau ]
ham paapee thum paap kha(n)ddan neeko t(h)aakur dhaesaa || rehaao ||
We are sinners, and You are the Destroyer of sins. Your abode is so beautiful, O Lord and Master. ||Pause||
's' (s) for the next one :cool:
Lets add some rules to make it harder:
Only Rahao lines, since otherwise it's so easy
, what do you think Heera Singh Ji?0 -
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As Gursikhs we do not need to quarel about this, since it's completly irrelevant to our Sikhi whether they exist or not.
We do not believe in superstitions, but whether ghosts and spritis exist, seriously doesn't matter.
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I think these situations need to be solved with Hosh rather than josh.
Why has no-one actually mentioned involving the police?
If the committe find out, the most they can do is fire him, which will take him to the next Gurdwara.
Involvin the police will atleaast ensure their *****¤%¤%&/ learn a lesson for once.
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Happy B-Day bhaji :lol: (I Know, a bit late
)0
Can Amrit Sikhs Deal With Ppl With No Belief God?
in GURBANI | SAKHIAN | HISTORY
Posted
Yes I thought that section was very dodgy as well.
That's not how I would explain about Sikh, personally.