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If you wish to discuss it personally with me, lets discuss it openly with any rules of engagement- here is the thread: http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/16500-sikh-beating-another-sikh-elderly-sikh-begging-for-their-mercy-crying/ There was clear outrage on facebook, as that video was shared 70,000 times alone on facebook and had 1.9 million views. Daily sikh update condemn it so as sikh24 channel. Anyway i must stay on topic on here.

No its not fine if you are perceiving things in relative dualistic context. But beyond relative context, there is absolute non duality source of everything perspective, so from that perspective its fine, its irrelevant as such distinction does not exist in hat state of mind.

They say this year Canadian election is one of most anticipated election as it will be tight race..so who you guys thinking of voting? I voted ndp last election, this year i am voting liberal as last year vote towards ndp ended up in vote splitting, giving majority to harper so this year we have to make sure we vote smart if we want to get rid of harper..polls are showing ndp is already falling. what you guys think? Main great points of liberal - They are neither right wing or left wing, neutral as he said harper wants us to live under fear that there is terrorist hiding behind the tree, and thomas muclair want us to have romanticize view of things - live in la la land where there are unicorns flying... away from reality. - Trudeau is charismatic passionate natural leader compare to thomas muclair who is so political that his playing a nice guy attitude (telling people what they want to hear) its frankly scary, it does not take principled - truth/integrity stance..he tells anglo Canadian one thing and franco Canadians another thing - speaking to middle class - liberals have great history of surplus in the country and champions of human rights within Canada. - liberals usually launch lots of rehabilitation programs for convicts in jail- integrate people back in society. I don't mind ndp either, if jack layton was alive..i would have voted for him too. But i don't know about this guy thomas muclair..more talk no substance..he promising so many things ..how he is going to full fill them...he fails to give us clear concise framework plan.

It's Nikon d750 with NIKON AFS-VR 70-300 F4-5.6 TELEZOOM LENS I made a mistake on the lens, they say for beginner landscape photography- NIKON AF-S NIKKOR 50MM F1.4G LENS is recommended for wider angle shots so you have wider depth of field.. but i guess benefit of those zoom lense was wild life photography shots, you can zoom right in, those pictures really look close by due to zoom as i must be atleast 40-50 meters away from shots..it was great experience.

No it was me, i simply lost it..i was livid...I was abhorrent on the fact eldery- father like figure sikh figure being beaten up violently..it wasn't only me who was outraged...after the fact we all saw how sikh sangat out in west was equally outraged as well, it was resounding condemnation from all squares from sangat out in west and back home resulting on arrest of individuals. All of us are made out of five element body- air, water, earth, sky(space), fire (energy) whole teaching of gurmat is to find out our real essence which is beyond body, body sense perceptions, mind.

I think its due to election time, parties aren't taking any chances any opinion which is contrary to public opinion remotely sounds against charters of rights or seem controversial are being rejected, mps are dropped..i think in just last one month, all parties had dropped mps from all walks of life of making remarks which is contrary to public opinion/votes...its election time its too much at stake carry unnecessary baggage (controversies)..parties simply can't afford to loose election on these things and besides we all know h ow media amplifies them three times these days. Another point, i am not sure how any sikh can vote conservatives let alone be conservative mp are so hell bent banning niqab...we don't agree with them but they have a right to wear it...it was same stephen harper who back in 1990 wanted to ban turban in rcmp.

Depends on the state of mind of person, person may only see five elemental body but ask whats source of everything? and drop a inquiry in your intuitation how exactly Waheguru is all pervading? Bring it in your direct experience, your questions will fall away and even questioner will fall away.

From absolute non dual one solid reality in mool mantar they don't exist as separate/independent reality and hence many great gyanis in our panth have done antriv arths(deep meaning) of gurbani tukhs along with sargun and uthanka. However, in relative reality-sargun, they very much exist do exist in relative reality(lower planes bound by subtle five elemental maya) maya which is mentioned in Sikhi. In other words, from standpoint of absolute non dual one solid reality in mool mantar once our consciousness is merged in its source it ensues full realization of mool mantar which is supreme state/sehaj samadhi ( thoughtless spontaneous effortless state ) in that state - they simply don't exist but as soon one perceives fragmented reality maya relative realities then they do exist. Everything is connected with your perception or perceive as world does not independent reality on its own, you create world and you destroy it. For example again everyone can relate to this example- they simply don't exist hell even world does not exist when we are all gone in deep sleep every night. Supreme state is just like deep sleep without any thoughts- stillness except there is pure awareness/knowledge realization.

This is interesting topic, based on my research and understanding: There is no hell or heaven in Absolute reality of Sikhi but hell/heaven do exist in relative reality(lower planes bound by subtle five elemental maya) maya which is mentioned in Sikhi. Divinity has meta reality soley based on one's cognition. Here is an example from gurbani by bhagat kabir when bhagat kabir talks- Kya Narak, Kya Surag Vichaara, Santan Doneo Roade || Perception of hell or heaven does not exist in saint's consciousness (there is no conceptual organized independent separate reality out there somewhere up in the sky- Indeed, what we perceive is our reality) , so to them why even vichar about it among themselves? Both are rejected. Now that does not mean hell or heaven literally don't exist , it very much exist but on separate meta reality level/ human consciousness level but does not exist in one solid non dual absolute reality in sikhi mentioned in mool mantar.

Well did he made those public comments in news paper while holding public office as mp? I beleive its conflict of interest. its in the contract. No integrate comment make sense, one of elderly gursikh told me once...it make perfect sense with canadian charters rights of freedom as how can any of us- poke a hole/disregard same charter rights of freedom which has given us freedom to practise our five ks freely..our singhs are rightly quote same charters right and freedoms to ride bicycle without helmet.

Will do, here is one from this august recently: http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/16507-getting-into-nature-photography-any-good-dslr/?page=2 May be we can connect on nature level

Amazing post, totally agree. Naam Simran = Truth(real self- Naam- pure jagad jot within/gurmantar/shabad gyan) remembrance moment to moment that itself becomes meditation in later stage.

In puratan gurmukh parkash,..Sant gurbachan singh bhindrawale talking about his avastha that there is no forne at all so what questions i can ask or answer i can give , singing glory of atma/ supreme consciousness talks about maha vak* upon asking if you have any questions from sant sunder singh bhindranwale From time - 00:02:01 http://www.mahapurakh.com/multimedia/Sant_Sundar_Singh_Ji/32kbps_mp3/45_Sukham_Pdarth_Vichar.mp3 *http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/74815-deep-gnosis-behind-mahavak-in-gurbani/

The problem sn't what his statement said - he can believe whatever he wants to do, he has full right to do so but problem he along with other likes him using political secular platform/his mp position to spread his views. He has speak to all of his constituents not just sikhs. Its not limited to only sikh only platform...also i have seen others also including evangelical / Anglican/sharia islamic influenced people also bringing their views as well in secular context- which is contrary to fabric of this great Canadian nation - charter right and freedoms. It's so ironic that people will attack same values - charter right and freedoms which gave them full rights to practise of religion, liberty, to wear whatever they wish when they are in comfortable position. We should stop becoming like ungrateful people who eats the hands that feed them, give them opportunity to start a new life in country but yes at the same time we should also be vary of going too left as well. Integrate not annihilate. Thats the key.

DSGkeepingitreal, I like to answer your questions in detail on http://www.sikhawareness.com/ even I am up for chat on sikhawareness.com under chat feature to sort out issues you have against me since you have quite a bit issues with me... I will not answer any personal questions on here tu tu mein discussion here but i will address your allegations you bought up. Myth- Khaliban term was somehow invented by me. Fact - I been on cyber sikh sangat affairs both on sikhsangat and on sikhawareness.com before you know it since 2003 and quite bluntly when you realize your own existence.. khaliban term was never previously pre 2013 used by me or heard before up until 2012 .. go ahead search our archives and archives khaliban term was recent phenomena Khaliban term was coined recently on facebook to highlight extremism cases in uk sikh community specially- High profile cases starting beating of our elderly in leamington spa. Not sure who created it but first time i heard it on facebook which singhs windows were smashed, camp feuds between singhs resulting car windows smashed, own sikhs were threatened by own just because one was from different group or tribe. I do support this usage of term to discourage youths who are potentially slipping to radicalization..i have used this term before when some of our misguided fanatic bunch start using violence, intimidation, violent threats to solve non violence/ideological/difference of opinions matters, that method never used in puratan non reformist sikh history. I will use that term to describe them there is no question about that- i have used in the past, present and will do so in future to describe them. I have no regrets over that. Myth- Also, Mr. Neo said he was doing an undercover investigation, compiling data and creating a huge report to give to the BBC in order to 'expose' and consequently stain and mailign the worldwide view and reputation of Sikhs. Not much different than what Mr. Sukhvirk76 is doing. These types of people are anti-Sikh and enemies of Sikh Panth. On the outside they pretend to be with Sikh Panth, and inside they have a hidden agenda to carry out. Fact - I was working on compilation on data on uk sikh fanaticism along with other victim singhs documenting their stories..i initially started the work but realized since i am not there i won't get a true picture so left it to dr gurnam singh * and rest we see on facebook every day is pretty self evident ..so no real need to try so hard to bring awareness of this issue its pretty self explanatory on facebook we see and on recent article by sunny hundal. However, i have created a brand new section last year on our forum to bring http://www.sikhawareness.com/forum/67-sikhs-against-global-extremism/ - This forum section is dedicated towards awareness, fight against threat of Global Radicalism/Extremism/Fascism towards Humanity where not just sikh but hindu/rss extermism, islamic extermism, buddhist extermism, atheist extermism are also highlighted/probed) I be shortly going to india- talking interviews of our famous parcharikh and probing intolerance among sikh youths/sikh katarvaad/extremism abroad from mansik rog perspective (phsyological void emptiness among youths), will start working on meditation videos for troubled youths so they don't end getting into trouble, recent stastics from uk is very worrisome its showing many sikh youths are going to jail and sikh youth bham are helping them out with de- radicalizing programs..i m not sure though if they are qualified enough. Nevertheless, thats my current projects going on..anything else you like to know? Oh forgot i bought a nice dslr camera for nature landscape photography..my schedule is quite busy in upcoming months..i am driving from bc to yukon shortly exploring northern canadian rockies, learning nature photography in fall before winter hits. *

Yes I agree veer on basic level they are different. But on deep profound level they are same as stake on real game of love is way too high and thin as tip of khanda. Its pretty much all or nothing for true bhagat upasakh. In the eyes of panj pyares full surrender of their tan, dhann , mann to guru mahraj was matter of life and death for premis full surrender of their head was life and other manmukh jevan is death there is no middle ground there when stakes are too high. Hopefully this clarification help.

His overall conversion, lack of faith It's inner personal relationship between him and Guru sahib, we should worry about our own relationship with our Guru Maharaj. We should not be deluded for a second, just because we took amrit and can keep up with certain basic outer rehit -we managed to make our Guru sahib happy and scored a free sachkhand express card. In each and every moment, guru maharaj (pure inner awareness jagad jot) throw an test/riddle/chess move/hide and seek game to his sikh - to see if sikh identifies with his conditioned mind (manmukh) or if sikh identifies with his real self-jot saroop (Gur-chaitain-consciouness-mukh(towards) unconditioned pure inner intuitive awareness jot. So real game is already on in which most of us fail as we identify with our conditioned/preconditioned/psychological egoic self mind all the time, we should worry about our own relationship..whats the difference between bemukh and manmukh..? ignoring the semantics overall its same thing..so i wouldn't sit on high moral ground and worry about others. Most sikh parcharikhs never talk about individuals directly - judge or misjudge them, they always talk about overall social issues which affects people never go on personal level- name calling.

Modern day Sikh community secret/at times quite evident love influential relationship with tribal punjabiyaat and cultural-religious mindset instead of influence of religious-spiritual- gurbani/gurmat- lead to do this type stereotype at the first place. Media/movies does what media meant to do is to find stories, make a movie out of it to make quick bucks. We cannot really solely blame on media. Media is doing it we give them material to do it, we not only inadvertently give all these narratives to media but we laughingly jokingly candidly give to them as if nothing happened. You have to wonder how come media/movie industry does not stereotypically negatively target other spiritual communities like tibetan, buddhist, chinese taoism, shintoism , zen..why? Because they cannot find anything on them, thats why. Blaming others is quite easy, and it also bring complacency in us (collective sikh community) which has no place in Sikhi. Sikhi is practical proactive living. Sikh is a leaner- Acknowledge, revise, improve and move on thats how community are grown stronger not being victim, passing the buck to someone else or being Narcissist- in many ways our vanity is our worst enemy because it hinders our self improvement, introspection, self reflection towards many important issues.

Some good suggestions here but i m afraid strict dress code implementation all accross the board will make our faith make more exclusive in my opinion-leaving no room for outsiders and someone who is simply not there yet in their stage of their life to commit to strict dress policy. During guru's time, there were multiple darbars of maharaj, sri guru gobind singh ji maharaj had 52 interfaith kavi poet darbar along with gurmat learning darbar with dress codes along with other darbars for raag kirtan, shastarvidya etc. I cannot imagine maharaj main darbar of guru's time had strict dress code policy as history of visitors tells otherwise Most of gurdwara already have multiple halls so what we need to do - leave general main hall assembly of maharaj darbar the way it is-except for few tweaks-signs etc which is does not conflict with our sidhant of inclusiveness. But what we really to need to focus on -learning/dharamshal section or hall of maharaj darbar within gurdwara where these strict dress policy/no cell phones policy are upheld in which deep gurmat is taught, felt, experienced. Once people are drawn towards maharaj in main darbar, people will automatically will be drawn to deeper gurmat. This is good example of gurmat learning dharamshal from jawadai taksal within Gurdwara:

Just to clarify previous post: Depression, stress, anxiety, negative thoughts can be removed- if you don't give up and with perseverance combat them by not identifying with them. Start off with ardas to Guru maharaj ji to bless you with will power and perseverance, because without grace of vahiguru/satguru's kirpa not even one leaf can move on the tree. Everyone(even sinners of highest calibre) is born with pure portion of mind ( source of mind which is right at the starting edge of mind) which we sikhs call it surat/bibek/brahmakar unconditioned birthi- intuitive unconditioned consciousness/pure cognitive perception. So divide your mind into two- -diseased mind which is affected by five vices, depression, stress, anxiety, emotional negative suicidal thoughts -pure portion of mind-intuitive unconditioned consciousness/pure cognitive perception mind What we often do is we try to combat diseased conditioned mind with diseased conditioned mind which may only provided band aids fixes but it does not look at the root, that's why many psychologist fail to address the root cause, they provide solution to fix one problem but inadvertently create other problems as well-such as more conditioning, dependency on medication etc. So With pure portion of mind start a first phase journey which is simply witnessing the thoughts come in, let whatever thoughts (no matter how hideous) come in and whatever thought go -go..don't judge or analyze the thoughts, just simple witness as pure witness, it will take some practice so to make it easier..here are some analogies it help further or visualize: -Witness the thoughts visualize-thoughts being clouds-appearing/disappearing on its own accord , it does not matter to you because you are the sky which has pure vantage view (pure unconditioned intuitive cognitive consciousness-achal thoughtless surat) in which thoughts come in and out as clouds, you have pure vantage to witness your thoughts not matter how big and scary clouds are, it cannot touch you as you can always see them below, they are below you. - Imagine you are in the middle of road- each thought is car trying to hit you, drag you with it. Imagine how painful it is being hit by each car (thought) which is dragging you all the way, what you do ? do you fight with a speedy car coming at you? No..you simply get on a side of road, move away and witness the thoughts(in form of car) travelling in and out of road-your view and ultimately ignore them by abiding in your consciousness(surat)...after a while car-lethal weapon (thoughts) will loose its influence on you as you will start witnessing them and not getting hit by them and eventually you will also transcendent witness stage as well in straight in abidance in already available inner state we all have already in our pure universal portion of mind which is achal moraat (pure motionless stillness-afor-thoughtless awareness) universal being at the point Guru's kirpa will unfold itself and guide you further. Anyway, your main focus should be to disidentify with your negative thoughts, but since you are at it, you might as well try to understand thoughts structure how transient they are and illusory they are, disidentify with them all together with pure universal portion of mind (pure unconditioned intuitive cognitive consciousness), and don't worry about right actions and rights speech, trying to figure how to do naam jaap since everything comes from there, this unconditioned pure intuitive cognitive consciousness will guide you further how to do naam jaap, gurbani patt, right speech, right actions very naturally and spontaneously

Thats true, but unfortunately sangat has no control over these committe people and most often committe people pick and chose speakers, they go for speakers who does not target these issues. Even if one of sangat wants to get into committe, existing commitee members will make sure of their screening process -make sure they are not threat to them, try applying with ramaghari sounding last name in singh sabha jatt gurdwara and vice versa.

Please remember - you are not your thoughts you are witness consciousness to your thoughts where thoughts/self indentifications come in and go like clouds appear and disappear-That which remains never comes and goes (analogy sky above clouds) which is real you- pure witness consciousness awareness bliss, abiding in that truth remembrance itself is first stage which in itself is quite liberating, all negative emotions, good and bad thoughts are destroyed in a instant fire of that wisdom (gyan) of knowning, after spontaneous knowing that you are not your thoughts, thoughts looses its power on you and then one is more and more automatically start disindentifying with their thoughts but more and more identifying with our universal pure portion of mind or source of mind which is our pure unconditioned surat(intuitive consciousness). One of deep profound meaning of Gurmukh is Gur(chaitan-consciouness) Mukh(towards) - Gurmukh is one who attention is towards its inner pure consciouness(Gur) within which helps breaking egoic condtioned mind(thoughts) structure slowly. Thoughts is root problem, that has to be addressed than everything falls into place. You cannot pursue spiritual sikhi with fearful/diseased conditioned mind. Pure pristine Sikhi start reflecting on open unconditioned receptive mind not mind with conditioning.

Well whats different now is obviously christian missionaries are exploiting the situation (capitalizing on someone vulnerability) converting our sikhs all together, back then atleast if sikhs were discriminated against -they hang around with their own in segragation -not that i m gauging this anymore severe but it was bearable to keep us united on major issues. Anyway, pure panj pyares symbolism of original panj pyares came from each caste/from different corners in india is itself biggest slap to jatt supremacy in the panth in garb of modern singh sabha gurdwaras or ramagharia supermacy in segregated ramagharia gurdwara so on so forth. We should look at the root of problem this time around address both pressing caste issue and due to that Christian exploiting to convert in one setting.

Caste discrimination is single most threat in the panth. Singh's who do panj pyares Seva should do lot more in terms of awareness campaign against caste creeping in the panth. Orginal panj pyares were all from different castes different part of india in the past before they became Khalsa and took amrit from same batta. This intself is great profound powerful symbolism which can affect many people that we are all one Khalsa is all one. Current Singhs sahiban an who is doing panj pyares di Seva should carefully note and follow this profound practical symbolism to unite Sikhs by living by original panj pyares. Original panj pyares did lot more than many Singh's who do panj pyares di Seva who seem to treat this extreme pious honourable chivalry representation as part time only when there is amrit sanchar.

As i was saying on another thread as well: Personally, I am not totally against depiction of SatGuru Nanak Dev Ji. However, in my opnion person who is director should have deep profound understanding and realization of metaphyics/gnosis of Satguru nanak not only just in manifested form but profound ultimate unmanifested form of Satguru Nanak-shabad resonance-dhun, shabad gyan/anubhav parkash/knowledge. Unfathomable ocean of divine knowledge. Otherwise movie depiction will fail to do full justice towards essence of Satguru in its totality. In my opinion, current overall standards to depict Satguru nanak dev ji in eleven forms- whether in form of art, picture or movie does not full justice. This is very good and deep video on this subject: Regarding calls to ban this movie, sending outrageous death threats to director(saw tribal crazy people calling out death threats to director on facebook) is absolute knee j erk reaction, most people haven't been seen this movie or looked at this overall issue -see positive message behind this movie - great work is being done to spread awareness guru maharaj teaching to whole humanity being spread in form of movie , actual intent for director which is nothing but positive. By looking at all of these, there is no reason for call for outright ban for this movie but we should just provide constructive feedback to director to explore -Satguru nanak dev ji deep nature for future projects. I love how people who calls for ban and death threats to directors- pick and choose where to apply their irrational beadhi argument..same beadhi argument can be applied on depiction of satguru nanak in form of picture, cartoon books(animated picture of satguru nanak dev ji in sikh cartoons books for sikh kids), artistic imagery in the mind and confining satguru nanak to only picture which is nothing but biggest insult of depriving our satguru nanak dev ji to its most profound saroop which is shabad and nirgun saroop.