Harpartap Singh

Yes we do have a strategy. We want Guru ji saroops, wherever they may be, to be treated with the proper respect. We do not want Guru ji saroop to stay in any Library. We are entering discussions with BL now - this is our goal. As for resources - when BL agree then we will arrange for 'appropriate' premises and facilities. As a bare minimum, the BL should devote some of its funding to ensure Guru ji saroop are kept properly. Our community is approx 1% of this country's population so that is a big sum of money that the BL is getting from US.

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikFateh! Veero, I have spoken to the R4G sevadars and they have said that the British Library (BL) were very reluctant to communicate with them on this issue. What they did discover was that BL went to their own 'representatives of the Sikh community' - Anglo Sikh Heritage for advice. The only confirmation that BL did make was as to the number of Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji's in their control (17) and Gutkas's. They said they have put in place environmental and security procedures in place to protect Guru ji but pointedly did not even mention any procedures for ensuring proper respect. Harbinder Rana of Anglo Sikh Heritage (ASH) has said they were asked for advice on this issue but stated that they had informed the BL in writing that they should take advice from Sri Akal Takhat Sahib. ASH have not followed this up hence the coin exhibition next week. We all need to think about how we can realistically resolve this issue.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw! vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!! The main person behind the taking of Guru ji's pavittar saroop to these hotels in West London and Berkshire is: SATVINDER SARL of Harrow, Norh London. He also organised the wedding at Vikrams banqueting hall in Slough three weeks ago (I think the photos can be seen of him at www.gurugranthsahibji.com) with blankets put over the bar areas. This is also the same person who arranged Guru ji saroop to be taken to the C&L Country Club, Northolt in August this year, where the 'guests' sat on tables and chairs eating and drinking whilst Guru ji's Manji Sahib was placed on a sheet in the middle of the dining area. Guru ji saroop came from 'Guru Granth Gurdwara' also known as Mangat Hall, Southall. As for the all negative comments - respect comes from within. If a person is merely going through what they regard as a ceremony and what concerns them is the convenience of their guests being able to get quickly to the bar and meat afterwards, this is a sure sign of contempt for Guru ji. A person who regards Guru ji as an object to used for ceremonies has no right to call themselves a Sikh or to disrespect our beloved Guru ji. I pray that more and more of the UK Sangat back the Campaign's goal of achieving real respect for Guru ji in all forms - individually by our thoughts and deeds being in consonance with Gurbani and collectively as a separate and distinct community/Nation.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw! vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!! Bhai Sahib, Do you know where a lareedaar pdf of Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji is available?

WaahegurujeekaaKhaalsa, WaahegurjeekeeFateh! WHAT & WHERE? Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji is to be taken to the Menzies Prince Regent Hotel in Chigwell, Essex http://www.london-hotels-guide.co.uk/Engla...ince_regent.cfm WHEN? Sunday 3 October 2004: WHO? It is not known where Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji's saroop is to come from. In the circumstances the only information available is that of the family - Gurpal Singh [surname unknown at present], Ilford, Essex. The home address and telephone number is known to us. WHAT'S HAPPENED? Enquiries have been made as to where Guru ji saroop is to come from but no definite information is available yet. The family have been contacted by letter but they did not respond. The family have been contacted by telephone on four occasions from Thursday through to Sunday - the Hukamnama has been explained and two alternative locations (Gurdwara Sahibs) offered in East London. They have NOT given any indication that they will stop although they know what they are doing is wrong. They have called Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji a 'book' and when it was suggested they should just have a registry they had no answer. WHAT CAN YOU DO? 1. Call the Hotel on 020-8505 9966, ask to to speak to the duty manager and tell them that: a) the wedding which is due to take place is very offensive to Sikhs and is being opposed by all the leading Sikh organisations in the UK (including the National Council of Gurdwara's); b) that there wil l be a large protest on the day with the media being invited to attend as well; and c) that they should contact the Respect for Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji Campaign's Gurjeevan Singh on 07743-211135 if they wish to discuss this further. 2. Organise transport i.e. cars, mini-buses, from your local area for the Sangat to attend on the 3 October. Sangat ji - we can stop this disrespect happening if we all work together. Brent Sikh Centre have formally apologised for taking Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji to Vikram banqueting hall in Slough on Saturday and have said they will not allow this to happen in the future. Please keep up the pressure on these people. Stay Chardhi Kala!! WaahegurujeekaaKhaalsaa, WaahegurujeekeeFateh! T: 07743-211135 E: sikhalerts@yahoo.co.uk W: www.gurugranthsahibji.com Saarang, Fifth Mahalla: This Holy Pothi [sri Guru Granth Sahib ji] is the home of the Transcendent Lord God. Whoever sings the Glorious Praises of the Lord of the Universe in the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, has the perfect knowledge of God. ||1||Pause|| Ang 1226 of Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/r4g/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: r4g-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! It seems we should abide by the Hukam of Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur ji - when the GurSikhs forcibly recovered the saroop from the Sodhi's, Guru ji instructed them to return it to them. Who does the SGPC and people like Badal think they are? Do they know better than Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur ji? If the Saroop had been in the control of the SGPC in 1984, they would have put it in the Central Sikh Reference Library in a glass exhibition case just like the other ancient Saroops - and what happended to them? they were either burnt or stolen by teh Indian Army. DHAN DHAN Sri GUru Tegh Bahahdur Sahib ji who was all seing and all knowing and foresaw exactly what would occur in 1984!!!! Did the SGPC and Badal and company defend to the death these Saroops? NO - so why should we entrust the Saroop of Aadh Guru Granth Sahib ji to them???

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh! Brent North MP, Barry Gardiner has expressed support for the campaign by UK Sikhs to have the British Library accord proper respect to Stri Guru Granth Sahib ji, Dasam Granth and other manuscripts which contain Gurbani. In his letter, he stated that he had written to the Department of Culture head, Teresa Jowell, and the Chief Executive of teh British Library. Sangat ji, please make an effort to help in this worthwhile campaign - make this one of the small ways we can pay tribute to the majesty that is our Satguru ji, Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji. This is what you can do: 1. Sign the online petition at: http://www.petitiononline.com/beadbi04/petition.html. 443 members of the Sangat have signed already... 2. Sign the postcards which are being distributed in various Gurdwaras around the UK over the next two weekends. Just fill in your name, sign it and hand it back to the sevadar - no stamp needed! They will make sure that it gets sent to the Chief Executive of the British Library Please forgive all the mistakes we have made... Sent on behalf of Gurjeevan Singh Respect for Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji Campaign Tel: 07743-211135 Email: sikhalerts@yahoo.co.uk Website: www.GuruGranthSahibji.com (work in progress - so please bear with us!)

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! 'JSN', your arguments sound like those of a lawyer. Taking your argument to its logical conclusion, it means that we do NOT have to show any particular external form of respect to Gurbani or Guru ji in physical or non physical form. I am sorry, but this is a complete joke. Would the Sikhs of the Guru era not have bowed their heads to the physical human form of the Guru when he was not uttering divine Gurbani? The answer to this is unequivocally no - they did respect the physical form of the Guru. Guru ji could not be more explicit - in Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji, Guru Arjan Dev ji has said that the 'Pothi' (Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji) is Parmesar. As for downloading Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji - there should be a notice stating that a complete print out of the documents is considered the embodiment of the Guru and the Sikh code of Conduct must be adhered to otherwise this is a grave insult. However, if it is kept in 2 or more parts, this is not the case As for Gurbani in non physical form i.e. the sung voice, on a computer screen, in the times of the Guru, teh Sikhs would sing Gurbani at all times throughout their working days. People who were non Sikh would have been present and Guru ji did not consider this an issue. However, the form of Gurbani in the form of a scripture was treated as the Guru ji himself from the time of Guru Nanak Dev ji onwards. If, we take your argument again, if the complete Guru Granth Sahib ji is not present then no external form of respect should be shown - it would follow then that the Adi Granth Sahib which Guru Arjan Dev ji himself carried on his head to Harima ndir Sahib could be left on a bookshelf and no wrong is done by this. Is this what Guru Arjan Dev ji intended? This is the exact argument that the British Library have used in their statement. Sikhi always has two aspects, miri and piri, bana and bani, internal and external - in light of this, it is clear that external cleanliness and actions are inseparable for the Rehat of a Sikh. It is impossible to try to follow only the inward path of trying to cleanse the mind and practice Simran 24/7 and disregard all external actions. Inner cleanliness, love and respect for Guru ji and Vaheguru are supreme but they must go hand in hand with our external actions. Just my thoughts...

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh! The British Library is currently presenting an exhibition called ‘Faith and Brotherhood: Treasures of the Sikhs’ running from July to September 2004. As part of this exhibition, the British Library decided to display a puratan saroop of Adi Guru Granth Sahib ji in a glass cabinet! Visitors were walking around with shoes on, without their heads covered etc. If that was not enough, they also exhibited Sri Dasam Granth Ji without any cloth coverings. The backlash from the Sikh Community resulted in the immediate withdrawal of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and a public apology from the Library. Despite further pressure from Sikhs around the world the British Library is refusing to revoke Sri Dasam Granth Ji from the display. The Library has issued a statement saying: “[we] understand that within the Sikh community itself there is no unanimity regarding its authority and status.” Michael O’Keefe (British Library) What right does the British Library have to interpret what the beliefs of the Sikh faith are? The fact is that Jaap Sahib, Akal Ustat, Bachitar Natak, TvaPrasaad Svaiya, and Kabyo Baach Benti Chaupai Sahib are all unanimously agreed to be Gurbani. The Library has no right to differentiate between Gurbani and treat it differently. It has emerged that the British Library have not taken any advice from Sikh historians or organisations (religious or otherwise) about what is appropriate. Khalsa Ji, you must voice your objection to this exhibition by demanding: 1) That Sri Dasam Granth Ji and other Gurbani Gutkas should be removed from exhibition immediately; and >2) The British Library must put procedures in place to ensure disrespect like this does not happen again and that the Rehat Maryada is followed at all times in relation to Gurbani manuscripts. Please take a few minutes to sign the online petition at the following link: http://www.petitiononline.com/beadbi04/petition.html

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! Thank you for bringing these two issues to teh Sangats attention. I cannot for one minute believe that any self respecting Panthic Jathebandhi would support the 'display' of Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji as an object of curiosity or Prakaas next to idols. Both of these things are unacceptable. If anybody has contact details for the exhibition, please post them here.

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! Bhaji, Is Sant jagjeet Singh ji here in the UK now? Can you post more details please

PS Bhaji, please name and shame them Take photo's of them, get there home addresses and phone numbers and post them on the Net. It may be an idea to do this after trying to resolve the situation with your Sangat.

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! 'Khalsa' bhaji above has made some really constructive comments. The way forward to gather together Sangat and take it from there - Guru ji will be with you

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! Tarunjeet bhaji, If anyone has info on where Anjum Choudhury (leader of al Mushroom) lives, please let us know. There was a lot of Sangat from Ilford at the rally yesterday - it would be good if we knew who the enemy was. As a matter of interest - a few weeks ago at about 4am a few car loads of Dastaar wearing muslims pulled up in a side street in the Ilford area. They then started to get out one by one and go for a drive in another car which had pulled up. When the car would come back, the guy would get out and another would get in and go for a drive. Only when all the people in the orginal two car loads and spoken to the people in the third car did they drive off. This carried on for nearly an hour. These are guys are dangerous - keep your eyes and ears open...

VahegurujikaKhalsa, VahegurujikiFateh! Sangat ji, The UK Passport Service are trying to agree a meeting date with the Sikh community concerning their current ban on the Sri Sahib. Please could everybody send me details of all occasions when a Sikh has been refused entry to the Passport Office or if they have been forced to remove their Sri Sahibs. This information is urgently needed in order to show that 'most Sikhs are NOT content to comply. I hope the Sangat will assist me in this. Make a difference - get the word out and lets get this information collated. PS - please could somebody please post this on all e-groups they are members of as I am having difficulties accessing them. My email address is harpartaap@hotmail.com Harpartap Singh