Mehtab Singh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3G0FV_rRso8

Mr Inder Just because Article 25 of the Indian constitution says that Sikhs are Hindus does not make Sikhs Hindus. 2 things, firstly, the name of our way of life is not Sikhism, its Sikhi or GurSikhi. It was the British who coined the term Sikhism, I think? And although people may also want to blame the British for differentiating Sikhi from Hinduism, fact is that Guru Sahibaan had long before already blessed His Panth as distinct and unique from all other pre-existing faiths. Secondly, I am not sure if this is even a religion, or a way of life. Earlier on I used to say its a way of life and death, its a spiritually developmental journey of the soul, etc. But anyone can claim the same about their religion as well. Hinduism is a tradition/culture, not exactly a religion per say. Buddhism and Jainism are probably more of philosophies you could say. The 3 Semitic religions born in the Middle East (Judaism, Christianity & Islam) might be considered religions based on the definition of religion. Each and every one of them can claim to be a spiritually developmental journey of the soul using their own logic. So how do I define Sikhi as unique? The one word I can think of right now in the English language which can define Sikhi is CHALLENGE. From day one Sikhi has been about challenges. Guru Sahibaan challenged the evils of society when They were physically present on earth in human form. Caste system, gender inequality, female infanticide, exploitation and oppression of the economically weaker sections of society, blind rituals and superstitions, you name it. Then later on They challenged the tyrant rulers. After 1708 the Khalsa challenged both the Mughals and the foreign Afghan invaders. In later stages more recently it was the British and in present times the Indian regime who have faced challenges from the Khalsa. Besides these, there are the internal challenges to fight our vikaars within us. When you become a Sikh, you take up the challenge to 1.) control your vikaars 2.) raise your voice against the evils prevailing in society 3.) fight oppressive regimes and invasions of tyrants There are several more which I may not be able to think of as I type right now, but there are definitely tons more. Sikhi is about taking up the challenge. Winning or losing doesnt always really matter. Once we become Vaheguru Jee Ka Khalsa, we will automatically get Fateh (victory) because Vaheguru Jee Kee Fateh, that Fateh also belongs to Vaheguru Jee. When Dasmesh Pita demanded 5 heads, that was also a challenge. When Shaheed Baba Deep Singh Jee asked only those who were ready to die to come forward, that was also a challenge. In 1947, Sikhs had the option of either joining India, or Pakistan, or having a country of their own. Since the Sikh leader Master Tara Singh was very naive, and stronger on rhetoric than on being practical, he fell prey to Nehrus words of assurance that Sikhs would fare better if they joined India. And so thats what happened Sikhs did choose to join India. In the past decade or so, a new zeal has developed among the Sangh parivaar to somehow make Indiaa Hindu rashtra. Since the Muslims were given Pakistan, they probably dont have much choice left. Other communities like Christians are in very small numbers and so pose no threat to the communal factions in India. The ones who can be a headache for them tomorrow are obviously the Sikhs as they were promised a secular country in 1947 and so any idea of a country based on one particular religion will never be accepted by them. The first thing they will demand will be that Punjab be handed over to the Sikhs as a country distinct and different from this supposed Hindu rashtra. Thats another scenario the communal factions can never allow to happen. They cannot let go of defense forces like the Sikh regiment, Sikh Light Infantry and Punjab regiment. They cannot part with 40% of India wheat. So at any cost Punjab needs to remain with India. The only way to do this is to pacify the Sikhs so that they dont pose any risk and happily agree to be part of the Hindu rashtra. There are 2 ways to terminate your foe. One is annihilation which means finishing him off by force. This is what the Mughals did and killed scores and scores of Sikhs. The other is assimilation, which is when you make your foe join your ranks, and you use his power and resources for your own benefits. Thats what the present day communal factions in India are doing to the Sikhs, and this is where the Sikhs are Hindus concept has to be introduced. Recently I heard a discourse according to which there are 12,700 villages in Punjab, and 13,000 Sikh saints dwell in them. The striking point is that all these saints sprang up only after 1984. Thus one starts questioning their existence before 1984 and the sudden resurfacing only after the Sikhs went through a holocaust. The Sikhs are Hindus concept is thus a vital tool in convincing the Sikhs that they are a part of the Hindu rashtra. Not that Sikhs have anything against Hindus, but trying to manipulate an entire communitys history and scriptures just to tamper with their ideology and personality for selfish personal motives is severely disgusting. A number of attempts have been made to portray the Sikh Gurus as Hindus, to misinterpret Gurbani in a way that it also declares the equivalency of Sikhs and Hindus, and to further belittle the Sikh religion by branding it as an offshoot of Hinduism. Several upon several references and quotes from Gurbani and a number of other textual and historical sources that clearly outline Sikhisms unique, distinct and different identity are not even bothered to be studied by these communal factions. They even reject some valuable historic events such as Guru Tegh Bahadur Jee sacrificing His life for saving Hinduism and label it as incorrect information. These people forget the fact that Sikhism came at a time when historians had already started penning down history, whereas their own faith had its scriptures only after the original orator was not around anymore. The inclusion of verses by Hindu and Muslim saints in SREE GURU GRANTH SAHIB JEE is seen as a compilation of items copied from other faiths and incorporated into Sikhism, whereas the truth that SREE GURU GRANTH SAHIB JEE is indeed the only scripture that crosses boundaries of religion is sadly overlooked. Indiawas a slave under the British for some 200 years, a slave under Muslims for some 500 years, and slave to others such as Greeks, Persians and Afghans too. It has been a slave under foreign invaders for at least a millennium. The Sikhs who fought the oppressive Mughal and British governments are made to believe that they are supposed to live as subservient to those who were slaves for 1000 years. How hilarious is that! Those who deny the fact that it was Guru Gobind Singh Jee who saved Hindustan from complete cultural and religious annihilation need to familiarize themselves with a couplet by Baba Bulle Shah: na kahu ab ki, na kahu tab ki, agar na hotay Guru Gobind Singh, to sunnat hoti sab ki, which is translated as I dont talk about the present or the future, but if it wasnt for Guru Gobind Singh, all would be circumsized which implies that all of India would have converted to Islam. These were words by a Sufi Muslim saint and yet the communal factions refuse to accept it. Other reasons as to why such campaigns are started to confuse Sikhs about their identity remains partly obvious and partly yet to be investigated. Perhaps those who try to confuse the Sikhs are themselves confused about their own respective religions. Perhaps they find Sikhism, Sikh history and the immense knowledge in Sikhi too intimidating, and so to hide their fragile self-esteem they make fun of Sikhs in order to make a Sikh feel ashamed of his/her identity. After all its human nature to bring down anyone heading higher than you, to pull back anyone getting ahead of you, and so such individuals would do anything to mess up a Sikhs mind and try their best to break off a Sikh with Sikhi, and eventually break him/her off from Gurujee. If you raise a lions cub with kittens and puppies, initially the cub may consider itself as part of them. But as the cub grows and realizes that it looks different, that its characteristics are different, it will no longer categorize itself as a cat or dog. The same is for the present Sikh generation in India. All you need to give a cub to make it realize its true self is a small sip of blood (the famous Hindi phrase sher ke mooh khoon lag jana comes to mind). Similarly, the day those Sikhs realize that they are unique, distinct and different, the day they get a taste of their history written in the blood of countless shaheeds, the day they drink the divine elixir of Gurbani, all attempts by any of such communal factions to further mislead the Sikhs will fail miserably. To conclude, all I want to say is that Sikhs have gone through the worst possible ever in the few centuries of their history. Time and again repeated attempts have been made to finish or subjugate them in one way or another. Those who do so need to remember that this community of lions started by Guru Gobind Singh Jee does not owe any allegiance to anyone but their Guru, and since lions dont fear sheeps, it is pointless to even try. Guru Gobind Singh Jee said Vaaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa Vaaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh. He didnt announce that His Sikhs were a sub-sect of a pre-existing community, He called them Khalsa! He didnt have them owe allegiance to gods/goddesses/prophets, He made them owe allegiance only and only to Vaaheguroo! Thus the Sikh greeting of Vaaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa Vaaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh is in itself a complete declaration of the distinct, unique and different identity of the Sikhs. Any attempt/effort made to modify/dissolve/tarnish it will only meet with stiff resistance and insulting defeat.

lol not all, but way too many, for some reason i doubt you'd fall under that category. changaa jee, i will, right after this post i wish i was intelligent too...alas! leh tenu kee pata! koee gall ni jee

Compare that with 1947 where Sikhs ensured that the Muslims of Malerkotla were left unharmed only because Sher Muhammad Khan protested against the killing of the Chhote Sahibzaade. It shows that Sikhs never forget their friends or enemies for centuries. Indians on the other hand, especially Hindutva loving fanatic Hindus see everyone who doesn't agree with them as a foe. India right now has an element which is called by some columnists as the "Hindu Taliban". And every Diwali gift your Hindu friends with a huge frame carrying this picture

You're blessed if you can dream. Atleast you hope/expect to see good for the qaum.

Glad to see you smile! Yes, posting here possibly wasn't the best idea. You see we have people over here who can't even stare at a Hindu for 45 seconds, but come on here posting as though they could slaughter all 800 million of them in a day. Then we have those who cannot answer the dumbest questions thrown by Muslims at them and they come here and turn scholars (God bless copy-paste). 99% of the above mentioned creatures have beards less than 0.5 inches and are yet to receive college degrees. Now tell me, do you (32 and working) really want advise about your life from the kind of breed that breeds here? What am I doing here? Promise me you won't laugh? Well I still have no clue! Entertainment you might say :D

sarbat da bhala and human rights, freedom, welfare, peace, justice for all.

That is not correct, but choice is yours.

Here is where we need to learn from the Jews. They number less than the Sikhs yet they are the biggest stakeholders in America's economy, thus influencing global economy. They are stuck in the middle of ferocious enemies like the tongue between the teeth yet they have managed to keep their enemy movements in check. How did they manage this? They ensured (a.) never to forget their language, (b.) never to forget their scriptures, (c.) ensure top level and highest education for their future generations, (d.) enshrine the notion of "you are a slave and need to break the shackles of slavery" within the minds of their progeny. Believe me, until the day comes when Sikhs are in a position where they hold an irreplaceable asset extremely dear to the western powers, nobody is going to give a damn about how many massacres we have suffered. We couldn't even have the UN declare 1984 as genocide, they merely labelled it as human rights violations and asked us to shut up. Ever wondered why? Make sure your next generation is more educated than you are, and then urge them to make sure that their next generation is more educated than their previous one. Keep going this way for a few generations and you will have these super powers fall at your feet. Sorry guys, we do NOT have numbers like Christians/Muslims/Hindus that the world will even notice us. But we can make use of whatever we have, in a way that they HAVE TO depend on us someday for something valuable to them, and I am talking in economic terms. The world today is not ruled by governments, its ruled by elite corporations. Regarding suing governments of UK or India, how about we start with questioning our "Panthic" Punjab sarkaar about what the hell had happened?

yaar Limca kaahde vaaste bnai aa ?

You guys are wasting your time preaching to the wrong listener. She didn't come here asking how to convert her white boyfriend to Sikhi. The way I see it, she probably wants to find a way to work things out so that she can (a.) have her parents blessings in order to marry the man of her choice; (b.) not break up with him and marry the guy her family chooses for her. If you can advise her on that, good, otherwise please read other threads, and thank you. Lets get one thing straight. I really don't want to say "Sikhi isn't for everyone", but we have to admit that "everyone cannot dare to be a Sikh". It is not Sikhi that is her issue, it is the Punjabi culture practiced by her folks. Her priority is not to find a Sikh guy, its to be with the one she claims to have "clicked with". So I would request to treat this scenario a bit differently. Its very easy to preach and advise someone when you have no idea what they're going through (this applies to me as well). So take a moment and think before you guys type whatever you are typing. Some of you already seem to have passed the verdict on the dude just because he is white. To be honest, the only mistake she did in her life so far was perhaps coming to this forum asking for advise.

A large mob of Hindus attacked members of the Sikh community in Mattan whilst they were changing the Gurdwaras Nishan Sahib. Police intervention prevented the incident from escalating further in the Mattan area of Indias Kashmir District. The issue has been ongoing over a land dispute between Gurdwara Mattan Sahib and Surya Mandir, which are situated on the same site. A few Sangat members were changing the Nishan Sahib at the Gurdwara and were then viciously attacked by a large mob of youths armed with weapons. The group of thugs pelted stones at the Sangat whilst shouting derogatory slogans at them. The Gurdwara Parbandhak Committee stated We were just changing the Nishan Sahib and were suddenly attacked by a large mob of Hindus. They swore at us and then pelted stones due to which we suffered injuries. The SHO of Mattan, Bashir Ahmad claims that the situation is now under control. The land dispute case has been pending in the apex court for a while and is still unresolved. http://www.punjabnews.tv/sikh/sikh-hindu-clash-gurdwara-mandir-land-dispute/ Height of thanklessness! This is the same temple from where the Kashmiri Pandits started their journey to Sri Anandpur Sahib where they went to beg Sahib Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur Patshah Jee Maharaj to save Hinduism!!!!!

It would be good if you told your folks about this guy, atleast your mom or sis if you're really scared to tell your dad. Would it be possible for you to arrange a meeting between your parents/family and the white gentleman? Perhaps they might change their mind once they meet him? Or perhaps you might change yours once the meeting is over? Think about it, and if possible, see if you can work it out.

Just read this newspiece today. These guys are possibly the only descendants of Bhai Mati Das Jee left. http://ibnlive.in.com/news/lone-hindu-brahmin-family-in-pakistans-chakwal-leads-a-secluded-life/485869-56.html

ਗੁਰਿ ਕਹਿਆ ਸਾ ਕਾਰ ਕਮਾਵਹੁ ॥ Do those deeds which the Guru has ordained. ਗੁਰ ਕੀ ਕਰਣੀ ਕਾਹੇ ਧਾਵਹੁ ॥ Why are you chasing after the Guru's actions?

Funny how the guy who started this thread never came back even once after May 17th, i.e. the day he started this thread, and did not post a single message after that one. Anyways, carry on....

I personally like both teams, and will be watching it purely for fun. What about you guys?

Also check this out: http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/73370-the-sikh-martyr-of-guru-nanak-period/?p=599075

Where did mention the word miracle? Guru Sahib was much more than just a mere man, and His ਸਮਰਥਾ is way beyond mere miracles.

I really wanted to avoid getting into this, but anyways..... So basically what Maskeen jee said in one of his kathas (which I was unable to find on Youtube but heard it a long while back) was an explaination of Bhagat Naamdev Jee's shabad. Maskeen jee admits that just like several of you on here, he too used to think that this entire turning of the Kaaba was a metaphor used by Bhai Gurdas Jee. But on a visit to the temple in Maharashtra mentioned in the Shabad, Maskeen jee came across a writing on the temple wall which actually authenticates this claim that the temple DID MOVE. Believe it or not, the Pandits there themselves confess to it, that Bhagat Naamdev Jee (who in their language was a lower caste) did worship there and the temple turned. Most of you guys obviously wouldn't have a clue that Hindu temples (for whatever reason) are always facing east. Guess what, this particular temple is the only one on planet earth that faces west. No, it was not constructed that way, it ACTUALLY turned as the Shabad states. If a Bhagat of Vaheguru can make such a thing take place, what is there to stop Guru Sahib Himself? Now Bhagat Gurdas Jee's Vaar I wouldn't blame you guys if you didn't understand any other Indian language outside of Punjab, but I would have expected you to have at least some understanding of Punjabi. "ਫਿਰਿਆ" here means "turned around", "ਹੋਇ" here is plural, referring to how ALL the people there were shocked (ਹੈਰਾਨੁ). What next? "ਕਰੇਨਿ ਜੁਹਾਰੀ", they ALL bowed to Guru Sahib. So, it was not just Jeevan who saw Kaaba turning, it was ALL of them, thus ALL were shocked, and ALL bowed to Guru Sahib. And no this is NOT used metaphorically. Neither Guru Sahib nor Bhai Gurdas Jee loved telling fairy tales, they spoke only the truth. Couple of questions. Those asking "If Guru Sahib pointed His feet towards Kaaba, whats wrong if I point my feet towards Sri Guru Granth Sahib". My question is, are any of those guys at Guru Sahib's level? Guru Sahib did that to teach a priceless lesson, that Vaheguru is everywhere (something those Islamic convert seekers don't accept to this day when they come on here asking "so is your god also there where there is sewage?"). What lesson are those folks trying to teach when they point their feet to Maharaj's saroop? Secondly, do these guys know the difference between the Kaaba and Maharaj's saroop? Ask a Sunni, Shia, Christian, Jew about the Kaaba, they will have a different definition of it. Hang on, spare Google for now. Has anyone of you ever bothered asking one of these people what the Kaaba is for them? Try it, you will be even more confused because none of them have a single definition. Oh and don't forget asking your favorites, the Hindus ofcourse! Their theory puts a Shivling right inside the Kaaba! LOL! You're trying to compare that with Maharaj's saroop? The same Bani given Gurta Gaddee by Sahib-E-Kamaal Dasmesh Pita? Yeah? Really? Wake up! Guru Sahib had NO intention to disrespect anyone's religion ever. He came to preach the message of truth which everyone had forgotten. He did it whatever way He chose best. So in the end, as usual, once again... And did I forget this... And also... Thats what Gurbani says. And based on that, we can say that turning the Kaaba, or ANYTHING, is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING for Guru Sahib. Because ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਮੇਰਾ ਵਡ ਸਮਰਥਾ ॥

If all this works out successfully, someday we may have a North American GPC, European GPC, etc. to look into the local affairs of Sikhs and report directly to Sri Akal Takht Sahib.

Likewise! :biggrin2: Only thing is I came 11 years ago

Listen to Maskeen jee to clear your doubts.

http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/49632-the-psychology-behind-the-reason-why-some-non-sikhs-converted-to-sikhism-and-joined-the-khalistani-movement/?p=605293