Pheena

define 'aching'.

As one does not become a human simply because of the physical bodies is of a human. To become a human you must outgrow your Animalistic behaviours that is present within our mind(eat, sleep and procreate). We must transencd our ancestorial needs and desire. There are also plenty of 'Humans' who behave like animals. Now when i say we must grow from these thing, that does not mean we leave them behind, as we don't eat, sleep or have sex. In one sense yes, we must rise above them to regain our full potential which does not revolve around our primordial desires. The potential that exists within this human body is far greater than other animals. Animals are bound by the laws of nature, as is man, but Man also has the capability to deviate from those laws. This authority has been granted to Man. Animals cannot deviate from these laws to which they are bound because they are incapable of grasping their full potential which is limited by their mental ablities and their bodies, unlike Man. Man too is bound, but he is able to tap into his higher mental albity and he contain within the body necessary nerve connections that are capable of opening windows to a new divine reality. These are often refered to as Chakras. Nature gives you this Human body so that they may reach your full potential. You can even call it an evolution of your consciousness. If you even after attaining this Human body revert back to your animalistic behaviours, you are then reincarnated into an animal where you must again climb up the ladder to attain this human body. This is not due to God demoting you, rather your own actions. And it is your Karma which determines how long you remain in the Animal life cycle, or then sometimes, just sometimes a Mystic, a Master may bestow his grace, his compassion upon an Soul that he removes his karma and grants a soul a human body in his next birth. Nature provides us a curtain that blocks out our past lifes for a good reason. The question is do you really want to know what you were in your past life? Are you prepared to face the reality of who and what you were? If you found out that the woman you married, the mother you have in this life was an enemy of your, someone you disliked, someone who harmed you in your past life? Will you be able to move on in this life? Will you not carry with you the animosity or the hatred that you had in your past life into this one? How could you live your life at ease knowing you were born out of a woman who harmed you in your past life? A story i heard of a woman who disliked her mother very much for reasons unknown to her. Her mother on the other hand wanted only love from her daughter. But her daughter despised her and was unable to give that love to her. After sometime in meditation she became aware of her past life where she found out that her mother in this life had killed her in her past life. The mother now suffers as she only seeks love from her, but she does not recieves it. The daughter cannot stand her due to the past life tragedy that occured to her. So next time there is a natural tendency to Love or dislike someone, do not simply dismiss it. There is a reason behind why we often tend to dislike or like someone without any provocation. You are the Soul, a drop of the Divine ocean, a spark of the Divine flame. As to what it is, one cannot use words to describe it. Where words are used, limitations are imposed. You must experience yourself to know what exacty you are.

Simply put when it removes the freedom of another it becomes Moh. Love creates Freedom, Moh removes it. True love can only exist in freedom for the other to do what they wish to do, but remember don't cofuse this Freedom of Love with carelessness. Love does not create demands, it gives surrender. If your beloved so wish to leave you tomorrow, then it is your Moh that will try to hold them. Love on the other hand will wish them a loving farewell. Just as it accepted their arrival with love, so it sends them off with the same love. It is always Moh that brings your pain, never love. Sometimes it is this Pain that provides us a window that places us face to face with our attachments, that allows us to understand it. Few are able to see this through the storm of emotional turmoils. Love removes expectations, Moh creates them. How to become Nirmoh, its rather simply don't expect anything from your beloved. Learn to give full freedom to the other to do what they wish to do. If they arrive at your gate, hug them with Love, if tomorrow they wish to leave your house, then send them off with Love. If today they curse your then forgive them with love, it tomorrow they embrace you with forgiveness invite them with the same Love. If today they are with you, enjoy your moments in Love, if tomrrow they wish to be with someone else, allow them to leave out of your Love. It seems difficult, its not. Love other like God loves you. how can prem become moh? im just trying to understand...i like my house and my car but im not attached tothem....but a good question, when does something become moh? can u have attachment with god? ok that sounds dumb,u can .............rite?i mean u shud b/c thas what we're all here for...or does moh mean attachment to worldly things?? Yes this is going to be long, but it will help you understand your answer better. ****************** "An important thing to keep in mind, as Nanak stresses time and again, is that God has not stood apart or removed Himself from His creation after creating it, nor is He in any way opposed to it, nor has He forgotten it. God's work of creation goes on every minute, eternally. Actually, creation is God's way of being. He creates and creates and creates, and He is always interested in whatever He creates. This is very significant. We tell the seeker not to be attached to anything in order to attain God, but God Himself is not unattached or uninvolved. If He were so, the process of creation would stop; everything would come to a halt. Now what is this? As soon as you become one with God a new kind of involvement arises, a new interest, where there is no difference between attachment and nonattachment, where there is neither desire nor desirelessness, where there is neither enchantment nor otherwise. All differences fall away. God creates with full interest and desire, yet He is desireless, uninvolved. How will you be able to understand this paradox? Nanak says it is as difficult as 'chewing on iron'. God creates, so His interest is natural, His involvement is natural; but it is not a blind involvement as we have with our desires. In His involvement there is no possessiveness, no ownership. He creates you and frees you, and lets you loose. This is why you can wander, commit sin, do evil. He does not bind you in chains to keep you away from evil. He has His relationship with you, all right, but He does not stand in the way of your freedom. It is not that He is against you, yet you are completely independent. This is rather complex. When a mother is attached to her son, this attachment kills his freedom, for she is always saying: Don't go here, don't go there. Don't do this, don't do that, and a thousand other don'ts. She smothers him with her love, but kills him nevertheless. She doesn't give him enough independence to allow him to stand on his own two feet or gain some experience of life; in this manner she cripples the child. He will never become mature as long as he is under his mother's protection; even when she dies, her hold over her son will continue as before and he will find it difficult, if not impossible, to love another woman. He knows only one love, his mother. Anyone else would be sinful. The mother was interested in the child, but it was blind infatuation. A relationship with open eyes protects you, and at the same time does not destroy your freedom. It sometimes obstructs with a view to making you worthy of going ahead. It makes you strong. It supports you today and withdraws the support little by little so that you may be able to stand on your own tomorrow. It does not lend the support in order to make a cripple of you. Then there is another kind of mother: if she is told that her attachment to her child is harmful, she draws back completely and removes all restraint from the child. Now total nonrestraint is not the same as giving freedom to your child. If it is a boy he may go to prostitutes, take drugs, gamble, steal, murder. The mother has given him full freedom to do as he pleases; she has become indifferent to her child. First she cared so much, but her caring was blind; now there is negligence and indifference, which is equally blind. The balance lies between the two. This balance is the characteristic of God. It is His very nature. His attitude towards His creation is: He protects you so that you may be independent, and gives you independence so that one day you may be able to surrender. These are two apparent contradictions. He gives you the opportunity to go far away, for if you do not go far how will you come close? He gives you license to wander, for if you do not wander how will you gain experience? He gives you a chance to fall, for if you do not fall how will you learn to protect yourself? And yet He protects you and follows you. His eye watches everywhere; His shadow is everywhere; He envelops you from all sides. No matter how far from Him you go, still He is beside you, so close that whenever you need Him you have only to turn and there He is -- available to you that very moment. There is the well known couplet: "In the mirror of my heart is the picture of my beloved. I have only to bend a little to get a glimpse of Him." No matter how far you go, He is always behind you, following you. He causes you no interference, no matter what path you tread. He does not even stop you from going wrong, if that's where you are heading. He allows you to be wrong if you so wish, and in His tender love He does not remove His energy from you, but waits. He awaits your pleasure. He hopes that one day you will return and when you do -- ah, what joy, what ecstasy he feels! SEEING ALL THIS AND THINKING OF IT, HE FLOWERS IN HAPPINESS, NANAK SAYS, TO DESCRIBE HIM IS LIKE CHEWING ON IRON. This is certainly so, for there all contradictions are laid to rest, and become one. I have studied the lives of many people and find that we can move towards any extreme and do all kinds of things, but all extremes can be very dangerous. I know a very possessive husband who follows his wife not just as a shadow, but like a ghost. When he is in the office he is always worried; perhaps his wife is laughing with someone and having a good time. He would leave his work and pay surprise visits home just to check on her. He cannot bear her talking and laughing with others without him. He firmly believes in the descriptions of the wife given by Kalidas, the famous Indian poet. In one of his best known poems he describes a wife so pining away from a fifteen-day absence from her beloved, that she 'wilts away and becomes like a skeleton' and then she describes it all in messages sent to him with the clouds. This constant siege from all sides has filled the wife with boredom and subtle hatred. Theirs had been a marriage of love. They had been very much in love. I could see that, and I knew them for a long time. But when the husbands love became so excessive, his hands no longer formed a garland around her neck, but became a noose. It is not diamonds and gold alone that bind; such love could also be fatal. The wife's love began to diminish and she began dreaming of being freed from her husband. The more independent she tried to become, the more restrictions he created for her. I explained to the husband that this was madness, that he was killing his wife's love for him with his own hands. Love also wants freedom and a chance to breath. Love needs a little distance, a little aloneness, some time to oneself. I advised him, "Don't be after her so much or you will kill her love for you. Then you will have only yourself to blame." After a great deal of discussion the husband began to see some sense in it, but then he began to disregard her completely. Now even if he saw her in bed with another man, it would make no difference to him. He says he has given up his possessiveness. He says, "Now I have nothing to do with her. She can do what she pleases. I am in no way connected with her now." The only type of connection he knows is a noose. This is a natural human trait. If full freedom is given as in the West, it tends to become total indifference, or we set up such a complete subjugation that it can strangle. This is what is happening in the East. To say anything about God is as good as 'chewing on iron', so difficult is it. He is both: He gives you full freedom, but His love is not an iota less on account of this. He leaves you free, which is the only genuine love.. There is no conflict between His love and the freedom He gives you; He does not stop you even if your feet go astray, but waits patiently for you to return. When you retrace your steps and the prodigal comes home -- oh the joy, the celebration! Nanak says: He worries about you and thinks of you. He rejoices in you. He does not stand apart, unaffected; His nonattachment is filled with a deep essential affection. He is far and yet He is near. He has left you to do as you please, and yet His eye is always on you. He has never, never left you. He always stands besides you. Your sorrow and anguish touch Him; your joy and happiness fill Him with cheer. You are not a stranger in this universe; it is your house. You are not alone in this world. God is always with you. This assurance and comfort has deep meaning for the devotee; otherwise there is nothing. If you put aside the thought of God, the world stands untouched, unconcerned beside you; it does not bother what you do or what you do not do, whether you live or whether you die. Let the storm take you; there is no one to care. But for the devotee there is great assurance and solace in the feeling that 'someone is waiting for me'. When you return home you will not find it empty; when you return inwards to your own nature you will find God awaiting you. Not only will you find Him waiting, but you will be enchanted by all the arrangements for the celebration He has made in your house. A story that Jesus told time and again is well worth understanding. A rich man had two sons. One boy turned into a vagabond. When he came of age he demanded his half share, which he took and left for the city, for the village offered no means of spending his money: there were no gambling houses, no taverns, no prostitutes. He lost every penny he had in these pursuits and become a roadside beggar. The father was keeping track of him. When he heard of his son's destitution, he was very unhappy. He knew that it was useless to try to bring him back by force, for that might take him farther away. He could only wait, hoping that when his son began to see things in their right perspective he would return on his own. The elder son remained at home. He worked hard and had doubled the remaining inheritance. He plowed the fields and tended the vineyards, working from morning to night. Then one day it occurred to the beggar son: "I shall die this way. I still have a home. My father is alive and I can count on his love. He gave me an opportunity to learn for myself what is right and what is wrong, so I am sure his compassion will not fail me now and he will take me back to his heart. I have full confidence in him." One day he sent word to his father that he was coming home. The father arranged a grand reception. He had lambs butchered and the best of everything prepared, for his son was coming home. He decorated the whole village with flowers and invited everybody in the village. The elder brother was in the fields. Someone went to him and said, "It is so injust! You have served your father faithfully your whole life and have doubled and trebled his assets. You have never gone against his wishes, yet he never arranged such a grand reception in your honor. Now your brother who squandered his inheritance on wine, women and song is returning, and look at what your father is doing for him. It is rank injustice." The elder brother also felt it was unfair. He returned home saddened and downhearted. He saw the lamps and the flowers set out in his brother's honor and could bear it no longer. He went to his father and said, "I have served you and obeyed you my whole life, but you have never prepared a feast in my honor. Today this prodigal son of yours returns home and look how much you have done to receive him. I can't believe my eyes." The father replied, "Son, you have always been near me. You never went astray, so there was no need to welcome you. You are always with me and welcome every moment. You are so close to my heart, but this boy who went astray, who wandered and ruined himself, and for whom I spent so many anxious, sleepless nights, he is returning and needs to be welcomed. You gave me no cause for worry; instead I have always been happy and pleased with you, so there is no need to express excessive happiness in your case." When the prodigal returns a magnificent reception is called for. Jesus would say: Good people, holy men and saints, are like the elder brother; those who have gone stray, sinned, committed crimes, are like the younger brother. Jesus made this a wonderful beginning for his spiritual teachings and because of this, the Jews turned against him. For the Jews believe that he who sins is punished by God; whereas Jesus has said He will welcome him when he returns for He loves him. Do as much wrong as you please, you cannot remove yourself from His heart. You may show your back to Him but He will wait. He is the Father of all. We have a very deep connection with existence, and existence feels pleased -- so the Hindus have known from time immemorial. That is why it is said that when a person attains buddhahood flowers bloom out of season. Flowers open when Buddha passes by, whatever the season, for existence is filled with bliss at that moment. This is what Nanak is saying, that He is so filled with joy and dances in ecstasy whenever the prodigal returns. This is the union of freedom and love. Do what you will, you cannot displease Him. His love for you is much deeper than anything you might do. But His attachment is not like yours. He doesn't chain you by the neck. God is not a prison; God is love and freedom. It is difficult to explain, for they appear so contrary, for when you love a person you take away his freedom, and when you give freedom you say goodbye to love. Where affection and nonaffection both are, where desire and desirelessness both are, where all contradictions unite, there is the great confluence. NANAK SAYS, TO DESCRIBE HIM IS LIKE CHEWING ON IRON."

That too is fine, as long as you keep in mind that this image that you are holding on to is just a tool for your mind to hold on to when it tries to run in thousand different directions. Images can provoke deep devotional responses which can aid the meditator. I say go with the flow of things, if it works for you so that your mind becomes silent, then i don't see any reason to not do this. But keep in mind that what you are using is just a leash for the mind, so that it can become more silent. Pray for guidence before you begin your meditation.

A thoughful reply my veer. I don't disagree with your statements, they seem pretty valid with what little i know. But the question to your original question is what exactly? What is the seed?

If only you had given your insulting remarks some deep thought, you would've found something hidden in your own remarks.

Is it not I(ego) as a seed that must break out of its boundries of its encasing (selfish desires)? Is it not the seed (I-self) that contain within it the whole of tree? It is said that the seed never meets the tree, but the tree is hidden within the seed. Is this tree of divinity hidden within us all? Whether it is the layer illusion of ego or body that holds us from this realization, the seed must erupt into a tree. Is it not the seed of your self identity that must be lost or broken before the tree of divinity can explode from within you? no ego is the herbicide!!! its YOU not I Yes, but it is this ego that give gives you the perception of a seperation, it is this ego that allows you to express humility, it is this ego that brings you the Anand of Surrender, it is this ego that gives you freedom, it is this ego that allow you to act out of Love from the perception of a seperated lover. Whether this act is a mere illusion is another thought, but regardless this ego has its function. After all it is only when we are seperated that we realize the significance of what we had. It is so then that we yearn to find that which we have lost. If it were not for this ego, we'd have nothing to surrender, for the only significant thing we have that we can give as a gift to the Guru is yourself, your ego, your I.

Am I the seed?

If Guru Nanak stood infront of you in flesh and blood, would you still hold this view?

Why do you think that it is maya or your Ego that is giving you this suggestion of you are good without Sangat? Where will you go without your Sangat? The mere fact that you considered this influnce to be arriving from Maya and not your inner voice, tell me perhaps you should stick with what you have going on. Trust your intuition. I suggest you Sincerely pray for guidence and let the one who put you on this path guide you.

It is the difficulty of the Journey. Remember, try to contextualize the words, as the shabads are written to project a certain state of the mind or a stage in the Journey. It is not so that the whole Journey is going to be depressing, rather it is a state when this mind lookes ahead at the path and sees the amount of distance it must travel to attain his or her goal. Hence the last line Fareed ji says to start early on this path due to the length of this journey. You will find other Shabads that contradict this one when relating to the journey, but that is not to say there is a contradiction. Both shabads state different stages one may face in their journey. The path is depressing because the path is sharper and the edge of a sword and it is narrow. The Fridakot Teeka translates kharee Udeenee as Ati Udaas which does not mean necessarily mean depressed. It can also mean a deep Sadness or dukhdai (painfull, arduous). It then relates Ati Udaas to death awaiting me on this Path. It is but a glimpse of a stage one may encounter on their journey when he or she fully realizes the journey that is ahead of them that they have not yet begun.

I advice you to do the same veer ji.

beautiful...

The answer to your question is the answer to, "Are you Ready to Die?" (Egoistically and Physically)

What do you think is the Definition of Saint and what suggestion/advice/hukam does the Guru prescribes to you regarding those Saints?

This shabad is about Guru and Prabh. To use it to fool people into bowing to ur derawala is mahapaap equal to that of masands and meenas, andd dheermulleas, etc. You tools have ruined the Panth. So every Sant is a "Derawalla" and to that which you have automatically branded to be Fake, lying imposter. Which is fine given that 99% of these Derawalla "Sants" are exactly that. But what made you think that the quote is speaking interms to those fake derawallas and not to those which are True in their essence of what the Definition of a Sant is? Don't uproot the tree of apples because you don't care to or don't have the patience to shuffle through them to find that one apple which is in perfect condition.

What is done is done...Ask for forgiveness in your heart with her in your mind and move on. What happend was indirectly related to you, you simply became an excuse for your parents to delieve their spite. Ask for forgiveness on their behalf as well. It is not always necessary to be in the Physical presence of another to ask for forgiveness. Sometimes the wavelength of our Hearts can carry our intents across the world. Be content in your own self my veer.

All those who are suggesting next time he sees her he should take a thaalee of Ladoos in his hand need to slow down. There is a mountain of difference in infatuation and the state where one can consider another for marriage. He needs to define in which state his mind is in.

Isn't it also a possibility that your parents are acting selfishly to avoid the burdon of a un-married daughter on their shoulders? You first need to understand their true intention to get you married. Is it because they consider you a burdon, perhaps not in a direct or insensitive manner but maybe it is there in their unconscious. If so then convince them otherwise. If it is out of Parenting Love, then Love is such a force that it can rise above any conflict, with a little bit of mending through an honest discussion. If they are doing it for your benefit, then perhaps they odn't understand your decision to lead such life. As it does not fit into their norm of living they had expected for their children. It is not so much that you are wrong in wanting such a life style, it is the inability for both parties to reach a common consensus on what is the best for you. Often (indian) parents find their childrens ambitions to be rather child like with no real foundation. The thing is all they have been taught, all they have known is this way of living. You get a Job, get married, raise a family, teach them education, marry them off and the cycle continues. It is an efficient and in most cases productive to the Society as a whole. So it continues. This has happened to them, because it had happened to their parents and their Grand parents and so forth, now it is again being used upon their children. All they know is that this system works and for the 90% of your generation it does, but there are those exception who rebel. The result from the rebellion is almost always dependent upon the openess and the sensativity to hear their children that the parents must posses. Their ability to understand and let go of this norm-cycle, to create a detour for their children from this Social Norm which is almost hard-wired in their minds. So you have to understand their side of the situation as well. I can't think of any other way but an open an Honest, Sensable and Resonable dialogue. One thing is for sure is that you better have thought this out to consider every possibility of your future. If your parents are not easily convinced as it is looks to be the case, you better provide them valid yet reasonable plans for your future to which they can relate to. Best of luck to you my dear sis :D Waheguru

What exactly are you seeking from her?

http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showtopic=18543&hl= **MODs/Admin Can i get a Global Sticky please? **

nice link here is another refrencing the Kabbalah and our ability to create what we see. and another

what will you do IF you do meet with that someone? Is that person easy to get in contact with? If you are so passionate about meeting that individual, then what is holding you back? At the same time, don't lose yourself in dreaming and forget about what you have in front of you...the life you are leading right now. It is perhaps more prescious than chasing a dream which might leave you stranded in the middle of your dream and your present life. So if you feel that after meeting this person you'd be able to live yourself free of this dream then why not. Sometimes we have to face things to resolve them.

How does this quote relate to what you are trying to say.

Yes and No Yes it will and can affect you. Food itself is very reception of vibrations both good and bad. While preparing the food it is nearly essential to prepare food with positive thoughts, with the thoughts of Love, so that the consumer of the food can also benefit from it. With the possession of enough sensativity one can certainly tell the difference between the food that is made while in anger or negative thought and the food that is made out of love. No it will not affect you if you are able to transfrom the food that is prepared infront of you with prayer into Amrit.