asmlondon

There was a news story recently about The Prince of Wales visiting Hibernia Road Gurdwara. IN fact its scrolling past me on the right as I write this out. ON another message board I wrote this about that visit "I am getting increasingly fed up with sikh organisations trotting out the same old hackneyed stereotypes when "entertaining" royals and politicians. The routine is now so old hat [VIP arrives is garlanded with flowers, hankies on the head, quickie tour and then a gatka performance]. Sikhs in Great Britian are a vibrant, modern, diverse and high-achieving group - we must do much more in pressing our standing in this country than performing like circus monkeys in front of the Prince of Wales while he sits bored rigid in a plastic picnic chair. What occured yesterday was nothing short of a coon show. It was a demonstration that the Sikh community in the UK can be reduced to dressing up in the garb of the warriors that the British defeated and humiliating themselves by attacking raw fruit ! The Prince of Wales is visiting Punjab later this month. Why not educate him on the destruction of Sikh Architectural heritage in the state ? He is after all a passionate advocate of architecture; in a few well-chosen diplomatic words he can single handedly rescue the "Guru ka Bagh" in Amritsar which is under threat of being concreted over. Why not press the environmental issues in Punjab or the potential for organic farming in Punjab - other subjects that he is deeply interested in. Very disspointed amandeep

We are still waiting for a response from the SGPC. I am still hoping that they will back out of the proposal quietly and save face by doing so. The letters are a really powerful first step. Hopefully that will be enough. If we dont get a favourable response from that, then we should move to petitioning. But remeber that the petition will only be influential if we can get many thousands of signatures [the women's seva issue at the Harimandir petiiton only realised about 2500 signatures] , if it is underpowered then the SGPC can just as easily state that this issue isnt a major one. Lets proceed with some caution. Can anyone get me the mailing address for Darshan Dhaliwal? He runs a Milwaukee based company called Bulk Petroleum Corp. amandeep

I had hoped that the reaction to this scandalous proposal by the SGPC would have been that they would have quickly backed down. It doesn’t seem that this is the case. I have tried to get the BBC in India to take the story as well as a few national newspapers in India and the UK. Pressure from foreign media outlets is (sadly) much more influential than what many thousands of Sikhs in the UK/US are asking for. I am drafting a letter to the SGPC president, with similar letters to the Badal office and also to Mr Darshan Dhaliwal (who is funding this project). I will send these by the weekend. I would encourage all others to do the same. The SGPC do not respond to emails, so it is vital that those of you who want to do something write a letter and send that by post (addresses are below) Letters should be short, to the point and courteous. For example, welcome the principal of the museum but insist that the site should not be the sacred Guru-ka-bagh site. The more letters that the SGPC get, the more chance that they will respond. The minute that I have any kind of official or unofficial response from the SGPC I will post on sikhsangat.com and copy in some of the other boards PLease address your letters to : Jathedar Avtar Singh, President SGPC. Shiromani Gurdwara Parbandhak Committee Teja Singh Samundri Hall Amritsar - Punjab 143006 (India) cc. S.Sukhdev Singh Bhaur General Secretary, SGPC,

Last week the SGPC announced the intention to build a Hi-Tech Museum in Amritsar. This week it has emerged that the likely site for this venture is the sacred Guru-ka-Bagh in the Harimandir complex that was the garden of Guru Arjan Dev ji and the place within which "Barah Mah" was composed. This sacred space is to be replaced by concrete, killing off the last green area in the complex and causing irreversible damage. The small shrine that commemorates the place that Guru Arjan Dev ji composed "Barah Mah" would also be lost forever. This is not the first historically important site to be bulldozed and concreted in recent years. The SGPC have previously demonstrated their utter disregard for Sikh Heritage in all its forms by whitewashing, replacing and concreting all manner of sacred monuments and sites. Please visit www.punjabheritage.org for the full report and for the latest news on this ongoing campaign for the SGPC to reconsider location of this museum. Amandeep Madra www.punjabheritage.org

Gurinder Chadha, Director and writer of the films ‘Bend it Like Beckham’ and ‘Bride and Prejudice’ said today will appear on BBC2 at 9pm tonight tracing her personal family tree from Britain to Kenya back to India and originally from West Punjab. This program sheds light onto how sikhs in britain can trace their family heritage as far back as the 10th century and shows how the indigineous indian records can be even more detailed than the British ones. Earlier this week, commenting on the launch of a new website devoted to Punjab's heritage Gurinder said : “I learned about my own past and my family's history on BBC 1's 'Who do you think you are?' At Punjab Heritage News I learned how much of that history is in danger of disappearing”

Introducing Punjab Heritage News : The very latest news and commentary on a heritage under threat. The Punjab has played host some of the world’s greatest civilisations. Each has left a interminable mark on the country; sumptuous palaces, imposing forts, havelis and courtyard residences and the unique mud built houses of the rural peasantry inimitably identify the region. Within Punjab the rich and diverse traditions of different communities have clashed over the centuries and spawned a multitude of hybrids. Cultural fusions of musical traditions, religious expression, linguistic oddities, and even culinary styles abound in its fertile plains. A powerful combination of robust colour, strong narrative and brutal honesty distinguish Punjabi art in all its forms prompting one nineteenth century observer to describe the unique colour palette of the Punjab as “warm and rich and fearless” Today, that unique and rich heritage is under threat. It is being torn down in the name of modernisation and ripped apart in acts of cultural vandalism. Neglect and ignorance of the importance of Punjab’s material heritage are a huge contributor to the persistent destruction of buildings, artworks, manuscripts and other items of material heritage. Today the United Kingdom Punjab Heritage Association (UKPHA) launches a new website called Punjab Heritage News to act as a daily news source for those who share our interest in the heritage of the Punjab. Commenting on the launch of the new website, Gurinder Chadha, Director and writer of the films ‘Bend it Like Beckham’ and ‘Bride and Prejudice’ said today “I learned about my own past and my family's history on BBC 1's 'Who do you think you are?' At Punjab Heritage News I learned how much of that history is in danger of disappearing” This site collects all the very latest news stories on Punjab's material heritage; architecture, arts, historical monuments and cultural traditions. These stories are augmented with reviews and editorials from leading writers, journalists, conservators and activists who write specifically for this new site. This makes Punjab Heritage News the primary place for the latest news and commentary from the world’s experts on the state of Punjab’s rich heritage. We hope that this site promotes the conservation efforts that are taking place as well as giving a voice to the activist and practitioners who are working tirelessly to preserve Punjab's heritage in all its forms.

Then comes the best part, I need someone who is going to India and/or Pakistan to get me longitude and lattitude measurements for as many Guru Ghar. If any Sikhsangat member in India has access to a handheld GPS unit and fancies undertaking this task please let me know. 150359[/snapback] I'm not going to India but I have used Google map to identify a number of Gurdwara in India/Pakistan such as : Darbar Sahib, Dera Sahib (Lahore), Bangla Sahib, Sis Ganj (Delhi), Hazoor Sahib (Nanded) and Hemkunt Sahib (roughly), Dukh Niwaran Sahib (patiala). The resolution of the Indian Maps (outside Delhi) is pretty poor so only the really big ones can be identified. I can send you these aman

I tested the UK_Gurdwara POI databse on my Tomtom Navigator 5 on a PDA. It works perfectly with the khanda graphic showing up in the menu screens and on the maps. The only very minor bit of feedback is that the database should be renamed as the UK bit is superfluous and because it starts with a "U" it appears right at the very end of the list of POIs. It woudl make much more sense to simple call it Gurdwaras. A great bit of work by Kurtas - excellent job aman

I know the photogrpah that you are refering to. It is NOT of Maharaja Ranjit Singh and HAri Singh Nalwa. It is actually of the Amir of Sind and his Pathan bodyguard. Ranjit Singh died in 1839 when photography was extremelly experiemental. No real portrtrait photographs were taken for another 5 years and the first camera came to India in 1849 when Ranjit had been dead 10 years. Aman

for a start, it's "grammar" not "grammer"!

This is the original news paper article from the Jeruselum POst. You will note that it has been edited a bit before posting onto SikhSangat.com. That's a bit fishy. If you note carefull references to "His Holiness" & "Keeper of the Golden Temple" have been removed before posting on this website and others. "Keeper of the Golden Temple" is an interesting epithet to use because as everyone in the middle east will know the King of Saudi Arabia is known as the "Keeper of the Kaaba". The question is, was this a case of journalistic sloppiness or was this a deliberate attempt to aggrandize a particular person ? Since the original Jeruselum POst article was judicioulsy edited to remove the bits that woudl offend Sikhs and then posted on a number of website one is left wondering! Dec. 27, 2005 10:07 | Updated Dec. 27, 2005 10:45 Sikh and ye shall find Earlier this week, an international delegation of 17 Sikhs led by His Holiness Bhai Sahiba Ji completed an eight-day pilgrimage across Israel and the Palestinian Territories Monday, having met with Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Druze and Baha'i religious leaders in the hope of resolving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict through ecumenical dialogue. "Israel is a country of contrasts with the potential for being the center of peace in the world," Gurcharam Singh told In Jerusalem. "There is a huge potential for God to bring peace. The desire is there from the people." Singh lives in Birmingham, Britain but was born near Amritsar in India's northern state of Punjab - the homeland of the world's 20-million Sikhs. This week, he was part of a Sikh Diaspora mission that included men and women from London, Birmingham and Leeds in Britain as well as from Nairobi, Kenya and Adelaide, Australia. "Our original plans were to come in the year 2000. But we were advised it wasn't safe," explained Singh alluding to the outbreak of the second Intifada. Contrary to their expectations of violence and religious strife, Singh said, the group were overwhelmed with kindness everywhere they went. Their packed itinerary, which took them to Tabgha, Safed and Isfiya in the Galilee and Bethlehem and Tekoa in the West Bank, included meetings with former Sephardi Chief Rabbi Eliyahu Bakshi Doron, Rabbi Menachem Froman and Sheikh Abdul Salaam of Nazareth. In Jerusalem, in an unusual gesture of spiritual good will, Sheikh Sidi Muhammad al-Jamal, secretary of the Sufi Council - who rarely grants interviews to non-Muslims - met with the delegation at his office on the Haram a-Sharif (Temple Mount) and insisted on personally serving tea to everyone, Singh recalled. The group visited the al-Aqsa Mosque, which has been closed to non-Muslims for the last five years, and toured the Stations of the Cross along the Via Dolorosa and inside the Church of the Holy Sepulcher. Speaking at a festive Punjabi banquet Sunday at the Kiryat Shmuel home of Jerusalem peace activist Eliyahu McLean, Bhai Sahiba Ji spoke of his being repeatedly overwhelmed with emotion and tears during the trip. There is only one universal God, he declared. Then turning light-hearted, he said in this modern age we must communicate with one another using the Internet, and "the address is love dotcom." Bhai Sahiba Ji, who is also known as Mohinder Singh, holds the honorific title "Keeper of the Golden Temple" - the Sikh shrine in Amritsar, India and is one of the central leaders of the religion today. A civil engineer by profession, he is the chairman of the Guru Nanak Nishkam Sewak Jatha temple in Birmingham. An outspoken proponent of inter-religious dialogue, Mohinder Singh is a member of the European Council of Religious Leaders and an advisor to the Sikh Heritage Trust. Recalling one of the highlights of the pilgrimage, Bhai Sahiba Ji spoke at the farewell dinner of standing in the pouring rain at Jerusalem's Western Wall on the Sabbath eve, "being showered with God's blessings." The full-bearded Sikh men - dressed in traditional white robes and turbans - were surrounded by a fascinated crowd of Hassidim and Haredim with similarly untrimmed facial hair but wearing black. The two faith communities represent the yin and yang of common humanity and the oneness of the Divine, he said. McLean, the director of Jerusalem Peacemakers, organized the pilgrimage together with a team of well-known figures in the holy city's interfaith and peace communities, including Rabbi David Rosen, Haj Ibrahim Abu al-Hawa and Dr. Rabbi Alon Goshen-Gotstein. "I wouldn't want to be doing anything else," said McLean. "It's work that feeds my neshama (soul)." The Peacemakers project also sponsors a program at Nazareth's Sufi Center where Jewish and Muslim high-school teachers study religious texts together. Sikhism, which like Judaism encompasses both a religion and a people, is based on the 10 gurus or enlightened masters who lived in India in the 16th and 17th centuries. The relatively new religion promotes a life of virtuous action, hard work, and dedication to family and community. Straightforward in its theology and open to the teachings of other faiths, it now ranks as the world's fifth-largest religion. What of the future? Did the Sikh pilgrimage indeed advance the cause of Middle East peace? "That's in God's hands," said Gurcharam Singh.

I was really quite surprised to see this too. This guy is the son of a bloke called "Darshan Das" who was the founder of a new age neo-sikh movement called Das Dharam. It was gaining ground in the 1970s and 1980s, it was extremelly pro-India very nationalistic, and extremely vocal against the popular Sikh movement of Bhindranwale in Punjab. Whilst nothing was ever proven it is highly likley that Das Dharam and Darshan Das were being supported by the Congress party in order to drive a wedge between Sikhs and the ruling Akalis, just as they supported the Sant Nirankaris. Dharshan Das was well travelled and had a significant following in the UK and Canada. His vocal opposition to the Akali Dal and Bhindranwale gained him many, many enemys and he was shot dead (along with two of his bodyguards) in Dormers Wells School in Southall where he was holding a programme in 1988. At the trial of the two singhs that shot him a great deal of evidence about Das's nefarious activites and lifestyle were published in the Punjabi press. I cant recall all the details but it was pretty seedy. In retrospect it was a time where there many rumours and many half truths and hearsay and exageration as well as a great deal of activity by Indian security services in the UK and, as have now realised, in Canada too. The guy on the telly is his son and I must admit that I thought the das dharam movement had comepletely died out but it seems like its still limping on aman

I completely agree with you - this story really stinks, I read that he is blaming the police for not taking it seriously! which means that either he hasnt told the police (ie he made the story up to get some politcal capital) or they simply dont belive him (in which case he'll be done for wasting police time). A shooting in west london is big news and no one but the Tribune of India has covered it ! that si really suspicious Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!! True, but if the conspiracy is what it has been made out to be you would expect the Police to at least monitor Miri Piri Gurdwara. Shootings are still rare in UK, the Police would have acted immediately. 114607[/snapback]

The apparant shooting took place in Heston (or Huston as the Tribune reported it) not in Southall. It is interesting to note that the mainstream media havent picked it up - if its true of course Aman

From today's Guardian An immediate answer to yesterday's G2 front page teaser: has Britain lost its sense of humour? The answer is a clear no, at least judging from the new T-shirts being worn by young Asians on the underground, which display the slogan: "Don't freak, I'm a Sikh". We'll give top marks to the joke writer for that one and (for some obscure reason) the tale has also prompted a very loosely connected thought: does anybody know what happened to the Guardian Angels? Unlike funny Sikhs, you don't see too many on the tube these days. Surely they're missing a fantastic marketing opportunity? Amandeep www.punjabarchive.org www.sicques.com

thanks for your comments. we hope to steadily expand the database to include many more piece sof ealy journalism. These will include both newspaper accounts from the 1700s (extremely rare) and more recnt ones. I am specifically working on a site taht will collate and present news stories charting sikh material heritage thanks again for your comments amandeep

How would you like to have access to almost 100 years of illustrated newspaper articles about Punjabis in the Press? The United Kingdom Punjab Heritage Association’s new website http://www.punjabarchive.org brings you closer to that ultimate on line reference source. The new website has been described by BBC Television’s South Asia Correspondent, Navdip Dhariwal as “a fascinating window into Punjab's history. . . great journalism from the past coupled with innovative technology makes punjabarchive.org a fascinating, informative and fun experience " This is the first step taken to create an electronic web-based archive highlighting the extensive body of material relating to the Punjab as reported in illustrated and non illustrated Victorian newspapers. The material graphically illustrates the shared heritage and contribution of Punjabis in world history, especially in relation to the building of the British Empire in the second half of the 19th century. Nearly all of the newspapers are profusely illustrated with evocative woodblock engravings and photographs, and cover a range of events and characters, many significant, some curious but nearly all little known. Highlights of the important events between Punjabi Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs with the British include: The land and people of the Punjab ruled by Maharaja Ranjit Singh The two Anglo-Sikh wars (1845-6, 1848-9) and subsequent annexation of the Punjab to British India in 1849 Maharaja Duleep Singh – the first Sikh known to have settled in England in 1854. The Punjabi contribution to the development of the British Empire in military campaigns in Asia, Africa and Europe (1860s - 1900s) The largely unheralded role of Punjabis in World War I and II The material represented in this website is from a private collection. We are grateful to the owner for their permission to access their valuable archive. UKPHA The UK Punjab Heritage Association (“UKPHA”) is a non-profit voluntary organisation based in Greater London. The Association was founded in 2001 to foster the appreciation of the Punjabi heritage in Britain and encourage the preservation of endangered items of the Punjabi material heritage. If you have a query, require assistance with your own projects or would like to support us, please contact us on sicques@gmail.com

One of London's first Sikh immigrants was Asa Singh Grewal. In fact he was more of a nomad than an immigrant flitting between the US, the UK and back to India and almost single handedly bringing over half of the village of Narangwal to the west. His formidable frame and over powering appearance are almost always evident in those great group shots of Sikhs in the 1930s at Shepherds Bush Gurdwara Anyway I was talking to his son, Surjan Singh Grewal (now deceased) some years ago and he told me a story of his father during the german air raids on London during WW2. Apparantly during one of the bombing raids a stray unexploded bomb landed in the Gurdwara premisis (i think it was either Putney or Bow?). It was sitting in the yard at the back almost completely intact with its bomb case intact and the flights just bent from the impact on the soft ground. Asa Singh (the unoffial Gurdwara gaurdian) simply picked the bomb up, hauled it over his shoulder (as Jats do to a sack of grin back in the Punj) and marched it down to the local police station. there, he plonked it down on the counter in front of a terrified desk jockey copper !! Apparantly the story made it into the newspaper but I never managed to track it down from Surjan Singh before he passed away. the point is that there was a spirit in those days, that Sikh had. Indefagitable, powerful, taking no crap from anyone - least of all the Nazis, self assured and solf-confident and probably fool hardy. I write all this becuase I am increasingly uncomfortable that the vocal Sikh community is seen as winging and whining about getting "stared at on the tube" or a few bricks being thrown through a window in the few weeks after 56 poeple were blown to bits on the underground. We shoudl be showing the fortitude & defience and self respect of Asa Singh not cowering behind our colective sofas and whinging the racist morons are "looking at us differently" - let the Muslims worry about that. Since I am on the topic. Its been reassuring to see that in the last 3-4 weeks not a single turbanned face has been seen on the telly associated with the bombing, this is in sharp contrast to 9/11 when you couldnt move for trubanned Ayatollahs, Talibans and Al-Quadas popping up every 5 minutes. In this case it has to be the severly mentally retarded to connect a turbanned Sikh with the Muslim extremeists.

I'm sorry that you find this thread funny - I think it's really serious. I do have an Engineering Degree but this is actually a question for a conservation architect not an engineer. Look, in heritage & religious terms the Darbar Sahib is a precious jewel, a vitally important and beautiful living monument. From a purely historical and heritage perspective we have to be incredibly sensitive when making interventions to the buildings. Of course no -one wants to see it rot - that is an entirely stupid thing to say. The building did have issues prior to hte seva, but the work that was done by the jaths has cuased enourous problems which are ultimately destroying the building from the inside. At the very least this shoudl be acknowledged or indeed an independant expert shoudl be bought into verify this and propose a way forword. Whilt I am confident that this is indeed the case (and I am sure that you take a contrary view) the SGPC/GNNSJ should at the very least commission this. It is all a folly becuase the recognised world's expert on Historical Punjabi architecture (and someone that was recently awarded an honour by UNESCO for consevration work on a gurdwara in Gujerat) has already raised her serious concerns about the way that the work was carried out. there is a second much more serious issue to address and that is the question of the original copper plates. What gives the jatha the right to rip these off the building and replace them with copies? these plates need to be recovered, conserved professionally and replaced onto the building. These were the work of countless artisans commissioned by Maharajah Ranjit Singh and the work was the very epitome of the art of guilded copper work. Its amazing that th worlds sikh community has allowed a group to literally debase the building by unthoughfully removing these. Again, I cant believ you find this funny . . . but that explais a lot doesnt it aman

Hello Aman, this is aman madra., did your chacha take any pics by any chance? I am keen to see what the frescoes under the godl work were before they were rendered over aman

Bhai Mohinder Singh wsa given the opportunity of a reply during teh BBC documentary and his repsonse was that the GNNSJ had doen a perfect job and nothing was to change. These are not new questions, Patwant Singh & world class conservation architects have been pleading for years to have the GNNSJ put right the damage that has been done but to no avail. If you cant respond to the world's experts on early punjbai buildings then the penny isnt going to drop by sending him an email is it? The damage that is done is done - that cant be reveresed now. but the issue of water ingress can be stopped and the original plates can be returned. These are the absolute minimum requirements. Aman

His body is buried in the graveyard in Elveden. He did become a sikh again for a few years after his flight from England and whilst he was in Paris and Russia but he recanted publically and became a christian again before he died. this is evidenced in his own letters, his will (which asks for him to be buried) and a diary entry by Queen Victoria with whom he met before he died. She described him and it is quite clear that he wasnt "keshadhari" at that meeting. Aman

There is no point going to Gurdwaras. For example, sikhcybermuseum was set up by the Council of Sikh Gurdwaras and they cant even invest in their own website let alone others! Before we invest in irrelevant websites like Sikhifm, sihitothemax, sikhsangat etc we really shoudl ensure that every town, city and village in the UK has at least one £17M gurdwara with a nice long high interest loan that will keep the sangat indebted for at least three generations. that's the way to do it aman

Ranjit Singh was dead for ten years before photography came to India. There are no original pics of him. What you saw was a picture of Sher Ali the Amir of Sind with his Pathan bodyguard that a hoaxer in the UK sold to the Punjbai press back in 1990 as a picture of Ranjit Singh and Hari Singh Nalwa. Aman

From the authors of Warrior Saints, introducing a fascinating new reconstruction of Sikh History through eyewitness accounts: "Sicques, Tigers or Thieves" : Eyewitness Accounts of the Sikhs (1606-1809), Amandeep Singh Madra and Parmjit Singh. Palgrave Macmillan, New York, 2004 see www.sicques.com for more information In 1810, Sir John Malcolm published the ground-breaking Sketch of the Sikhs. Contrary to popular belief, Malcolm was not the first European to write an account of the Sikhs. In the previous two centuries, soldiers, travellers, administrators, scholars, missionaries and empire-builders had witnessed the development of the Sikhs. The letters, diaries, newspaper accounts and memoirs of these men and women have been painstakingly researched and compiled to shed light on a little-understood period of Sikh history. A fascinating account of the Sikhs as seen by foreign travellers in the land which was to become their kingdom. They give us an insight into the macho self-image that Sikhs have to this day - anything you can do I can do better. This spirit of upmanship has sustained the community miniscule in numbers but grand in achievements - KHUSHWANT SINGH, JOURNALIST AND AUTHOR (History of the Sikhs) Better than time travel... a richly-peopled, intimate journey through the dawn of Sikh history - CHRISTY CAMPBELL, AUTHOR (The Maharajah's Box) "Sicques, Tigers or Thieves" promises to include the following highlights: 1. Over 35 of the earliest European accounts of the Sikhs in one volume, many previously unpublished. 2. Over 20 of the earliest images of Sikhs including those by, or commissioned for, Europeans. 3. The only European written account of the martyrdom of Guru Arjan in a new translation of the original 17th century Portuguese text. 4. The first ever translations of French accounts of Sikhs. 5. Several early British newspaper reports of Sikh military activity in the late 18th century, not known to have previously been published in any other work. 6. The chroniclers, many unaware of the traditions of this new faith group, have often witnessed unorthodox practices and extrapolated these as articles of faith. In many cases these statements provide a useful insight on early Sikh practices, but in some instances they can be misleading (the editors introductory remarks and endnotes will address these areas).