BhForce

Throughout the ages, whenever Sikhs have face difficulties they have refreshed their spirits and reminded themselves of who they are vs. who their enemies are via Gurbani and approved works. Please post tuks here that are relevant to the current situation.

dasnimana, you are right. With mobile camera phones, SMS, multimedia phone service, Youtube, and the Internet, it is much more possible for us to get our side of the story out. Even if we're not able to communicate our message to other communities, at least we can do so with our own.

There's already a thread on this: How To Download Youtube Videos (sikhsangat)

What Bloom said. 5 kakari rehit, don't do bajjar kurehit, love God, Guru, Gurbani and Gurmukhs.

When someone stands with their foot on your throat, you'll naturally feel threatened and fight back. Hindi chauvinists trying to impose their language on all of India naturally results in anti-Hindi feeling. He's not speaking English to riksha drivers. He's speaking English and Punjabi in Chandigarh, not Uttar Pradesh.

Since some people don't know Punjabi, here is a transcript of sorts of one of the videos posted above. The speaker below was an eyewitness at the scene: From the past 10 days, Sant Smaj was saying ban the Ashutosh samagam to prevent problems. Yesterday, 300 Singhs were sent from Gurdwara Parmeshar Duar. There were 2 meetings in Gurdwara Kalgidhar and Jawaddi Kalan. The DSPs assured that the Shoba Yatra of Ashutosh was canceled and banned. In 2003, the Central Govt. had banned Ashutosh from doing samagams in Punjab other than Nurmehal due to anticipated problems. Regardless of this prohibition, the Punjab Govt. allowed it. Many organisations had noted this for many days looking at the posters for the smagam. Even though they said it was banned, we still decided to go there. There were about 15 Mahapurkhs, including Harman Singh, Baljit Singh Daduwal, etc. Dal Khalsa, Federations, KAC, Mohkam Singh. 500-700 Singhs left from the Gurdwara with ardas. At just 100 feet, they started surrounding us. They started hitting with sticks and taking turbans off. We did jaikara and resolved to go forward. Some Singhs were warm because Ashutosh had challenged the honour of the Sikhs. One MLA was saying again and again that he would make the smagam go forth under any condition. We were moving forward in peace reciting the Satnam, then they stopped us again, and threw gas bombs, injured many Singhs. There were 2-3 Singhs in front, 1 was shaheed, maybe more. 11 injured. One Singh who was with Baba Harnam Singh took a big blow on the head. One 60-year old Singh who was with me (S. Dhadrianwale) moved forward and took a bullet in the arm which was going toward S. Dhadrianwale. A "Panthic" government did Ashutosh's smagam along with Harish Bedi, MLA under protection of police for 2 hours while they fired bullets on us, including SSPs. They have a responsibility to make a wall, or use a water cannon, or fire at people's feet, or use rubber bullets. But they just started firing bullets, including with AK-47s. One Singh is injured he might not survive. Bhai Darshan Singh of village Lohara, a poor auto-riksha driver, went with us. When we saw what they were doing, hundreds of Singhs would have been shaheed with what the administration was doing. They desired that Singhs become so afraid they would never rise again. Our leaders recognised this and tried to reduce the ferocity of the Singhs saying that they are going to kill hundreds today, so just sit right here with legs crossed, there is no other solution. Now it's 12 at night, we're here from 11:30 in the morning. Maybe 500-700 bodies. We've given messages to all to take part in this strike. But the administration isn't letting anyone come to Ludhiana. Plan for tomorrow is that Ashutosh's smagam shouldn't take place tomorrow. And that the final sanskar of that Singh should take place on this stage. We're just sitting here instead of going home to give encouragement to the Sangat to come here. Some Federationists. No Jathedars so far. When I came from England, I also said then that Baba Baljit Singh Ji went to jail in relation to the Sirsa matter, 7 Singhs of ours were charged, our tour was stopped. One person had thrown oil on himself and inflamed himself, and they put the murder charge on us. The Sirsa case wasn't finished, and this new one started. Because the Sirsa Sacha Sauda fellow, Bhaniarewala, and Ashutosh.... We're saying from the morning that we're not against any organisation. Hindus have a lot of gurus, from Asa Ram to Parmanand to Ramdev, Brahmdev, Murari Bapu, they come here and do their programs, and we don't object. But if we object, it's to the Sirsa Sacha Sauda fellow, Bhaniarewala, and Ashutosh. Because they are against Hindus too, they say I am Ram, I am Guru Nanak, there is no need for parkash, I am parkash of Guru Granth Sahib. Some organisations are trying to create a situation in Punjab that Hindus hate Sikhs and vice versa. But Hindus don't oppose Sikhs. Yet if someone is speaking against Sihi, and Gurus, then we are opposing them. All this happened with the encouragement of Punjab Govt. even after the ban of 2003. The Singh who was with Baba Harnam Singh is now OK. One more Singh is serious, his bullet was taken out in surgery. The rest of the Sants had some blows from sticks. Some Sikhs have greater injuries, some less. Ashutosh closed his program and left. He said that, but the administration didn't. The way they said they'd ban it but they didn't, it seem to us that they'll say we'll close it, then tomorrow when all the organisations are gone, then they'll start it again.

Thank you very much for this photo of this ਦੁਬਾਜਰੀ shamelessly sitting at the feet of this charlatan. It makes sense why they wanted to protect this con-artist at the expense of shooting the Singhz. It also makes sense why she had air-conditioning specially installed in Darbar Sahib even though all the conservationists have said it will ruin the building. She's used to the AC in the deras she goes to. I heard from someone she supposedly does a lot of simran. OK, whatever. Guru Sahib says saying the name of God all day doesn't matter if your heart isn't pure: ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਿਤ ਕਰਹਿ ਰਸਨਾ ਕਹਿਆ ਕਛੂ ਨ ਜਾਣੀ ॥ They may continually chant, 'Har, Har' with their tongues, but they do not know what they are saying. (Anand Sahib) ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਨਿਤ ਕਪਟੁ ਕਮਾਵਹਿ ਹਿਰਦਾ ਸੁਧੁ ਨ ਹੋਈ ॥ One who chants the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, while constantly practicing deception, shall never become pure of heart. p732

I don't know what is being pasted, but, yes, the general idea to keep matters within the panth is valid.

You're right that the difference between Punjab and western countries is that they control immigration with visas. You go through an interview before going to Canada. So how about a Punjabi test before coming to Punjab? Anyway, India is in no sense a "nation". A nation is a group of people with common descent. India is a collection of different nations under one government. It was planned to be a union of states, although the central government keeps taking more and more power, like every other central government.

http://translate.google.com/ German to English translationShow romanization Alleged attack on letters claiming to be Sikh preachers So far around 30 witnesses were questioned about the shooting in the Vienna prayer house, killed a Sikh preacher and the other was seriously injured. Vienna - Four days after the assassination of the two Ravi Dass preacher in a prayer house in Vienna of the Vienna Police investigators have interviewed about 30 witnesses to the shooting, with one dead and about a dozen injured. Currently it is also a purported letter claiming responsibility - a call for other information - according to which the Khalistan Zindabad Force (KZF) assumes responsibility for the attack. The Discount rate is made - even with terrorist means - a unanhängigen for a Sikh state of Khalistan in the area north Indian state of Punjab. Was the addressee of the profession of radio stations in south London borough of South Hall, which is a strong Sikh community is located and where the late 80s and early 90s had come to clashes between various factions of the religious community. Authenticity is verified 01742640 (1spbreit) Sant Niranjan That was in the attack in Vienna seriously injured. He is still on the road to recovery. Picture: EPA "Currently, the system checks whether the call is genuine or whether professors they are free riders," said police spokesman Michael Takacs on Thursday in Vienna. In the Confessor message is called, according Akash Radio is not the appropriate behavior of the Sikh faith, Ravi Dass community. Since the Ravi Dassi despite warnings still being committed "sins" would have, had the attack was inevitable. The seriously injured by shots preacher Sant Niranjan That is, according to Takacs continue on the path to recovery. He is closely guarded in a Vienna hospital. Imposed among the six suspects - all were pre-trial detention - is the man as a suspected main perpetrators, who himself suffered a bullet to the head and temporarily can not be questioned, since it is in artificial deep sleep. Advocate criticizes authorities The criticism appeared on Friday's edition of news magazine "Profil", the British lawyer Lekh Raj Birdy, the fact that Sant Niranjan and Rama killed Anand (Nand) has represented the inaction of the Austrian authorities. In Britain, it had threats against the guru of Ravi Dass given sect, and there "were the threats seriously" and "steps taken to minimize the danger." In Austria, the Austrian authorities were doing, "according to my information absolutely nothing to protect the holy men", the lawyer quoted in an advance notification. (APA)

Good for you. There was a former Tamil Nadu Chief Minister, C N Annadurai, who was non-Hindi speaking. He was opposed to Hindi as national language for India because Indians don't all speak Khari Boli (a dialect which is projected as the "national" Hindi language). He explained it like this: There was a man who had two dogs, a big one and a small one. So he made two flip-up doors, one for the big one and another for the samll one: Someone asked, why 2 doors? Why not just let the small dog go through the big door? In the same way, Annadurai said why have Hindi as a language for communicating among Indians, and English for communicating with the world? If everyone in India is learning English anyway, why bother with burdening them with a third language? English is more advanced than Punjabi in the scientific realm, but Hindi is definitely not ahead of Punjabi in any way. Pity the poor fools who think so and leave their own language behind. Would you leave your mother for your massi? Anybody who wants to learn Hindi can do so with a month of watching Bollywood movies, which are available everywhere.

Well said, we need a balance of bhagti and shakti. Just one or the other turns us into either cowards or butchers.

Some threads are 10 pages long, so why did the original thread have to be closed? Why not just merge them?

One of the reasons that cults like this have been able make headway by promising visions of the divine light (dibia jot) is that some of our own Sikh preachers and academics have denied that there is such a thing. So, if you go up to a typical Sikh, and tell him there's a way to see the divine light, he will naturally be interested. The fact is the divine light (parkash, dasam duar, etc.) can only be seen by receiving the Gurmanter from Satguru Granth Sahib Ji through the Panj Piare. Some see it earlier, some later according to their past deeds and Sikhi progress. A very few see it immediately upon taking amrit.

The funny thing is that the Ragi's friends at the Spokesman keep saying "What is the significance of a building?" Now the Ragi wants to give significance to building itself for his own purposes.

The Ragi is saying that he is just going to present himself before the Akal Takhat building, and not before the Jathedars who may be in the Akal Takhat secretariat. This is ridiculous beyond belief. When the US Congress summons someone to testify on some matter or another, they don't necessarily go to the actual main US Capitol Building, but rather one of many associated office buildings where hearings are held. It's entirely acceptable for a governing body to hold its meetings at approved locations in accordance with its rules.

What is amazing is the Ragi went to the Akal Takhat, but then just sat outside, and didn't go when called in for his appointment. Can anyone imagine anyone else doing that with a worldly court? You can't just go and sit outside a courthouse and expect the judge to come outside and greet you. If you don't show up for court you are in contempt of court, and you will have a judgement entered against you by default. I guess that's where the Ragi is heading.

You can just go to sites like http://www.searchgurbani.com/megasrch.php?Param=punjabi and use their on-screen keyboard and then copy and paste: ਸਾਹਿਬ ਬਿੰਦਰਾ ਸਾਹਿਬਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਬਿੰਦਰਾ I didn't know this was your name, I just thought you were "Bindra Sahib" Lol

What's VLC? Also, can people post the links of re-posted videos here? And anything else related to downloading, reposting, viewing videos?

That site is different from any I've seen. It doesn't load like patshahi10.org does, and you can't increase the text size. Can someone who knows the author tell him to fix it?

That's the point. People aren't chelas of S. Ranjit Singh. Rather, they are simply responding positively to the fact that their family members have given up drinking, cutting hair, and are starting to mold their lives according to Gurbani. Given that, the fact that some rich fellow gave an Audi to S. Dhadrianwale doesn't even register as a problem.

Thanks for the link. Jatt_Di_Jawani_Fikaran_Ne_Khaa_Layi_Sippy_Gill Lyrics are pretty good. Visuals are nice, but the video quality isn't as high as it could be. Singing isn't as good as Babbu Mann.

Thanks for the link. I agree, let's keep the 5 Dec Ragi discussion in one thread, instead of ten, like it usually happens on Sikhsangat. It seems every site wants you to install their special fonts just for that one site. I couldn't even figure out what font they're using. I just looked at the photos.

As a general matter, how can you make you mind up about anything (whether it's Liberals vs. Conservatives, or Tories vs. Labour, Camry vs. Honda Accord, or S. Dhadrianwale) without having even listened to what one side is saying? The sermons are online at: http://parmeshardwar.com/ We've all heard what Babbu Mann, NS Chauhan, Shinda, Guri, etc. have to say, what about S. Dhadrianwale?

Direct link: http://patshahi10.org/audio/interviews/Bh%20Harbinder%20Singh%20Ji.mp3 Some notes on what the speaker said: It should be noted that he (Joginder Singh Sahni) never calls Guru Nanak "Guru Nanak". He says Guru Nanak never gave anyone a gaddi. They don't have greater faith in Shabad Guru. THey don't believe in Guru Granth Sahib being prepared by Guru Arjan Dev ji, nor Akal Takhat by Pa: 6, nor Khande bate da amrit. These articles aren't written on a one-off basis, but rather on planned basis. Ragi is saying the "new ardas" They say there is no such word as "Sant". Sant Anari. They say they want to put the SRM into practice, but the SRM says you can't modify the first pauri of ardas. He says there is no proof in history of which banis were read during the first amrit sanchar. That the current nitnem isn't same as Pa: 10 times. So, was he defrauding the panth all this time? WHy didn't he do anything while being Jathedar? 3 things big in Sikhi: Ardas, Nitnem, Amrit. So he's targetting all 3. They're saying there's no proof 10th Guru took amrit. Trying to destabilise the whole tradition by which people have given their heads to Sikhs. No such thing as Amritdhari. Yes, Panth can modify small things. But not Amrit. Sure, they could create a new faith, but not Sikhi. Faith is the basis of every religion. We have faith in bani. If there is no faith, there is no religion. They also say you can only do kirtan of Gurbani. There has always been kirtan of Dasam Bani in Harimander Sahib. Ragi says "I didn't know anything before, now I do" when he's 70 years old. But bani says a 70-year old is senile. He should just sit at home. In 1984 when the nation was bloodied, he was acting in the Nimmo film with Preeti Sapru and telling made-up stories regarding Hemkunt Sahib. He said Guru Teg Bahadur was doing tapasia there. The Ragi says if someone is reading this Dasam Bani that his nose doesn't work. Yet he did kirtan of the same Dasam Bani. From Chandi Charitar, Zafarnama, Krishnavtar, Bachittar Natak. And the 268th Charittar. From Sarab Loh Granth. Apni Katha. Amoung the Singhs, he use to say a piece of paper is useless without the stamp of the Government; so too, you need the stamp of the Guru. On JusTV he said, that a piece of silver that has a stamp becomes currency. But without a stamp, the silver still has value. (I.e., being mona is OK.) Doing a U-Turn is very easy for him. Now he's saying a new bad thing: He says one charittar is in relation to 10th Guru. That Guru Sahib went to some woman, etc. But there is no place in that charittar that mentions Guru Gobind Singh ji. The phrase "Sikh-Sakha" also comes in Gurbani (Kabir Ji's sloke). It doesn't refer solely to the Sikhs of the Satguru. The charittar also talks about the woman's "Sikhs". Meaning her men, employees, etc. He used to read lines of charittars ("Nij nari") and get money. Now he sees money in opposing it. But he was wrong then too because it was all about money. He's saying some writings of Guru Gobind Singh's could be OK if we deem it in accordance with Gurmat. So that means the whole panth should just dance according to his whims. If he says such-and-such a bani isn't bani, then we are supposed to agree. The method of destroying a kaum is to create panic, then confusion, then fighting. These people have been around for a long time. They just write a book, say sorry, then write another book. Now they're objecting to Bhai Gurdas Ji. The Kaaba turned around in Mecca. But the Ragi's fellows are saying kaaba didn't turn, Panja Sahib is fake, 5th Guru didn't sit on a hot iron plate, etc. Now he's saying that Panthic matters should be discussed in open, not in closed doors. OK, so when he was Jathedar, why did he give such a strict punishment to Surjit Singh Barnala? Putting a board around his neck, tying him to columns, etc. In the Ragi's hukums he has said no roti-beti di sanjh until he (Barnala) asks for forgiveness. Why didn't Barnala have the option to discuss the matter in the open? As big as someone thinks of himself, their consequences are also big for the Panth. You won't be saved. Regarding Parkash: You can't put the Dasam Granth in your lap. Even the Suraj Prakash is parkashed when doing katha. No question that the Guru is Guru Granth Sahib. But when we also give respect to other religions' granths, why not Dasam Granth? The nitnem banis are from Dasam Granth. Recognise the people who will say anything for money. They are leeches and we need to remove them from our body.