jashb

OMG, is it that common??? Lolz, I thought this just happened in my family, with my dad... :stupidme: I can second that...

You, my old friend, are deluded. Go and ask Australians how they feel about Islamic immigration and its impact on the host community. I suspect you'll receive a markedly different answer. Your view that "Islamic Communities are very well assimilated...specially in United States, Canada" would only be remotely true, if there was such a thing as a homogenous Islamic community to speak of. However; there ain't one. There is no homogenous Islamic community. Non-Punjabi Pakistani muslim immigrants are viewed as a nuisance making community, that sucks on the state, and is highly prevalent in crime, no matter where it goes; be that the UK, Norway, Sweden, Netherlands, or, for that matter, USA and Canada. The same applies to an extent to Bangladeshi muslim immigrants. Iranian (or Persian, as some prefer to be known) muslim immigrants, on the other hand, are viewed comparatively favourably. Most are seen as moderate people, who keep their faith to themselves, as a private, rather than public, matter, which is, quite frankly, the way the whiteys "like it". Iranian, and even Turkish, muslims are far more likely to be viewed as integrated than Indian-origin muslims residing in the same country. That's just a small example of how muslim immigrants from current countries differ in their own attitudes towards their host countries, and therefore, how, as a result, their host countries view them back. Besides the fact that Islamic communities are not homogenous. In fact, non-Indian/Somalian origin muslims even really hate it it when Paks/Bangla/Somalis, who have ben in the same country for shorter, try to piggy-back off "their" success in integrating overseas, and try to claim it as some wider achievement; just because they also happen to be muslims. Try speaking to some Turkish or Iranian muslims about Pakistanis; see how many positive responses you get. Even ask the Bangla immigrants about Paks; there is not a muslim of non-Pakistani origin that doesn't have something bad to say about Pakistani immigrants. And with good reason.

From, a humble, neeva jeha neemaana; To, one of the greatest ever protectors of humanity; PARNAAM. __________________________________________________________________ On recalling such a fearless warrior, even the heavens are reminded of the immortal folk verses, never more fitting than when recalling Shaheed Bhai Sahib Jaswant Singh Ji Khalra; QUOM HAMESHA KARDIYE; PARNAAM SHAHEEDAN NU QUOM HAMESHA KARDIYE; PARNAAM SHAHEEDAN NU WATAN DEE KHATAR HOYE JO, QURBAAN SHAHEEDAN NU...

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You and I both know that it is far less than "a dialect of hindi"; nay; It is a wholesale bastardised plagiarism of the hindi language, slightly adapted for a particular audience. If that is what they truly believe; not just what they try to preach to others (taqiyyah); then they truly are more deluded than they will ever know.

OMG. This is what happens when an entire race of people are truly enslaved, indoctrinated, and most thoroughly owned; to such an extent, that it's pre-eminent honour is viciously ground to fine dust. The hopelessly defeated slaves are fighting over their "professed" adherence to their unconcerned master. Oh dear.

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I highly doubt that. But, nevertheless, one wishes you well on your endeavours.

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This, precisely, is the answer to the conundrum. ;-)

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My heart pours out for them.

LMAO!!!! Yes, truly "PUNJABIYAN DEE SHAAN VAKHRI"! :biggrin2:

ROTFL.... LMFAO!!!! :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: This reminds me of a Punjabi Comedy, one of many directed/produced by the legendary Gurchet Chitarkar, who always focuses on dysfunctional families. This one is FAMILY KHUSREYAN DEE.....!!!! :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2:

The girls that dress like when they go to the Gurdwara don't listen to their own mothers. So why would they want to listen to some next aunty??? Many of these girls are highly rebellious. It's a trait which they have manifested, developed, and practised since childhood. As a result, they regularly got away with murder at home, due to the weakness of their parents. They aren't about to see the error of their ways anyone soon now. And they certainly don't appreciate being told what to do by older females. Ironically, they are more likely to listen to a FIRM MALE. They respect men far more than they respect themselves. In fact, they live and die for men!!! The parents of many of these girls have given up on them. The only answer for "proclaimed offenders" like these is to be strict and refuse entry to the Gurdwara for those who cannot muster up the respect to at least dress modestly in front of the Guru. You need a firm alpha male to lay down the law for these types; they simply don't respect anyone who respects them, because, fair enough, they know themselves that they're too dirty to be worthy of the respect (!!!), and can see straight through such "pleasing" behaviour as a lack of confidence, which they eat up. Once this becomes a norm, s2appers will think twice before turning up to the Gurdwara dressed like a hoe, because no one wants to have to go back home and get changed. And, just to make it absolutely clear; if they can't respect Guru Ji; they CAN go straight to the wedding party.

I've not seen or heard of this, and I thought I'd seen it all. Where does this happen veerji? Midlands, I guess? Eh...???

I've not come across these people, but I know what I'd like to do if and when I do. ;-)

LOL :biggrin2:

SP have said this for years and years. As well as the need to rethink and reform the way we carry out Nagar Kirtans, as they are a beehive for perverts and groomers. But their recommendations were ignored then, and I bet they'll continue to be ignored now. In fact, the most brisk business that any "Sikh" shop does, is in Sikh Kara's. The owner and staff are almost always Kesadhari or Amritdhari, and yet they couldn't care less if a su22a picks up a Sikh Kara for 50p. It is ridiculous. Likewise, on the point about Nagar Kirtans; Gurdwara committee members are so out of touch, that they have NO idea what is going on at the back of the Nagar Kirtan; which is basically a free-for-all carnival atmosphere. I requested a Gurdwara committee member to watch the documentary, specifically the part where the abused girl mentions that her abuser enticed her at a Nagar Kirtan. The response was "oh, well it could have happened anywhere." I pointed out the irony of that answer, and also explained how the Nagar Kirtan increased the likelihood of such an event occurring multiple-fold; but only after a "face palm" moment when I questioned the sanity of the said committee member. Who needs enemies when.... You know the rest.

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True, but we have taken the pursuit of promotion of the Punjabi language to a next level; where it easily overshadows the importance of the promotion and propagation of the distinct Sikh identity. The fact is that our culture is NOT Panjabi. It never has been and never will be. Panjabi culture was created by, and belongs to, the majority muslims of Panjaab. Anyone who seriously believes that Sikhs would create a culture that runs totally opposite to the teachings of the Guru's needs their heads tested. Moreover, we couldn't have created a Panjabi culture even if we wanted to. Since it is widely acknowledged that Sikhs formed less than 15% of the population of greater, undivided Panjaab, even after the great proselytising success of the Singh Sabha movement; how were we supposed to impose our way of life on the 85+% majority??? __________________________________________________________________ The truth is that we HAD our own distinct KHALSA culture; But we abandoned it very quickly, soon after we came into massive power in Panjaab, some 30+ years after the misl's were formed on a purely KHALSA foundation; During the late 1700's, when there was a vacuum of power, created by the impotence of the later Mughal administration, and the frequent absence of the de facto rulers, like Ahmed Shah Abdali, from Panjaab. Why??? I don't know. I guess the temptation to emulate the Mughals in terms of hedonism and excess was too strong, once the misl's could ruler freely, didn't have to go into repeated hiding, and had considerable proceeds from rakhi money. So we adopted the muslim panjabi culture (which itself is a local adaptation of the indian mughal culture); which consisted of, though not exclusively; wining and dining, multiple women, excessive sharaab consumption, promiscuity, lots of meat, women wearing lots of make up ("shingaar") and jewellery, and generally having a good time. __________________________________________________________________ [sikh men getting absolutely hammered, or even drinking alcohol at all, and Sikh women getting dolled up in what was, for back then, the equivalent of mini skirts and tight tops of today, was absolutely, totally f'n unheard of in the early 1700's. The same insanity was considered 'normal' for Sikhs in the early 1800's. Look how we fell.] __________________________________________________________________ Then what happened??? What did we gain from this cultural "advancement"/change??? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. The result is all plain to see. We gained nothing, but we lost everything. At the end of the 18th century, we were, in some ways, lucky to have Maharaja Ranjit Singh. For all his many faults, he was still an exceptionally strong and politically astute leader, the kind that comes around only once in a few generations; and this helped to mask all the deficiencies that were slowly creeping into Sikh society during his dictatorial reign. He was strong, clever and ambitious enough to be able to overcome the smaller misl's, and merge the others with his own through diplomacy, and thus chalk out, a large, united, strong, so-called "Sikh" kingdom. Albeit heavily weakened by the gradual moral slide/degredation of higher Sikh society, the Khalsa Culture was still kept burning, during this period,by a small, but vocal, and distinct, minority of Kattar Singh Soormeh, the likes of, to name a few; Sardar Hari Singh Ji Nalwa, Sardar Sham Singh Ji Attari, and Akali Nihang Baba Phoola Singh Ji. These heroes acted as a magnet force to slow down the inevitable moral slide, that would have happened even faster, had these Kattar Singh's not been in full public view. __________________________________________________________________ But, after the Maharaja's demise, chaos ensued. Especially so within the royal household, where none of the Maharaja's elder sons were able to manage the mess, partly because that's where the hypocrisy and duality, with regards a reinforced "Punjabi" identity, as opposed to a purely Sikh one, started from; where the rot stated. Children are impacted by adults' changes in behaviour far more than we adults think; the secularism, opulism, hedonism and excess, so adopted by the Maharaja, that is totally alien to Khalsa Culture, had clearly rubbed off on his sons. Blame the Dogra's or not (in fact; they wouldn't have even been in a remote position of power had secularism not crept into upper Sikh society); the fact is that we weren't strong enough, to retain the empire, in the mid 1800's, even with far better weaponry and far more manpower; Than we were, to build the empire, in the mid 1700's, with far simpler weaponry and much smaller forces, when we possessed PURE KHALSA CULTURE. __________________________________________________________________ The rise and fall of Sikh power is directly related to our change in attitudes toward Sikhi, and our resultant abandon of our indigenous Khalsa Culture, given to us by Dasmesh Pita, in favour of the adoption of the foreign ("malechh") muslim "Punjabi" culture. We make so many excuses for it these days, and try to blame it all exclusively on the Dogra's. But the fact remains that we wouldn't even have had non-Sikhs (which they originally were) in the Khalsa Raj in. the first place if we had stuck with our own Khalsa Culture, rather than adopting a horrible self-hating brand of secularism, which turned out to be the equivalent of shooting ourselves in the foot. It's as if Dasven Patshah is giving us a clear and unambiguous lesson. The question is, Sikhs; are we going to take it? __________________________________________________________________ Dasven Patshah took a valuable stone (diamond), and threw it into the river. They asked a Singh, why did that diamond sink? The Singh answered, because it's heavier than the water, that's why the diamond sank. They asked another Singh, why did that diamond sink? The other Singh said, because it went into the water with force, that's why the diamond sank. Then, Dasmesh Pita asked Bhai Daya Singh (pehle pyare). Why did that diamond sink? Bhai Daya Singh answered "Dasven Patshah, I don't know why that diamond sank. All I know, is just one thing. That; Whoever, and Whatever, that left the sanctuary of YOUR Protection, Pita Jee; SANK TODAY, AND WILL REMAIN SUNK FOR EVER MORE!" DHAN DHAN DASMESH PITA - PUTRA DA DAANI !!!!! :)