proactive

95%?? Not really. The Jats from Lyallpur and Montgomery made up only about less than a third of the Sikh Jats who migrated from West Punjab to East Punjab, In fact there were more Sikhs Jats in the Lahore district than in the two canal colonies combined and owned nearly 58% of the total land in the district. Added to these Jats, the Sikh Jats of Sialkot, Gujranwala, Sheikhupura districts these Jats constituted the a vast majority of the Sikh Jat migrants into East Punjab. The author probably did not consider the canal colonies which apart from a small original Sikh population were mainly populated by migrants from various districts. However, the Sikh populations of the other districts were a part of the original population of the districts. This is why they would have felt the loss of their lands much more than the ones from the canal colonies. From personal family experience our connection with the canal colony area of Khanewal in Multan district only went back to 1920s when land was allocated due the war service of a family member. You are right about the way the author appears to based the book on his family history, there has always been a tendency for West Punjab Urban Sikhs to think that their family experiences constituted the history and culture of the entire Sikh community. Based on Khushwant Singh's family/clan history in West Punjab, the oft repeated story of the elder son of a Hindu family becoming a Keshdhari Sikh has been universally accepted as something that happened in all areas of Punjab when it was only the case in the Pothohar region and was mainly from the Sehajdhari Sikh community rather than the Hindu community. The stories of these Sikhs were used by Doordarshan to make propaganda BS serials about how great the Hindu-Sikh relationship in Punjab had been prior to the 1980s.

I see Dal Singh is back with his anti-Jat agenda.

These movies are not for the western Sikh audience although now that these movies are being banned in India the producers will have to consider catering more for the western Sikh audience as this is where they will likely recoup their investment. Whatever your thoughts on the artistic merit of these films, one thing that cannot be argued against is that they have led to Sikhs gaining more knowledge about the events that happened in the 80s and 90s. This can only be a good thing especially as the whole Indian education system and media is gearing towards either ignoring these events or painting these events to suit their own ends.

Stop making one sentence statements which will only confuse people. Expand on your view and give the evidence for it. Otherwise you are just spreading confusion,

Read all the thread for my view on the Guru building a mosque. If the story is true then it was something that occurred due to a particular situation otherwise if was something to be emulated by Sikhs then there would be Guru Ki Maseets all over Punjab especially in the towns founded by the Gurus such as Amritsar, Tarn Taran, Anandpur Sahib etc. The thing that you do not seem to grasp that these Mosques will become centres of Dawah, they will not just stay small structures, no doubt they will 'find' some evidence of a Muslim graveyard nearby which they will demand be handed back to them and within a few year as more and more Muslim bhaiyas are settled there the Mosque will be expanded and it will become a centre for dawah. They Saudis are pumping billions of dollars every year around the world into non-Muslim countries building Mosques and Madrassas which will become a threat in the next few decades. Do you think that the idiocy of Sikhs like this man has not now been noted in Saudi Arabia and that money will now not be pumped into Punjab? In the previous years this would not have been a problem because the Sikhs of previous generation knew what Muslims and Islam was about and were strong in their beliefs. The Muslims didn't dare even attempt to convert Sikhs but do you think this will be the case now? Now reading the above, do you still think that the Sikh who built the mosque for the Muslims did a good thing?

What a stupid comment. You claim Sikhs building Mosques shows that they are above 'narrow religious views' but then want to BAN evangelicals and dawah preachers? So now instead of just building Mosques, the Gurus now also built Temples ?? You sure there isn't a sakhi about them building a synagogue as well somewhere? You don't need to ban any other religious preaching, if only Sikhs were strong in their faith instead of becoming dhobi day kuttay going from one manmat to another. Those idiotic Sikhs building Mosques are the ones who are weakening Sikhi by their actions.

Islam only understands and respects force. This is why the Sikhs of previous generations were so successful against it. Just as Islam had its spirit of superiority, the Sikhs of previous generations had belief in Raj Karega Khalsa and a Sikh as Sawa Lakh. If they were hit by a stone they would strike back with a brick. Unfortunately apart from a few pockets in Punjab and ironically in areas where the Sikhs are a minority like Hyderabad, Jammu and Saharanpur and some other areas outside Punjab the Sikhs have lost this self belief. There was a time when a single Sikh would have been enough to intimidate a group of Muslims but those days are gone now. Even the Sikhs of 1947 although surrounded by Muslims and not even a majority in any of the districts of Punjab had the foresight to realise that their survival lay in creating an area where the Muslims would be expelled and the Sikhs of West Punjab resettled. Now that same area is becoming a Muslim region again. Instead of the Sikhs of previous generations who knew more about what Muslims and Islam are than all the so-called scholars in the west, we have Sikhs like Jigsaw and Singh123...who think that allowing a religion which wants to enslave them to become stronger is a way of showing Sikh-Muslim unity!

Unfortunately these idiots don't realise that the decisions they make today to help a rival religion to establish itself will come back to haunt their descendants. The Muslims just need to gain a foothold and the time is not distant when they start to dominate the area. Muslims like to test the waters first and in the villages where idiotic Sikhs have helped to build Mosques these Muslims were scared to even ask for help knowing that Sikhs have always been the ones to know what Islam is like having suffered from it more than most in India. So they were surprised when instead of being met with opposition which would have been the case had these Sikhs of today had the same blood flowing through their veins that the Sikhs of the 18th and 19th and even the 20th century had, they met the Sikhs of the 21st century who are muppets who actively helped a religion whose sole aim is to enslave them. Look at Saudi Arabia, they have not taken any refugees from Syria and yet want to give money to Germany to build 200 Mosques for these refugees. The same is the case of Pakistan which is using its agents in Punjab to settle Gujjars and Bhaiya Muslims in Punjab villages and establishing a fifth column in Punjab. Islam will either dominate through war or through emigration (Hijrat) just as Mohammed did in Medina. So the settlement of Muslims in Punjab is a part of a larger plan to make Punjab into if not a Muslim majority state at least a state with a large Muslim minority. The case of the refugees is quite relevant as the arch dhimmi Jigsaw Singh or is it Vingha Tinga Singh was doing siapa here claiming to be ashamed to be a Sikh because we weren't all doing more to help the Muslim migrating into Europe. Vingha Tinga Singh will not rest until Islam rules everywhere and he is either a Muslim or willingly paying them Jizya. It should not be him that is ashamed to be a Sikh, but it is Sikhi that is ashamed to have a Sikh like him in its ranks. Can you imagine what the Sikhs of the Misl period would have made of someone like him if he was alive then probably lecturing the Jathas on how to live in peace with the Muslims just as they had wiped out more than half of the Sikhs in a single day.

The only one displaying his ignorance here is you who thinks that Sikhs building a Mosque is a good show of Sikh-Muslim unity. The worst thing is that came on this forum posting a story and thinking that everyone would cheer you on. Unfortunately for you not everyone is as ignorant of Islam as you are.

You've been found out mate. Bringing out stories to support your dubious contentions and not coming up with the goods when challenged. Respond to my post and don't go off on a rant.

duplicate

Good try at trying to patronise me. I'm sure the other members here who will have followed this and other threads will know who is the Siana and who is the Bacha here! Ok so let's cut to the chase. I think yours is a classic case of claiming one thing and then when challenged for evidence providing nothing of the sort and then claiming victory! This is a classic Muslim trait, I suggest the next time you are alone at home, draw the curtain, put your mobile to silent and then take off your pyjama and check that you aren't missing something below because a long association with Muslims, an extreme bout of Islamophilia could have resulted in a miraculous dissection! Missing something below may also lead to a readiness to believe in BS stories about miraculous appearances of Misri at the Dargah. It's quite obvious what is going on at that village. A story has been made up to show that the Dargah, of which there are hundreds in Punjab and which until the 1990s were disused and neglected, has a connection with Guru Arjan Dev in order to get Sikhs to visit there. No doubt some Sikh muppet with more money than sense will have paid to have the place renovated. The story of Guruji telling the Muslim sufi that his shrine will have maanta before the Guru's shrine shows how these stories are used to show that Guruji approved of the manmat going on in these shrines. As you obviously do not know the history of the Guru and that during his Guruship the main converts to Sikhi were Jats who were former followers of Sufis like Sakhi Sarwar. Read the Sakhi of Bhai Manjh Ji and you will understand why this story of the Guru and the Dargah appears unlikely. The main converts to Sikhi at the time of Guru Arjan Dev were Jats of Majha and Doaba who were former followers of Sufis like Sakhi Sarwar. Read the story Bhai Manjh to see what opposition there was between the Sikhs of the Guru and the Sakhi Sarwar cult. Although you made a snide remark about me reading up on rather than visiting the shrine, the reason for taking evidence from historical sources is that if a story doesn't feature in a travelogue from the 1880s then it is likely that it was made up after that date. The mosque shown at the time you stated does not even look like it is in the compound and appears to be in the middle of some fields. You stated that Guruji had the Mosque constructed within the compound. Firstly the Gurdwara manager did not make any reference to this and in fact the made a marked point of the fact that the local Muslim village leader wanted to prevent the marriage of the Guru there. Whereas you stated that the Guru was moved by the love shown by the Muslims there. Now if the Mosque was built by the Guru then that would be a big deal and not something that the Gurdwara manager who was so informative about the history of the Gurdwara something that he would be liable to forget. Now I am not going to say that there might not be a Mosque like structure in the Gurdwara compound especially as these Gurdwara compounds have grown over the years and been extended through Kar Sewa many times. The original Gurdwara would have been a minor structure which after many years as more and more people become Sikhs in the village would have expanded. There might have been a small dargah close by which was eventually subsumed by the Gurdwara compound and which for anyone visiting the Gurdwara would be assumed at have been a part of the Gurdwara all the time. Such a thing would have happened after 1947 when there would have been very few Muslims around to protest or even if there was a sizeable amount after the violence in 1947 they would not have dared to protest. After a while they would have accepted the status quo and then a story would have been floated that the Guru got the Gurdwara built because the Muslims there had treated him so well and in a roundabout way gain some kudos for the local Muslims from the Sikhs of the villages. Now it would be good if you could provide some evidence for the Mosque being built by the Guru and not fairy stories told to you by some Muslims in the village

So in order to ascertain whether Guru Arjan Dev built a Mosque within a Gurdwara for Muslims in Mao village, I need to go down there are ask all and sundry, Anyone can write any rubbish on here and then just say that the evidence for their 'facts' can be located at such and such a place. Either you have the evidence of that Mosque or you don;t. I would have thought that there would have been an account in the same Gurdwara noticeboard as this would make the Gurdwara unique having a Mosque in its premises. Looks like the same sewadars who related the history of the Gurdwara forgot to write about the Mosque on the noticeboard. There is also no such account in a travelogue written in the 1880s. You obviously have no regard for testing the veracity of a story. If a traveller visiting every Gurdwara related to the Gurus, their sons and wives as well as well known Gursikhs did not write about the Mosque when he visited the Gurdwara chances are he was never told the story and the so-called Mosque may be a Muslim structure about which now some story has been made up. A lot of this takes places nowadays.

These cities were holy because of their connection with the Guru and not because some Pakistani bureaucrat had the bright idea to announce the obvious. While on the subject of Nankana Sahib here is what the Muslims are doing there A massive mosque is under construction just next to Gurudwara Janam Asthan. Its minaret is so tall that it could not be constructed the way minarets of most mosques are. So, it has a special design that enables themaulanas to snarl at this minuscule community from the heights of their hateful selves. The mosque is designed to dwarf the Gurudwara. A further element of insult, that is cast in concrete is that the prayer compound of the mosque is constructed on an unusually high platform, that is higher than the highest point of the prayer hall of the Gurudwara. So that the Muslims can remain a floor above. Does that make them nearer to God? The eateries in the entire bazaar that is frequented by the local Sikhs either plainly refuse to serve them or have separate cups and glasses for them. Kalyan Singh who has spent almost his entire here can even tell you which rehri wala will serve him and which won't. http://www.dawn.com/news/1025160/day-3-the-sikhs-of-nankana-sahab Maybe you and Jigsaw Singh could start a fundraiser for the mega mosque they are building next to Gurdwara Janamsathan, it would be in line with your worldview.

You obviously have no idea of how to conduct a debate. Was there a need for the Gurus to create another language? How can you equate the two there would have been opportunities to build Gurdwaras if the aim of the Gurus were to build religious places of a rival faith which is at odds with their core teachings. The rest of your post is a rant which shows little understanding of the issue. I am not surprised that you bring out Khalsa Aid into your argument because in your attempt to win the argument you think who could have anything against Khalsa Aid? Well Khalsa Aid are the same mindset as the guy who built the Mosque. The aim of Khalsa Aid is to get publicity and there is no publicity in helping Sikhs so they concentrate on helping non-Sikhs especially where ever their is a natural disaster. They duplicate what ever the more larger and organised charities do. I remember debating with one of their founders on Sikhnet a few years after Khalsa Aid was set up about why they were sending aid to Gujarat after the earthquake when there were farmers in Punjab who could do with their help as they were committing suicide because farming was unprofitable. The guy's response was that they only dealt with natural disasters! To be fair they have tried to do something in Punjab in the last few years but they will drop everything if there is a disaster anywhere. SOPW is a much better organisation that Khalsa Aid. They have done more foe Sikh causes in the last few years of their existence than Khalsa Aid have done in 16 years.

You must be confused, Mao Sahib is actually associated with Guru Arjan Dev and his marriage. Having read about the Gurdwara in Sri Guru Terath Sangreh which is the earliest travelogue guide to the historic Gurdwaras there is nothing about a Mosque being built by the Guru. If anything it says that some disrespect was shown to the Baraat The Gurdwara noticeboard also does not make any claim to the Guru having built a Mosque there. http://www.historicalgurudwaras.com/India/Punjab/Jalandhar/GurudwaraShriVivahAsthanShriGuruArjanDevJiateMataGangaJiMaoSahib/gallery.php Since you claim to have been there maybe you can enlighten us further. Anyway having increased the number of Mosques built by the Gurus to a grand total of 2! How does that justify a Sikh building a Mosque for Muslims in this day and age?

That is the one of the problems we have within the Panth. Instead of seeing this person's actions as against Sikhi we try and absolve him of his wrongdoing because we think that he does such great Kirtan. If this actions in visiting an Anti-Sikh dera weren't bad enough he then LIED to get our of it. Is this the type of person who should be doing Kirtan in the presence of the Guru?

When the whole of the SGPC is being run by a bunch of corrupt criminals led by Badal and his son then you can't accept any respectable person to remain within it. These criminals will only hire fellow criminals.

Why are you using rare examples of Muslim displays of humanity as an example of Islam? Let's do this in simple terms. Did the Gurus support Sharia law? Answer is no because Sharia does not allow a non-Muslim in a Muslim state to carry weapons or ride a horse or make any claims to sovereignty. Do all Muslims support Sharia law in a state ruled by a Muslim ruler? The answer is yes. What does the Sharia say about any person who is rebelling against the Sharia in a Muslim state? It mandates punishment by the ruler according to the extent of the offence. So were Ghani Khan and Nabi Khan in helping Guru Gobind Singh following their religion and the sharia or going against it?

There is no proof that any Guru ever built a Mosque for the use of Muslims. What is missing in all the articles about the Guru Ki Maseet is any evidence that the story has a basis in fact. If Guru Hargobind had built the Mosque for the Muslims then why did every Guru after that not do the same as well? All the four Gurus after Guru Hargobind interacted with Muslims throughout their lives and there is no doubt that Anandpur Sahib would have contained some Muslim residents. So why didn't Guru Tegh Bahadur when he founded Anandpur Sahib not also build a Mosque? Guru Gobind Singh was friends with many Muslim holy men and yet there is no sakhi about him building a Mosque. So tell me why in the whole 550 year odd history of the Sikhs only one Mosque exists for which claims are made that it was built by the Guru?

Look, historically the Muslims have been our enemies because their religion does not accept the validity of other religions. So it will always be the enemy of all other religions. The Hindu or more especially the Hindu elite (bahman-bania) are our enemies at the moment. So should he accept help from or have unity with our historic and natural enemies in order to fight our present enemies? By building mosques these stupid Sikhs are aiding a rival religion to gain a foothold in our land.

https://video-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hvideo-xpt1/v/t42.1790-2/11995119_856781284412762_2094012627_n.mp4?efg=eyJybHIiOjM5NiwicmxhIjo4OTJ9&oh=cb9738081d14e3a7f51dcc89e4a1276f&oe=55F304B5

Drugs, female foeticide, caste discrimination, dismal education system, unemployment and now building mosques, Punjab is going downhill fast.

At least her rinsed out the cup, goray workmen wouldn't have done that. Anyway I think his main problem is that as a plumber he couldn't deal with a leak!!

They and other groups are doing good work for the last few years, work which should have been taken up by the SGPC on a grand scale. One thing they should consider is to relocate these communities which are sometimes in small number in backward areas to areas where there is a greater Sikh population. Places like Abchalnagar or Hyderabad or Nagpur. A better scheme would be to relocate them to Punjab. This would ensure that Punjab's labour needs are satisfied and they wages they will get in Punjab would be much better than they would get in their areas.