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Only 5 this is what I meant that both forms are same Nirankaar Aakaar Api Nirgun Sargun Ek, Ekahi Ek Bakhanno, Nanak Ek Anek Anyway I know your trying to express your views but do you know what sargun worship of akal purakh is? (I bet you do it all the time) If you haven't then why debate on something you don't know much about. I know a saint and many bhagats that did worship of sargun saroop and their names are well known to the panth to this day! Also when the gurus and avtars came to the world everyone bowed to them and that is sargun worship as well. Doing chaur sahib, doing mata tekna to sri guru granth sahib to sri guru granth sahib is sargun worship. Don't get put of between sargun and nirgun worship both are same. One who gets gian on sargun saroop will get gian eventually on nirgun saroop. Also if one gets gian on nirgun saroop then 1 will get gian on sargun saroop eventually as well. <edited : personal attacks and attacks on jathebandis won't be tolerated here> I am very fortunate to meet a person that whatever he says comes true, when I am with them my 5 evils get destroyed and with his help has attached me to sri guru granth sahib. Please read the 13th astpadhi of sukhmani sahib. Also a brahmgiani can give naam. As they have authority to do so.... As their avasta is: har harjan dohi ik he bib bechar kish nahe Jal te upaj tarang jeho jal he bike samai Like the water merges in to the ocean how can you tell them apart. Tui mui mui tui antar kesa I am you and you are me what difference is there waheguru mera me waheguru da I am yours, your mine Mohinder pal "Shorter the Gurmantar, More Quickly Seeker gets Success(Sidh of the Mantar. " I agree with you completely.

ਕਿਰਤਮਨਾਮਕਥੇਤੇਰੇਜਿਹਬਾ॥ ਸਤਿਨਾਮੁਤੇਰਾਪਰਾਪੂਰਬਲਾ॥ (੧੦੮੩) There is a great difference between kirtam naam (Allah, Ram, Khudaa) and Sat Naam (ie: "WaheGuru"). During Amrit Sinchar Sikhs are given "WaheGuru" mantar which is Akal Purakh Sahib's SatNaam, we are NOT given any kirtam naam at that time. The Hukam for Sikhs is to jap SatNaam (ie: "WaheGuru") as their Gurmantar. The above verse states that only SatNaam is Akal Purakh Sahib's PRIMAL and ORIGINAL NAAM - the same one the Panj Piyaray give to the Sikhs in the presence of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Naam is naam regardless of what you jap. Bhagat kabeer ji japped raam raam and still met waheguru. Obvioulsy as sikhs we will jaap waheguru but it doesn't mean the other names of waheguru are worth less..

It's called intellectual discussion...as Sikhs's we should be seekers of the truth...we should not be scared to discuss controversial topics...and resort to calling them "nindiya" because we may not like the content or even if it goes again our own particular viewpoints.

They who joined hands with the Kala-Afghanis in this protest are part of the same jundli that has supported and promoted Ragi Darshan in the past. They have branches in the East Coast and Southern California and continually misuse the Jatha's name. One of them runs the KhalsaSpirit.com website that promotes Anti-Sri Akal Takht Sahib and Ant-Sri Dasam Granth thought. See: http://www.khalsaspi...ikhAffairs.html and http://www.khalsaspi...IsnotObeyed.pdf These guys are a disgrace.

I fully agree with you, Bhai sahib. You have opened my eyes about this character Jasjit as he writes on Gurmatbibek in a diplomatic language, They bring disgrace to high ideals of jatha who have been part and parcel of panth and gave immense sacrifices.These people misuse misuse name of jatha.They have a different agenda that is harmful for panth.They are in fact chelras of kala afghana and Ragi darshan. some of them are misled persons.

This was in today's Ajitjalndhar.com in Amritsar news section http://www.ajitjalandhar.com/20100829/ Reported by Bohru Per news singh sahib Giani Gurbachan singh was addressing Sangat at Richmond Hill Gurudwara , New York. During his speech supporters Of excommunicated Gurbakhash Singh Kala afghana and prof Darshan singh asked some questions from Singh sahib. Singh sahib told that he will reply to their questions after he finishes his address to Sangat. But they continued to disrupt his speech. Unquote It is obvious and posted video proves that center of attack was Akal Takhat jathedar.Denigrators were disciples of kala afghana and Ragi Darshan. Behaviour of kala afghana thugs can never be justified. At personal level i have read posts of this Jasjit singh on Gurmatbibek forum.He is an anti akal takhat, anti Dasam bani and pro Darshan Ragi.One can easily make out by reading his posts.How can he claim to be a sarblohi and yet ridicule Dasam Bani as sarab loh and our shashters originate from there.His website shows full support for sharabi / kababi ragi darshan.How can he join hands with those nastiks who ridicule Naam simran practice of AKJ jatha. It is our duty as a sikh to expose such shady characters so that they do not mislead sangat.

<br /><br /><br />Gatka never saved anyone, it's a circus entertainment act to please crowds...definitely not a real warfare art. Why do people still insist on telling fairy tales...