jassa

Greeb Maar.

Gurbani have 2 arths

1 Shabda arth

2 Bhav arth

And bhav arths can be many It cant be called misinterpret till it makes sense.

Ok I will search for it download and listen to it.

But let me again clear my stance on banda bhadur so that we are on the same page of discussion he started as a sikh and died as a sikh but years after sirhand fateh till he was captured he didnt behaved as a sikh in between.

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Criticism_of_Banda_Singh_Bahadur

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Bandai_Khalsa

Ok provide me a written (book) or recorded authentic taksali source (not some random website) which says Baba Gurbachan singh got darshans of Banda Bahadur and I will not debate on this topic again.

We want quality and not quantity is just a justification for failing to spread sikhi to non sikhs.

I would like to recommend every one to read maskeen jis book title Desh Videsh De Gurdwarian Da Prabandhaki Dhancha Ate Pracharak Shreni – Giani Sant Singh Ji Maskeen .... It clears all doubts why sikhs are failing in spreading religion. Its also available in youtube as audio book for those who cant read.

When Guru Nanak Dev ji started spreading Sikhi estimated total population of Indian sub continent was around 8 crores and it is said around 3 crore people became sikhs of Guru Nanak. Even During Guru Gobind singh jis time Sikhi was spread all over India just look at places where 5 peyare came from. King of Assam gifted Guru Gobind Singh ji chita hathi. How many local assames know about Sikhi today ?

King of Sri Lanka waited for Guru Nanak for years. How many people in sri lanka know about Sikhi today ?

Guru Tegh Bhadur was invited by whats today is bangla deshs king to resolve his issues with Local tribal population as both were sikhs of Guru sahib. How much sikhi is left in bangadesh today ?

Lets stop giving excuse of quality and quantity and think about it seriously.

Baba Deep singh faught with Banda Bahadur in battle of Sirhand and Sadhaura before shifting to Amritsar with Baba Binod Singh. Google can help

You have still not answered my question why did baba Deep Singh left banda bahadur ?

Why did when Baba Deep Singh heard about beadbi of Harimander Sahib traveled around 180 Km with handful of sikhs but didnt went to help Banda Bahadur when he was just around 70 Km away and Baba ji had around 5000 singhs with him stationed at Amritsar Sahib.

First of all your logic dont hold any value because it was Mata ji who wanted to save Baba Baj Singh and Baba Kahan Singh the only reason being they were the 2 of 5 peyars sent by Guru Gobind Singh. Mata ji was in delhi when this execution took place. She couldnt save everyone yet she tried to save these 2 singhs and offered money to Farakhshir. By the time she could reach some sort of agreement with the Mughal ruler Baj Singh was already executed. She paid 12000 rs at that time for Baba Kahan Singh life.

Do you want me to apply the same logic over here as well ? Logic should be based on facts not Imagination.

You have still not answered my question why did baba Deep Singh left banda bahadur ?

Why did when Baba Deep Singh heard about beadbi of Harimander Sahib traveled around 180 Km with handful of sikhs but didnt went to help Banda Bahadur when he was just around 70 Km away and Baba ji had around 5000 singhs with him stationed at Amritsar Sahib.

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This is what Kahn Singh Nabha Wrote in Mahankosh. Keep in mind he same Person who wrote "Hum Hindu Nahi"

ਪਰਭੁਤਾ ਵਧ ਜਾਨ ਪਰ ਬੰਦਾ ਬਹਾਦੁਰ ਨੂੰ ਕੁਝ ਗਰਬ ਹੋਇਆ, ਆਪਣੀ ਗੁਰੂਤਾ ਕੀ ਅਭਿਲਾਖਾ ਜਾਗ ਗਈ | ਜਿਸ ਪਰ ਉਸ ਕੇ ਕਈ ਨਿਯਮ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਵਿਰੁਧ ਪਰਚਾਰ ਕਰਨੇ ਚਾਹੇ ਜਿਸ ਤੋਂ ਪੰਥ ਦਾ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਖਾਲਸੇ ਦੇ ਦੋ ਦਲ ਬਣ ਗਝ.....

This means After attaining popularity, Banda turned Egoistic and wished to become Guru. Under this Egotism, he preached his own Code of Conduct against Gurmat(i). Due to which Panth split into two parts. One Tat Khalsa(With Gur Gobind Singh) and other Bandai Khalsa (Khalsa of Banda Bahadur).

All early Sikh historical resources including Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha, Giani Gian Singh, Historian Karam Singh, Giani Kartar Singh, Nihang Dharam Singh etc. also mentioned these facts.

Copied from Wikipedia.

It was his son kahan singh not nephew and Binod Singh ordered him to stay with Banda bahadur becuase he along with other 2 Singhs, Fathe Singh ( Singh who killed Wazir Khan in battle of Sirhand ) and Ram Singh were leaving him. So Binod Singh ordered Baaj Singh and Kahan Singh to stay with Banda bahadur even though they wanted to leave as well. So 3 Singhs out of 5 sent by Guru Gobind Singh ji along with Shaheeds like Baba Deep Singh ji and Chitar Singh Ji left.

Ok even If I agree Binod singh was not a Good despite being made head of these 5 singhs by Guru Gobind Singh ji and had full support of Mata ji bhai Mani Singh ji. Why Baba Deep Singh left banda bahadur ?

We have been brainwashed from that time to modern times. The only contemporary historical accounts we have of Banda Singh Bahadur are from Muslim and Mughal sources. After that the Sikhs who had abandoned Baba Banda Singh Bahadur in the fort of Gurdas Nangal and took benefits from the Mughals had to justify their treachery, and so they concocted lies about Baba Banda Singh Bahadur like saying he disobeyed Mata ji, he wore red, called himself a Guru etc. These traitors had then spread these lies to all Sikhs who unfortunately started to believe this as fact. It is only until the Singh Sabha movement that these lies were challenged and dispelled and Baba jee is now once again upheld as a Sikh Hero as he ought to be.

But the few singhs who left Banda Bahadur under the leadership Of Baba Binod Singh ( One of 5 sikhs sent along with Banda Bahadur and 1st Jathedar of Budhadal ) were like Shaheed Baba Deep Singh, Shaheed Bhai Chitar Singh ( Son of Bhai Mani Singh ) etc. Do you still think they did treachery and spread concocted lies ? I doubt that.

Bundha first of all remove this from mind that I am disrespecting Banda Bahadur. I was just asking a question that our history says this till 1900 after that in 1920 it started saying this. Why is so. If you can understand this we will be on same page.

Did I ever say I dont believe in it ? I was asking your views. Do you you believe in this and answer could be yes I do. Why are you being judgemental ?

Where did that dusht dayanand write praise of Baba Ji? You are confusing him with Parmanand an Arya Samaji who wrote a book called Banda Bairagi or something like that. And the reason he wrote praise of him was because Sikhs had foolishly disowned Baba Banda Singh Bahadur (who in my opinion was one of the greatest Sikhs ever). So Punjabi Hindus who had no historical hero of their own started to steal our historical heroes like Baba Banda Singh Bahadur as their own. This guy Parmanand was the first of a long line of authors to write lies like saying Baba ji did not take Amrit and remained a Hindu and that it was a Hindu who gave the Sikhs freedom from the Mughals.

I might be confusing the name thanks for correcting me up. My concern is not what Banda Bahadur did. My concern is why great sikh scholars of 17 th and 18 th century didnt wrote what we are reading today.

Kavi Santokh Singh writes that when Mata ji wrote letter to Banda Bahadur to stop after he conquered Sirhand. Banda Bahadar ignored and wrote back he is not sikh anymore but a bairagi. After this Tat khalsa left and stop giving him any military support and shifted their base to Amritsar Sahib where as Banda Bahdaur shifted to gurdas nangal. I am not saying it its written in our historic granths.

In chaubis avtar Guru Sahib wrote about 24th avtaar ie nehkalank avtar. Do you believe he will come in future kill all bad people and end kalyugha and start satyugha ?

ਇਮ ਕਲਕੀ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਜੀਤੇ ਜੁੱਧ ਸਭੈ ਨ੍ਰਿਪਤਿ ॥ ਕੀਨੋ ਰਾਜ ਸੁਧਾਰ ਬੀਸ ਸਹੰਸ ਦਸ ਲਖ ਬਰਖ ॥੫੭੬॥

In this way Kalki incarnation conquered all the kings and ruled for ten lakh and twenty thousand years .576.

1667110 ਦਸਮ ਗਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਪੰਨਾ ੧੧੯੧ ਪੰ. ੧੦

These Dushats are Rattan Singh Bhangu writer of Panth Parkash grandson of Mehtab Singh who killed Massa rangar and ‘Kavi Churamani’ Bhai Santokh Singh ji whose 2 Granths Nanak Parkash and Suraj Parkashs katha is done every day in all Gurdwaras around the globe. They might be RSS agents who knows.

And one of the very first person in punjab to write glories of Banda Bahadar was gujrati aray samaji dayanand saraswati who was also the writer of book "sikh hindu hai".

You are welcome to cross check the information provided.

There is no sikh historic granth written in 18th century or before that praises banda bahadur. Suraj Parkash granth even compared banda bahadur to Abdali and claimed he wanted to be Guru. Same reference can be found in Prachin Panth Parkash of Rattan Singh Bhangu.

I would say unwillingness to answer each others questions ( both in favor and against ) to the point is the only reason for whatever hate is there for dasam granth sahib and calling each other RSS agents and stuff like this shows the inability to debate on the topic.

Historically highest of all takths was Patna Sahib but later during khalsa raj the power was shifted to Akal Bunga ie Akal Takth Sahib.

There is No bani written by Guru Gobind Singh ji under the title "Chandi di Vaar" its original name is "Durga di Vaar" which was later edited to new name by Sodak Committee. There are hardly any hand written sroops of compiled dasam granth sahib but which ever are available has the older title and even the end of bani it self it says Durga Path Baneya Saabe Porihan Fir Na Juni Ayyea Jin Eh gayea. and Durga chandi Kali bahgauti all are same thing.

There is no time frame of sunset or early morning to read any bani. In Hinduism yes they do believe you should not worship certain Gods after sunsets like kali bhairo shani dev etc but nothing like that is sikhism.

Remember these powers are created by God and they are beyond our imagination they are not bound to a time frame to hurt you. If chandi wants to do you any damage it can do broad day light. Moreover she is not going to appear and ask you how dare you read my praise at 10 Pm in night.