Kira

I saw a very strange incidence of Gurbani helping someone out. It has the power to do anything, but that doesn't mean we should stop seeing doctors or nurses.

To be fair the Bhaji here has a good point, so many muslims I know parade new converts around like trophies. Meanwhile back in our Sangat we're dissolving into bickering or reverting back into the chains of superstitions and rituals. Muslims are pretty tight knitted, and some of us are discouraging people from socializing with one another because of some stupid feud. Muslims are pretty uptight about their identity, most of them know atleast the basics. Meanwhile some sangat members are struggling to name our 10 human Gurus and are now attending hindu mandhirs to do "Pooja" lol.

Not going to sound like the best advice but. You're 20 years old, man up (or in this case woman up). You're a Sikh woman for crying out loud, the likes of Mai Bhago went to war against armies with a handful of sikhs and Mata Gujri who was a pillar of reliance in that cold, stone tower where she was held. You're only going to feel like a loser if you keep letting everything get to you. Accept it all as the will of god and move on. Going to your mother, politely ask her why she constantly shouts at you, try and reach out to her rather than taking it all. You're friends are weighing you down, or well "friends" to put it. You can't concentrate because your so concerned about them, who cares what they think? Most people are out for only themselves. This is even more apparently in this backwards creed of competition that many punjabi/asian people love to breed. Don't associate with them, find people with similar targets to you and hold on to your life because student life is a rollarcoaster my friend. You're feeling this despair because you're letting it all get to you. Don't waste your time shedding useless tears, use those tears as a fire to light the way to show these people what you're made off. Crying isn't going to make anything better. Find a hobby, something you enjoy doing and spend time on that. Any time you feel sad or depressed turn your attention to those who have had a worse time than you. Finding new friends is easy if you go about it in a good way. Find a study group (loads in uni/college), find a club to join. Your social circle will expand massively and slowly work your way into a more exclusive circle. Do Path, do as much as you can, learn about Sikhism. Seriously do chaupai sahib and Sukhmani sahib or even Dukh-banjani path. Invoke the name of god before doing anything and move around like nothing will knock you down. Watch as these so called troubles which are tormenting you pick up their weapons and run from you.

So is this about the Sau Sakhi again?

The world is such a strange place, that very thought crossed my mind a couple of days ago and i spent a good few minutes considering it (I was walking and when I walk i enjoy conversations with myself D: ). When it comes to Maharaja Ranjit singh ji he did hand himself over the Akal Takhat once or twice when he violated Sikh rules I believe. The Akal Takhat is our parliament, it's meant to guide Sikhs in the temporal sense. Politics, sciences, economic issues and even spiritual issues are discussed here and the orders issued here are akin to a government. The Guru Granth Sahib is our spiritual leader. The Guru Sahib is unchallenged in terms of knowledge, spirituality and how we should act. The point of the Mirri/Pirri was to show that we need both to wage war against any crisis that may fall us. This was completely opposite to the yogi practice of detaching and not being involved in worldly affairs. Our Guru Sahib encouraged us to be aware of what is happening around us. Every Sikh should be armed with these 2 "theoretical" swords. Knowledge of the world and knowledge of God. As Sikhs if we ever have to take vows for any monarch we should swear to serve only Waheguru who is the personification of good and justice. We should promise to protect the realm from evil,tyranny and harm. But we should never swear our alliance to any throne or power, other than Waheguru. We should protect the common people with all our power, which is the point of the Monarchy (or at-least was). This should be enough for any monarch. The monarchy is more or less dead anyways.

A true Sikh doesn't need to speak waheguru 24/7. It's like every part of his very being is saying waheguru 24/7 without words, the entire universe itself is already praising waheguru. They may live in the realm of humans but their minds and souls are at the feet of Waheguru

There's a very nice Elegance to using politeness with a sharp tongue.

The main thing we can do is help distinguish that we're not Muslims or Hindu. Most of the hatred the British seem to have are directed to Muslims, unfortunately since our community seem to look the same to them we're the targets of abuse. The main change that came was that almost all the crimes commited against us relating to 7/7 or any terrorist attack are a case of mis-identity. Obviously had the attack not be such a case it was equally horrific. Many people might disagree with me but I feel we should crack down on the Mosques. many muslims are fine living peacefully and abiding by UK laws. However the ones that aren't are congregating at their mosques. The Mosque is a place of religious important to Muslims but at the same time there should be monitoring on who is going in and what's going on. we're so busy focusing on India that none of us actually realize that if we can help the West understand our distinct heritage, who we are it can proove fruitful for our future in India as well. Or well separating from India if thats what people want.

To me it implies that a woman needs her brother to protect her and isn't able to do adequately alone. Which is hardly the case for some woman. Especially in our time.

The Sikh raj in general is under-looked. The British tend to talk about the time after Maharaja Ranjit Singh ji's death and how the court fell apart. They usually gloss over the fact that many times the Sikhs did outsmart and outmanoeuvre them. In quite a few cases the battle against the British were pushed back by female leaders. Which not only shocked but surprised the British. It was a strange contrast with Queen Victoria at that time as well.

I tend to ignore fundamentalist Christians. When they start going on about the bible all you really need to mention is how much inconsistency there is in there and that pretty much falls apart any decent argument they could conjure.

Are you sure you're punjabi Bhaji. Why are you not comparing your child to other people's childs and proclaiming them as perfect role models to your failing offspring. I for one have lost all respect I have for you for not upholding that important Punjabi tradition.

Do you even speak english? A blessing is something waheguru gives you. Waheguru blessed me with a car, he blessed someone with a big house. The Primary goal is to get closer to god, stop arguing, your wrong. Gurbani is right. That's a bit rich coming from someone who considers wordly affairs totally useless. The Primary goal of a marriage will never be to have kids, Lavan prove that. That's why someo choose to have kids while others don't. Because Science wasn't as advance then? what did you want Guru Sahib to do? come down to earth, smack out a book about the theory of general relativity and create massive 21st century structures? The fact that you're implying their not blessings purely because they didn't exist back in Guru Sahib's day just further shows your limited, myopic views Why is it so hard for you to accept that not all enlightened sikhs were fertile. You're resticting the ways in Waheguru can work. But I thought medicine is useless and only the guru's kirpa can cure people. Are you now saying that the medicine could have worked to cure Guru Sahib, are you now implying that the medicine was an aid for the perfect guru sahib? You;re right they didn't force them. So far you're implying that thier good Karam got them into the Guru's household but it wasn't enough to help them with Bhaghti. Prithi Chand stole from the Sangat, he started composing and passing his hymns off as bani. But I guess that's not harmful. Or let's not forget how Ram Rai tried to undermine Guru sahib's authority and created controversy in the sangat. None of that is harmful, my apologizes. So what now you're saying is that Guru Sahib let their children go astray? that they were bad parents?

Guru Sahib also refers to humans as brides, he refers to humans as wretches as well. Recognize the Lord's Light (Spirit) within all, and do not consider social class or status; there are no classes or castes in the world hereafter (Guru Granth Sahib Ji, 349). if your mind can process that. There is no class or caste according to Guru Sahib. What you're doing is a violation of Gurbani. There's a quote. Once again good work on missing out the actual point. Praying isn't enough, you need to take action against the world. Gurbani says otherwise. I'm not angry, the capitals were to highlight my point. I can see you've not mastered reading yet What comes after merging with Waheguru. You tell me. I hope the words "there is no caste" will finally sink into your brain. It's a rather assumptive leap. I point out what Gurbani says so suddenly I must support a rights movement. I don't like reading one portion and then jumping onto a band wagon. I like to be thorough and do my research, but hey I guess that's a brand new concept to you. Actually Indian culture is a bi-product of a vast collection of persian, arabian (to some extent) and even various other foreigners that habituated the land. Delhi was the centre of the Mughal raj and that tradition has continued on into present day culture. You should move there, they'll absolutely adore you.

How many times do I have to say it, its the Primary goal. everything else is secondary. A child in ANY form is a blessing. You claim that with Bhaghti one gets a child, a chil from baghti can come in the form of adoption, IVF. But just a while ago you said that infertile people have bad Karam so that's why they don't get to conceive children. So looks like not everyone can have it. Stick to a script please. god. Yes they can, Waheguru works in different ways. His blessing comes in any form, who are you to say what he does or doesn't do lol. Guru Harkrishan Sahib died at a tender age of Small pox. Waheguru ji could have cured him but Guru sahib passed away. You have no right to say an infertile couple is lacking in Bhagti. Guru Nanak asked Questions which is the basis of all science. You can make a song and dance about it but they were scientists. Along with scholars, academics, warriors and leaders. Good so we now know that they encouraged people to get an education. Unlike you who considered it "useless". what they did and didn't isn't something you can comprehend. Nor can anyone. They used weapons, they used words, they could and did use science too. Not the modern day style of building labs but their thoughts and deeds were extremely coherent to science, heck it went beyond that. So Guru Sahib's Karam which was pure and divine couldn't negate the bad Karam of their children? lol. are you implying that whereever Guru Sahib talks in Gurbani about how a saint is someone so spiritual that he could get rid of the bad Karam of his children? So now you're saying Waheguru blessed his messengers who were embed with the divine light, with children that were disobedient, carried out acts of evil and rebellled against their fathers? are you saying that Guru Sahib's Karam that saved people like kauda the Cannibal wasn't enough to save his children from it? Well this is turning into quite a list. So far you're pro-caste system, refuse to accept what Gurbani says, and now you're implying that Guru sahib (the most pure being who ever walked the earth) didn't have enough good Karam to save their children.

Once again the Gurbani went over your head. Look at how Guru Nanak is saying those Pirs and Pundits are sitting around doing prayer after prayer to stop him but none of it worked. Because none of them were willing to do anything more about it. That's what you want for our Panth, none of us should get involved in world affairs and try to do good in the world. Good work on disobeying your father. I've never met someone who's so lost in their own words that they can't even read anything properly. I said FINDING A SPIRITUAL PARTNER IS THE PRIMARY GOAL. WHAT PART OF PRIMARY DONT YOU UNDERSTAND. Children being born or not are of NO CONSEQUENCE TO ANYONE. THEIR A FAR MORE SECONDARY GOAL. To provide a contrast of how the caste system then held people down, how they were considered lowly and how compared to god WE are lowly. why do you keep asking me that? I already told you my thoughts, I'm not sure would you like me simplifying so it can get through to your narrow minded brain? My arguement is that gay people aren't any more Kaami than straight people. And that the Anad Karaj is to find a spiritual soul mate, that is it's mission.. Something that many people keep telling you, many sikhs keep telling you but you're so wrapped up in your punjabi culture that you decide to ignore gurbani. Good work, you're comparing something like gender to the caste system. Gender doesn't determine where you fall in society. And our Guru's discarded it and you go about saying we should treasure it. It in every rehit maryada, mentioned countless times in Gurbani that we should NEVER ASSOCIATE WITH IT. By saying the crap you say we ARE ASSOCIATING WITH IT. Delhi is the pinnacle of Indian Culture. You love it so please go and move there, you're so wrapped up in it you conider Gurbani nothing compared to it. BY you're logic it's ok for every white american to call a black man there the N word because their ancestors treasured that culture. But nah it doesn't mean their any smaller than the white person.

She's also demonstrated she has no desire to learn about Sikh History and thinks that she can be a part of the Khalsa and embrace the caste System.

The Spark is the truth. I said it's a factor but not the most important factor. As the Lavan said getting close to god = most important above all else. So basically you're advocating what Christian Scientists believe, something our Gurus themselves (even Guru Nanak) criticized. God's blessing comes in many forms, insemination, IVF, adoption, anything. You just said that people can get children from Waheguru. You tell me why they should give up on waheguru blessing them since that was your first message. Please don't use the word "science" without actually knowing what it means. Science is the study of the physical realm, it's based around the Scientific process which involves hypothesis, testing,re-testing and then finally considering something as a "scientific fact" . Religion and god are far beyond those realms, Science has never claimed to know all the answers. But even our Guru Sahib saw them as tools to dispel ignorance, just look up Guru Nanak dev ji's thoughts on Indian Culture back then, on how Guru Har Rai ji had multiple physicians working in his hospitals. If you're going to argue that the Guru's weren't interested in Science and considered it useless then History and Gurbani will prove you wrong. So they had amazing Karam to be born into Guru Sahib's household. But they rebelled against their divine fathers? Since you don't apparently like looking at History or books in general let me educate you on how serious some of these acts were. One of Guru Angad Dev Ji's son kicked Guru Amar das ji, he physically assaulted Guru sahib. Prithi chand made Guru Arjun dev ji's succession to Guruship hard. He also tried to have guru hargobind sahib ji killed. Ram Rai Changed Gurbani to impress the Emperor. Guru har Rai ji told him to never return again. Are you going to say that it was Guru Sahib's Karam that their children were pushed to do such acts? You've mentioned Karam so many times but you refuse to even see what Guru Sahib says about it.

You claim to read and take Knowledge from Gurbani. But Guru Nanak once again proves your line of thought as being inconsistent and even backwards. ਕੋਟੀ ਹੂ ਪੀਰ ਵਰਜਿ ਰਹਾਝ ਜਾ ਮੀਰ੝ ਸ੝ਣਿਆ ਧਾਇਆ ॥ kotee hoo peer varaj rahaa-ay jaa meer suni-aa Dhaa-i-aa. Millions of religious leaders failed to halt the invader, when they heard of the Emperor's invasion. ਥਾਨ ਮ੝ਕਾਮ ਜਲੇ ਬਿਜ ਮੰਦਰ ਮ੝ਛਿ ਮ੝ਛਿ ਕ੝ਇਰ ਰ੝ਲਾਇਆ ॥ thaan mukaam jalay bij mandar muchh muchh ku-ir rulaa-i-aa. He burned the rest-houses and the ancient temples; he cut the princes limb from limb, and cast them into the dust. ਕੋਈ ਮ੝ਗਲ੝ ਨ ਹੋਆ ਅੰਧਾ ਕਿਨੈ ਨ ਪਰਚਾ ਲਾਇਆ ॥੪॥ ko-ee mugal na ho-aa anDhaa kinai na parchaa laa-i-aa. ((4)) None of the Mugals went blind, and no one performed any miracle. ((4)) "Hearing of the invasion of Mir (Babur - the Mughal ruler), millions of Pirs (religious persons) were engaged by Pathans to perform miracles (praying and reciting of Kalmas /mantras) to check or repel the attack by the Mir. But the Mir (Babur) burned all the age-old temples and resting places, and princes were cut into pieces and thrown away. Not even a single Mughal (Mir) was blinded by religious leaders (Pirs) and none of their miracles could check the invasion of Mughals (Mir)." I stole that from SikhiWiki but it's applicable to this. Since you enjoy speaking about avatar let's look at yours. You have a Khanda up but you don't even bother looking at the significance behind it. Look at the point of Miri Piri and then come and talk to me about Spiritual gian being everything. No offense, but you'll never be a member of the Khalsa while spewing crap like this. Guru Gobind Singh JI and all of the Guru before him abolished the Caste System. By associating yourself and others with it, you're purposely tampering with their legacy. Not for a Sikh. A child is a secondary goal, the primary goal is finding a companion who shares your strive to get close to god. It's in the Lavan, stop adding your crap into divine bani. I do Path daily, but we're always confronted with evil. I see sexism, racism, hatred, anger, greed. Their the evils I combat to stop them taking a hold of me. But of course you're already an enlightened being who's knows far more than what the shabad guru can teach us. Actually Sikh is an ethnicity as we have our school of thought, lifestyle and traditions. We're not Indians, we're Sikhs. If you want to be an indian so bad go to Delhi, become a Brahmin and dance for your masters there.

I suppose their a bi-product of a technical age. For myself I was born in a time when there was that transition period into it, as a result I got the best of both worlds. I spent my summers outsides playing with friends. Sadly now the only playing I do is on games. I can see why many governments are now stressing an emphasis on P.E but that's all going to be for nothing if no one has any interest in it. Why would you go outside, get sweaty, tired and dirty when you can stay inside, open a window and play games. All the fun at half the effort. The more intelligent children will be very active as they'll see the benefit in it. But getting a balance is notoriously hard considering we can't survive 2 or 3 days without technology. My younger sibling was worried when we went to India about the lack of Internet, but she ended up enjoying it there simply by playing outside with other kids. A whole host lol. I miraculously predicted the weather and what video our teacher would be playing, I was able to "curse" induviduals with bad luck if I desired, really it was just me using their naivety against them. When it came to bad luck they would become so paranoid and worried every little mistake would seem like a result of it. . They weren't so much superpowers, it was honestly just foresight and psychological manipulation (gosh I sound like a right sociopath), just my curious nature drawing me to strange things. I also loved reading books about science, one of them was about science and magic. I convinced my friends I could move a magnet with my mind but really i was just pulling it along under the table and no one noticed. haha

It's a very straight thing, Parental love. I personally believe children in general are far more aware than their parents do give them credit for. But most parents who are were born and brought up in a traditional, conservative punjabi household probably followed everything their parents did without question or even thought. that didn't make them ignorant or even unintelligent. But in our time (especially in the west) with the use of the internet and mixing with our cultures, Children are alot more aware of things. They ask questions, talk to their parents about current affairs. some parents are alarmed about this but some see it as promising. On a personal note I have a younger sibling. I had a rather exemplary (im sorry for bragging) background, I was academically excelling, I could read adult books from a young age and even when it came to religious I would devour books about Sakhis, history or even general gian. I could hold a decent conversation with mosst adults about religion and even other things. I'm a bi-product of this day and age where Knowledge is easily accessible. But back to my sibling, She is far more intelligent than I. I never had access to the internet at her age, nor did I have access to an older sibling who's been there and can help (point point). As a result of all these openings she's flourished a-lot, at a young age she's already danced circles around adults, we come from a pretty conservative family. They have this notion of a girls being more household wives than anything else. She was around 7-8 when she questioned and defeated our sexist relatives and really left them speechless. Back to my actual point. Children are growing more and more intelligent day by day. But Knowledge is like a drug, too much of it at once will completely destroy you. It can even push you over the edge. Parents (educated or not) are still a key role in helping them make sense of it all. But that role should not be a role where they control their child. I believe putting a child on the right path and then letting him go from there while observing and guiding passively is more effective than actually forcing them onto it, holding their hand and pulling them along. Just my thoughts My friends believed I once developed superpowers lol. I used that to gain some pretty nice privileges.

the fact that you know that was code geass has put a smile on my face but sure.

No Point debating about it Benji. She/he supports the caste system and refuses to accept what was written in Gurbani because it contradicts what he/she wants it say.

Oh look my avatar's the queen now. I suddenly want to be the Monarch of Britain.

Our Guru Sahib also encouraged us to get educated in world affairs, They themselves learnt multiple languages, became great writers and had extensive knowledge of Science, Spiritual knowledge is the ultimate key but have world knowledge can help you spiritually as well. You're encouraging illiteracy. Promotion of caste system people. Clear as day. A culture doesn't apear out of thin air. The literal defination of it is "the arts and other manifestations of human intellectual achievement regarded collectively." Do you see the word collectively, everything. irregardless of where it came from. You think Punjabi culture was flawless. That is the Zenith of ignorance. No Culture is perfect. Lavan say one thing, you say another. You think you're right and by extension Guru Sahib is wrong. I would love to meet the people who would agree with you on that. The People in my avatar are known as Lelouch Vi Britannia and Susaku Kurrorugi. lelouch lead a rebellion against a tyrannical regime that sought to destroy an entire country's culture and enslave their people. They represent my personal strive to fight the evils that are plaguing my life. No offense but you should stop trying to make me seem like I want to be Japanese. There are people here who have weird avatars (Thugger and Sheikh) come to mind, I bet none of them wish to be what they have up. You should stop judging people on their avatars, it's pretty ignorant and just serves in displaying your own myopic views.