DalbirSingh

Well it seems you can't debate the issue further it is outside of your knowledge set so you have resulted to insults like a little baby. If one day you do understand it come back. Wearing a bana running around like a school girl saying you are a sant sipha doesn't give you mukhti.

Manmat is a chain of those to follow desires of a lower form rather then the guru, I am doing a veechar on a form of understanding from guru sahib not necessarily the coherent one but right now majority samprayadas and jathas contradict themselves on the basic. It was in the singh sabha revolution the kurehits were listed down and the defintions of kesh stated some people tried to say beard is not a part of kesh or armpit hair or chest hair it was latter decided after many debates and meetings the standard defintion. What I am saying is it is not stated in guru granth sahib fully and explicitly. Go to a giani ask them what "budhi" means, what "man" means and what "mat" means and what are the differences. You use budhi not man in understanding any katha. The debate of shabad guru is still used by namdharis and radhaswamis but we have some other evidence for that from credible sources, in guru nanak dev ji janamsakhi he said shabad is guru all the gurus have accepted that and guru granth sahib states it. As for me being God, mate you seriously are confused between Islam and Sikhism. Islam says you can't be god no way possible it is shirk. Guru Sahib tells you God is everywhere, within you and you can meet him in union, God is inside of you at the point of mukhti you will see him everywhere, you are god within you atma lies deep within parmatma. As for muslims they don't understand this themselves the quran preach omnipresence it says allah is to the east as he is to the west. Why follow people who are spiritually blind themselves. Page 51, Line 18 ਸਭ ਹੀ ਮਧਿ ਸਭਹਿ ਤੇ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਬੇਮੁਹਤਾਜ ਬਾਪਾ ॥੨॥ सभ ही मधि सभहि ते बाहरि बेमुहताज बापा ॥२॥ Sabẖ hī maḏẖ sabẖėh ṯe bāhar bemuhṯāj bāpā. ||2|| Inside of all, and outside of all, You are our Self-sufficient Father. ||2|| Guru Arjan Dev Page 80, Line 1 ਅੰਤਰਿ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਸਰਬਤਿ ਰਵਿਆ ਮਨਿ ਉਪਜਿਆ ਬਿਸੁਆਸੋ ॥ अंतरि बाहरि सरबति रविआ मनि उपजिआ बिसुआसो ॥ Anṯar bāhar sarbaṯ ravi▫ā man upji▫ā bisu▫āso. Inside and out, He is pervading everywhere. Faith in Him has welled up within my mind. Guru Arjan Dev

Kesh is a sanskrit word the origins are from vedanta itself it was practiced by sahdus, yogi, monastics for yog traditionally however generally many yogis sitting like shiva the deeper meditator get knots the key difference would be dastar and kangha but some argue these were practised even by rajputs. Kesh is still a mandate in Sikhi however the understanding of why is butchered by people they make things up and follow it blindly.

ਬਾਣੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੁਰੂ ਹੈ ਬਾਣੀ ਵਿਚਿ ਬਾਣੀ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਸਾਰੇ ॥ baaNee guroo, guroo hai baaNee, vich baaNee amrit saare. The Word, the Baani is Guru, and Guru is the Baani. Within the Baani, the Spiritual-life giving Nectar is contained. (Ang 982)

When Guru Tegh Bahadur shaheedi was done people couldn't tell the difference between muslim, hindu and sikh all had beards and a turban. It is difficult sometimes with a turban to see if he has kesh and joora and sometimes between a young singhs small beard and a hindus or muslim trimmed beard. These days with punjab you can't tell the difference with some hindus and sikhs people just randomly put a paag on and randomly keep a bushy looking gelled/tied beard or some randomly keep a beard. Some muslims tie paags some were difficult to distinguish. Part of survival in life is fitting in to the crowd sometimes and when you stand out you can suffer from racism, hatred, lack of opportunies in school, jobs, sports, etc. But we all know you can counter act that.

Have a read of this: http://www.sikhreview.org/pdf/april2005/pdf-files/pers1.pdf

lol dalip singh picked up christianity he wasn't forced into it, he by his own choice later became sikh. He was a young impressionable boy they didn't hold him down and cut his hair. Look your not able to comprehend culture and religious difference. But you have your answer to why people cut there hair according to your logic they are confused simple as and just like the taliban they should all be held down and have paags tied on them and forced to do paath. Mate culture is defined by the way you talk, what you eat, how you dress, things you think like - culture is the difference between a ponce and a chav. Hope you get that? Please tell me you understand what culture means, what virsa means? If not please go to an english teacher or an intelligent person ask them what culture means, look it up on the internet, look it up in a dictionary. Go find out what the word culture means young boy, after which I will tell you where babies come from. However ask yourself next do you think only you will go to heaven and the majority of the world who cuts their hair will go to hell and burn and reincarnate until they are born in your family. Or for cutting their hair all christians, hindus, muslims, jews, buddhist will reincarnate to various stages of animals and you need to save them. Second to do that if not cutting your hair is following his hukam and will why do you cut your nails then?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBLc61WfgY0 read about al-taquia seems like you been a victim of this propoganda yourself.

Well we know from kashmir situation what muslims are like they lie about stuff all the time, saying hindus and sikhs are oppressing them, they have been the biggest liers you can ever meet in the entire world. They have lied about the Sikh relaitonship sayings sikhs are enemies, they lied in 1947 to rape sikh women, the mullahs are satanic incarnates of the devil who start problems, lie and stir them up. This stuff about palestine the muslim land being innocent targetted by evil jews is the mullahs at work. The read the haddiths and find wars with muslims and jews so they start jihad on jews themselves. Muslims have started war with everyone, the main goal they have is to kill everyone, or convert them they can be very patient but ultimately want to convert everyone so we have loads of pedophila all over the world, with cutting of peoples hands and stonning to deaths. Israel has been decided but muslims want to take over the land, convert them all imposing shariah law, they are after declaring war with the whole world. We are unique, we have some things to learn from everyone but on what you need to create a state and to have representation in the UN is the main thing we do have a channel right now in the UN we need to help various organisations grow, we need to contribute our time, services and funds. We need a growth in awareness and media. We need better communications and understand how to talk to people, to read on diplomacy and how to communicate effectively.

You do know you can find loads of keshdhari sikhs who do drugs, go to clubs, have loads of sexual relations, who drink loads, gamble, steal, cheat, murder and commit loads of crime. Sikhi starts from inside first naam japna and doing nitnem hold high importance what is the point of keeping kesh if you don't do paath or commit endless number of sins. As the truest Sikh you are I guess you have never lied and always done lots of humanitarian work feed poor people, helped the ill, respected all elders. Worked very hard doing loads of charity.

Paṯ viṇ pūjā saṯ viṇ sanjam jaṯ viṇ kāhe jane▫ū. Worship without faith; self-discipline without truthfulness; the ritual of the sacred thread without chastity - what good are these? Nāvhu ḏẖovahu ṯilak cẖaṛāvahu sucẖ viṇ socẖ na ho▫ī. ||6|| You may bathe and wash, and apply a ritualistic tilak mark to your forehead, but without inner purity, there is no understanding. ||6|| SGGS ANG 903 Page 39, Line 9 ਮਨਿ ਮੈਲੈ ਭਗਤਿ ਨ ਹੋਵਈ ਨਾਮੁ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ਜਾਇ ॥ मनि मैलै भगति न होवई नामु न पाइआ जाइ ॥ Man mailai bẖagaṯ na hova▫ī nām na pā▫i▫ā jā▫e. With a polluted mind, devotional service cannot be performed, and the Naam, the Name of the Lord, cannot be obtained. Guru Amar Das Maharaj also says that people have a false outward identity of being holy but inside are liers full of corruption and falsehood. If you want to know the arth of why kesh the reason is to do with isht, you can attain certain khands without kesh.

Listen stop doing nindya here and talk properly you are only showing your own ignorance. Give every quote that explicitly (with no question full stop) tells you in guru granth not to cut hair. Secondly most people translate the word "rom" wrong it's origins are from sanskrit it means molecules go ask a few people to verify the ignorance you posses (an ignorant person in punjabi is called a moorakh). Just look at all the sikhs who think they are kaala or gangster that is culture. The Kesh rehat is stated in guru gobind singh jis maryada upon khalsa initiation. If this is the way you behave with other people how do expect anyone to embrace sikhi at all, they will look at you thinking you are the truest representation of guru gobind singh and run away. Now the point you don't understand I will have to expand onto. Before you go further benti go get a dictionary and look up the words "religion" and the word "culture" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion http://dictionary.re...browse/religion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture http://dictionary.re.../browse/culture dharam and virsa are separate things. Virsa does mix with dharam however virsa changes such as bhangra boliyan we are not doing the same bhangra boliya our ancestors did. RDB's bhangra compared to the standard bhangra from 500 years ago are different. Just look at footwear what different shoes are worn, chappal designs have changed over time. Sikhi stays firm throughout time. Food is a part of culture - you don't have to be sikh to eat the punjabi dish paranthas loads of hindus, christians, buddhists and muslims eat them. Some sikhs don't eat them but eat italian dishes such as pizza or paste. Eating Pizza doesn't convert you to christianity, pizza is a dish mainly from people who were christian. Now to break down the thing your not getting is guru gobind singh said "raj bina dharam nai chalda"- Guru Gobind Singh in his time was the equaivalent of a raja people gained sikhi from him. In sikh raj, maharaja ranjit singh was a the king who ruled a sikh rule. Everyone who came to his court had to wear a turban. He made many hindus into sikhs in his rule even europeans became sikh. People have dress, ethics, beliefs amounted upon them some what by peer-pressure what we like to say as sangat take good sangat you become good if you go bad you become bad- but you can set up your own mental bubble so you don't let it effect you. Now people went to people who kept hair and wanted to keep hair. look at the opposite when sikhs first came to a country were people cut hair, people like maharaja dalip singh cut his hair. Cutting hair is a christian, muslim and jewish belief instated it is mandatory if you read those books you will find instructions which tell you to do so however they still kept it long culture wise fashion has changed now they keep it very short. In hinduism you can keep kesh you will find instruction in rig vedas to do so, these days with heresy people going against traditions mandate they do what they want, we are not the taliban to run madrassas to beat children and force them to do things.

Jews thirst more for success then sikhs do, loads of sikhs are okay with just alcohol, tv or other things in excess from punjabi culture, entertainment and leisure have a place in life but only after success. Jews dream of becomming billionaires and have some Sikhs are happy being millionaires they feel they own the whole pind like that, jews want more then we do. Sikhs need to dream and aim of being trillionaires and achieving the near mark of billionaire to the level we can be equal to other people. Jews come in all sorts of colours they mixed with people you will find some indian jews, black jews but on the front end you have white jews just like sikhs we are now becomming more diverse we have 3ho who have gone far we only dream of that. Guru Gobind Singh made us king of world we give away our sikhis diamonds easily and those diamonds are used against us only a dimaond can cut a diamond. Sikhs harm sikhs or hindus from sikhi orient background- indira gandhi went harmandar sahib she had some few practices of sikhs knew about it to some extent she just didn't like sikhs like some sikhs don't like each other. We have internal drama. Jews have loads of sects but they work together, they don't cuss each other and they learn about each other so they can respect each other more and work together for common good. Sikhs only get together if we want to beat someone up in common. Jews did have a caste system still do however they respect their own minority situation and marry still however they have the surname problem as well, however you find loads of jews who have doctorates, phds, mbbs, lawyers. We have a few drs and don't let them take us forward to have more educated people. All their priests are highly educated our priests are limited in education they can only read guru granth sahib and that is about it, we don't let them write papers or get involved in conferences, sikh studies or other academic means. Publishing sermons and more research, we have destroyed our research tradition, we have oceans of treasures to study and go deeper into the last person we have was bhai vir singh today we only have people like gs. sidhu and Dr. Sukhpreet S. UDHOKE we need more people like this and go deeper then them to go beyond them a million times.

Jews are together they work together, when we get together we start fighting after the hollocaust no one could do anything. Sikhs have taken vengence for things people sikhs shot loads of members of the congress party something the jews couldn't dream of doing to the nazi, the nazi got away with most of it. The jews zionist movement lead them to control the media so jews have the say in bbc news and sky news- sikhs have no role in the news media and in many times are victims of several forms from the news media. You will find rarely any sikh media figures in the news media doing a good job of reporting the real news guess they wouldn't hire them, otherwise we can publish 1984 properly. We have silly flops who are far from sikhi like sonia deol and bbc asian network djs who don't represent sikhi or the sikhs. You can find them turning their back on the real events of 1947 and 1984 we take favour of those we commited crimes against sikhs, they allow sikhs to be mixed with the taliban. Even after the sikh riots people who defended southall, the area, mosques and gurdwara sky news called the singh sabha gurdwara a mosque and still no appology for the ignorance from sky news, instead some reports were against sikhs saying they were vigillantes some on the extent saying they want to make more trouble. In 1984 no sikh could report that bhindranwale was not a terrorist or report a voice of reason for indira gandhi assinations. No sikh could represent sikhs in the partition of India. We don't have sikh footballers or media personalities like jews have. But jews are very passive were sikhs can fight at times. Jews are a smaller population then Sikhs, sikhs fight more with each other then support each other for a mp, representation or young reporters.

Just here to encourage all the sikhsangat.com to start a youtube channel to record some videos or any animations we can make. To start producing audio and video publications we have christian and muslim youtube channels how about videos which we can film, such as debates, forums. Things we see on sikh channel, sangat tv we can film our own things which can be the amature productions we see even christian channels have amature christian youtube videos those which are good enough get aired. We have cameras digital phones, iphone. I encourage all of you to open your own channel to get the sabat soorat sikhi saroop for the whole world to see. We can make comedies, we can do parachar. We can film even local gatherings and so forth?

We must build dikes of courage to hold back the flood of fear. Martin Luther King, Jr . Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear. Mark Twain Expose yourself to your deepest fear; after that, fear has no power, and the fear of freedom shrinks and vanishes. You are free. Jim Morrison In order to succeed, your desire for success should be greater than your fear of failure. Bill Cosby When the fear of not facing the fear is greater then facing your fear courage comes alight. Some Guy When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty. Thomas Jefferson Where there is reverence there is fear, but there is not reverence everywhere that there is fear, because fear presumably has a wider extension than reverence. Socrates [take into account the highest form of reverence is God hence we fear God] Courage is a mean with regard to fear and confidence. Aristotle I fear not the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times. Bruce Lee People always fear change. People feared electricity when it was invented, didn't they? People feared coal, they feared gas-powered engines... There will always be ignorance, and ignorance leads to fear. But with time, people will come to accept their silicon masters. Bill Gates Battle is the most magnificent competition in which a human being can indulge. It brings out all that is best; it removes all that is base. All men are afraid in battle. The coward is the one who lets his fear overcome his sense of duty. Duty is the essence of manhood. George S. Patton Courage is fear holding on a minute longer. George S. Patton

Do some caligraphy of a tuk of bani

We need nurseries in more gurdwaras, loads of kids need to take care of them and keep them happy.

We have gurdwara commitees, presidents, the sikh council many sikh organisations we already have a structure. Those misls where people from each region who fought hard and people followed them. These general were on the front line who would fight first not sit in the back and watch others fight. We have heirachy today such as singh sabha, we have loads of groups and babas and still nothing happens. As for police we have to be responsible for ourselves no one is going to do anything we have to do everything ourself, people will be lazy we have to sort out our own mess. We never had a police force we did our own things back then and now. We have groups in the police force and other departments but when something comes up an argument comes about as it did with misls but misls knew the basic ground of the panth and protect harmandar sahib and gurdwaras. These days we attack gurdwaras ourself.

friends they are sikhs, instead of dividing them you will stir them to hate guru nanak dev ji. People following manmat are attacking others following manmat where is the gurmat in all of this? It looks like the blind are leading the blind.

I agree!

Go read gurbani read about the mention of krishna, shiva, mahabharta. You show signs of not understanding the difference of culture and religion. Culture changes with time, religious beliefs are indicated. Sikhism doesn't prescribe to eat parantha forever, food + art+ language change with time. In 25 years a language changes, in 25 miles a language changes. Hence fashion changes, the huge fashion trend is clashing with a religious belief system as is an older religious system (abrahamic traditions) which have made themselves cultural clashing with the kesh belief (sabat sorat vs sunnah). Musical instruments change with time. I am sorry if you are unable to comprehend this stuff, I advise you start from basics of reading books with nursery books. Jack and the beanstalk is a good one to start with.

The laws you live under are reflected in the culture, media and law systems. When sikhs lived under mughal law the shariah was imposed and it restricts certain things, behaviour, language, art, dress. We had persian systems and writings people learnt persian and islamic legends since it was the normal thing of that time. Living in a christian country many people are cut hair when compared to an islamic country where people love prophet muhammad and turban hence the turban is respected more. Look into the nature of culture. Like right now you speak english, you use english logic such as insulting people when you don't understand things. You use english legends, tv, english fashion - nike shoes etc.

Well he thinks it's a win and before marrying thinks it is okay to date you. But you want to marry him straight when the time is right, so your present relationship is complicated because you are no longer friends but prospectively near marriage. In marriage we have to face bad words said, just need to be cool about it. It is nothing compared to what can be faced, so relax with a cool mind and then think where you want to go. It seems like he might be ideal for you and you need to take it carefully from there.

Bhagat Sheikh Farid used to dance in bhagati. Guru Gobind Singh gave the rehat to his Sikhs to became the kings of the world. What you will see is that there are several rehats recorded from various authors such as Bhai Desa Singh, Rehatnama Bhai Nand Lal Goya, you will find some from sau sakhis and amongst we have some fabricated rehat from Massands. Thing is these days due to this hindu allergy developed after aryan samaj and singh sabha problem. Some people think they are muslims following shariah laws. We are not the taliban, under shariah law dancing and music is forbidden, you also have to cut mostaches and beard (when the mughals caught some singhs they cut their beards). Under shariah law certain drums apart from one is forbidden. We use nagara and dholki for sukhasan, for battle. If you study how singhs actually fought the mughals, the allignement these are devoid of islamic means. Muslims employ various tactics to convert people one is by brainwashing them and confusing them, such as using sikhs against hindus or developping this allergy. Due to this hindu allergy loads of sikhs and reading gurbani wrong as well, changing bits taking bits out people like kala afgana and darshan singh want to get rid of dasam granth and portions of guru granth sahib. You also translated man and mat wrong, even in santiya you use your brain. In punjabi you have several translations for brain and mind - budhi, mat, man, so forth. You will use your mat (minds intellect), man is (minds desires), man neva, mat uchi. Manmat is using that direction of intellect towards desires, if you desire to lust for muslim women you will then follow islamic ways away from guru sahib of being gurmukh and gurmat (that intellectual minds path of the guru). We are following Guru Nanaks path did he go around telling people not to dance and sing? *Edited*