H4RPAL

Beautiful. Thanks for sharing

If you have any more, please share them with us- That really was amazing! Thanks for sharing it

I also notice that the Nagar Keertan has not been advertised (so to speak) in other Gurdwaras in Coventry (or at least some of them)- I do not belive all the Gurdwaras participate in this one.

Great to see some good publicity for once- we could do with something like this in the Uk at the moment.

It ain't working (YET!!)

If that truly is the case, then everyone should get their wallets (or purses) out for Khalsa Aid. Has anyone got the details on hand to post on this thread as to how to make a donation?

I've got to say, I'm pretty amazed by these Americans- how do they train them to pull a trigger- surely such a complex operation is beyond the grasp of their intelligence

The way Gurdass Mann kisses up to terrorists like KPS Gill, I think I won't even bother wating my time watching this rubbish- I think (maybe, just maybe) I might even rather watch that Bollywood rubbish instead (just kidding)

Gurdwara

Perhaps they have ardaas earlier in the morning for the langar, before the official ardaas? (Do I make any sense whatsoever there?). Also, is it not the case that at the time of Si Guru Amardass Ji, that before anyone could enter the divan to meet with him, they first had to eat langar? This would suggest it would be ok, wouldn't it? I do not know- :wub: Thanks- I think youv'e confused me too!!

I have a question about point number 4- is it true Guru Nanak once got a "silly string" tied by his sister, although he did explain at the time such rituals were useless? I know some who participate in the "silly string" festival as a result of this, and link the tying of "silly strings" to the fact that Waheguru is the real protector of all, and thus through the symbol, a deeper representation, and meaning is give to the process of "silly string" tying. Is it also the case that Sikh warriors in the past used to get "silly strings" tied to their weapons again to show Waheguru is the real protector? :T: Just to make it clear, I am not challenging any views or anything- I just have a few questions that I would like to be answered, also I like writing "silly string" in messages ( I have just discovered this about myself- It was kind of a revelation!) :wub:

The thing I believe laest is that even when all have become beggars, when the ego of all should be shattered, such things still happen. I know this would sound rather unfair, and many people would disagree, I just which there was a way I could channel my own donations to the real needy- the ones whos need would have shattered the falsehoods of castist beliefs, and the ones, who are once again opressed. While we must feel for every single person touched by the horrific events, such things make me think twice about putting my hands in my pockets to make any more donations- the first thing anyone asks when donating to charity is will the money really go to a good cause- our money is just going to reinforce castist anti-Sikh beliefs here. The aid agencies should be made aware of this, especially the Sikh agencies who will be familiar with such contexts. Maybe if no-one else bothers, they could make it their niche to help the most needy at this horrific time of depravity, maybe they can provide the voice for the opressed and forgotten. So many years of opression have destroyed the dalits, we are lucky that with the Kirpa of Waheguru the Sikh Qaum still has a voice. Despite all atrocities aginst it the Qaum still lives, and speaks, and will never be silenced like the unfortunate dalits.

I defiantely don't think we should read much into it- it is obviousl a publicity ploy- of all people why photo the sardar? I actually found it rather a cheap and tacky attempt at trying to raise awareness of an organisation by presenting something that surprises people.

Society should have the duty not to favour one way of life over another, it should be left to citizens to make the choice of their own lifestyles, and thus society should only invoolve itself in such matters where there is conflict in such views. On both of these instances, the use of public money to fund such arts propogates the freedom of speech, artistic lifestyle over the religious, more sensitive lifestyle. We should be playing this angle- that we are losing freedom of choice, as the state is propogating certain beliefs at the expense of others. We have tried various approaches in this issue to turn the tide against us, but all have seemingly failed. This could help us with the opening we need. What do you all think? :T:

Just read this on yahoo news- yet another appaling episode to add to the great volume of injustices based on caste. Just wonder where my donation is headed ! --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- India's untouchables forced out of relief camps KESHVANPALAYAM, India (AFP) - India's untouchables, reeling from the tsunami disaster, are being forced out of relief camps by higher caste survivors and being denied aid supplies, activists charged. Kuppuswamy Ramachandran, 32, a Dalit or untouchable in India's rigid caste hierarchy, said he and his family were told to leave a relief camp in worst-hit Nagapattinam district where 50 more families were housed. "The higher caste fishing community did not allow us to sleep in a marriage hall where they are put up because we belong to the lowest caste," Ramachandran said. "After three days we were moved out to a school but now the school is going to reopen within three days and the teachers drove us out," he said. "Where will I take my family and children? The school had no lights, toilets or drinking water," available for the displaced. More than 6,000 people died when tsunamis struck this southern Indian coastal district on December 26 and activists said that included 81 Dalits, who were daily wage earners working in agricultural lands. The ferocious wall of sea water destroyed swathes of farm land and the Dalits no longer have any employment. At Keshvanpalayam, the Dalits had only flattened homes to show while survivors elsewhere enjoyed relief supplies such as food, medicines, sleeping mats and ke rosene. No government official or aid has flowed into the village which houses 83 Dalit families more than 30 kilometres (20 miles) from Nagapattinam town. Cranes and bulldozers cleared the debris of a neighbouring fishing community, but they are yet to reach the Dalit village. Chandra Jayaram, 35, who lost her husband to the tsunamis, said her family has not received promised government compensation of 100,000 rupees (2,174 dollars). "At the relief camps we are treated differently due to our social status. We are not given relief supplies. The fishing community told us not to stay with them. The government says we will not be given anything as we are not affected much," Jayaram said. S. Karuppiah, field coordinator with the Human Rights Forum for Dalit Liberation, said in some of the villages the dead bodies of untouchables were removed with reluctance. "The Dalit villages are in most places proving to be the preferred choice of the fishing community to bury the dead. If the Dalits ask for relief materials the government says they can only give the leftovers," Karuppiah said. "The government is turning a blind eye," he said. "When Dalits bury the dead they are not given gloves or medicines but only alcohol to forget the rotten stench." Another activist, Mahakrishnan Marimuthu, who heads the non-governmental Education and Handicraft Training Trust, said tsunamis dealt a double blow to the caste. "They lost their jobs, houses and relatives. On the other hand the social discrimination is proving to be worse," he said. The government denied the allegations and said it was providing relief to every tsunami-affected family. "There is no intention of closing down any camps and we are providing relief to each and every family. We will provide temporary shelters as these relief camps are getting overcrowded," said Veerashanmugha Moni, Nagapattinam's senior government administrator. The United Nations (news - web sites) Childre n's Fund UNICEF (news - web sites) said government, relief agencies and aid workers did not discriminate against the Dalits but the caste issue always exists. "All the aid going in is distributed the same way to all survivors. The social discrimination has been there during normal times," said Amudha, who heads a team of UNICEF volunteers in Nagapattinam. "After the disaster happened it is still continuing. That is nothing new," she said. Vijaya Lakshmi, spokeswoman for South India Federation of Fishermen Societies, agreed and said one could not wish away a centuries-old caste system when a disaster struck. "If they (Dalits) are comfortable by staying separate they will," she said.

The day is so much more than a birthday, which is a time for family and friends to rejoice- the 'birthday' of Guru Gobind Singh Ji was, and remains a time for the world to rejoice- I think out of respect we should make a distinction.

Amazing story- have never heard that one before, but will never forget it now!

Amazing stuff- please make sure you post them EVERYWHERE so the sangat can make the most of them. :wub:

This bothers me too. :wub: @

where can I awap some of my realtives for some of these :T:

why has it been changed?

Bacteria and things living like that also count as joons. I have also heared that some other natural physical things are also counted, and I have always wondered if this was accurate. I have heard taht mountains (parbat) is also a joon- is this correct? How can it be correct?

Also, do not worry about your good deeds not mattering, they always matter. If nothing else, remember they will at laest help you in your next lives if you fail to achieve mukti on this instance of incarnation. Remember the words of Sri Guru Nanak in the Jap Ji Sahib- karmi aavai kapra, nudri mukh duaar. Your good deeds will in this way, at the very least earn you material things in the next life, although as the secoind part of this quote says, it is only with the Grace of Waheguru that salvation can be achieved, and the gate of the master can be reached.

I think it is people like your friend who do much damage to Sikhi regardless of their own spiritual accomplishments and the like. It is such people who create divisions between Amritdharis, and non-Amritdharis rather than working to bridge such differences with a view to then helping others onto the path they have been allowed to find with the grace of Waheguru. I cannot see that your friend has done anything constructive here, and he should be reminded that not only does a Sikh have a duty to become Amritdhari, but also has the duty to help others become Amritdhari, not push them away when they are heading in the right direction. Just my thoughts! :nihungsmile: