MisterrSingh

A bit of common sense is all that's needed.

No. I think Trump, going by previous declarations, has said he wants to curb the trend of the U.S. being an intervening force in the world's affairs. Whilst I don't think that means we'll be seeing an isolationist foreign policy, I do believe he will hesitate leaping into armed conflicts that will waste trillions of dollars and add to an already massive national debt. Of course, I don't think the industrial military complex that has its tendrils deeply embedded into the U.S. machinery, will ever allow that to happen. I believe something will transpire, perhaps on an unprecedented scale on American soil, that will force him to act and renege on that promise.

Really? I don't know how to process that. It seems to be inappropriate but I'm not quite certain.

Well, they think they're superior to NRIs (possibly because of a belief that they're "purer" Punjabis who are more in touch with our roots and culture), yet their words and behaviour belie an unmistakable sense of insecurity and inferiority that stems from an unconscious perception on their part that they don't like being lectured - as they see it - by first-worlders. So a bit of both.

Just wanted to get the sangat's opinion on a subject that's been brewing for a while now but has only hit the mainstream since recent political and social upheavals in the West. Are whites who claim they are being oppressed, marginalised, and rendered powerless in their own countries, exaggerating or is there something valid in those claims? All replies are welcome, but some maturity is preferable. Avoid half-cocked personal prejudices. My opinion is in the spoiler tag below if anyone is interested. It's a very brief summary that I may expound later, time permitting.

Is that a thing nowadays? I haven't been to a bhog for decades.

It amazes me how people cannot see any of the above. Are they so blinded by partisanship? Is it only objectionable if the other side does it? So, doesn't that make them bigoted when they adhere to a code of silence when their preferred candidate enacts the same policy? Yet... it's also obvious that Trump is taking baby steps, and he is indeed testing the waters. What his endgame is I have no idea.

Lol at that first paragraph. Unfortunately, it's drilled into men (by whom I'm not sure; the collective cultural subconscious of the time?) that to have a hassle free life, a man should cede all control to his wife. Basically it allows him to "switch off" and coast along on the coat tails of his wife's whims. The path of least resistance and all that. It's an especially prevalent attitude in the West. That, I believe, leads to all sorts of problems since when one partner in a relationship actively "checks out" of any mental engagement with his significant other, the assumption being that everything will run smoothly "if I don't causes waves." I don't know how any male can live like that. Equally, having a woman who's barely there, mentally speaking, or so meek as to be virtually invisible, isn't my idea of a marriage. Unfortunately, it's a very rare situation where like-minded, mature, and switched-on individuals decide to live a reciprocal and mature existence as partners who want to be there, as opposed to two people brought together just because. The older I get the more I'm beginning to feel that our elders had, by and large, the right idea. They weren't suffering under illusions or fantasies. Marriage was a transaction. It facilitated the growth of families. People just got on with things, give or take the obvious occasional dramas between folk living in close proximity. It wasn't fuelled by a culture of wholly unrealistic dreams of perfection that are so ludicrous that believing in such things will clearly lead to deflation and disappointment. Affection grows (dependent on the people involved); I don't necessarily believe it should be a prerequisite.

I've heard something similar. Kids as young as 7 used as mules to carry drugs between homes in the same pind. It's like something out of a nightmare. Why get married? Just hire a cook and a cleaner, lol. I have to wonder whether Punjabi culture has facilitated the process of marriage for guys who, if they had to fend for themselves and find a life partner on the strength of their personality, appeal, and generally pleasant demeanour, wouldn't be capable of attracting a mate of their own volition. Are things set up so they can't fail? Can't blame the guys completely. The pickings available here and back home are increasingly slim for differing reasons. Nobody wants to tolerate a mouthy, difficult woman. Any man with an ounce of awareness will not be dominated.

That's one decision she won't be able to return from. They'll make her life very difficult if she does that. A part of me says compromise and understanding only occurs between two parties that share a semblance of wisdom and maturity, and a desire to be amicable. I don't think there's much of that going on in our people or in this instance.

I dread to think the kind of pressure they'll apply to make that happen. Or maybe they'll just forge her signature?

As much as I was defending the emotional link between your husband and mil in terms of the father not being on the scene, a man should be strong of mind to make his own decisions. Yes, consult the mother, show her due respect, but ultimately stand on your own convictions. I don't blame them for opting for a wife in you that would offer the least resistance. There are some terribly horrific tales of what happens to Sikh families once the wrong woman enters the home. Still, that's not your problem. As I said, your best bet is to talk sincerely to your husband without giving the impression you're plotting against his mother. Aside from that there isn't much you can do without making a huge scene, and doing so would just escalate issues that don't need to be escalated.

Thing is once the dust has settled you don't hear their own - even the apparently apologetic, liberals amongst them - turning around and spitting in the face of those who took some pretty dank and tough action in hectic times to advance a cause. Our lot are, to name one example, ready to excommunicate someone like Baba Banda Singh, lol, because he doesn't meet our apparently enlightened standards of sitting on our behinds and pontificating about horrors we can scarecely imagine.

They stick together on the major stuff, though, don't they? Sure, there's tribal loyalties, etc, but they club together and get things done against recent foreign invaders. I don't know whether that's an Islam / fear thing that keeps the population in-line or just old fashioned loyalty, but they know how to wear out superior opposition.

Just a cautionary note: we need to stop with the fetishization of armed struggles, especially since we cannot hope to win without training. Adrenaline and desire will only take you so far, especially amongst a population that is notorious for selling out for personal gain, and in a hypothetical modern Sikh insurrection, we would need the vast majority of the population to be on the side of the fighters. Would any of you trust the current lot in the villages in Punjab not to make a phone call to the police during the night to shop a bunch of fighters for a reward? In that respect, one has to wonder how a group like the Afghans have managed to repel occupying forces throughout their history, be it the Soviets and later the Americans and Europeans, considering they're hardly training in barracks on a daily basis. As TigerForce said, awareness is the first step. Resident Punjabis have a worrying inferiority complex when it comes to hearing advice from the likes of us; it visibly rankles them. Some of that is rooted in being in complete denial about their situation over there, whilst the rest is a sort of demoralisation and fear stemming from previous horrors. Sadly, there is very little big-picture thinking over there. It's incredibly frustrating.

How long's it been going on?

Apparently the rationale behind such decisions is that the "degeneracy" of the West isn't conducive to a sensible and respectful child with morals and values. Funny how that doesn't extend to the opportunities it affords these same people to accumulate cash, lol. Have they completely managed to avoid any other people in Punjab, and haven't heard the carry on by the youngsters over there? An inadequate and foolish parent is going to make a pig's ear of their child no matter which country he or she is raised. Well, now some more details are emerging, it seems the husband wants to shirk his duties as a father by palming off his child to his mother.

That's not right. In that case you should be in your husband's ear to convince him of your feelings on this issue. But do it with diplomacy and without burning bridges. Festering away on the sidelines isn't helping anyone. I apologise if I may have seemed harsh previously.

Lol.

Talk to your husband and discuss these issues with him. It seems you have an irrational dislike for your husband's mother, and wish to sideline her in favour of your own parents. I'm guessing you would like to isolate her from her son rendering her powerless and your husband floundering making him easier to control (moreso considering she doesn't have a husband to physically and emotionally support her) whilst simultaneously "promoting" your parents to the role of primary grandparents, which you seem to think will provide you with an upper hand and greater leverage in family power plays. I think you'd like to enact your own sphere of control and dominance, and your husband's mother is the last obstacle inbetween such a policy coming to fruition. It is unfortunate your mind works in such ways; expending mental energy in worthless and imaginary battles that serve no purpose aside from creating discord and hurt feelings but I cannot say I'm surprised. It hasn't occured to you to show affection and emotional solidarity to your husband in order to convince him that he has a wife with whom he can share his burdens (yes, children are beget between people who can barely tolerate each other). Instead you've passively aggressively shown him that you resent the one person that's been a constant in his life since his childhood. Yet you wonder why this problem exists in the first place.

I'm on the verge of graduating from the School of Hard Knocks. It's been quite an education.

This needs to become a regular, visible occurrence. Sikh males cannot be perceived to be taking the lead on these issues whilst Sikh bibiya stand on the sidelines as passive observers, with the unspoken implication being circulated in the minds of westerners that Sikh females silently disagree with their male counterparts (and therefore tacitly endorse the mistaken belief that all relationships between Muslim males and Sikh females are instigated in the spirit of harmless mutual attraction), but are denied a voice due to the "overbearing" presence of their male co-religionists. If these bibiya speak up and step forward it might actually get through to some of their floundering sisters who find themselves poised dangerously on the edge of life destroying situations.

74 going on 34, lol!

She needs to stop buying into the adversarial "Saas vs Nau" culture that's a staple of Punjabi life. As someone on the path of Gursikhi, surely she should be above such nonsense? God forbid a guy is close to his mother after having being deserted by his father when he was a child. There is a case to be made of guys who are manipulated and controlled by an overbearing female presence (there are some truly horrific accounts of couples ripped apart by such women), but in this case the wife seems to be threatened by the mere fact that the husband isn't immediately bowing and scraping at her feet. No wonder so many Singhs are turning their back on grishti, when this is the level of maturity out there when it comes to potential partners. If the mother is making life difficult for them both, then she needs a stern talking to. But if there's none of that, and the wife simply resents the closeness between mother and son, then that's just twisted. I also find it quite ironic how she expressed her devotion for her baby, but resents that same level of intimacy between her husband and his mother. Very amusing.