BABBAR KHALISTANI

Hindus want to hamper every progress that we make coz of their sheer nature of jealousy and hatred towards sikhi right from the time of Satguru Nanak Patshah. Recently they falsely complained about Major Sandhu's show "Munda Southall Da" on MATV sky channel 793 that he had said on show that all hindus should be killed. The show was banned for some time before the investigation into the matter finished and bore no credibility and hence the show was allowed back on air again. They want to nip our every effort in the bud that aims at strenghthening sikhs and sikhi either lawfully or unlawfully as they are doing in india. It's high time we learn something from these very small events happening around us.

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2007/20070606/punjab1.htm#3 Bhindranwale never wanted Khalistan, claims Indian envoy Varinder Walia Tribune News Service Amritsar, June 5 Amritsar-born Indian Ambassador to Madagascar Daljit Singh Pannun, who had made efforts to avert Operation Bluestar by mediating between Sant Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale and the union government, has said certain forces had played mischief and misguided Indira Gandhi that led to the Army operation in June 1984. This was despite the fact that the firebrand sant had agreed to initiate dialogue to resolve the deadlock. The exclusive interview with Pannun assumes significance since he had put his life in danger in resolving the vexed Punjab problem. The Indian envoy has also given first-hand information about the talks between Central government and Bhindranwale in “Cannon unto Canon”, brought out by Singh Brothers, which is yet to be released. “I was pushed to talk to Sant Bhindranwale at Akal Takht. It wasn't my personal effort, rather I was pushed into it by a large number of friends, including the then senior-most officer of the government of Punjab, S.S.Sidhu, who was the de facto ruler of the state.” The Indian envoy said he was kept in the dark about the impending Army operation by the vested interests, otherwise many innocent lives could have been saved. He said he worked out some details with Sant Bhindranwale and it looked so simple and straight. “We had an informal and frank exchange of views. The book by Pannun reads that “the dialogue with Sant Bhindranwale was conducted in such warm and cordial atmosphere that he called for Rooh Afza which was arranged by Baba Thara Singh and we took it”. “I remember I mooted the proposal that Indira Gandhi shall speak to the nation and appeal for peace and normalcy in the country, particularly in Punjab, and elaborate that all problems afflicting the state shall be resolved through mutual discussions,” Pannun said and added that he wanted the sant to respond to this appeal by announcing that he would wait for a month and shall persuade his followers and others to keep their guns without bullets during this period. The envoy said he had proposed a period of four weeks for the same (while he wanted just one week), which they hammered out to 10 days. Pannun asked Sant Bhindranwale that if some mishap took place, Indira Gandhi would not name that it was done by your men. The sant, however, sought commitment from Pannu that the Central government would stop torturing Sikh youths during captivity. Pannu claimed that Sant Bhindranwale was keen that this plan should not be sabotaged. The documentation of the reports sent to the Central government before Operation BlueStar reads, “We ended this meeting in utmost cordiality, understanding and were happy at the outcome. In fact I found there was nothing that would frighten the Government of India and anyone else. Pannu claimed that Bhindranwale had repeatedly told him that he did not want Khalistan. He said Sant Bhindranwale told him that “I don’t want Khalistan but they would give it on a platter to me”. He said the sant was “grossly misunderstood” and had he been tackled with honestly and consideration, Operation Bluestar would have never taken place.

waheguru.....why no week passes off without hearing such stories??.........i m sick of it now...can't ignore it coz i m a sikh and can't discuss it coz everyone says "oh i know, these are just few stupid girls" or "yeah heard a lot, but it is good innit we get rid of all the crap from sikhi" good at making excuses but no-one tries to do anything....there are few other guys like raju, british sikh lad and killah etc on this forum who are well versed with this problem and try to point out to sangat but are not welcomed by the 'peaceful' sangat .. if ppl like me point towards the root cause cause from their quran, hadiths and sharia then we are labelled as "full of hate", if we encourage ppl to read muslims, judge their mentality and be careful of their tactics we are called anti-muslims and no one listens to us...... i remember a few days back when someone highlighted the sarabha blogspot sumone on this forum had problem with the blog...why???? coz it made their blood boil and stirred up hatred...... doesn't ur blood boil now when when ur amritdaari sisters are being brainwashed??? U have right to question if someone tries to spread mis information but why cricticise if we just propogate truth albeit sensitive in nature...... if one sikh walks in right direction there are 10 pulling him back so how can u stop things from getting worse???. NOW MY VIEWS: I suspect it to be some 'love affair' thing and subsequent brainashing. Who is the muslim and his family with whom the girl seeked refuge ???? It's not easy to brainwash a practicing singhni and convert her and take her away from her family and society....i think it's the spell of 'love' not islam that has blinded her......just my foolish assumptions. Waheguru known the best- the all knowing lord. Waheguru bhali kare......just do ur bit do ur bit, do the chaupai sahab path and ardaas for singhni.

This was my first time i had got to be a part of this rally. It was wicked. Though i was quite late but i managed to catch a jatha who were being troubled by police and were arguing. Guess who were they??? BABBAR KHALSA singhs , i said " lao aah tan gall ban gayee" after being searched by police we were let to proceed. A bhai sahab told me tht there were a few informers as well. They were doing c.i.d for police, and honestly police was quite suspicious as well they searched singhs and belongings of singhs as well as a singhni's baby thingi (donno what u call it in which kids are laid and driven around, in panjabi we call it baggi). Chalo , then we proceeded and raised jaikaras and we had a nice march through central london, though i wasn't happy with a few slogans, how the hell would goras understand "babbar khalsa zindabad" "jagtar singh hawara zindabad" "bhai wadhawa singh ji zindabad" and other thousand non engilsh slogans??. Anyway things at trafalgar square were good. And forgot to mention my relatives had also come over from leeds so i got to meet them as well. My cousin was telling me tht this time turnout was quite low as compared to previous years. Anyway still it was good. The speech by that gora postman, kuljeet kaur penji, dhadi sahab's daughter and other people were good. The video presentations on the giant screen were informative. A CONCERN: Though Trafalgar square seemd full, how many sikhs were there?? Maybe 2000 or at the most 3000. Now what came in my mind was : From about 550,000 sikhs could only 3000 sikhs manage to turn up to show their concern and solidarity for the most important event in modern sikh history??. I think the turnout at an average mela or gurdas mann show would have been much more than what it was at the square. It really ashamed me to think what were other 99% uk sikhs??? or don't they care anymore about ghallughara, human rights abuses, our genocide and our future aim of khalistan??? we also need to show to our people as well other than the outsiders. BUT few suggestions: Things were good by our standards but guys we are still lagging far behind the mark in reaching a wider audience to get our message across. We need to raise the level of our presentation and make it more organised. Things didn't seemed to be co-ordinated. Sangat from leeds left early and others at different times. Can't all ppl come and leave at the same time and make event look more presentable and organised. And we need to be more explanatory as well. I doubt would goras or the visitors have understood what was that all about or each and everything??? Anyway still very very well done to all the organisers and the participating sangat for coming and making our presence felt and at least showing that we still haven't forgotten the past. Lets hope we all sit down, analyse our mistakes and flaws and overcome them to make next gathering a memorable one. Bhul chuk maaf

Paaji i wont comment nything on divine amrit and panj pyaare. All it's gonna do is lead to a massive debate off-topic. As for me i don't have any hunkaar at all, all i have problem is with ppl giving out judgements own their own , as u can read in my first post i didn't give out judgement on any issue i just advised her to read bani and lead gursikhi life and leave rest on waheguru to wash away her sins or not. Sincere apologies for any offence caused. Bhul Chuk Maaf

What problem do u have wiv ppl qouting bani? I'v heard parcharaks saying repeatedly tht coz we don't take direction of our life from bani and in accordance with gurmat, we become manmukhs and stray from the sikhi path. Isn't it right to discuss things in the light of gurbani so that we can give the best possible advice to ppl rather than from our own matt which might not always be in the line with gurmat. I normally don't use bani in my posts but the reason i quoted from bani was to make my advice as close to gurmat as possible coz it refers to sumone's real life.

First of all we all need to be careful coz there are always topics of such nature posted which are absolutely FALSE like there was another topic in gupt section where some singh posted that he's losing faith from sikhism coz he'd allegedly been sexually exploited by his dad and brother(if i m not wrong). That person started the topic and then didn't reply, maybe coz he might have started the topic for some fun wiv sikhs. I feel that was the best example of dodgy post. The person not only degraded sikhs but also potrayed faith in sikhi to be weak. There are lot of ppl who infilitrate our forums and create a bad impression of our people among us to dent our psyche big time so that our faith in sikhi can be weakened so that we might think about converting to some other faith. We simply need to be careful before fully believing topics of such high sensitivity. Anyway if this topic is actually a reality then listen KAUR : u haven't lost a match that u can avenge by winning the next one. U have committed a Bajjar Kurehit (unpardonable sin i guess). And for those of you who have previously posted and have guaranteed this bibi that since she has taken amrit guruji will forgive her sins plz don't give out judgements by your own manmat. It's not as easy as some guys have posted. ਭਰੀਐ ਹਥੁ ਪੈਰੁ ਤਨੁ ਦੇਹ ॥ भरीऐ हथु पैरु तनु देह ॥ Bẖarī­ai hath pair ṯan ḏėh. When the hands and the feet and the body are dirty, ਪਾਣੀ ਧੋਤੈ ਉਤਰਸੁ ਖੇਹ ॥ पाणी धोतै उतरसु खेह ॥ Pāṇī ḏẖoṯai uṯras kẖėh. water can wash away the dirt. ਮੂਤ ਪਲੀਤੀ ਕਪੜੁ ਹੋਇ ॥ मूत पलीती कपड़ु होइ ॥ Mūṯ palīṯī kapaṛ ho­ė. When the clothes are soiled and stained by urine, ਦੇ ਸਾਬੂਣੁ ਲਈਐ ਓਹੁ ਧੋਇ ॥ दे साबूणु लईऐ ओहु धोइ ॥ Ḏė sābūṇ la­ī­ai oh ḏẖo­ė. soap can wash them clean. ਭਰੀਐ ਮਤਿ ਪਾਪਾ ਕੈ ਸੰਗਿ ॥ भरीऐ मति पापा कै संगि ॥ Bẖarī­ai maṯ pāpā kai sang. But when the intellect is stained and polluted by sin, ਓਹੁ ਧੋਪੈ ਨਾਵੈ ਕੈ ਰੰਗਿ ॥ ओहु धोपै नावै कै रंगि ॥ Oh ḏẖopai nāvai kai rang. it can only be cleansed by the Love of the Name. By taking amrit u have devoted yourself to guru, u have made a pledge to guru to walk on gursikhi way and it's now you dedication and devotion to gursikhi that will decide your future not the sikh sangat posts.......ur past sins do count, they have polluted your intellect and only you can wash them. And ur mentioned sin aint the ordinary one it's bajjar kurehit. Now the final judgement can and will only be passed by waheguru whether or not to forgive you. Your task is cut out: Naam, bani and gursikhi jeevan. As for ur relationship wiv this guy marriage might be good for you but i'm not sure abt that guy who's a gursikh. Therefore u better ask a gyani, if not face to face then call anonymously to gurughar and take advice from gyani ji or from some learned gursikhs.

Can u plz enlighten me as well on the 'agendas' of radio stations.

I feel if ur mind is immersed ....not immersed actually that's a quite high avastha..... but if ur mind's devoted to guru and gurbani the music and films etc just don't taste good anymore instead u shun them as they make u feel uncomfortable and ashamed from inside coz deep down you know this is anti gurmat and ur mind wouldn't allow u anymore to watch this 'koor'.

The last post was by me .Sorry, didn't log in coz was in a bit of hurry. Anyway doesn't matter if she's a sikh anymore but surely u can help her be god conscious for her betterment at least. As u wrote last time that u'd helped her give up meat/alcohol.... but does that make sense as meat and alcohol are allowed in christianity? I personally feel she can't develop spiritually to our desired levels or sikhi levels by remaining a christian coz they have so relax laws and meat,alcohol sex etc are not major restrictions and she's (i assume) been brought up in a lax atmosphere as a christian. But still u can help her change and be a better human at least....who knows maybe she can return back to her roots??? Bhul chuk muaaf

That gurdwara sahib where i go has a very 'moderate' commitee running it. There is very little effort to enforce sikhi laws. ppl roam abt wiv chappals in the kitchen and uncovered head in langar hall. The commitee members simply turn a blind eye. And there is no panthic parchar, not even a single word on our sufferings, our human rights abuses, the genocides, the morchas, the shaheeds and nothing about our aim to free khalistan. Recently on vaisakhi they invited some deputy mayor guy who was gujju anad he gave his stupid lecture in hindi and gujrati which was nothing about gurbani and all about our 'hindustani' culture and patroitism. The <banned word filter activated> even said something like sikhs are no diferent from hindus. I simply feel very frustrated but who cares?? our golaks should be full. How can such parchaar produce gursikhs???

I talked to ma mate yest in bathinda and he mentioned me this incident of a singh being caught but i thought maybe it was a rumor coz no media hasn't reportd it yet . I am upset by the way how media simply sides against sikhs and doesn't report unbiased. Nothing much has been reported abt shaheed kamaljeet singh as well, though they are quick to report everything about dera had there been a braman killed in the whole process, the centre govt wud have come running but not even a single word for sikhs who are suffering.

Aint nishan sahib the one in front of gurdwara sahib? I just want a the flag bit (massive one) from the whole unit. Later on i'll get "khalistan zindabad" inscribed in it. Does anyone know where can i get one? I'll also ask my gurdwara sahib ppl coz they had changed the nishan sahib on vaisakhi. Yes it will also serve as statement that khalistanis are still alive nd they can get u anywhere...... there r not some indian blacklisted middle aged ppl but also the youth of today who absolutely love khalistan. We haven't got our own media but still we can use the world media by various means and send a messaege to india. Now don't say i m an extremist coz i m not gonna shout anti-hindu or anti-india rants over there i'll be cheering for monty and harbhajan singh, they both aint perfect sikhs but still worth supporting.

They do this in various forms..... though i don't watch bollwood anymore but still try and keep a check on their anti sikh activities. Even in trailers and songs of movies you can watch turbaned sikhs doing stupid dance. My mates are big movie fans, i was told by them and later watched dvd (fake one!!!!) of film 'kabhi alvida na kehna' in which a sikh woman from chandigarh was potrayed as having a big backside and amitabh bachan taunts her in the whole movie by naming her backside as chandigarh and mentioning abt it quite frequently in whole film. I dont remember the whole story now but it was pretty offending.

We constantly find ourselves being bashed and mocked by indian media and bollywood, infact in my opinion we are most bashed and mocked community in the world by indian media but still we hardly do anything to raise awareness. Instead we flock to watch filthy bollywood movies, spending our hard earned money and feed the same filth to our kids, let them watch their favourite khans and then blame everyone but ourselves when our daughters run with real life khans. We prefer wasting money on filth rather than use it as daswand or donating for gurbani parchar. As a result of our gross negligence and propoganda of indian media the after-effects are easily visible in our society. Dastaars are fastly being replaced by bollywood haircuts.Sardars are so much ridiculed and mocked by indian media that youngsters dont have that confidence to carry their identity and prefer chopping off their joora and blend in the mainstream rather then being seen as the charactes of santa-banta jokes. Traditional dresses have paved way for bollywood fashion. Girls do their threading, waxing stuff more than ever.They cut and colour their hair like bollywood heroines rather than dressing up as sikh daughters. Oh how can i forget these aunties who prefer kitty parties to satsangs, like dressing up in sarees and bindis like hindu women rather wear decent and simple attire. Bolywood and hindi tv serial lifestyle is taking over the traditional panjabi or sikh lifestyle. In this atmosphere are the kids are raised who can relate more to being hindus than sikhs. Believe it or not at places like chandigarh ppl proudly prefer speaking hindi than panjabi coz hindi represents high class mindset whereas panjabi is thought to be pendu or desi language. Gatka or has nearly perished in our life apart from nagar kirtans and has been replaced by bhangra and booze. Shashtar vidya has been replaced by fashion schools and modelling agencies in panjab. Well, but everyone is not like us. Muslims, i aint sure if are mocked or bashed by indian media and bollywood at such a large scale as us but they take strong objection to bollywood. Bollywood movies are although banned in pakistan but reach there on release date ...thanx to piracy. And now pakistanis are beginning to feel the effects of this filth in their society. They also feel bollywood and hindu culture is creeping in and corrupting their society. They feel their youth is being driven away from religion and culture by bollywood. Even their religious parcharaks mention these things to their masses and make them aware repeatedly. They feel the effect in a different nation whereas our ppl sitting in same country watch movies with their families and turn a blind eye- shame on us. Here are two videos that i came across that they have made for awareness of their community especially youth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d6r9u1gOUU...ted&search= After watching these videos ask yourself: don't these videos relate more to us? Shouldn't we've made these these videos long time before? Haven't we failed badly yet again on another issue? And how long will it continue?

One thing we done terribly wrong is not to have moved ahead with the time. We are not using media and technology for parchaar of sikhi. So much money but no single sikhi tv channel for parchaar, no sikh news channel to present our viewpoint, no newspaper to raise awareness among our masses, no free gurbani literature for ppl in villages, no missionaries to preach gurmat in this dark age . How many international level parcharaks we have? Even our gurdwaras have fake granthis who can't even recite proper gurbani. Our parcharaks can't do parchar to our own kids in west coz they can't speak english. If there are any good parcharaks they aren't treated well by committees. Then come parents who don't infuse sikh values in their kids and let them have their way which lets them drift away from religion. Then our foremost body sgpc is malfunctioning coz of political pressure and under the control of enemies. They,ve got tons of money but no brains and guts to spend it for sikhi. As a result of that ppl are drifting away from sikh values. Majority of them go to deras, pakhandis, pandits, peers. The fault lies on us from top to bottom. And on top of everything we have loads of enemies with venemous agendas like rss, arya samaj, shiv sena, vhp and indian govt who want to dissolve sikhi and we are busy drinking and doing bhangra. Boys shedding their hair is also a result of these above problems. We aren't simply prepared and equipped to deal with this wave of 'moderisation' which is sweeping everyone. Bollywood or fashion is effecting not only our youth but our culture as well, often boys get the blame for cutting hair because it most visible but do we ever blame girls for threading etc, do we blame aunties for following kitty party culture, wearing bindis,dressing up as hindu women, following useless hindu rituals and adopting their lifestyle through their movies and their tv serials or their media. The worst thing in the whole matter is that we are simply not ready to do anything. If we look at muslims or pakistanis they are more concerned abt the hindu culture corrupting their youth and society than us. Repeatedly their parcharaks mention abt this to their society to stay away from hindu culture and not let it affect them though they live in a different country where bollywood movies are illegal but we live in same country and get mocked and still dont care.

Ready for what? War? Anyway, what is wrong about Punjabis converting to Christianity? Why are you so worried about Punjabis converting anyway? Shouldn't you be more worried about Sikhs converting instead? The reason i m worried abt panjabis converting is coz as per their own website figures 63% of panjabis are sikhs and their target for year 2007 is 125,000 so that means if it's accomplished nearly 78,000 of them are gonna be sikhs. As for conversion i have no problem if these people read gurmat first and then analyse christianity and if they feel christianity is better for them then it's cool but the problem is that most manmukhs feel what they are currently following is sikhi when actually they don't give it a chance. And ready for....yes a war of a kind, an undeclared ideological war luring people with salvation, happiness etc and sometimes also with money and generally people whom society calls low caste fall prey either for money or to get rid of their low status or for a mix of both. Why should Punjabis give Sikhi a chance? Should Punjabis also give Hinduism and Islam a chance as well? Like I said before, you should worry about the Sikh community and let the Punjabis worry about their community. U shud remember tht panjabis are not aliens infact 63% of them are sikhs and they shud give genuine sikhi (not the manmukh version they follow) a chance first by reading gurbani and sikh ideology and then comparing it against christianity. Same goes for other communities to read their religious philosophies thoroughly before thinking abt leaving them. I am not begging other panjabis to give sikhi a chance before christianity...u guys got it wrong. Most ppl in india who convert have least idea abt their own religion and usually succumb to the tricky and luring parchar. My idea is tht these ignorant ppl shud not fall in the trap of misleading, clever and false parchar of other religions like christianity, islam who believe in exclusiveness of their religions and think only people from their religions attain salavtion and think that only their religions are true and the rest are false.

wah! u soorbir babber sher! be careful, those indian fans might attack u with their chappels Shame on u guys......if that's the case i 'll definitely go. Y r u guys so pessimistic? tu ja mera sher! jakay panth da naam roshan kar! Hahaaahaahahahaha......lolz u cracked me up man......bapus in pind talk like this when sum youngsta act stubborrn.

I was gonna go anyway to watch the match coz i m a cricket fan and i've been to may matches here in london and in panjab (mohali) but this time i wanted to do sumting different, maybe carry a khalistani flag. I don't see anything wrong in it or is it wrong?

wah! u soorbir babber sher! be careful, those indian fans might attack u with their chappels Shame on u guys......if that's the case i 'll definitely go. Y r u guys so pessimistic?

Why the hell would you want to take a Khalistani flag to an Indian cricket match? Don't try to bring politics into sports, man. You're looking for trouble if you end up bringing a khalstani flag at that cricket match. What exactly are you trying to prove here? Don’t be surprise if someone ends up fighting you because of the flag. What do you mean my politics? Don't people bring flags inside the stadiums. Anyone can take their flag.....i am passionate about khalistan and i don't think khalistan flag is banned in u.k. As for fighting it's <admin-profanity filter activated> for tat.

Oval allow everything like flags,drums, fancy dresses, vigs etc whereas lord's doesnt allow it coz of their tradition.

Ready for what? War? Anyway, what is wrong about Punjabis converting to Christianity? Why are you so worried about Punjabis converting anyway? Shouldn't you be more worried about Sikhs converting instead? The reason i m worried abt panjabis converting is coz as per their own website figures 63% of panjabis are sikhs and their target for year 2007 is 125,000 so that means if it's accomplished nearly 78,000 of them are gonna be sikhs. As for conversion i have no problem if these people read gurmat first and then analyse christianity and if they feel christianity is better for them then it's cool but the problem is that most manmukhs feel what they are currently following is sikhi when actually they don't give it a chance. And ready for....yes a war of a kind, an undeclared ideological war luring people with salvation, happiness etc and sometimes also with money and generally people whom society calls low caste fall prey either for money or to get rid of their low status or for a mix of both.

Hey folks have a look at this one and know about the plans to convert panjabis. A question that arises here is : Are panjabis ready to deal with all this. No wonder why so many schools like sacred heart, st joseph etc are opening in panjab. Have a look. www.igniteindia.org

Whens the Match? Whats the Ticket Price?! If all Is well, Id take a crowd down with Flags...can cheer Monty at the same time :devil: The one at oval starts is 0n 9-13 aug but first 3 days are sold out tickets are available for 4th and 5th days http://www.surreycricket.com/tickets/international-matches/ At lord's tickets are available for 4th day but the problem is tht they dont allow flags and other equipment. So oval's the best bet if sumone's serious. I'd love to support england nd monty.