DSGj

You guys keep on bringing up Akal Takhat Maryada. Get one thing straight in your heads. IT'S NOT THE SAME TODAY, AS IT WAS EVEN 75 YEARS AGO. If you look at the Rehit Maryada's first few pages....it CLEARLY shows that those who first attended the meeting stopped coming to the others, BECAUSE proper Rehit was not being put in place. Would you ever expect a true Gursikh to support the creation of a document stating that it's okay to eat meat, and that keski is not kakkar? Due to many of these factors....many Gursikhs dropped out of these meetings and didn't care for them, as it was clear that some people were trying to implement a very vague and open-ended Maryada which leaves a lot of loopholes for corrupt people to take advantage of. You can see for yourself at how the names of those involved changed right away after only the first meeting: http://sgpc.net/sikhism/punjabi/Sikh%20Reht%20Maryada%28Eng%291.pdf Stop twisting the story....Akal Takhat Maryada is not the same as it was before. THAT IS A FACT. Keski is Kakaar if you have any historical knowledge and support equality of women and men. It baffles me how it's okay for women to not wear dastaar, but not for men? Are you kidding me? Rehitnamey even show Keski as Kakaar. As well as eye-witness of first Amrit Sanchaar by Guru Gobind Singh Jee, shows Guru Gobind SIngh Jee giving Keski as Kakaar to Sikhs. Also, it is historical FACT that Bibia had to wear Keski before being able to get Amrit at Amrit Sanchaar at Akal Takhat Sahib. Just because the times have changed....doesn't mean the Rehit has. Akal Takhat can change as much as it wants....but Rehit is same, even if Akal Takhat attempts to change 100 times, it does not matter. Rehit is eternal. Rehit is set in stone by Satguru and Gursikhs way before. Read history...you will see the truth. Read the following for true answer: http://www.tapoban.org/article/52 Keski as Kakkar Bh. Manmohan Singh Jee (LA) Keski, Kesgi, chhoti dastaar (or mini turban) is the first important striking symbol which makes the members of the Akhand Kirtani Jatha conspicuous - especially the women. And, naturally, it is the first object of criticism. One very distinguished scholar, S. Kapur Singh states: 'Bhai Randhir Singh and his admirers claim and assert that five K's obligatory for an Amritdhari Sikh, a Singh, include a Keski, i.e., a short turban for men and women, as a must and one of the other K's, Kangha (comb) is not one of the five Do's.' According to him '...It is wholly arbitrary and schismatic...and thus an act of sabotage against the solidarity and monolithicism of the Khalsa.'20 Another critic asserts the rahit of Keski to be an 'absolutely mundane' teaching of the Jatha having 'no precedents' and thus being the 'teaching of an individual.' Before taking up the question of whether 'Keski' is a symbol or not, it may be pointed out that in their eagerness to criticize Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh, even the well versed Sikh scholars, like S. Kapur Singh, have not cared to verifify the facts before offering their criticism. Keski is not at all considered to replace Kangha as a symbol as asserted by him. It does, however, replace Keshas as a symbol because Keshas is the first fundamental requirement for a Sikh. Shaving or trimming of hair is the first of the four Cardinal Sins -Kurahits (Big Don'ts) - the commitment of any one of which makes one an apostate and results in one's automatic excommunication from the fold of the Khalsa Brotherhood. Moreover Keshas form part of the human body and are not obtained and worn like other Kakaars. Sikh history is full of instances where the devout Sikhs were hacked joint by joint, boiled and even sawed alive, had their scalps cut' their limbs broken on the wheel, and faced bravely many other unbearable and severest of tortures, and yet remained firm in their faith to their last hair and breath. Right from Sahib Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, the Sikhs have been commanded to abstain from shaving or trimming of hair. According to Bhai Sahib Mani Singh's Gyan Ratnavali and other Janam Sakhies, Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, while initiating Bhai Mardana into the newly founded Sikh faith, laid down the following three-fold Code of Conduct for him: 'Firstly, you are not to cut your hair. Secondly, you are to get up early in the morning and do practice of the Sat Naam; and, Thirdly, you are to serve hospitably the visiting devotees of God.'21 In another instance Sahib Sri Guru Hari Rai Ji, while blessing Bhai Nandlal, grandfather of Bhai Hakikat Rai with the Holy Naam, is reported to have codified as follows: 'Firstly, you are not to cut your hair; Secondly, you are not to consume tobacco; and Thirdly, you are not to wear a cap.' It is thus crystal clear that the injunction regarding abstaining from cutting Keshas was initiated by Sahib Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji himself and continued to be adhered to by all his successor Gurus. Hence the importance of keeping Keshas intact is the basic and fundamental requirement for becoming a Sikh. In fact, the Keshas are considered so sacred that for their cleanliness, care, and protection, two additional Kakaars, i.e. Kangha and Keski, have been prescribed in the Sikh Code of Conduct. It is well known that the outward appearance of the Sikhs is absolutely unique and different from those of other faiths. This applies to all Sikhs irrespective of sex. The wearing of the Sikh symbols has been obligatory for both the sexes. In addition, Sikh women are also conspicuous because of the absence of any piercing ornaments for nose and ears, such as those customarily worn by women of other religions. After their initiation into the Khalsa fold by partaking Khande-ki-Pahul (Amrit), the Sikh women have always tied their Keshas in the form of topknot and covered the same with Dastaar (i.e. Keski) just as men do; the only difference being that they wear chunnies or dupattas over their small turbans. Right up to the reign of Maharaja Ranjit Singh, Sikh women had been steadfast in following the edicts of the Satguru in respect to their spiritual inner life as well as dress, including Keski. That is what J. D. Cunningham himself saw and wrote in the middle of the Nineteenth Century when he wrote his book, History of the Slkhs. Even after the Punjab came under the British rule, this symbol of Keski was conspicuously seen in case of Sikh women as well as men right up to the Gurdwara movement and the establishment of the Shromani Gurudwara Parbandhak Committee in 1926. Until then, no one - man as well as woman was allowed to be baptized (by taking Amrit) at Sri Akal Takht Sahib without Keski. It was only afterwards that laxity was introduced in this respect and the wearing of Keski was made optional. With the introduction of this laxity, the other anti-Sikh practice of wearing piercing ornaments in the nose and ears also became prevalent in Sikh women. This is a brief summarized account of the historical background in this regard. In the following pages, an effort has been made to elaborate a bit on the above points by presenting certain facts: i. Rahit Naama of Bhai Chaupa Singh Ji contains the following couplet regarding 'rahits': Kachh, Kada, Kirpan, Kangha, Keski. Eh Panj Kakaari Rahit Dhaarey Sikh Soyee. To be a Sikh, one must observe five rahits of wearing five Sikh symbols beginning with 'K': Kachh, Kada, Kirpan, Kangha, and Keski. (Those Sikhs not believing in keski have wrongfully broken the word Keski in this couplet into two words, Kes and Ki, indicating it to mean 'the rahit of keshas.') ii. The renowned scholar of the Panth, Bhai Sahib Kahan Singh Ji of Nabha, compiled the Encyclopedia of Sikh Literature and Terminology (Gur Shabad Ratnagar MAHAN KOSH) in 1926. The term 'Keski' has been explained therein on page 254, Col. 3 of its Second Edition published by the Punjab Government in 1960, as: Keski: Noun - small turban worn to protect hair. iii. Well known 19th Century English Historian, J. D. Cunningham (1812-1851) who was an eye witness to the First Anglo-Sikh War, in his History of the Sikhs - 1848 refers to Sikh women of that time as follows: 'The Sikh women are distinguished from Hindus of their sex by some variety of dress, chiefly by a higher topknot of hair.'22 Higher topknot of hair on Sikh women's heads automatically implies their coverage by some sort of turban, as Cunningham has connected it with 'some variety of dress.' iv. According to the Sikh history, Sahib Sri Guru Angad Dev Ji, impressed and pleased by the untiring and devoted labor of love and selfless service of Baba (later Guru) Amardas Ji' bestowed upon him Siropas in the form of Dastaars a number of times. Even now this tradition of bestowing Dastaar as a Siropa continues at Sri Akal Takht Sahib and other Takhts and Gurdwaras. v. Sahib Sri Guru Arjan Dev Ji's hymn on page 1084 clearly states: Naapaak Paak Kar Hadoor Hadeesa Sabat Surat Dastaar Sira. Make unpure (mind) pure. It is the true adherence to the Muslim Law (Hadees). (One can obtain this objective) by keeping one's body unviolated and by always wearing a turban on head. The above instruction to keep the body in its original complete form and to wear turban is meant for all, irrespective of sex. vi. The tradition of 'double dastaar' prevalent amongst Khalsa men was also the result of the practice of keeping Keski under the big turban so that they may never remain bareheaded. Keeping this very tradition in view, the British rulers of India prescribed wearing of double dastaar, i.e., one small (also referred to as an under turban) and the other outer big one, as part of the official uniform for Sikh members of the armed forces. They were, and perhaps are even now, officially provided with two turbans, one big and one small, as part of their uniforms. vii. At the end of the nineteenth century and the beginning of the present one, as a result of the Sikh renaissance movement, a number of Khalsa schools for girls were established in Punjab. Small dastaar (Keski) was prescribed as an obligatory head dress for students as well as teachers in such schools at Jaspalon, Ferozepur and Sidhwan in Punjab. viii. . In a number of Rahitnaamas, the importance of keeping hair always covered with Dastaar has been emphasized very clearly. A few quotations are given below: 'Each candidate for Baptism be made to wear kachhehra, tie hair in a topknot and cover the same with dastaar; wear Sri Sahib (i.e. Kirpan) in Gaatra (shoulder belt). Then he/she should stand with folded hands.' (Rahitnama Bhai Daya Singh Ji) '...Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa should keep his hair unshorn, have flowing beard and have simple dastaar which saves him from impiety. Then the Sikhs asked what would happen to those Amrltdharis who start cutting their hair or do not keep their hair covered. The Guru replied that they would be stupid and will lose their sensibility It is a blemish to remain bareheaded...Always keep two turbans. When the bigger turban is removed, the smaller be kept. The smaller turban should not be removed.' (Bijai Mukat Dharam Shastra - Sakhi-8) '(A Sikh) who eats food with turban removed from the head (i.e., bareheaded) is destined for 'Kumbhi' hell.' (Rahit Rama Bhai Prahlad Singh Ji) 'One who combs hair twice a day, ties turban fold by fold and cleans teeth everyday will not come to grief.' (Tankhah Naama Bhai Nandlal Ji) 'Whosoever roams about bareheaded, takes food bareheaded and distributes the 'prasad' bareheaded is considered punishable.' (Uttar-prashan Bhai Nandlal Ji) 'Women should tie their hair in topknot and should not keep them loose.' (Rahitnama Bhai Daya Singh Ji) 'Keshas be washed. Turban or dastaar should not be placed on floor but should always be kept with due respect. Food should not be eaten bareheaded.' (Bijai Mukt Dharam Shastra, Sakhi 70) It is thus, absolutely clear from the above quotations that remaining bareheaded at any time (except when washing, drying, and combing) and keeping hair loose and unknotted are basically against the Sikh Code of Conduct, which is applicable to all, men and women alike. For obvious reasons, therefore, the use of small dastaar or keski is indispensable. There is no other way to keep the head covered all the time. Sikhs - men as well as women - who wear only big turbans and dupattas, mostly remain bareheaded, at least in the privacy of their own homes, while taking food, etc., and thus are, perhaps unconsciously, infringing the Sikh Code of Conduct in this respect. A FEW HISTORICAL AND OTHER FACTS IN THIS RESPECT: 1.Well-known Sikh historian Bhai Sahib Bhai Santokh Singh has given a somewhat detailed description concerning Mai Bhag Kaur (commonly known as Mai Bhago) of Forty Muktas fame in his well known historical work GUR PARTAP SURYA. He mentions that Mai Bhag Kaur had reached the highest stage of enlightenment and had almost lost her body consciousness...so much so that when her clothes became worn to shreds, she did not care to replace them. Sahib Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji called her in His Holy presence and instructed her to always stick to the Gursikh dress as prescribed in the Code of Conduct. In particular, she was ordered to wear Kachhehra and chhoti dastaar. In fact, according to some chroniclers, the dastaar was tied on her head by the Satguru himself. If this dastaar was not a Rahit, where was the need to include this item in the instructions given to a lady who had reached almost the Brahmgyan stage? It apparently shows that the Satguru gave as much importance to Dastaar as to other Rahits like Kachhehra. 2. In the Museum of Maharaja Ranjit Singh's fort at Lahore and Victoria Museum at Calcutta, the pictures of Sikh women of old time can be seen even now, depicting them with small dastaars or keskis. 3. Bhai Sahib Vir Singh, in his well known poetical work, RANA SURAT SINGH, depicts Rani Raj Kaur as a Saint Soldier or Rajyogi of the highest order. Her very impressive picture given in the book depicts her with a well-tied Keski, on which is also affixed a khanda-chakkar, the emblem of Sikhism. 4. The Sikh women belonging to the Jatha of Bhai Sahib (Sant) Teja Singh Ji of Mastuana, have been seen doing Kirtan in congregations wearing dastaars. He was instrumental in establishing Akal Academy - a Higher Secondary School at Baru in Himachal Pradesh wherin all students - boys as well as girls - are required to wear turbans as a prescribed school uniform. 5. The Central Majha Diwan and Panch Khalsa Diwan, Bhasaur - the two organizations which played a remarkable role in the Sikh renaissance movement in the first decade of the twentieth century laid special stress on the wearing of Keski by women. 6. The author had the privilege of meeting the late Baba Gurbachan Singh Ji Khalsa of the Bhindranwala Jatha along with his whole family, including his wife, two sons and their wives. They were all wearing Keskis just as the members of the Akhand Kirtani Jatha do. 7. It is a historical fact that there was a time when a price was put on the head of a male Sikh. Greedy and unprincipled people, both Hindus and Muslims, availed of this opportunity to make money. When they could no longer find male Sikhs in the villages and towns, they started beheading Khalsa women and presenting their heads as the heads of young unbearded teenager Sikh lads. As such, many Sikh women, out of fear of persecution, stopped wearing Keski and converted topknot of hair into fashionable styles like women of other faiths. This practice, which originated in a helpless state of affairs, became a fashion in due course of time. By the way, it was perhaps under these very abnormal circumstances that Sikh women also started wearing ear and nose ornaments to avoid the disclosure of their Sikh identity. 8. S. Shamsher Singh Ashok who has been an active member of the Singh Sabha movement and an erstwhile Research Scholar of the S.G.P.C., while discussing the prevalence of the use of 'keski', states: '...and, consequently in the Amrit-Parchaar at the Akal Takht Sahib, this was a precondition even for ladies before they could be baptized there. Any woman who was not prepared to wear Keski was not baptized. This practice continued even after the end of the Gurdwara movement. Relaxation was made only when Giani Gurmukh Singh Musafir became the Jathedar of the Akal Takht.'23 9. A recent discovery from old literature puts a final seal on the Keski having been prescribed as a Rahit by the Tenth Guru himself. While going through the old Vahis of the Bhatts, lying with their successors in Karnal District in Haryana State, Prof. Piara Singh Padam of Punjabi University Patiala came across a paragraph explaining the first baptism of the double-edged sword bestowed by Sahib Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji on the First Five Beloved Ones on the Baisakhi of 1699 A.D. and the Code of Conduct imparted to them on that auspicious occasion. Based upon the language and style, this manuscript has been assessed to have been written in about the end of the eighteenth century. As this finding is of special significance in this respect, the English translation of the whole paragraph is reproduced below: 'Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Tenth Guru, son of Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji, in the year Seventeen Hundred Fifty Two, on Tuesday - the Vaisakhi day - gave Khande-Ki-Pahul to Five Sikhs and surnamed them as Singhs. First Daya Ram Sopti, Khatri resident of Lahore stood up. Then Mohkam Chand Calico Printer of Dawarka; Sahib Chand Barber of Zafrabad city; Dharam Chand Jawanda Jat of Hastnapur; Himmat Chand Water Carrier of Jagannath stood up one after the other. All were dressed in blue and he himself also dressed the same way. Huqqah, Halaal, Hajaamat, Haraam, Tikka, Janeyu, Dhoti, were prohibited. Socialization with the descendants of Prithi chand (Meenay), followers of Dhirmal and Ram Rai, clean shaven people and Masands was prohibited. All were given Kangha, Karad, KESGI, Kada and Kachhehra. All were made Keshadhari. Everyone's place of birth was told to be Patna, of residence as Anandpur. Rest, Guru's deeds are known only to the Satguru. Say Guru! Guru! Guru! Guru will help everywhere.'24 This discovery is a landmark in this respect: Kesgi or Keski has not only been clearly mentioned as one of the five K's, but also the specific and seperate mention of making all Sikhs Keshadharies, makes it clear beyond any shadow of a doubt that Keshas are not included in the Five Symbols (i.e., Five K's): in other words, keeping them intact is a separate and specific injunction for all Sikhs. (By the way, regarding eating meat, both Halaal and Haraam- the Muslim description of any meat other than Halaal - were also forbidden. It means that eating meat was totally prohibited.) It is thus abundantly dear that Keski has been in vogue right from the birth of the Khalsa Nation and is not the innovation of Bhal Sahib Randhir Singh or anybody else. A FEW POINTS OF RATIONALE WHY KESKI AND NOT KESHAS IS ONE OF THE FIVE SIKH SYMBOLS. Now let us consider why Keski and not Keshas is one of the Sikh symbols. By considering Keski as a symbol, the importance of Keshas IS NOT UNDERMINED IN ANY WAY. In fact, the Keshas are the basic and fundamental edifice of Sikhism without which no one can become a Sikh. The following points are put forth for a rational and unbiased consideration in this respect: 1.Keshas are the natural blessing of the Creator. They grow from within the body and develop gradually with age as other parts of the body. As against it, all other symbols or kakaars are external and are put on the body from outside. Even a very devout Sikh may, at times, be forced to remain without any one of the four symbols under circumstances beyond his control. This cannot happen with Keshas, which do not fall in line with the other four symbols and are in a class by themselves. 2. Kangha, which is one of the symbols, is kept for the upkeep of the Keshas (which is also generally considered a symbol). No other symbol is meant for the protection of any other symbol, these being for the protection of the body or some part of it. Evidently, therefore, Keshas cannot be considered as an outer symbol but a part of the body for the protection of which Kangha and Keski are required to be kept as symbols. 3. The RAHITS, including the wearing of the external Five Symbols (Keski, Kachhehra, Kangha, Kada and Kirpan) fall in the category of DO's, while Kurahits (Cardinal Sins or Taboos), including cutting of the hair, are placed in the category of DON'TS. The vested interests try to intermingle them. In this way, they unconsciously belittle the value of Keshas. They should realize that the value of all outer symbols is alike. 4. Then there is an evident anomaly in the commonly accepted Code of Conduct with regard to Keshas. These are included in the category of four cardinal sins which are so basically important that commitment of any one of these by a Sikh makes him an apostate. These are, then, also included in the category of Rahits, the infringement of which makes a Sikh merely a Tankhaeeya or punishable. Evidently there is definite incongruity in it which defies logical or rational explanation. The only logical explanation, therefore, is that the Keshas are not included in Rahits but are one of the four major Kurahits (Taboos or Cardinal Sins): A Sikh must not cut hair. 5. The wearing of Keski enables Sikh women to show their distinctiveness of being Sikh or Khalsa like men. The importance of this Khalsa distinctiveness has been clearly emphasized by the Tenth Guru for the Khalsa as a community, both men and women, and not for men only. 6. At the time of the baptismal ceremony, the same Amrit (Khande-Ki-Pahul) is administered to all without any distinction, including that of sex. The title of Khalsa is bestowed on all of them. The same way of life and Code of Conduct is enjoined upon all of them. All of them are forbidden to roam about, take food, etc. bareheaded. How, then, have women become exempt from any of these injunctions? Keski is the only answer to this contradiction. In view of all the aforesaid, it is clear that Keski or small turban has been traditionally worn by Sikhs, or Khalsa men and women, right from the birth of the Khalsa Nation. This Rahit has been enunciated and strongly emphasized by the Satguru himself. Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh, the Akhand Kirtani Jatha, and a few other individuals and organizations are preserving this dignified Khalsa Rahit with Guru's grace. Having become aware of these facts, the Sikh intellegentia has also started showing a remarkable response in this regard. If the Khalsa is to live in accordance with the Rules of true Gurmat , both Khalsa men and women have to accept it. Keski is the crown bestowed by the Satguru for the head of the Khalsa, whether man or woman, who stands bestowed with the special form of the Satguru himself. By refraining from the use of Keski, a Sikh becomes a follower of his own ego instead of the Will of the Satguru. Wearing of Keski by Sikh women is decried mainly because modern day Sikhs want their women to fall in line with other women with respect to the so called modern way of life, including the modern fashions of dress. Sikhs - both men and women - will continue to be guilty of showing disrespect to the sacred hair by keeping them uncovered. In fact, it is the Keski's nonacceptance (and not its acceptance) that is very unconsciously eviscerating the Rahit Namas of their 'tremendous and literally unlimited potency that operates on the collective subconscious level' of the Sikhs in general. One fails to understand how the use of Keski '...destroys the purity of the Khalsa Rahit and sabotages the unity of the Khalsa', as alleged by some. In fact, the shoe is on the other foot. If Keski is accepted by all Khalsa men and women, it will help in maintaining the purity and ensuring the unity of the Khalsa, as even women of the Khalsa faith, like the Khalsa men, will be distinguishable.

Everyone, read this thread before posting in here. http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/70922-girls-in-india-commiting-suicide/ Bhagzi Jee, if you or the girl are having suicidal thoughts (because you might not be able to get married and live the rest of your lives together), then please get professional help from professional councellors or psychiatrists.

Veer Jee, I think it's related to this thread: http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/70823-marriage-to-a-lower-caste/ Bhagzi Jee, if you or the girl are having suicidal thoughts (because you might not be able to get married and live the rest of your lives together), then please get professional help from professional councellors or psychiatrists.

Amazing ragi jatha! Amazing Dasam Granth Keertan! Lots of knowledge and memorization! Amazing that they're spending a full month in UK, especially during Hola Mahalla and Vaisakhi time of year.!

Go to Panj Piaarey and ask them.

Very nice decision!

Very nice outcome!

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL...too funny! Also, "NeedSomeAdvice"/"Guest" Jee..... best thing is to be a living example yourself. You can only tell her so much. You have to make the leap of faith and become such an example, that you know Guru Gobind SIngh Jee would be proud. The rest is not in your hands. I have seen anti-Sikh/atheists living within Gursikh households. You cannot control someone else's destiny. They will do what they're going to do. You do what you want to do. This Shabad is by Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Raag Gauree on Pannaa 156 Gauree Chaytee, First Mehla: Who is our mother, and who is our father? Where did we come from? We are formed from the fire of the womb within, and the bubble of water of the sperm. For what purpose are we created? ||1|| O my Master, who can know Your Glorious Virtues? My own demerits cannot be counted. ||1||Pause|| I took the form of so many plants and trees, and so many animals. Many times I entered the families of snakes and flying birds. ||2|| I broke into the shops of the city and well-guarded palaces; stealing from them, I snuck home again. I looked in front of me, and I looked behind me, but where could I hide from You? ||3|| I saw the banks of sacred rivers, the nine continents, the shops and bazaars of the cities. Taking the scale, the merchant begins to weigh his actions within his own heart. ||4|| As the seas and the oceans are overflowing with water, so vast are my own sins. Please, shower me with Your Mercy, and take pity upon me. I am a sinking stone - please carry me across! ||5|| My soul is burning like fire, and the knife is cutting deep. Prays Nanak, recognizing the Lord's Command, I am at peace, day and night. ||6||5||17|| This Shabad is by Bhagat Kabeer Ji in Raag Aasaa on Pannaa 481 Aasaa: Why bother to read the Simritees to a dog? Why bother to sing the Lord's Praises to the faithless cynic? ||1|| Remain absorbed in the Lord's Name, Raam, Raam, Raam. Do not bother to speak of it to the faithless cynic, even by mistake. ||1||Pause|| Why offer camphor to a crow? Why give the snake milk to drink? ||2|| Joining the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation, discriminating understanding is attained. That iron which touches the Philosopher's Stone becomes gold. ||3|| The dog, the faithless cynic, does everything as the Lord causes him to do. He does the deeds pre-ordained from the very beginning. ||4|| If you take Ambrosial Nectar and irrigate the neem tree with it, still, says Kabeer, its natural qualities are not changed. ||5||7||20|| This Shabad is by Bhagat Naam Dev Ji in Raag Aasaa on Pannaa 485 Aasaa: The snake sheds its skin, but does not lose its venom. The heron appears to be meditating, but it is concentrating on the water. ||1|| Why do you practice meditation and chanting, when your mind is not pure? ||1||Pause|| That man who feeds like a lion, is called the god of thieves. ||2|| Naam Dayv's Lord and Master has settled my inner conflicts. Drink in the sublime elixir of the Lord, O deceitful one. ||3||4|| This Shabad is by Bhagat Ravi Daas Ji in Raag Gujri on Pannaa 525 Goojaree, Paday Of Ravi Daas Jee, Third House: One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru: The calf has contaminated the milk in the teats. The bumble bee has contaminated the flower, and the fish the water. ||1|| O mother, where shall I find any offering for the Lord's worship? I cannot find any other flowers worthy of the incomparable Lord. ||1||Pause|| The snakes encircle the sandalwood trees. Poison and nectar dwell there together. ||2|| Even with incense, lamps, offerings of food and fragrant flowers, how are Your slaves to worship You? ||3|| I dedicate and offer my body and mind to You. By Guru's Grace, I attain the immaculate Lord. ||4|| I cannot worship You, nor offer You flowers. Says Ravi Daas, what shall my condition be hereafter? ||5||1|| This Shabad is by Guru Amar Daas Ji in Raag Vadhans on Pannaa 588 Third Mehla: Wearing ceremonial robes, the fire is not quenched, and the mind is filled with anxiety. Destroying the snake's hole, the snake is not killed; it is just like doing deeds without a Guru. Serving the Giver, the True Guru, the Shabad comes to abide in the mind. The mind and body are cooled and soothed; peace ensues, and the fire of desire is quenched. The supreme comforts and lasting peace are obtained, when one eradicates ego from within. He alone becomes a detached Gurmukh, who lovingly focuses his consciousness on the True Lord. Anxiety does not affect him at all; he is satisfied and satiated with the Name of the Lord. O Nanak, without the Naam, no one is saved; they are utterly ruined by egotism. ||2|| This Shabad is by Guru Raam Daas Ji in Raag Gauree on Pannaa 171 Gauree Poorbee, Fourth Mehla: Within this body-fortress is the Lord, the Sovereign Lord King, but the stubborn ones do not find the taste. When the Lord, Merciful to the meek, showed His Mercy, I found and tasted it, through the Word of the Guru's Shabad. ||1|| Lovingly focused upon the Guru, the Kirtan of the Lord's Praise has become sweet to me. ||1||Pause|| The Lord, the Supreme Lord God, is Inaccessible and Unfathomable. Those who are committed to the True Guru, the Divine Intermediary, meet the Lord. Those whose hearts are pleased with the Guru's Teachings - the Lord's Presence is revealed to them. ||2|| The hearts of the self-willed manmukhs are hard and cruel; their inner beings are dark. Even if the poisonous snake is fed large amounts of milk, it will still yield only poison. ||3|| O Lord God, please unite me with the Holy Guru, so that I might joyfully grind and eat the Shabad. Servant Nanak is the slave of the Guru; in the Sangat, the Holy Congregation, the bitter becomes sweet. ||4||9||23||61||

I think that's an overexaggeration. There are not thousands of different rehatnamey and rehats. There is one basic one, and then there are just a few fluctuations and adjustments of it between different groups. Yet the message is the same from all of these groups. AKJ, Taksal, Nanaksar, Sant-Samaj, Nihungs etc...are all united in many ways and are mostly all united on this topic which we are discussing. AKJ and Taksal both strictly say that if one is married/getting married and Amritdhari, then the other has to be as well. Let's not overexaggerate and make it something it isn't. Most groups are united and respectful of one another. But still, before marriage is different. Before marriage both must be Amritdhaari. That is how AKJ works. AKJ will only do Anand Kaaraj for Amritdhaari couples. If marriage is already done before elsewhere and you want to become Amritdhaari but your partner does not, then see what Panj Piaarey say, they will probably adjust if you truly show your readiness and eagerness for Amrit. Remember, don't blame Rehit or Panj Piaarey...look at yourself. If you are drooling for Amrit and jumping forward to give yourself to Guru Sahib, then Panj Piaarey will realize that themselves. If they reject you the first time, come back again and again. You have to be determined. It's all on you. Don't blame anyone else. It is now this modern era, where people like kala-afghana and missionaries are infiltrating Sikhi and trying to change normally accepted Sikh traditions/ways of life. They are trying to make things appealing to these modern generations in order to gain popularity...and that is the most disservice one can do. Changing historical facts and traditions and misleading people...there are aren't too many things worse than that.ਸਾਹਿਬ ਕੌਰ ਮਾਤਾ - ਰੋਹਤਾਸ ਨਿਵਾਸੀ ਭਾਈ ਰਾਮੂ ਬਸੀ ਖਤ੍ਰੀ ਦੀ ਸੁਪੁਤ੍ਰੀ, ਜਿਸ ਦਾ ਆਨੰਦ ੧੮. ਵੈਸਾਖ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੭੫੭ ਨੂੰ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾਲ ਹੋਇਆ. ਕਲਗੀਧਰ ਨੇ ਇਸੇ ਦੀ ਗੋਦੀ ਪੰਥ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਪਾਇਆ ਹੈ, ਇਸੇ ਕਾਰਣ ਅਮ੍ਰਿਤਸੰਸਕਾਰ ਸਮੇਂ ਮਾਤਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਕੌਰ ਅਤੇ ਪਿਤਾ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਉਪਦੇਸ਼ ਕੀਤੇ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਹਨ. ਅਵਿਚਲ ਨਗਰ ਪਹੁੰਚਕੇ ਦਸ਼ਮੇਸ਼ ਨੇ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਭੇਜ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਅਰ ਗੁਰੂ ਹਰਿਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੇ ਪੰਜ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਸਨਮਾਨ ਨਾਲ ਰੱਖਣ ਲਈ ਸਪੁਰਦ ਕੀਤੇ, ਜੋ ਹੁਣ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਗੁਰੁਦ੍ਵਾਰੇ ਰਕਾਬਗੰਜ ਵਿੱਚ ਹਨ.#ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਦਾ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਮਾਤਾ ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਜੀ ਤੋਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ. ਸਮਾਧੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਹਰਿਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਦੇਹਰੇ ਪਾਸ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਹੈ. ਅਜੀਤੋ ਮਾਤਾ - ਦੇਖੋ, ਜੀਤੋ ਮਾਤਾ. ਜੀਤੋ ਮਾਤਾ -ਲਾਹੌਰ ਨਿਵਾਸੀ ਹਰਿਜਸ ਸੁਭਿਖੀਏ ਖਤ੍ਰੀ ਦੀ ਸੁਪੁਤ੍ਰੀ, ਜਿਸ ਦਾ ਵਿਆਹ ੨੩ ਹਾੜ੍ਹ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੭੩੪ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾਲ ਆਨੰਦਪੁਰ ਪਾਸ ਗੁਰੂ ਕੇ ਲਹੌਰ ਹੋਇਆ.#ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਕੁੱਖ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਬਾ ਜੁਝਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਬਾਬਾ ਜ਼ੋਰਾਵਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਅਤੇ ਬਾਬਾ ਫ਼ਤੇਹ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਜਨਮੇ. ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਦਾ ਪਰਲੋਕਗਮਨ ੧੩. ਅੱਸੂ, ਸੰਮਤ ੧੭੫੭ ਨੂੰ ਆਨੰਦਪੁਰ ਹੋਇਆ. ਆਪ ਦਾ ਦੇਹਰਾ ਅਗੰਮਪੁਰ ਵਿਦ੍ਯਮਾਨ ਹੈ. ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਦਾ ਸ਼ੁੱਧ ਨਾਮ ਅਜੀਤੋ ਅਤੇ ਅਮ੍ਰਿਤਸੰਸਕਾਰ ਪਿੱਛੋਂ ਅਜੀਤ ਕੌਰਿ ਨਾਮ ਸੀ. ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਮਾਤਾ - ਲਹੌਰ ਨਿਵਾਸੀ ਰਾਮਸਰਨ ਕੁਮਰਾਵ ਖਤ੍ਰੀ ਦੀ ਸੁਪੁਤ੍ਰੀ, ਜਿਸ ਦਾ ਆਨੰਦ ੭. ਵੈਸਾਖ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੭੪੧ ਨੂੰ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾਲ ਹੋਇਆ. ਇਸੇ ਦੀ ਕੁੱਖ ਤੋਂ ਸ਼ਾਹਜ਼ਾਦਾ ਅਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਟੇ ਸਨ. ਦਸ਼ਮੇਸ਼ ਦੇ ਜੋਤੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਸਮਾਉਣ ਪਿਛੋਂ ਆਪ ਦਾ ਪੰਥ ਉੱਤੇ ਪੂਰਾ ਹੁਕਮ ਚਲਦਾ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ. ਭਾਈ ਮਨੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੇ ਹਰਿਮੰਦਿਰ (ਅਮ੍ਰਿਤਸਰ) ਦਾ ਗ੍ਰੰਥੀ ਥਾਪਕੇ ਭੇਜਿਆ ਸੀ. ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਆਪਣੀ ਅੰਤਿਮ ਅਵਸਥਾ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਰਹਿਕੇ ਵਿਤਾਈ. ਕੁਝ ਕਾਲ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਭੀ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਸਨ, ਜਿਸ ਥਾਂ ਆਪ ਦੀ ਹਵੇਲੀ ਦੇਖੀ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ. ਉਸ ਸਮੇਂ ਜਯਪੁਰ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਦੋ ਪਿੰਡ ਜਾਗੀਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਭੇਟਾ ਕੀਤੇ ਗਏ ਸਨ. ਮਥੁਰਾ ਤੋਂ ਫੇਰ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਵਾਪਿਸ ਆ ਗਏ ਅਰ ਉਸੇ ਥਾਂ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੮੦੪ ਵਿੱਚ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਹੋਇਆ. ਆਪ ਦੀ ਹਵੇਲੀ ਤੁਰਕਮਾਨ ਦਰਵਾਜੇ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਹਰ ਸੀਸਗੰਜ ਤੋਂ ਡੇਢ ਮੀਲ ਦੀ ਵਿੱਥ ਪੁਰ ਹੈ. ਕਲਗੀਧਰ ਨੇ ਜੋ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਮਾਤਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਕੌਰ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਅਬਿਚਲਨਗਰ ਤੋਂ ਤੁਰਨ ਵੇਲੇ ਸਪੁਰਦ ਕੀਤੇ ਸਨ, ਉਹ ਮਾਤਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਸਮੇਂ ਮਾਤਾ ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਹਵਾਲੇ ਕੀਤੇ, ਮਾਤਾ ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਆਪਣੇ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਸਮੇਂ ਆਪਣੇ ਸੇਵਕ ਜੀਵਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੂੰ ਦੇ ਕੇ ਅਦਬ ਨਾਲ ਰੱਖਣ ਦੀ ਆਗ੍ਯਾ ਕੀਤੀ. ਜੀਵਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਬਖਤਾਵਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ, ਉਸ ਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਮਿੱਠੂ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ, ਉਸਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਸੇਵਾ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ, ਉਸ ਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਭਾਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਇਹ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਆਪਣੇ ਘਰ ਰੱਖੇ. ਭਾਈ ਭਾਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਮੁਤਬੰਨੇ ਆਤਮਾ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਪੰਥ ਦੀ ਇੱਛਾ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਗੁਰੁਦ੍ਵਾਰਾ ਰਕਾਬਗੰਜ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਸਥਾਪਨ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤੇ ਹਨ. ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਇਹ ਹਨ- ਇੱਕ ਤਲਵਾਰ, ਇੱਕ ਖੰਡਾ, ਇੱਕ ਖੰਜਰ ਅਤੇ ਦੋ ਕਟਾਰ. Some of you can't accept truth of historical cultures, traditions and timeframes. All the way till even 1920's people in Punjab somewhat commonly had 2 wives. Today it's frowned upon, but that's the truth. I can tell you from person experience as well, as my great grandfather had 2 wives. It's not a big deal back then. On top of that, back then, people were married in their early/mid-teens. Now today you would call it disgusting...but that's just the way it was back then. People who say it was a "Muslim thing", are liars. Many different people from different cultures had multiple wives. The historians, scholars and Gursikhs who have supported that Guru Gobind Singh Jee had two or three wives all give very specific dates and details. The people who say that he only had one wife are the same people who cannot bring up any historical facts or dates to prove it. Look at this and how there are no dates or specifics that can show that the dates given are wrong: http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Guru_Gobind_Singh%27s_wife_or_wives'>http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Guru_Gobind_Singh%27s_wife_or_wives ^All of the points shown in the above link are proven wrong by Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha Jee. He takes everything into account, the 'Lahore brought to Anandpur', the nicknames and name change at Amrit Sanchar, as well as the interaction between Mata Sahib Kaur and Mata Sundri Jee (handing over the Shastars, travelling together), etc. One time I was watching a program with Jeonwala in an interview and he spent most of the interview talking about how Guru Gobind Singh Jee only had one wife, etc. That show also discussed it with other missionary/kala-afghana pracharaks. They say he had one wife in order to seem acceptable and modern in this new era/generation and new social standards and gain support/popularity. In reality, none of these people have specific dates or details. Just because these types of things are almost totally taboo in today's society, doesn't mean you can change history. History is clear, you have to open your mind and be willing to accept things that you're uncomfortable with. We as Sikhs try and "protect" the honour of our Guru and sometimes are so over-protective, that we are even willing to change historical facts, which is really sad.

It is historical fact that Hukamnamas came from all Sikh Takhats. This further proves that Takhats were made while Khalsa was still strong. Don't spread lies by saying "see when the other Takhats were built/made". Read the following to see Patna Sahib historical eye-witness account.... Takht Sri Harimandir Ji, Patna Sahib It was here at Takhat Patna Sahib, that Guru Gobind Singh, the tenth Sikh Guru was born in 1666. He also spent his early years here before moving to Anandpur. Besides being the birthplace of Guru Gobind Singh, Patna was also honored by visits from Guru Nanak as well as Guru Tegh Bahadur. This is one of only five Takhats or Holy Seats of Authority of the Sikhs. The Gurdwara Patna Sahib is in remembrance of the birthplace of Guru Gobind Singh, the tenth Guru of the Sikhs. Like many historical Gurdwaras in India and Pakistan, this Gurdwara was built by Maharaja Ranjit Singh. Originally, this is the place where Guru Nanak visited before going to the holy place Gaya. He was a great scholar of history and knew the importance of Pataliputra, which already was almost forgotten by Hindus. He tried to revive the glory of Indian culture. At this place stood the haveli of Salis Rai Jouri, who was a great devotee of Guru Nanak. He was so influenced by the teachings of the Guru that he converted his palatial home into a dharamsala (place where dharam is learned). When Guru Tegh Bahadur visited Patna, he stayed in this exact site. A magnificent house was built above the dharamsala of Salis Rai. Mullah Ahmed Bukhari, the author of Mirat-ul-Ahwal Jahan Nama, who stayed at Patna for some time at the close of 18th century, has made a reference to Harmandir Sahib. He writes, "Over the birthplace of Guru Gobind Singh, the Sikhs have raised a public edifice, made it a place of power and strength, and call it 'Harmandir'. It is also called 'Sangat' and is held in great esteem and veneration. They have made it a place of pilgrimage. Maharaja Ranjit Singh started the work of reconstructing the Harmandir in 1839 following destruction by fire, but did not survive to see the new structure. Again in 1934, when an earthquake rocked the entire state of Bihar, some portions of the Harmandir fell down. Construction of the present building was taken up on November 19, 1954 and was completed in about three years. Illuminated Guru Granth folio with nisan (Mul Mantra) of Guru Gobind Singh. Collection of Patna "As described by Charles Wilkins" by Professor Kirpal Singh, Punjabi University Charles Wilkins was one of the pioneering orientalists of the 18th century. With his help Sir William Jones, founder of the Asiatic Society, Calcutta, learnt Sanskrit. Later, he earned the title of "Father of Sanskrit" in the eyes of his contemporaries by writing grammar of Sanskrit language. He was the first to design and manufacture the type for production of Sanskrit and Persian grammars and proved to be a pioneer in the typographic art in the oriental language. Born in 1749 in England, Wilkins joined the service of the East India Company at the age of twenty. He suggested to the Governor General, Warren Hastings, to establish a printing press in 1778. Wilkins translated Manusmriti, Mahabharat and Hitopdesh and the later years of his life were devoted to the revision of Richardson's Persian, Arabic and English Dictionary. He died in 1836 in England. Charles Wilkins was one of the earliest Europeans to write about the Sikhs. He wrote on March 1, 1781: "Before I left Calcutta a gentleman with whom I chanced to be discoursing of that sect of people who are distinguished from worshippers of Brahm and followers of Mohomed by the appellation 'Seek' (meaning Sikhs) informed me that there was a considerable number of them settled in the city of Patna." Since he was proceeding on leave to Benaras he stopped at Patna. Following is the description of Gurdwara Patna Sahib and the daily routine there: "I found the College of the Seeks (Sikhs) situated in one of the narrow streets of Patna, at no very considerable distance from the custom house. I was permitted to enter the outward gate; but as soon as I came to the steps which led up into the Chapel, or public hall, I was civilly accosted by two of the Society, I asked them if I might ascent into the hall. They said it was a place of worship open to me and to all men; but at the same time, intimated that I must take off my shoes.. I did not hesitate to comply, and I was then politely conducted into the hall, and seated upon a carpet, in the midst of the assembly, which was so numerous as almost to fill the room. The Congregation The congregation arranged themselves upon the carpet, on each side of the hall, so as to leave a space before the altar from end to end. The great book, was brought, with some little ceremony from the altar, and placed at the opposite extremity of the hall. An old man, with a revered silver beard, knelt down before the desk with his face towards the altar; and on one side of him sat a man with a small drum, and two or three with cymbals. The book was now opened and the old man began to chant to the tune of the drum and cymbals; and, at the conclusion of every verse, most of the congregation joined chorus in a response, with countenances exhibiting great marks of joy. Their tones were by no means harsh; the time was quick; and I learnt that the subject was Hymn in praise of the unity, the omnipresence and the omnipotence, of the Deity. I was singularly delighted by the gestures of the old man; I never saw a countenance so expressive of infelt joy, whilst he turned about from one to another, as it were, be speaking their assets to those truths which his very soul seemed to be engaged in chanting forth. The Hymn being concluded, which consisted of about twenty verses, the whole congregation got up, and presented their faces with joined hands towards the altar, in the attitude of prayer. A young man now stood forth; and, with a loud voice and distinct accent, solemnly pronounced a long prayer, or kind of liturgy, at certain periods of which all the people joined in a general response, saying Wa Gooroo. They prayed against temptation; for grace to do good; for the general good of mankind; and a particular blessings to the Seeks; and for the safety of those who at that time were on their travels. This prayer was followed by a short blessing from the old man, and an invitation to the assembly to partake of a friendly feast. The book was then closed and restored to its place at the altar. The Holy Pudding The two men entered bearing a large iron cauldron, called a "karahi", just taken from the fire, and placed it in the centre of the hall upon a low stool. These were followed by others with five or six dishes, some of which were silver, and a large pile of leaves sewed together with fibres, in the form of plates. One of these plates was given to each of the company without distinction; and the dishes being filled from the cauldron, their contents were served out until everyone had got his share. Myself was not forgotten; and, as I was resolved not to give them the smallest occasion for offence, I ate up my portion. It was a kind of sweetmeat, of the consistence of soft brown sugar, composed of flour and sugar mixed up with clarified butter, which is called "ghee". Had not the ghee been rancid, I should have relished it better. We were next served with a few sugar plums and here ended the feast and the ceremonies of the day. They told me the religious part of the ceremony was daily repeated five times. I asked what were the ceremonies in admitting a proselyte. A person having shown a sincere inclination to renounce his former opinions, to any five or more Seeks assembled together, in any place, as well on the highway as in a house of worship, they send to the first shop where sweetmeats are sold, and procure a small quantity of a particular sort, which is very common, and, as I re-collect, they call "Batasa"; and having diluted it in pure water, they sprinkle some of it on the body and into the eyes of the convert; whilst one of the best instructed repeats to him, in any language with which he is conversant, the chief canons of their faith, exacting from him a solemn promise to abide by them the rest of his life. They offered to admit me into their society, but I declined the honor; contending myself with the alphabet, which they told me to guard as the apple of my life, as it was a sacred character. I find it differs but little from devnagur; the number, order, and powers, of the letters are exactly the same. The language itself is a mixture of Persian, Arabic, and some Sanskrit, grafted upon the provincial dialect of Punjab, which is a kind of hindovee ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮਾ - ਫ਼ਾ. [حُکمنامہ] ਹ਼ੁਕਮਨਾਮਹ. ਸੰਗ੍ਯਾ- ਆਗ੍ਯਾਪਤ੍ਰ. ਉਹ ਖ਼ਤ ਜਿਸ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੁਕਮ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਹੋਵੇ। ੨. ਸ਼ਾਹੀ ਫੁਰਮਾਨ। ੩. ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦਾ ਆਗ੍ਯਾਪਤ੍ਰ. ਦੇਖੋ, ਤਿਲੋਕ ਸਿੰਘ.#ਗੁਰੂ ਸਾਹਿਬਾਨ ਦੇ ਸਮੇਂ ਜੋ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਾਂ ਦੇ ਆਗ੍ਯਾਪਤ੍ਰ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਵੱਲ ਭੇਜੇ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਸਨ, ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀ 'ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮਾ' ਸੰਗ੍ਯਾ- ਸੀ. ਮਾਤਾ ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਜੀ ਭੀ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਨੂੰ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮੇ ਜਾਰੀ ਕਰਦੇ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ. ਗੁਰੂਪੰਥ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਬੰਧ ਵਿੱਚ ਚਾਰ ਤਖਤਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਭੀ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮੇ ਭੇਜੇ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਰਹੇ ਅਤੇ ਹੁਣ ਜਾਰੀ ਹੁੰਦੇ ਹਨ. ਚਾਰ ਤਖਤ - ਸਤਿਗੁਰਾਂ ਦੇ ਚਾਰ ਸਿੰਘਾਸਨ. ਅਮ੍ਰਿਤਸਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਕਾਲਬੁੰਗਾ, ਪਟਨੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਹਰਿਮੰਦਿਰ ਆਨੰਦਪੁਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਕੇਸ਼ਗੜ੍ਹ ਅਤੇ ਨੰਦੇੜ ਪਾਸ ਅਬਿਚਲਨਗਰ. ਪੰਜ ਤਖਤ - ਅਕਾਲਬੁੰਗਾ, ਪਟਨਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ, ਕੇਸਗੜ੍ਹ, ਅਬਿਚਲਨਗਰ ਅਤੇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੇ ਹਜੂਰ ਖਾਲਸਾਦੀਵਾਨ. ਅਕਾਲਬੁੰਗਾ - ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਹਰਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਨੇ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੬੬੫ ਵਿੱਚ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਸਰ ਹਰਿਮੰਦਿਰ ਦੇ ਸਾਮ੍ਹਣੇ ਇੱਕ ਉੱਚਾ ਰਾਜਸਿੰਘਾਸਨ (ਸ਼ਾਹੀ ਤਖ਼ਤ) ਤਿਆਰ ਕਰਵਾਕੇ ਉਸ ਦਾ ਨਾਉਂ "ਅਕਾਲਬੁੰਗਾ" ਰੱਖਿਆ, ਜਿਸ ਥਾਂ ਸਵੇਰੇ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਝ ਨੂੰ ਦੀਵਾਨ ਲਗਾਕੇ ਸੰਗਤਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਨਿਹਾਲ ਕਰਦੇ ਸਨ. ਅਕਾਲਬੁੰਗਾ ਪੰਥਕ ਜਥੇਬੰਦੀ ਦਾ ਕੇਂਦ੍ਰ ਹੈ. ਪੰਥ ਇਸ ਥਾਂ ਮੁੱਢ ਤੋਂ ਗੁਰੁਮਤੇ ਸੋਧਦਾ ਆਇਆ ਹੈ. ਇਹ ਗੁਰਦ੍ਵਾਰਾ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਦਾ ਪਹਿਲਾ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਹੈ. ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਮਾਤਾ - ਲਹੌਰ ਨਿਵਾਸੀ ਰਾਮਸਰਨ ਕੁਮਰਾਵ ਖਤ੍ਰੀ ਦੀ ਸੁਪੁਤ੍ਰੀ, ਜਿਸ ਦਾ ਆਨੰਦ ੭. ਵੈਸਾਖ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੭੪੧ ਨੂੰ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾਲ ਹੋਇਆ. ਇਸੇ ਦੀ ਕੁੱਖ ਤੋਂ ਸ਼ਾਹਜ਼ਾਦਾ ਅਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਟੇ ਸਨ. ਦਸ਼ਮੇਸ਼ ਦੇ ਜੋਤੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਸਮਾਉਣ ਪਿਛੋਂ ਆਪ ਦਾ ਪੰਥ ਉੱਤੇ ਪੂਰਾ ਹੁਕਮ ਚਲਦਾ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ. ਭਾਈ ਮਨੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੇ ਹਰਿਮੰਦਿਰ (ਅਮ੍ਰਿਤਸਰ) ਦਾ ਗ੍ਰੰਥੀ ਥਾਪਕੇ ਭੇਜਿਆ ਸੀ. ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਆਪਣੀ ਅੰਤਿਮ ਅਵਸਥਾ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਰਹਿਕੇ ਵਿਤਾਈ. ਕੁਝ ਕਾਲ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਭੀ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਸਨ, ਜਿਸ ਥਾਂ ਆਪ ਦੀ ਹਵੇਲੀ ਦੇਖੀ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ. ਉਸ ਸਮੇਂ ਜਯਪੁਰ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਦੋ ਪਿੰਡ ਜਾਗੀਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਭੇਟਾ ਕੀਤੇ ਗਏ ਸਨ. ਮਥੁਰਾ ਤੋਂ ਫੇਰ ਦਿੱਲੀ ਮਾਤਾ ਜੀ ਵਾਪਿਸ ਆ ਗਏ ਅਰ ਉਸੇ ਥਾਂ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੮੦੪ ਵਿੱਚ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਹੋਇਆ. ਆਪ ਦੀ ਹਵੇਲੀ ਤੁਰਕਮਾਨ ਦਰਵਾਜੇ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਹਰ ਸੀਸਗੰਜ ਤੋਂ ਡੇਢ ਮੀਲ ਦੀ ਵਿੱਥ ਪੁਰ ਹੈ.#ਕਲਗੀਧਰ ਨੇ ਜੋ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਮਾਤਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਕੌਰ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਅਬਿਚਲਨਗਰ ਤੋਂ ਤੁਰਨ ਵੇਲੇ ਸਪੁਰਦ ਕੀਤੇ ਸਨ, ਉਹ ਮਾਤਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਸਮੇਂ ਮਾਤਾ ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਹਵਾਲੇ ਕੀਤੇ, ਮਾਤਾ ਸੁੰਦਰੀ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਆਪਣੇ ਦੇਹਾਂਤ ਸਮੇਂ ਆਪਣੇ ਸੇਵਕ ਜੀਵਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੂੰ ਦੇ ਕੇ ਅਦਬ ਨਾਲ ਰੱਖਣ ਦੀ ਆਗ੍ਯਾ ਕੀਤੀ. ਜੀਵਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਬਖਤਾਵਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ, ਉਸ ਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਮਿੱਠੂ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ, ਉਸਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਸੇਵਾ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ, ਉਸ ਦੇ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਭਾਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਇਹ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਆਪਣੇ ਘਰ ਰੱਖੇ. ਭਾਈ ਭਾਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਮੁਤਬੰਨੇ ਆਤਮਾ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਪੰਥ ਦੀ ਇੱਛਾ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਗੁਰੁਦ੍ਵਾਰਾ ਰਕਾਬਗੰਜ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਸਥਾਪਨ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤੇ ਹਨ. ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਇਹ ਹਨ- ਇੱਕ ਤਲਵਾਰ, ਇੱਕ ਖੰਡਾ, ਇੱਕ ਖੰਜਰ ਅਤੇ ਦੋ ਕਟਾਰ. ਦੇਖੋ, ਦਿੱਲੀ.

Walk a mile in a Sikh’s turban Thursday at University of Guelph Preetam Singh, 20, describes his religious conviction as a love affair with God. The University of Guelph student is helping to organize the Sikh Students' Association's Sikh Awareness Day on Thursday. Non-Sikhs will get the opportunity to experience what it is like to wear turban. Rob O'Flanagan/Mercury staff GUELPH—A Sikh’s turban, or dastar, is a symbol of religious devotion and a mark of personal courage. It and other elements of customary Sikhi dress distinguish followers of the religion from others in Canadian society, and that distinction is not without challenges. The Sikh Student Association at the University of Guelph will hold a Sikh Awareness Day on Thursday, giving non-Sikhs an opportunity to experience what it is like to wear a turban. The event is patterned after others on Canadian campuses aimed at familiarizing Canadians with Sikh beliefs and inviting them to experience both the highs and lows of wearing the dastar. Preetam Singh, 20, was a striking figure over the weekend on the U of G campus, wearing flowing dark bana—traditional attire—with his high, dark blue dastar covering his uncut hair, and a kirpan—dagger—strapped to this hip. “As soon as I walk in a room I have people’s attention,” Singh said. “It gives me the opportunity to teach people something about my faith.” The Sikhi way of life, he added, has timeless and holistic qualities. While the rules, ethics and customs of society are constantly changing, the teachings of the faith remain stable. His religion, he said, is a love affair, and one he entered into of his own volition at the age of 13. “I think of it as falling in love,” said the U of G history student. “You don’t choose who you fall in love with, or when you are going to fall in love. You have no power over it. I never thought that I was going to be as religious as I am now.” As with other religions, Sikhs strive to be constantly mindful of the presence of God in their day-to-day lives. It’s a devotional ambition to which Singh is committed. “Everyday is a challenge to make yourself better,” he said. “It’s never good enough. You always have to work for something more, to try harder and strive for higher ideals. Ideals are perfection and we are imperfect as human beings.” Being easily identifiable as an adherent to a particular faith, he said, puts an onus of responsibility upon a Sikh. “As a Sikh I know that people know immediately that I am different, that I am religious,” he said. “If someone knows that I am a Sikh then I am representing the Sikh faith. All my actions represent the Sikh faith—what I say, what I do, how I act. It gives you a lot of responsibility, and I have to really strive to put the Sikh faith in a better light.” Sikhs do face overt discrimination because of their appearance, Singh said. Mass media, he said, has associated the wearing of a turban with perpetrators of terrorist acts, and that negative and unfair association has been applied to Sikhs. “I think it is very important for us to propagate the wearing of the turban, and to have people know the difference between the Sikh religion and other religions, and why we wear a turban,” Singh said. “It is a show of peace.” The Sikh religion—the term Sikhism is not proper—began in the late 1400s in the Punjab region of India. It has no clergy. The faith promotes the equality of all human beings, social justice, the removal of superstition and blind ritual from religious life, earning an honest living, and circumventing worldly desires and sin. There are about 20 million Sikhs worldwide, and it is estimated there are more than 300,000 in Canada. To be a part of the Khalsa, or collective body of the faith, one must wear five kakars, or articles of faith, on their person, including uncut hair, a wooden comb, a metal bracelet, special cotton undergarments, and the dagger. Thursday’s Sikh Awareness Day, sponsored by the Sikh Student Association, runs throughout the day in the University Centre and is a chance to “walk in the shoes of a Sikh for one day.” roflanagan@guelphmercury.com [www.guelphmercury.com]

Giani Sher Singh Jee Ambala did Katha again today at Bangla Sahib in the morning (March 19, 2013). Today was his last day. He did Katha on 3 days including today. So that means from March 17-19, 2013. I have today's recording and the 18th as well. I missed March 17, hopefully that is somewhere out there. Oh yeah, I forgot to add in.... the Sangat absolutely loved him :smile2:

Also check out Giani Sant Singh Jee Maskeen's recordings. They are so amazing, clear, correct and full of Amrit Ras and emotion/love/piaar. I know you asked for Taksali, but don't be limited to that. You will find out through experience that there are people just as good (if not better) who aren't "Taksali". Don't be afraid to explore and learn from everyone :smile2: http://maskeensahib.com/?p=p_23&sName=Nit-Nem---Gurbani-Ucharan

I get what you mean. What's the story with Giani Gurdev Singh Jee and Baba Ranjodh Singh and others? Please expand, this is the first time I'm hearing about this.

Very nice Jee! He's not just father...he's the God-Father :biggrin2: and Big Daddy :tongue2:

Veer Jee, didn't you get the memo? He's Sant, Mahapursh, Brahmgianee......but most of all..."Satguru Jai Samadha Sain Baba Narayan Bhajan". Veer Jee, I am shocked that people in this topic are sympathizing with him and his followers. First of all....he has Sain/Saee(n) and Satguru in his name......he's not God or Paalanhaar, yet his followers call him that. It's so pathetic to stand up for these people. Look at them bowing down to him...giving him offerings...like he's a God or something. And then, even more disgusting is how they want to be fed by him. So much, that they are willing to eat a cake piece which is jootha and already bitten by some other random stranger. In india...knowing all the diseases which can be spread through saliva...any sensible person would never do that...yet these people want that cake. If you watch the video closely...even if they got a piece of cake from the baba's side partner...they still go to the baba as well and want to get fed by him......what a joke. Also check these videos of a similar baba...I don't know which Granth/Book they have Parkash along with the idols, but it's very similar. They (some) have heads covered and the baba bows down to the granth before taking the "throne" (EXACTLY how this Narayan Bhajan baba did in the video in the second post of this topic). Here he is with lots of little girls.......very disturbing as we very well know what goes on in deras. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDmTatARjBc Other nicknames for videos on youtube are: Jai Samadha Sain Baba Sai Baba Satguru ...etc This youtube account is a major fan/follower......check out lots of the videos of the baba on here: http://www.youtube.com/user/MrAkashduseja ALSO..... don't be silly....it seems like you guys are very happy that they are covering their heads in Guru Granth Sahib's Hazoori. If you see all of the other videos.....you will see that they don't cover their head out of respect for Guru Granth Sahib. They cover their heads for the baba and because of the baba. If the baba is there..they cover there heads...not because of Guru Granth Sahib. So stop stretching the story to find some positive.

Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale (and all of his companions), Baba Karam Singh Hoti Mardhan, Baba Nand Singh Jee, Bhai Vir Singh Jee, Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Jee (and all of his companions, read Rangle Sajan and other books), Raghbir Singh Bir Jee, Baba Harnam Singh Jee Rampur Khera, Shaheeds in 1978, Bhai Fauja Singh Jee, etc.... Even Baba Ranjit Singh Dhadrian Valey...you know how many protests he participates in....he barely escaped a bullet as well..someone tried to silence him by killing him while protesting. Like I said before... Now back to the topic: http://www.panthic.org/articles/3542 CONTROVERSIAL SGPC BOOK INFLAMES SIKH MASSES PANTHIC.ORG Sikh Ithaas (History) published by the SGPC Nagpur, Maharashtra (KP) – The Dera Sacha Sauda issue has not been solved yet and another issue has already raised the fury of the Sikh masses living worldwide. The recently published controversial book ‘Sikh Itihaas’ has several peculiar facts behind it. Mainly, the SGPC not only put the book into circulation but also published it. The book has been written in Hindi and it contains several insults to Guru Sahib and Sikh history. Although the insulting terminology is prevalent throughout the book, many are surprised to find out that the SGPC allowed the book to be put into circulation. For this reason, the SGPC President in particular has received scathing criticism from the Sikh Sangat. Some of offensive passages called Guru TegBahadur Sahib Ji, the 9th Guru of the Sikhs as a 'thief', and the 6th Guru Sahib Ji a 'kidnapper', the 10th Guru Sahib a 'coward'. Atinderpal Singh, President SAD (International), is one of the only Sikh leaders that has raised concerns about the contents of the book. While talking to the press from Kotkapura, he lobbied that the role of anti-Sikh organizations such as the Rashtriya Sikh Sangat and Bhartiya Janta Party must be uncovered by initiating a proper inquiry into the book. In addition, the party president lashed out at Avtar Makkar, Parkash Badal, Jathedar Vedanti and several Sant Samaj leaders for allowing the book to remain in publication despite the requests of Sikhs living in various parts of Punjab. Bhai Atinderpal Singh stated that the writer of the book had even surpassed the acts of Gurmeet Ram Rahim by using such derogatory terminology in the book. He also expressed grief over the silence of the Sikh leadership in regards to the book and has asked Giani Joginder Singh Vedanti to understand his role as the Jathedar of Akal Takht Sahib and to summon the SGPC President along with Dharam Parchar Committee officials. Sikh Sangat based in parts of Punjab and other States has called for a boycott of the book and has been organizing programs to burn copies of it as an expression of their protest. Furthermore, Sikhs living in all parts of the world have been asked to cut any type of donations that are being sent to the SGPC until the organization’s officials are punished for their activities. A Khalsa Alliance (KA) representative based in California also used strong words in relation to the SGPC’s involvement in the book. It was brought to the attention of Panthic Weekly staff that the book was initially a part of Bibi Jagir Kaur’s set of proposed books that were circulated within hundreds of SGPC controlled Gurdwara Sahibs. According to the Alliance representative, while old copies of this book are still available at many Gurdwara Sahib libraries, distribution of this book was geared up once again just about a month ago. Reponse The Shiromani Gurdwara Parbhandhak Committee has responded to the concerns of the Sikh community in regards to the book ‘Sikh Itihas’. Despite the wait, the statement by Avtar Makkar that was provided to the press has fallen short of the expectations of the Sikh Nation. According to the statement, a new panel has already been initiated to review all the books that are proposed to the SGPC. SGPC Additional Secretary Joginder Singh has been asked to head the panel, while Prof. Balwinder Singh, Dr. Balwant Singh Dhillon, Dr. Kharak Singh, Dr. Kirpal Singh, Dr. Jasbir Singh Sambhar would sit on it to review the contents of the books. Avtar Makkar further held that he was not involved in the publication of the book and denied that any organization has contact the SGPC. He asked Sikhs situated throughout Punjab to contact the SGPC directly to report any derogatory parts of the book. A meeting was also held at Akal Takht Sahib about the controversy that has been stirred by the book. The panel of five Singh Sahibs has asked the SGPC to provide details about the publication of the book in full detail within seven days. Decisions on this issue have been delayed until the report is submitted to Akal Takht Sahib. In a separate incident, the SGPC President said that circulation of the book has been stopped and that the Dharam Parchar Committee is in the process of recalling the books that have been distributed in several villages. Also read: http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Cities/SGPC-published_books_to_be_scanned/rssarticleshow/2345523.cms FATEHGARH SAHIB: Not only 'Sikh Itihas' but all also other books published by Shiromani Gurdwara Parbandhak Committee (SGPC) would be put under scanner of experts to pinpoint any objectionable content in them. This was disclosed by SGPC president Avtar Singh Makkar, talking to TOI here on Thursday. He said the persons who committed negligence would not be spared and strict action would be taken against them. The SGPC president said a review committee consisting of Sikh scholars Dr Kharak Singh, historian Dr Kirpal Singh, Dr Balwant Singh Dhillon, Dr Jasbir Singh Sambhar and SGPC research board in-charge Prof Balwinder Singh had been formed under headship of SGPC additional secretary Joginder Singh. Makkar clarified that no such book having controversial content was published during his tenure. He said anybody finding anything derogatory in the book 'Sikh Itihas' should bring it to the notice of the SGPC instead of making an issue of it in the press. He alleged that some people were indulging in politics on this issue, which was not in the interest of the community. "It is time to mend our mistakes and blunders so as not to make a mockery of ourselves in the eyes of the public," he added. He said orders had been issued for withdrawal of the book 'Sikh Itihas' from the market and the libraries. Notably, the book 'Sikh Itihas' was published by the dharam parchar committee of SGPC. According to Malkiat Singh Ball of Gurmat parchar sabha, Nagpur, this book was distributed among the 'Nanak Panthis' Sikligar and Vanjara communities in and around Nagpur during the tenure of Jagir Kaur as president of the SGPC through the gurmat parchar sabha. The five Sikh high priests, in a meeting at Amritsar on Wednesday, summoned a detailed report from the SGPC secretary within one week. The hiromani Gurdwara Parbandhak Committee president further said that in future, the copies of script of the books to be considered for publication would be sent to the panel of Sikh scholars for review in advance to root out any mistake or blunder.

Which English translation do you use? A website or book? And how are you able to locate the tranlation on the website or locate it in the book?

Congrats! Also, very nice posts by Savinderpal Singh Jee and Jasdeep Singh Jee. Gurpreet Kaur Jee, no one is saying that it's only Bibia who do kurehit. Also, Jasdeep Singh Jee didn't call Savinderpal Singh Jee a dog. He called himself a dog out of humility. So, please clear up that confusion..no one is calling anyone else anything. So don't worry Gurpreet Kaur Jee, you can be a princess or daughter or whatever you wish. But if you say you're a child of Guru Sahib, then also remember.....Jai Gur Jhirkey....Ta Meethaa Laagai.........No questions asked. :smile2: You say you can question ("discuss") everything...but eventually you will realise that it will destroy your faith in Guru Sahib. You will start doing Kintu-Printu on even the simplest topics...such as this Panj Piarey topic. It's not a hard topic. It is Guru Sahib's Hukam and Bhaanaa. The other posters in this topic have explained very well. Gurpreet Kaur Jee, please listen to Giani Sant Singh Maskeen Jee's recordings....they are eye-openers...a lot of these comments you are making are answered in Maskeen Jee's Katha recordings. Gurpreet Kaur Jee....in Guru's Darbar...in Guru's House.....the lower you go the better. The lowest are actually the highest in Guru's House. You can be the daughter....I will stick with the dogs like the other posters. ਨੀਚਾ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਨੀਚ ਜਾਤਿ ਨੀਚੀ ਹੂ ਅਤਿ ਨੀਚੁ ॥ Those who are lowest of the low class, the very lowest of the low; ਨਾਨਕੁ ਤਿਨ ਕੈ ਸੰਗਿ ਸਾਥਿ ਵਡਿਆ ਸਿਉ ਕਿਆ ਰੀਸ ॥ Nanak seeks the company of those. Why should he try to compete with the great? ਜਿਥੈ ਨੀਚ ਸਮਾਲੀਅਨਿ ਤਿਥੈ ਨਦਰਿ ਤੇਰੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ ॥੪॥੩॥ In that place where the lowly are cared for-there, the Blessings of Your Glance of Grace rain down. ||4||3|| But don't think just because you are daughter, that you will get special treatment. :smile2: :tongue2: Sahibzaadey were sent into battle before many other soldiers. Are you ready to go onto the tree to get sweets, no questions asked? Or are you going to keep on saying Dad this, Dad that then as well?

UPDATE: I was able to download the 2 videos of Giani Sher Singh Jee Ambala at Bangla Sahib doing Katha today (March 18, 2013). I'll try and upload it, or maybe I can send it to one of you, and you can upload it, thanks. Also other programs which have taken place in Delhi Gurdwaras recently:

I AM SO HAPPY TO TELL YOU....TODAY HISTORY WAS MADE!!!!!! When I turned on the TV.....Guess who I saw doing Katha at Bangla Sahib??? GIANI SHER SINGH AMBALA!!!!!!!! VAHIGURU!!!!!!!! These past few weeks have been very amazing in Delhi Gurdwaras Bhai Pinderpal Singh Jee did Katha there Bhai Jasvant Singh Parvana Jee did Katha there Giani Sher Singh Ambala Jee did Katha there Bhai Balbir Singh Jee did Keertan there Darbar Sahib Granthi did Katha there other Panthic Parchaaraks and Keertania did Katha and Keertan there This is further proof that it's all politics when people try and make blanket statements and say that SGPC is RSS, Jathedars are RSS, Badal is RSS, Makkar is RSS, etc. Reminds me of how Darshan and Dhunda call everyone RSS as well....hmm.... The biggest RSS is GONE. That was Sarna/Missionaries/Darshan/Kala-Afghana.....they are gone from Delhi Gurdwaras!!! It was only because of Sarna that they became famous in the first place. RSS and Sarna did massive advertisement and promotion of RSS agents (missionaries). Those who say that missionaries don't cause divisions in Sangat.....how come none of you haters have any answer when I ask that why are missionaries silent on Sarna's faults and major disgraceful acts committed in Delhi Gurdwaras, like Lakhi Shah Vanjara Hall for example? Also, the same missionaries speak against Bhai Pinderpal Singh Jee, Giani Sant Singh Maskeen Jee, Bhai Balbir Singh (stopped him from doing Keertan), etc. Sarna/Darshan/Missionaries are the biggest Sangat dividers and trouble makers....PERIOD. Here is the link to listen to the Katha: http://gurbani.co/katha_bs.php ^ It comes in two parts. To get to the second part, in the player click on the upwards facing arrow with the line underneath it and click on #2. ^If someone could record it somehow, it would be great, because this is historical and rare moment. Please put it on youtube! Thanks! VAHIGURU.

GPS Veer Jee is spot on! Just like I pointed out earlier...this is all politics. Why is it only Baldev Singh Sirsa Jee who is talking about this? Where is everyone else? Why is a politician the only one making a big deal out of it? Also, it's not like this is the only book out there on Sikh history. To say that this book holds more seniority or importance than other books is overreacting. We already have lots of stuff written by Kala-Afghana and Ghagga, etc, which is just as bad as this book, if not worse. Even if this SGPC book is changed, there are probably still many copies out there in circulation, so the damage is already done. The only thing now is for SGPC to create a new book or an updated version. Or how about this...Baldev Singh Sirsa Jee can write his own book by documenting all of the errors in the SGPC book and correcting them. Now that would be a proactive solution. If Baldev Singh Sirsa Jee is truly worried about Sikhi and not politics...then he should have spoken out during the many incidents which took place in Delhi Gurdwaras under Sarna leadership. If he can call Badal, SGPC and Jathedars RSS agents...then I would love to see him be impartial and be able to say the same about Sarna and his group. You see...when you turn the tables...it's a totally different story and perspective.

Hey, very nice to read the discussion going on, very heart-warming :smile2: Sikhs meditate on the word/name: "Vahiguru". That is the Gurmantar or in other words, the Mantra bestowed upon Sikhs by the Guru. Also, Sikhs meditate on Mool Mantar as well. In the Ambrosial hours of the morning, Sikhs would wake up and meditate on Mool Mantar first, then Gurmantar and then recite their prayers. Along with this, Sikhs try to focus on this 24/7. Since you are native austrian/european, how do you understand the meanings of the Gurbani you listen to? Do you use an English translation?

It is not men who dominate all the time. Women put themselves down as well in MANY topics/issues. Also, if it's such a problem to you, why don't you step up yourself? Why keep on talking to Dad and putting all the blame on Him. Dad set everything proper. You have to do something proactive as well. You can start by becoming a Parchaarak, a top level Keertania, a Granthi, an Avastha high enough for Panj Piaarey Seva, etc. You can also go outside and cut the grass, shovel the snow and many other things that a lot of women leave it up to men to do and never want to do it themselves. Show some pride, go outside and grab that shovel and get to work in a manly-fashion. Show them how it's done :smile2: You wanted equality right? The reality is...women only want equality where it benefits them and makes things easier for them. They never truly ask for FULL equality in EVERYTHING. That's the type of mind games feminists play.

^ Oh please.... Naam Simran is one of the main pillars of Sikhi. Those who "closed their eyes and did Vahiguru Simran" were the same ones who gave up their lives for Sikhi and didn't run away when they were needed the most.