pedrorizzo

http://sikhcounciluk.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/SCUK-Special-Community-Safety-Bulletin-August-20112.pdf

Sikh Unit are a decent bunch of guys. Quite a few of them are ex-criminals and gangsters who found Sikhi in later life and cleaned up their ways. Regarding the content of their music, they are doing what all rap artists do, and merely reflecting their own experiences and opinions. After all, thats what rap music is supposed to be is it not? Many of them have previously come form broken homes, their day to day experiences include fighting for survival, fighting with muslim youth and other grim realities that one may have to face if living in a ghetto inner city area. Given that they are a bit rougher than your average table tennis player, these guys have also taken it upon themselves to do certain kinds of sewa that most people would avoid and stay away from, including protecting the community from certain pakistani gangs, saving girls who have been kidnapped by muslim guys and drugged up and other unpleasant activities. Basically, regardless of whether or not you like them or respect them, or even agree with their views, they have a niche role in the Sikh community, which is to raise awareness of Islamic extremism, deal with certain bullies and provide back up to people who may have some beef with muslims for some reason or another. They have also been known to promote and support the profile of Sikh fighters such as Subaig Singh and Suki Dhami. They also have an important role to play in parchar and promotion of Sikhi. Admittedly, they will appeal to a select audience and use different methods, but they are effective non the less. Whilst I acknowledge that there is a need for tolerence, inter-faith unity and working together, the threat to Sikhs from Muslim gangs is very real in many inner city areas. We need a few of our own thugs to keep the enemy in check.

Also, given that in most riots, 90% of the battle involves people just throwing bricks and stones at each other, I think we have forgotten the best riot weapon of them all...wait for it.... the catapult/slingshot !! Ten Singhs with slingshots/catapults and a bag full of marbles could defeat a crowd of 200 looters easily. You can pick up a catapult for a tenner lol.

Agreed with the above. Except for the statement forget about gatka. If anything we should have more gatka classes and more youngsters learning it. After all modern violence/civil unrest is likely to be conducted via metal bars, hockey sticks, baseball bats, swords and bricks rather than bare hands... so actually gatka is probably one of the most useful resources that we have as a community and we should use it and nuture it. We have a ready made system and class structure in place, rather than looking elsewhere. Agreed though, that it should be supplemented with other empty hand martial arts/self protection systems as well. I have heard that the Sikh Council is going to launch a nation wide self protection programe/krav maga to teach sikh youth who are interested self defence.

Iv recieved this message. Dont know if it is fact or just rumour. Could someone kindly confirm either way

I believe that the original poster has some valid points. I dont think that we should forget 1984, however I do believe that we should no longer let our agenda be dictated by 1984. The carnage of 1984 was the strategy of the Indian Govenment to derail the efforts of the Anandpur Sahib Resolution and Dharam Yudh Morcha whereby Sikhs were gaining power by campaigning for better rights and more autonomy. However, the instigation of violence by the Government gave birth to the Khalistan movement, the kharkoos and the on going cycle of violence in Punjab which did nothing to further the Sikh cause. In fact it probably set us back 20 years in reverse gear. Currently, there is no threat of violence, so this is our opportunity to regroup and reevaluate where the panth should be heading and what the new agenda should be, given our current conditions, and not the conditions of 25 years ago. We seem to be like fish swimming around in circles in a goldfish bowl, giving the same speeches, talking about grand and great things like Khalistan, when we cant even protect basic tenets like allowing kids to go to school with a kirpan. How exactly do we propose to start a revolution in a country where most of the populace are more interested in emigrating to canada or their next fix of smack, let alone growing their hair, which is probably the last thing on the list. Khalistan is a distant dream. We should not forget 84, but we need to shift gears, come back to reality and concentrate purely on the issues that affect us today. Too many Sikh youth of today fantasize about Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale and about being a kharkoo. He was quite good for his time, but a hardline no nonsense approach would not work in todays day and age. Conclusion: Never forget the past. But move on, live in the present and prepare for the future.

They are a good source of protein for guys that train but are vegetrarian but need the protein in the diet to help them recover from training, grow stronger and fitter.

I could mention his name etc but will not as he is a friend of mine and it is not fair on him etc. However, Niddar Singh was aware of the situation and threatened to expel him from the akhara for getting into street fights if he did it again. So Niddar Singh and other members of the akhara are aware of this. Perhaps you could ask them?

Shastar vidya is bs. Luckily, Niddar Singh has warped views about Sikhi, hence, not too many people take him seriously and attend his classes. Also his reputation has slid down into the gutter and he was beaten up at Hazoor Sahib in 2008 and made to apologise for his misdeeds, the video is on youtube. The only known recording of Niddar Singh, in anything resembling a real fight, is in a gatka tournament when he fought Teji, the gatka instructor from Southall. When he got frustrated by Tejis spinning moves, he threw is weapon on the floor and tried to grab Teji, only to be met by a slick drop seonagi (shoulder throw), and landing on his backside, which is positively the most hilarious thing I have ever seen. Definitely cannot say that Teji defeated Niddar, but he sure made him look rather silly. The video is on youtube. Niddar is a self proclaimed Gurdev of a self created martial art which borrows techniques from other styles and merged with his own creative imagination he has coined shastar vidya. Nonone else in the whole world has seen or heard of it. Nonone has ever used it. I know someone who attends shastar vidya classes and got into a fight with some goreh on a bus. He used his karra as a knuckle duster and smashed a few of them up, after which he was taken down to the floor and given a good kicking. Even by his own admission, he forgot all his techniques and lost his temper and couldnt think properly under pressure to use what he was taught, and he has been learning for several years. The above story sounds familiar to me, when traditional martial artists get their butt handed to them in a real fight, and all their fancy, deadly, killer techinques, all of a sudden dissappear To his brainwashed followers, clearly you believe everything Niddar says and cant accept that what he teaches is fake, and that your 'Gurdev' is a professional conman. If you want to carry on learning from him then go ahead. Just be aware that not everybody thinks that SV is the real true Vidya of the Gurus and puratan Singhs, and not everyone thinks that this martial art is as invincible and dangerous as you guys do. But if it works for you, then good for you. To everyone that is against SV, just be assured to know that most of the guys that follow it are brainwashed geeks, that live in a fantasy world where they are dangerous martial artists, just like you get geeks into Ninjitsu etc and walk around wearing samurai costumes etc. Thats what these guys are. Basically just a cult group with a cult following, like the Star Trek Society at Uni or something lol. You wont be able to convince them of their stupidity so best just to leave them alone. Luckily there are not many of them around. When they first started up, they were potentially a big movement. But luckily, Niddars own wierdo views on Sikhi put alot of people off anyway.

I'm saying it how it is pal, or at least how I perceive it. And I dont feel the need to get out of bed and make a difference. I'm not a guy that pretends that he is some kind of holy crusader warrior, picks fights with other communities, the authorities, police, or worse still members of my own religion, only to get my backside kicked due to my own inadequacy. I dont consider it self loathing.. more like loathing of people that act like idiots. So clearly, you have labelled me as a pessimist. As an optimist, do you wanna share what you see that I dont?

Cos they enjoy taking on battles that they cant win and then running away in the opposite direction with their jooreh open. Singhs are just into mindless aggression nowadays and then get surprised when they get whooped. I wonder why?

Get yourself a really good tan and make yourself as black as possible. You might be eligible for employment via a quota system for positive discrimination

warrior singh, I am a different guy. Nice to meet you lol

khalistan Gunman, Obviously I wouldnt want to meet such a dangerous person such as yourself in person. Standing before a great babbar shere soorma such as yourself would be a bit overwhelming for me. Good luck with your trip to pakistan. I hope your training goes well.

Khalistani Gunman, Thankyou for offering your alternative perspective. Although it is not stuff that I havent heard before. Personally, I believe the whole 1982-1993 period to have been a disaster for the Sikhs. You blame the black cats, lack of media support, betrayals, lack of weapons/training and infrastructure on the reason why we lost. However, in my opinion the reasons you have mentioned are crucial for the success or failure of a guerilla campaign. So it is simply not good enough to blame those aspects because they are just as important, if not more important than fighting spirit. All the kharkoo leaders failed the kaum including Jarnail Singh. The casualty figures, destruction, economic destruction, destruction to Sikhi, that occurred during that period was nothing but a pure disaster. Sure, brave men spilt their blood and died. However, what was achieved? The blame of the failure of this campaign must fall squarely at the leaders of the kharkoo movement and they should take responsiblity for it. So yes I stand by the claim that the kharkoos got battered. Unfortunately, it wasnt just them. The entire Sikh kaum got battered and had to pay too much of a heavy price. I do agree with your statement that the singhs with Jarnail Singh had great fighting spirit, so did many of the Kharkoos. Regarding your point about addressing Jarnail Singh as 'sant' or 'mahapursh', there are differing opinions on this. His non taksali peers/counter parts including Babbars and AKJ did not really regard him to be a sant. In this day and age, Sikhs jump to call someone a sant or a mahapursh, and 30 years after 84 Jarnail Singh's list of titles appears to be ever increasing day by day. Personally I think that Jarnail Singh was a good Sikh that stood and spoke up against the injustices against the Sikh kaum however made some very costly mistakes that the whole kaum had to pay for in blood. I certainly dont regard him to be a mahapursh, brahmgiani and will not call him Sant. However, if you wish to do so then that is your choice. Thanks for your offer of meeting personally but I think I will turn it down lol

warrior singh: If you believe in your 'mahapurukhs' then that is your choice but jus be aware that not everyone does. The only reason that Jarnail Singhs men performed reasonably well in battle was because of the military tactics and strategy of General Subeg Singh who was, you may have guessed it, military trained and the best expert on Guerilla warefare on the Indian subcontinent and an instrumental Special forces officer, whos undercover activities led to the independence of Bangladesh in 1971. As far as putting the Singhs down, I am giving my opinion on the reality of the situation as I see it. I personally dont want to join the army but at the same time I dont brainwash or blag myself into thinking that I am some kind of Kharku warrior with special powers, jus cos I wear a Bhindranwale t-shirt and listen to shaheedi immortality songs. As it happens, the kharkus that you look up to got battered in the 80s and 90s due to their lack of military/strategic intellect and caused resultant wisdespread massacre among the general populace and innocent civilians due to their miscalculations and immaturity. And I am not Yuba Singh. I admire him to want to join forces and I respect his reasons for doing so. But I dont think that most Singhs nowadays have got the balls, the mentality or the heart to be part of such an organisation. That is my honest view.

Singhs nowadays are too worried about their pagh falling off or their hair getting wet or getting kachera muddy. We would make the worst soldiers on the planet. We definitely dont like to follow orders from anyone, unless its from a so called mahapurash, in which case we dont question them, even when they fill our heads with fairytales about goblins, werewolves and other mystical creatures. Can you imagine a Singh on the battlefield, living it rough? What would he do without being able to wash his hands every three seconds, in case he dies from jhoot poisioning lol. Diet and exercise would be a problem. Since most Singhs dont do it in any meaningful quantity and get out of breath after a 2 minutes of jogging. Singhs are also have complex family needs which would be incompatible with military life. But its funny how great at making excuses Singhs are nowadays and Singhs deflect their own inadequcies by saying dont join the army cos its racist, and its oppressive against muslim countries etc.. clearly al quaeda and the taliban are our long lost cousins that we love so much and are duty bound to protect. Personally I would tell Singhs to stay away from the army. Purely because I dont think that any army would have much use for us and we would be more of a liablity than an asset.