Charandhoor Singh

My Friend you did not reply to a single point I made...Great post!!! :TH: p.s. You may want to read up a bit on 'nation' and 'nationalism' rather than freely using the terms and ideas, or alternatively edit your post. Or I am afriad I will have to address your points and make you look rather silly. :nihungsmile:

Involved in both the study of politics and economics, I must say I find some the stuff people have been posting on this forum pretty comical... childish fantasies to say the least. We have so many sources which we can refer to in relation to Khalsa Raaj.. Choubees Avtar Bani, Sau Sakhi, Naseeat Nama, Karnih Nama.... If you dont believe in karni nama you should know thats where the linke 'Raaj Karega Khalsa comes from....' Karni Nama is probably the prime source for information on Khalsa Raj... please read it properly first rather than making up fantacies of hows everythings gonna be.... Khalsa with submarines, warplanes etc... Have you lot gone mad?????? The International Recognition which people claim to seek... you should no the ideas of sovereignty and international legitimacy are based on Western Ideological phenomena... refer to the Westphalian Principles. Not to mention the idea of 'State' and the connotations of 'Nation' are created by states whom it suit to have exist. Who will govern this Khalistan... The AKJ disagree with the Taksal who inturn disagree with the Sikh Missionary who are hated by the Nihangs who are frowned upon by some Nanaksaris ..... endless list Please dont inslut the Sikh Community by going on about how Khalistan will be a democratic state...the Idea of democracy and all its benefits is another great western idea. For those who have lost all sense of reality (majority of people posting here) incase you didnt know... people of Punjab dont really want Khalistan... they are happy to vote Badal as the CM are alternatively Captain Sahib.... will you force them to accept Khalistan through Rousseau's theory of the 'greater good', as it certainly wont be on Mills theory on what the majority want or Benthams theory of the greatest happines of the greatest numbers - two of the main theorists who contributed to the popularisation democtaic idea. Sure Indian government is messed up and people like Sant Jarnail Singh did a great job in rasing awareness in the 70s and 80s - that the Mahapursh created shrunk immensely a long time ago. Look for realistic goals in life and dont create childish fantasies that you can dream about. Become harcore in you rehat, do maha simran abhiyaas, learn and study Gurbani extensively.... dharam should be fought based on daya (see Japji Sahib), true daya will come to us by following the teachings and rehat of our gurus. Once we have this we are in a position to fight for dharam.... then you can punish those who have wronged the Sikhs to start with. Im sorry but the majority of this thread is an absolute joke. People need to get reality checks. This has been a very quick reply... academically (whether in the field of religion, politics, economics, history, theology, philosophy...) peoples arguemens in this thread would be laughed at hysterically. Not to mention the highly unrealistic and fantasy nature of the arguements. Not to mention the fact that no one seems to care about what the karni nama says prior to the last lines... 'Raaj KArega Khalsa.....'

Nice post, thanks for that Nice reply 'papi', its funny how many people will burn indian flags and shout khalistan zindabad... yet many of them probably have no training in gurbani... many probably dont even do their nitnem. I strongly believe that a Khalsa is a raja, people want to be the raja but they dont want to put the effort into becoming Khalsa. Above all we become Khalsa through maharajs grace, yet we must put in some effort in order to recieve the kirpa. To those brothers and sisters who call out 'Khalistan Zindabad' and long for Sikh Raaj in Punjab... lets to Raaj over our amritvela first. Khalsa Raaj will undoubtedly come, only question is... how many of us are Khalsa?

In Nihang Dals and all puratan sampradava, wherever there is a reading of Aad Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji there is also reading of Japji Sahib along side - hence the fourth granth.

If you look at old paintings of Harimandir Sahib they dont appear to be showing any sign of marble around the parikarma.

Gurfateh LOL proactive it seems on this website everyone who disagrees with you becomes a sanatanist - stop being childish and labelling people as you see them. You me calling me a sanatanist is the same as me calling me calling you an akj for quoting amritpals site. WHilst i may not be incorrect its an acusation im not in a position to make as I dont know you. You obviously know more about me than anyone else around me. No i couldnt care less what you think of BAba Jis seva, I asked you to justify your remark when he said Baba Surjit Singh acted as the chumcha of Baba Santa Singh in 1984. Either tell us your source of information or apologise for your false lying remarks. This is the fourth time Im asking you, I hope you have some backbone.

Proactive veera im happy for you to believe as you wish, I have no wish to discuss the origins of Budha Dal on this thread, if you or anyone else wishes to discuss then i humbly request that you start a new thread. I personally do not think that a three page article based on one primary source which has been interpretated according to one person and his beliefs is adequate evidence to undermine the origins of Budha Dal. Every singh puratan institution within Sikhi excepts the lineage of Budha Dal, be it the various branches of Damdami Taksal, Sevapanthis at Sato Gali or members of Baba Daya Singh samprada. They may on beliefs and practices and about the legitimacy they Dal should hold - however they do accept their lineage. Its going to take more than a few pages on a personal article to make me undermine it - you are obviously easily swayed or have persoonal reservations against the Dal. Like I have said I do not wish to discuss the lineage of the Dal in this thread, however I will ask you for a third time to respond to the comments which I have made regarding what you wrote on the first page regarding Baba Surjit Singh.

Baba Nihal Singh is not part of Budha Dal - hes Jathedar of Hareeabelan which is under Budha Dal. He already has a huge seva which he is doing. That article is a result of the research by and a presentation of the opions of veer Amritpal Singh, it does not necessarily equate to fact. He seems eager to just prove the Satanan websites wrong in everything they have done. I think if someone wishes to undermine a long standing organisation such as the Budha Dal; they should present much more material on the topic than has been presented by Amritpal Singh. All the article shows is that there may have been two or more people who lived at similar times that shared the same name - hardly a shocking discovery.

Baba Nihal Singh is not part of Budha Dal - hes Jathedar of Hareeabelan which is under Budha Dal. He already has a huge seva which he is doing. That article is a result of the research by and a presentation of the opions of veer Amritpal Singh, it does not necessariily equate to fact. He seems eager to just prove the Satanan websites wrong in everything they have done. I think if someone wishes to undermine a long standing organisation such as the Budha Dal; they should present much more material on the topic than has been presented by Amritpal Singh. All the article shows is that there may have been two or more people who lived at similar times that shared the same name - hardly a shocking discovery.

In relation to the writer of the panthic news article hoping thet the SGPC and Akal Takht would take action against Balbir Singh as many believe Balbir Singh is working for them. It was SGPC who gave Balbir Singh an elavated status and used their control of the Akal Takht to proclaim his as rightful jathedar of Budha Dal some years back. As Balbir Singh is alledgedly conceding Budha Dal land in the courts to SGPC, it seems highly unlikely they will act on the beadbi which he is doing. He appears to be quite cosy with the SGPC: http://www.amritworld.com/hola/m16.html

http://www.ajitjalandhar.com/20070430/ If you look in the Bhatinda Section it says that the Nihang Singhs have started a poster campaign in which they are telling people of the true events that have been occuring - their story does seem to somewhat correspond to the article in the first post, i.e. massive conspiracy and corrupt police involvement, balbir singhs fraudy claims etc. It says that all Nihang Singhs jathebandi are supporting Baba Surjit Singh and also 'Nihang Baba Sukhdev Singh Babbar Khalsa' is one of the Singhs at the forefront of the poster campaign. I dont know much about what Babbar Khalsa is doing these days, does this mean that Babbar Khalsa is supporting Baba Surjit Singh? Proactive veera I would appreciate if you can answer my earlier questions(s) regarding comments you made on the first page, Thanks.

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2007/20070428/punjab1.htm#10

http://www.panthic.org/news/125/ARTICLE/2809/2006-10-11.html I found this article about Balbir Singh having mandirs built on budha dal property

Gurfateh Proactive may I ask how you know the role that Baba Surjit Singh played during the 80s and 90s and from where he learnt about his history. From what I know Baba Surjit Singh has been a long serving member of the Dal or chakarvarti horse band of Nihang Singhs. I was told by Nihang Singhs that during the 80s and 90s when there were very few Nihang Singhs left in the Dal, Baba Surjit Singh single handedly looked after all the horses. Looking after one horse is hard enough, and as korraya dee seva ts soo highly regarded within the Nihang Dals, Baba Surjeet Singhs seva is highly well respected and thats why he was given jathedari of the horse section of budha dal some years back. I dont think he did have any involvement with the actions/decisions of Baba Santa Singh in 1984. Perhaps you could be kind enough to enlighten me as to where you recieved this information from as it is news to me. Thanks.

Gurfateh Proactive veera on what grounds and based on what evidence do you you make the remark 'Im sure they are both as bad as each other'. Also from what I have read, Balbeer Singh left the Dal some years after 1984 - leading one to believe it had more to do withh glory of being recognised as SGPC and being given immense power rather then him diagreeing with Baba Santa Singh. I think you can mark that point of your scorecard. In situations like this where corruption, police goverment bodies are involved, especially the fact that its in India, you usually find that its the best of the two or the innocent man that ends up and jail while the worst gets away - I think everyone understands where Im coming from. 'Dancing Warrior' I think the article is definetely a good response to the one sided newpaper articles and stories being presented by the Indian Media, however I cannot claim any credit for it - i copy and pasted it from Sikhawareness. I have heard many Nihang Singhs complain about Balbeer Singh and his men consuming a lot of alcohol and indulging in some highly inappropriate activities. Its no secret that one of the first gurmuttas passed by Baba Surjit Singh was a complete ban on alcohol. Living outside of India I cant say I can completely judge the situation - however Balbir Singh claiming that 50 armed men shot him (to the tribune newpaper) does seem hilarous. Some Singhs from India have told me a similar story to what is written in the first post. I think the post raises some very interesting points. Also there seems to be something very dodgy going in with regards to the arrest of Baba Surjit Singh.

Gurfateh all The below post is from a discussion on Sikhawareness. I was wondering if any members of the forum from India may know more about the situation. "The past two weeks have seen a dramatic escalation of events within the Budha Dal which have resulted in the wrongful arrest of Jathedar Baba Surjeet Singh and fraudulent claims being made by Balbir Singh who insists he is the legal heir of the old Jathedar – Baba Santa Singh. Baba Surjeet Singh was arrested last weekend for allegedly shooting at Balbir Singh who rejoined the mainstream Budha Dal after more than a decade of proclaiming himself as the Jathedar of Budha Dal. During his self inflicted exile he received tremendous support from the SGPC and various governmental bodies who helped him secure ownership of religious shrines and agricultural land owned by the Budha Dal. Balbir Singh had mandirs (Hindu temples) occupy the Budha Dal land, including the Mandir Harisar which had Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji present in what can only be described as appalling and disgusting conditions. At the Vaisakhi celebrations at Sabo Ki Talwandi (Bhatinda), Balbir Singh had the sevadar who was performing ardas mention Balbir Singhs name as Jathedar in place of Baba Surjeet Singh. Balbir Singh alleges this is the reason why Baba Surjit Singh and 50 of his men attacked Balbir Singh with their firearms; Balbir Singh miraculously managed to dodge all bullets fired at him – a story nothing short of a Bollywood Drama. The truth is that it was one of Balbir Singhs own men that fired at him, the individual managed to flee after the shooting incident despite their being several thousand worshipers at the festival. When an enormous contingent of police officers arrived Balbir Singh had them arrest Baba Surjeet Singh who had remained seated at the same place during and after the shooting incident. Corresponding with the arrest of Baba Surjeet Singh more than a dozen of Baba Surjeet Singhs most loyal Singhs were also picked up by police from around Punjab, even although they were all at home when the alleged shooting incident took place. It was a well staged and perfectly executed plan in which Balbir Singh achieved his aim of having Baba Surjeet Singh arrested. One hour after the arrest of Baba Surjit Singh, leaders of Damdami Taksal, Baba Bakala Dal, Harainvela, Bidhi Chand Dal, senior members of Budha Dal and other panthic bodies held a meeting with Balbir Singh in which they condemned his actions and called for him to have Baba Surjeet Singh released immediately. At the refusal of Balbir Singh they themselves decided to go to the police station. The SSP said they would release Baba Surjeet Singh only if they received a signed letter from Baba Santa Singh asking for his release. However, as Balbir Singh controls who can and cannot visit the severely ill Baba Santa Singh, the police knew fine well this would not happen. Due to Baba Santa Singhs severe mental health problems and the corrupt men that are around him, it is plausible that he himself is not fully aware of the events which are occurring. Baba Santa Singhs health has been very unstable for many years, throughout the past year he has been unable to speak, hear or freely move any part of his body without support. Doctors who have examined Baba Santa Singh have claimed that he is severely mentally and physically disabled and has little or no awareness of his surroundings. Exploiting the weak health of Baba Santa Singh, Balbir Singh and his followers have written many legal letters on which they have been stamping Baba Santa Singhs left thumbprint. Bearing Baba Santa Singhs ill health in mind, it is very difficult to see how and why he would from his own accord appoint Balbir Singh as Jathedar, even although he had appointed Baba Surjeet Singh his successor two years ago. Eye witnesses claim that Baba Santa Singh is being subject to both mental and physical abuse at the hands of Balbir Singh, his body is believed to be severely bruised and beaten at this time. Now that Balbir Singh has the necessary documents which he needs to claim the position of Jathedar, most Nihang Singhs believe they will very shortly kill Baba Santa Singh. When Balbir Singh rejoined the Budha Dal he immediately took charge of personal duties of Baba Santa Singh. Nihang Singhs loyal to Baba Surjeet Singh were relieved of their duties towards Baba Santa Singh and Balbir Singh also appointed mahants of his choice at all major shrines of the Budha Dal. Nihang Singhs who actively opposed the use of alcohol by Balbir Singh and his men were also forced out of the Budha Dal headquarters at Damdama Sahib. Forcing Baba Santa Singh to print his thumb on letters, Balbir Singh has made himself legal heir of Baba Santa Singh and has been rapidly transferring Budha Dal property into his own name. Balbir Singh and Udey Singh (secretary of Budha Dal) have been conceding hundreds of acres of land and historic shrines to the SGPC, who recently announced that they will begin auctioning off excess land and property due to lack of funds available to them. It is no secret that the SGPC has an enormous treasury, however, it is run entirely according to the way in which Badal sees best. Balbir Singh has been publishing letters with the thumbprint of Baba Santa Singh in Punjabi newspapers which claim that Baba Surjeet Singh was solely appointed as the Jathedar of the Dal or horse branch of Budha Dal – a responsibility which he had held many years prior to his appointment as Jathedar of all Budha Dal. Although receiving very little support from the mainstream Nihang Singh, Balbir Singh insists he is the Jathedar of Budha Dal – despite not having a farla, which is a loose peace of cloth on top of the turban worn by Nihang Singhs who possess even the remotest of authority. Within the Dalpanth, the little popularity that Balbir Singh does have is a result of his immense police and government support and also his promotion of alcohol amongst Nihang Singhs. Many corrupt Nihangs joined Balbir Singh after Baba Surjeet Singh placed a complete ban on the consumption of alcohol and selling of bhang – both of which are serious problems within the Budha Dal. Balbir Singh is well known as an alcoholic and also has a reputation as a womaniser; many believe that he his intimately associated with the notorious child rapist and mass murdered 'Phoola' who has also been on working on the behest of Badal and the government for many years. If you have any doubts to the extent of Baba Santa Singhs severe mental and physical disability, all it would take is one visit to see that he is far from being in a position to make decisions on his own accord. Previously Balbir Singh's man had taken bribes from many people who wished to meet Baba Santa Singh, due to the present circumstances it is unlikely even by bribing Balbir Singh's men one will not be allowed to see Baba Santa Singh. Furthermore, one would not need to speak to many Nihang Singhs before learning of the alcohol problems which exist within the Dal (despite Gurmatta being passed on several occasions completely banning alcohol) – thanks mainly to Balbir Singh and his men." http://www.sikhawareness.com/sikhawareness...sc&start=30

Both sides have presented their points i think a neautral person can decide for themselves whether they think acts such as making animal noises in the presence of Maharaj is right or wrong and delibretely distorting the words of our Guru is correct. I have stated most of my points why it is wrong and others have posted their justifcations - including an unreferenced highly mistranslated and misleading point from a very contraversial text. This discussion has highlighted: 1. Most people are not willing to shift their views regardless of vast amount of evidence which stand against them. Any depths will be taken to justify their views. When those fail, they will try to frighten the individual from telling the truth by threatening him with punishment from God. 2. Tribal mindset dictates that individuals will defend others from their group, jatha etc. Their jatha is next level and everyonelse apparently doesnt have a jeevan. 3. Individuals will steep low to prevent to truth from being known (personal attacks, attacks on institutions, lieing, and even trying to make this post seems like it has disappreard.) 4. Most people and groups employ 'double standards', they will make the biggest noise in the world about 'beadbi' when others do it but will not acknowledge when they themselves are doing. And many more.... ...These points are not limited to this thread, this forum or the Sikh Religion - they are universal facts which people will begin to realise as they experience the reality of Life. I have posted the link to a video of how to do simran and cited 'Bandagi Nama' by Raghbir Singh as an excellent book for an introduction to the spirtual aspect of sikhi - someting which exists mainly as a fantacisation with peoples minds. I also recommend the writings of Sant Baba Isher Singh Rare Vale, writings of Baba Nand Singh and other great mahapursh. Above all surrender before maharaj and ask them for guidance. As some of you may have read on the 'Niddar Facts' section I know longer wish to post on this forum. So goodbye and God Bless all. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, Siri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Chardi Kala Teer Bhanay Sarbat Da Bhalla. Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

"we have also promised him that he is now in our circle" - That great, because you circle is next level man, he will surely got to God now because he is in YOUR lots circles - there has never been a circle like you groups circle, there has never been a founder or leader as great as the one that founded yuor jatha, no one loves maharaj as much as your circle does. Your circle are soo abhiyaasi that they are just like maharaj now, mahaaraj loves you so much and has blessed you so much that you shall guide the entire of humanity to enlightenment. YOUR CIRCLE IS DIVINE AND YOU ARE THE CHOSEN ONE!!!!!!!! That seriously 100% just somes you tribalists up perfectly. What a lot of bs. There is no point talking to people like you, because like so many before you, you believe your authority and legitimacy is divine and as its from the Guru that you are superior in your ways. 'Good intentions' dont stand well when you are playing with peoples lives. This is a diverse multicultaral world which consists of real people with real feelings. Why cant you accept as is the Lords creation and everything is in his hukam - yet you will state this when it suits you. Your self justification is typical, "Daas has been blessed by this seva by the Guru" - this is something that has been echoed through the begining of time by power hungry, exploiting self rightous b*st*rds. You are a human being, your authority is not divine! In your actions you shall make mistakes by nature, please think who will have to pay for your mistakes and who will be affected by your mistakes in this world? You shall certainly have to pay for them in the next. Have you thought that people may bot be 'standing up to him' because they have a life to get on with. You guys are like 'Team Khalsa - World Police'. Yet with what authority, other than your good intentions? Good luck with your blog, print out all your magnificent articles and stick them up on your wall, so every morning you can see your magnificent achievement, you can see than everyone else is wrong and you are the only right person in the world. Oh My God your so rightouss and you have so much grace from God that you might actually be Kalki Avtar - yes thats right, it is your mission to rid the world of sin, impurity, anything you dont like and oh yes... diversity! (so that your circle alone may flourish). Stop trying to dictate peoples life - worry about your own, what will you have to show for dharamraj other than your blog? Oh but your so chardi kala you wont go to dharamraj, you will get a one way first class flight all expenses paid trip to sachkhand for all your service for the panth! Who would be responsible if Satnam decided to kill himself after viewing your blog? You bring great shame to the Sikh religion - so greatly deprived of the universal love preached by its founder Guru Nanak Dev Ji, Maharaj taught us to love all, not just our great super duper maha chardi kala 'jatha' Experience has taught me the mindset of people like you and your associates and I know there is never any winning with people like you and others with fanatic mindsets. Therefore, I see no reason to post on this forum, we shall ALL be held to account for our actions. Good intentions do not justify bad and ill actions. Good bye, may God bless us all. Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa! Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh.

1. You do not understand the concept of sehaj - i suggest yo begin by reading the works of Bhai Raghbir singh and then have some discussion with some mahapursh or listen to some katha. Then practise it for some time what you have learnt and maharaj kirpa you may undertsnad. 2. What some individuals think is chardi kala simran is actually tantric chanting - i.e. sounds etc. 3. Never before has the word vaheguru been written with the letter 'Rharha', forget the spirtual affects which are obvious. Gramatically Bhai Gurdas Ji tells us the rara in Veheguru refers to Ram - not RRRRRRHHHHHHHHam. 4. Please provide a reference to what you are claiming is mentioned in sau sakhi. Do you accept sau sakhi as legitimate? are you aware of the controversies sorrounding it? Rolling our tongue does not imply we make loud agrressive emphasis on letters. The rara point cannot be refuted as our gurus spelt vaheguru with a rara. So unless you consider yourself above our gurus you cannot refute the rara point - trying to argue against what out gurus have written - is this what sikhs do? 5. When people can do gurbani in their mind like that it is next level, however, they dont make animal nices are make tantric chants at the same time. It is not sass giras simran what some people now do. 6. It does not matter if they are disturbing people intentioally - they are disturbing the entire sangat in Maharajs darbar - other than those who are doing the same thing. It gives the majority (particuarly lay people) sangat a sore head. 7. your arguement implies that it is okay to read gurbani incorrectly as long as you are reading in your mind - however history, philosophy and theology lead a rational individual to think otherwise. I wonder what brothers from various taksals and schools within Sikhi have to say about this. Your post is but a desperate attempt to prevent the truth from becoming prevalent, with no serious effort refute the points which I have made. Your idealistic arguements cannot survive against hard facts and truth.

Hello wake up. is shouting GRRRRR GRRRR not a distortion of the word VAHEGURU given to us Guru Nanak Dev Ji. your basic point is so weak as no history, theology or spirtual arguements can be made to support it. the fact that you are ignoring my posts (or not choosing to read them) kind of says it all.

when people start by doing vaheguru vaheguru and then move on to GRUUU GRRRU GRRUU and then GRRRRRR GRRRR GRRRR, are they not dervied from/immitating the gurmantar? The noises we hear are being heard because they are being made, and they are certainly not vaheguru. I have stated previously the importance of correct sound for spirtual feeling and then the importance in relation to theology. Vaheguru is written with the letter 'rara', not 'rharrha' and therefore it should be pronounced with the rara sound (any spirtual parcticer will no the significance of this). Using Rharha is mispronuciation - which is equivalent to breaking maharajs limbs. So people express their love to maharaj by breaking maharajs limbs? They express their love for maharaj by making animal noises that they heard someone else doing, they express their love by disturbing the other sangata around them? They express their love by ignoring what out Gurus taught and do what they want? Is this what you are saying? What you are saying is its ok read path incorrectly or even making animal noises instead of actually reciting japji sahib - because i have japji sahib going in my mind. some of my main points: - pervertion of Gurmantar and ins implications/connotations - importance of reciting Gurbani and Gurmantrar correct - The pervertion of the sound currents - the invention of tantric simran which is not what out gurus taught us - are individuals above what the gurus experienced? - The disturbence caused to sangat - THE CONCEPT OF SEHAJ WHICH IS PERHAPS THE CENTRAL/CRUCIAL POINT AT THE HEART OF SIKHI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! none of these points have been refuted

Yes I accept that cussinig Gursikhs is wrong which is why I havent cussed Gursikhs. I have certainly commented on the abuse of the Gurmantr and the level of beadbi that such distortions constitute. And i have extensively mention why such actions are entirely contradictory to Gursikhi. So unless you can refute my arguements made in each one of my posts then stop posting random things: "you do not know what level they are on" "You should cuss Gursikhs" "Its not Gurmantr Simran they are doing" etc etc etc If your read my posts you will see these points have been extensively refuted already, so stop bringing up old stuff. Above any jathebandi, dal, taksal etc... we as Sikhs are alligned to truth. And the truth is that the distortion of Gurbani or Gurmantr is wrong. Please I beg of you not to keep stating the same ideals again and again. Next i sense a random quote from gurbani coming up to try and illustrate something, please dont go there as the Gurbani card is something that we can both draw. Instead, either refute my points in line with Sikh theology and justify the pervertion of Gurbani. Or accept its wrong and stop trying to justify it.

Baba Ji please stop with your idealistic arguements and accept the facts. I am not ripping anyone behind there backs because I have not attacked any individual - I have simply highlighted that practices grossly contradictory to Gurmat are taking place. This issue is not about any jatha, it is about the distortion or beadbi of Gurbani and the Gurmantr - be it from an akj, nihang or anyone else. I would very much like to know who this farladhari Singh as. All Nihang Singhs (of differing levels from various dals) that I have spoken to about simran mention the importance of doing it slowly and above all maintaining sehaj, I dont think any nihang singh would like kindly upon the distortion of our Gurus divine words.

Can we have any evidence that theres a farladhari nihang doing any of that kirtan. Such practices are NEVER seen within any of the Nihang Singh Dals in India. Very unusual.

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...93&hl=en-GB seems appropriate to post this video I found here