Mat Pulo Rai

Simran is the key message of Gurbani, we learn what dasam duaar is, what unhand shabad is, what the punj choor are and there dutys, what this body is made of and how we detach from Maya, but it all comes back to meditation

Think you mean more will be killed in a peaceful movement, to be honest it depends if your ok with being a second class citizen, like Sant Jarnail Singh used to say.

Often to get picked for committees you have to be in with some uncle already in the committee, which means they know where you stand, or will try to see if your pro there agenda or not. As for people out side the membership its close to impossible to get in, in southall getting in to the committee is more about how many people you know, less about what you stand for. So good luck with that As for mergers I think thats a great concept, I must have talked to mate about this a few years ago. During the early 1800's the full moon would be a time for the sangat to get together, so in-effect there used to be 1 gurdwara per district, my history isnt to strong on this but isnt it because of Cast systems and lack of representation for other casts people Like Ravi Dassi's opened there own Gurdwaras due to the committees being monopolised by Jaths.

What beautiful about VaheGurus game is that there is one fix for everything, i mean everything, you dont need to do certain things to tackle certain problems. Guru Shaibs have said, that in the sangat of the Sadhs the a Crow like mind (full of sin) can slowly be transformed too a Swan which is a full of Devi Guns (clean mind frame, without anger lust pride and so on) All one needs to do is Simir (meditate) this is the weapon that we have been given by guru shaib to tackle the Punj Choor which corrupt our minds in to feeling anger lust pride and so on. So 1st step is to do ardas to Sat Guru to help with stopping Smoking. 2nd. Start waking before you go to collage and do 15-30 mins simran, really the amount we should be doing to really stave off attacks from Kaal is 4-5 hours a day. 3rd when you feeling anger do simran and concentrate on that sound Vaheguru sravanee suneeai rasanaa gaaeeai hiradhai dhiaaeeai soee | Hear with your ears, and sing with your tongue, and meditate within your Mind on Him. 4th Try go to the gurdwara and find sangat that are following this path, this maybe harder than it sounds, due to youngsters not always knowing what to do them selfs, you just have to try and test the friendships and see if there on the path. If not then do seva in the langar as you will usually find people with love for Vaheguru here. But out of these things the action which will help in this world and the other is Simran, so try do about a hour a day.

The bit highlighted is the important thing which only comes with age and maturity, as we are in a day and age, too confident with our opinions, we take them as learned objective views, when really our concept of divinity is close to nil, and only based on the little research we have done, and not backed by Practical Avastas or Jeveen. As for what Guru jee says, we are in a time where everyone will have a opinion, whether that be a learned one or unlearned, they are called Mooraks who have not seen God or Heard God and try to explain the Game and Spiritual world he has created So that no human being will ever be confused, at the meaning of liberation, signs of Being Mukt are within Gurbani First we achieve mukti while alive and not when we pass jeevan mukath har paavai soe | They become Jivan-mukta, liberated while yet alive, and they find the Lord. These are the identifications of a Jevan Mukth nij ghar vasehi anmrith peevehi thaa sukh lehehi mehal |1| rehaao | Dwell within the home of your own inner being, and drink in the Ambrosial Nectar; you shall attain the Peace of the Mansion of His Presence. ||1||Pause|| athaareh sidhee pishai lageeaa firan nij ghar vasai nij thaae | The Siddhis-the eighteen supernatural spiritual powers-follow in my footsteps; I dwell in my True home, within my self. These people keep the True Rehath that Guru Amar Das jee left us dhasavai dhuaar rehath karae thribhavan sojhee paae |3| Doing the rehath of the Tenth gate, He obtains the understanding of the three worlds. ||3||

Yea these Punj are Monstress intellects, Gurbani says that they scheme while the mind has left this Boby, too how to keep the curroption new and intresting to the mind so that it doesnt become aware of there doings.

This is answered by Guru Arjan Dev Ji nainahu needh par dhrisatt vikaar | The eyes are asleep in corruption, gazing upon the beauty of another. And Baghat Kabeer Ji nainoo nakattoo sravanoo rasapath eindhree kehiaa n maanaa |1| The eyes, nose, ears, tongue and sensory organs of touch do not obey any order. ||1|| baabaa ab n baso eih gaao | O father, now I shall not live in this village.

Do you know what it is to be jeven mukth, what would the signs be? As for the question Gurbani says yes you can be Jevan Mukt, gurbani calls it living Dead. jeevath marai marai fun jeevai thaa mokhanthar paaeae | But if he remains dead while yet alive, then by so dying, he truly lives; thus, he attains liberation.

2 Hours late But May Guru Jee Bless us all Happy Viaskhi

Thats all i wanted to know, Bhai shaib thanks for clearing that up, I always said people may have differing views, and i respect each and everyone, but i will have to say that when Sant Isher Singh Jee says that Rana Janak was merged thats the truth I believe. Fateh Jee

Benji this is what Guru Arjan Dev je says about rituals pourree | Pauree: naa thoo aavehi vas bahuth ghinaavanae | No one can bring You under control, by despising the world. naa thoo aavehi vas baedh parraavanae | No one can bring You under control, by studying the Vedas. nw qU Awvih vis qIriQ nweIAY ] naa thoo aavehi vas theerath naaeeai | No one can bring You under control, by bathing at the holy places. naa thoo aavehi vas dharathee dhaaeeai | No one can bring You under control, by wandering all over the world. naa thoo aavehi vas kithai siaanapai | No one can bring You under control, by any clever tricks. naa thoo aavehi vas bahuthaa dhaan dhae | No one can bring You under control, by giving huge donations to charities. sabh ko thaerai vas agam agocharaa | Everyone is under Your power, O inaccessible, unfathomable Lord. thoo bhagathaa kai vas bhagathaa thaan thaeraa |10| You are under the control of Your devotees; You are the strength of Your devotees. ||10|| The main point here is that God is under the control of his Loving devotes, so how do we become "Loved one" of Guru Shaib, jo saas giraas dhiaaeae maeraa har har so gurasikh guroo man bhaavai | One who meditates on my Lord, Har, Har, with every breath - that GurSikh becomes pleasing to the Guru's Mind.

Lets say i didn't misunderstand sant jee and i was right, would that be enough for you to believe that People before Guru Nanak reached Sachkand, or after hearing Sant jees audio would you still doubt it. Im willing to do the opposite.

Edited, wrong post

Dont see how this shows the extent of my attained knowledge, but he was the Raja of Treta Jug. I think the more pressing issue and the one that will define, whether we are on the same page is Do you doubt Sant Isher Singh jee, if so who do you reference. This is not to cause a rift, as i know many people within Sikhi make there own views according to what makes sense to them. But im one which believes that my intelligence is not on Par with Guru Shaib and so look to there Sants, Gurmukhs for guidance.

I understand fully that you belive that No one before Guru Nanak Dev could reach Vaheguru, But I totally disagree, not due to my own intelligence telling me , rather that Gurbani states this also that Sant Isher Singh has said in his katha that Raja Janak was 1 with God, the term is called Brahm Giaani, only someone that has merged with God can be given this status, any other Avasta have their own names but the Highest is GurMukh/Brahm Giaani, Ive read the post which you linked in which Kulbir singh gives examples, sorry but he is wrong due to the nature of understanding of Guru Bani, one can only fully understand what Gurbani is saying if one has Bibek Budh, which is attained once we reach Sant avasta, which is Unhadh Shabad, Amrit Raas and Seehj, The avasta is stated in Gurbani, Gurbani is Kooj of Akath and is called Akath Katha, and this is the stage which you need to be too give full and the right explanations of Sat Gur Bani. igAwnu iDAwnu Duin jwxIAY AkQu khwvY soie ] giaan dhiaan dhun jaaneeai akath kehaavai soe As this Bani is compiled from Sachkhand is called Maha Purkhs Ki Bani, those Maha Purchs vasa is within Niigh Khaar The reason I gave Sant Isher singhs reference was due that fact he had Met Seen and could Hear Vaheguru at all times, and he has full understanding of Sat Gurus Bani So if there is anyone here that reached this avasta then im Balahaar, and will take anything you say as Gospel.

@Kaal and people who think that no one reached Vaheguru or Sachkand before Guru Nanak is wrong, God sent many GurMukhs before he sent Guru Nanak Dev Jee who cemented the Daram of Such and left us with Dhan Guru Granth Shiab I only have to give 1 example out of 10+ thats Raja Janak he was Brahm Giaani (my source is Sant Isher Singh), according to Guru Arjan Dev Jee, Brahm Giiani is one who has Merged With VaheGuru, there isnt a higher Avasta than this. If anyone wants more examples and where it says within Gurbani that people had reached Sach Kandh before Guru Nanak Dev Jee, ill happily reply.

Bhai Shaib where do I start, do you know mannerisms are not a indication of your respect towards a person, many people during the times of Guru shaibs were considered abrupt and cold, yet there avastas where of Sants, I think startling peoples character has nothing to do with Sikhi or furtherment of one’s personality, as for respect, as long as people aren’t being obnoxious or rude then people have the right to act/talk how they want.

Think the person in the Sahki is in question, I very much doubt it’s the same Bhai Gurdas Jee who wrote the Vara, though I tend not to listen to stories on Guru Jee or Bhagats that arent from Guru Granth Shaib or a solid source like Sant Isher Singh Jee. Though Sakia do play a part in our development in understanding morals and a good character, again, 1. These are open to debate due to ones intelligent development 2. Personal opinions shaped by education, people and literature, as you can see for yourself this forum is full of a 100 different opinions for the same story and action. That’s why the moral code is very simple/clear. Also on the flip, even if you haven’t heard one Sakhi in your life, been highly educated or educated at all both can Meet Vaheguru, all that is needed, is to follow the teachings of someone who has practically passed through Bav Sagar in too Niijh Ghaar, there called Sants, Sadhus, Bhagats Gurmukhs, Brahm Giaanis in Guru Granth Shaib. maadho sathasangath saran thumaaree | O Lord, I seek the Sanctuary of the company of Your Saints; mil sathasangath param padh paaeiaa aatham raam rehiaa bharapoor</strong> |1| rehaao | Joining True Congregation, I have obtained the supreme status. The Lord, the Supreme Soul, is all-pervading. ||1||Pause||

The moral of the story is that even if you spend all your days with Sat Guru Guru Granth Shaib Jee and havent given your self to there teachings then this will be your Faith. This is what Guru Arjan Dev Jee says is raag bhairo mehalaa 5 avar oupaav sagal mai dhaekhae jo chithaveeai thith bigaras kaaj |1| rehaao | I have seen all other sorts of efforts; whatever you can think of, will only bring failure. ||1||Pause|| thaakur shodd dhaasee ko simarehi manamukh andh agiaanaa | The blind, ignorant, self-willed manmukhs forsake their Lord and Master, and dwell on His slave Maya. har kee bhagath karehi thin nindhehi nigurae pasoo samaanaa |2| They slander those who worship their Lord; they are like beasts, without a Guru. ||2|| I'll add more to this discussion later on.

Mind has no cast color creed and is the player which Vaheguru has sent to Earth to play the Game vs Kaam Kroad Lob Mou Hankar, so the answer is anyone can win this Game and return to there true home (Nihj Kaar) but whos going to tell you how defeat these Punj, Gurbani says only Sat Guru and his Sants/Gurmukhs/Brahm Giaanis know the full Piadh (Knowledge) how to defeat these vices also, Naam (unhand bani) which is the only way to get mukthi is obtained from Sat Guru, and Sat Gurus are instated by God bin sathigur ko naao n paaeae prabh aisee banath banaaee hae |9| Without the Sat Guru, no one finds the Name. Such is the making which God has made. ||9|| bin sathigur kinai n paaeiaa kar kar thakae veechaar Without the True Guru, no one finds the Lord. People have grown weary of thinking about it bin sathigur kihu n dhaekhiaa jaae | Without the True Guru, the Lord cannot be seen. gur saevaa thae har naam paaeiaa bin sathigur koe n paavaniaa |1| Serving the Guru, the Lord's Name is obtained. Without the True Guru, no one can receive it. ||1|| So there is no barrier for anyone Sikh Muslim Hindu or other to Meet Vaheguru, but he can only be found through whoever Vaheguru instates Sat Guru.

According to Gurbani anyone with enough will and effort can reach levels of Ridh Sidh also lower level of Unhadh Shabad (ones which are heard in Dev Loog) This is the same avasta the Sidhs had which Guru Nanak Dev Jee met in the mountains (written in Sidh Ghoast) but they are not mukth as you can only achieve mukti once you reached Unhadh Bani which is heard from the gates of Vaheguru. Mukti is the 1st stage of Bhagthi, there is much more after. You can listen to Sant Isher Singhs Jees Audios he explains what stages he went through before he Met Vaheguru.

1st Naam isnt given by Punj piaria there duty is writen within guru granth shaib jee This is the duty according to Guru Nanak Dev Jee so gur karo j saach dhrirraavai | akath kathaavai sabadh milaavai | har kae log avar nehee kaaraa | Guru Nanak Dev jee in this pangti has said make him your Guru -Whos shows you the True Form of God, (also Guru Arjan dev jee says this is what Guru Raam Das jee done for him) -Tells you the story of creation, Vahegurus game and attaches you with Shabad (Unhadh shabad) -As God's people have no other work to do This is the definition of Punj Piaaria Now this is the duty of the Punj Piaaria, the duty of Sat Guru is to give you Naam bin sathigur ko naao n paaeae prabh aisee banath banaaee hae |9| Without the Sat Guru, no one finds the Name. Such is the making which God has made. ||9|| Now many people out of respect would not think to try judge any punj piaaria, But keep in mind Guru Nanak Dev Jee used to say dont believe in me untill i can prove to you who I am say I am, the way he used to was through practical teachings which people would follow and then reach a practical Avasta or by showing them Bhruhm Joot (Gods light from inside) which would have been enough for people to believe this was the right path. So any person that puts him self forward for one of the Punj Piaaria should have this avasta where he can see God, hear God and tell you the full story of the Game and Vaheguru.

Our religion is based on Avasta and Avasta only, Guru Nanak Dev Jee only gave permission to Guru Angand dev Jee to continue parchaar because he had threw Guru Nanaks practicle teachings Seen and Merged back with Akaal Purkh. Teachers in our religion are that who have won against Kaal/Punj Choor and have found their True Home, Everyone else is a False teacher. igAwnu iDAwnu Duin jwxIAY AkQu khwvY soie ] giaan dhiaan dhun jaaneeai akath kehaavai soe | Giaan means Knowledge Dhiaan means 100% Concentration Dhun means Naam (aka Unhand Shabad this is 1st heard at the gates of God) Akath means Vaheguru (that which is indescribable) So what Gurbani clearly stated is that only one with this Avasta can do Katha of Akaal Purkh, and as 99% of people haven't achieved this avasta they talk about God with no real idea of who they are preaching about and, as in the case have given, convert so easily.

:D

Beautiful video baji thanks for sharing, question which Ragi is it doing Asa Di Vaar