ISDhillon

I would like to see them try.

but are they attacking us?

bollywoods attacking us....... - nope there just uneducated about sikhism and are trying to portray sikhs as they have understood them to be patta patta singhaa da vairee - not today planned attack on sikhism by such and such a scholar - nope such and such a scholar has never read the sggs so is just interpreting from what they seen and heard xtian missionaries have hidden agenda - nope its their job to proselytize their very open about this its nothing personal so and so forth.....

The biggest threat to sikhi is the negative culture of "perceived attack", this is constantly reinforced by pop intellectuals, self-styled jathas, reactionary scholars and finally bitter elderly sikhs.

exactly, and also depending upon how successful our reaction is other communities learn to do the same if they are confronted with the same situation so a level of responsibility is consistenetly ignored by our leaders, the nishan sahib is more than a flag its a sign of our standards in history, one thing that silences indian governement is when sikhs in the diaspora get certain privaleges from their host governments that they do not afford to sikhs themselves in their native, indigenous country of origin.

True, I think that firstly we have to remember that if sikhi is universal then we should always take a universal approach, "universal" for a long time has always been concerned with "sikhs" rather than "sikhism", temporal affairs have been confused with political affairs, and this is why there is a self-destructive element in sikhism, I think that we as a religion have always had a holistic world view, we see religions, cultures languages etc being connected in a relationship of interdependance with khalsa as the driving force in history, the role of religion however is increasingly becoming "an act of domination". Lets take a look at certain temporal affairs in sikhi for eg, abortion, death penalty and euthanaisia. The reason why we object to these issues has always been the need to "accept gods will", yet we find ourselves tackling these issues as if they were independant of one another, then sikhs themselves start to pitch one issue against the other as if their was only a certain level of "accepting gods will" that sikhs should abide by. Then lets look at the issue of marriage in sikhi we want an anand marriage act, yet one one jathedar says homosexuals cannot marry, next one says only keshdhari can marry, 3rd day only sikh can marry sikh but no interreligious marriage, this approach is neither universal or holistic, rather sikhs should say either all humans can marry or only humans who are amritdhari period. And then ask the community to support this decision. Extremist organisations need to be dealt with impartially by the government by introducing incitement to hatred bills, but not just the ones who say something against sikhs, why is it that we do not say anything to extremist organisations such as the maoists or lashkar, LTTE organisations, the pick and choose approach does not stand us in good stead as it is not the welfare of all that we are concerned with rather we are concerned only about our survival. Education in punjab and economic development should also take on a a more universal approach, the role of environmental welfare is an ideal setting for institutions in punjab the need for IT proffessionals does not ring true in punjab its as if the educational institutions choose those courses which will allow the punjabis to go abroad and "escape" hence the "survival of sikhs" not sikhism, sikhs should invest in sikh values not sikh people, sikh people should put sikhism on their redemptional agenda, just recently I have decided to do a course in sustainable development because I want to make a meaningfull contribution to this earth for future generations when I am no longer here and I know that for all the human rights issues we fight for none of it is worth it if there is no earth here to sustain future generations. Institutional linkages are very important, in this resepct functioning with autonomy is ok for internal sikh matters but universal concerns of sikhism should be mediated through established organisations, it is not necessary for our contribution to be acknowledged solely by our identity, sikhs should understand that we can work together with others rather than the need to be independant redeemers of mankind. Any way just having a rant, Indy

If hindus prepare then why have they been subjagated by every civilisation throughout history?, fear if anything makes people prepare, I dont think the sikhs need to prepare you should deal with people after they have fully spent themselves otherwise you dont know how much more they have got in store for you, our problem is that we have always been feircely independant I cant imagine that we would be any better off if we started to rely on others, secondly "hindu preparation today" is nothing short of mirroring zionism eg babur masjid and temple mount, even indira used the persecution of jews as a pretext for invading and liberating bangladesh. Hindus by and large have been using the foreign policy of other countries as a manifesto for their domestic policy for eg, putting bhindranwale on binladens bandwagon by using american rhetoric of "terror" to describe the situation in punjab, using china as a frame of reference when minority groups assert themselves as "this would not be allowed in china". So what have we learned from this? its simple hindus do not know how to run a country and india is not a sovereign power, whereas sikhs being feircly independant have adopted measures which india does not know how to deal with, remember it was sikhs themselves who turned on each other both after Maharaja ranjit singhs death and operation bluestar, only something sovereign can topple something sovereign. So if anything sikhs need to learn to be more cohesive and arrive at decisions together, the concept of sarbat khalsa has remained dormant since banda singh bahadar, the sikh clergy have been pick and choosie with what issues they wish to deal with and sikhs themselves then prioritise their own issues and this is where we get division in the sikh community which evetually leads to sikhs asserting themselves against one another and not for a common shared cause.

If it is a couple of guys theN yes I would understand that a person gets beaten, but why didnt the cab driver defend himself, how do you let one man bite youre face and pull youre hair where are youre hands and feet at that time, this guy did the right thing: http://www.sikhnet.com/sikhnet/news.nsf/Ne...72573990060C0D9 we should take a leaf out of his book and learn to attack the attacker and not just defend.

any missionary creed which is totalitarian is repulsive islam and xtianity are both as repulsive as one another they can both eat <admin-profanity filter activated> :lol:

Re: Nijjar Is this the Christian in Sikh roop who trys to convert Sikhs to Christianity? Is this what your version of Christianity teaches you to do? Old man, you are insulting the good Christians by your acts. Besharam!. Dont worry about nijjer he's a retard, I've already had the discussion with muslims and answered all there questions: http://www.islamicboard.com/comparative-re...14-sikhism.html Read it and refer any questions i'll answer. indy :D

that thing about killing all the daughters is disgraceful, when mughal forces attackd sikh women and children in the vadda and chotta gallughara or during any of the wars did we kill our daughters, what happened to "tera bhanna mitaa laagai". I dont think its an admirable thing when he talked about that in fact that upset me the most!!!!!!!!!!!!

The girl did nothing wrong blame youre culture.

its a rise in catholicism were seeing, not christianity, focus on why division and conflict exists between protestants and catholics and then preach that to the masses, they'll soo wake up. Westerners for years have exploited division in eastern societies we have just stayed asleep we need to learn to counteract with same medicine.

They say for a hate crime you can get 7 years, I dont know whether thats cool, I hope this is not a made up story.

Yes noone says you owe them somthing, but you dont infringe on others either, take care of yourself.

http://www.punjabheritage.org/material-her...atics-2505.html Baghdad Sikh Shrine destroyed by fanatics PDF Print E-mail Written by DNA India Friday, 25 May 2007 Iraq is keen to rebuild a historic Sikh shrine commemorating Guru Nanak's visit to Baghdad, which had been destroyed by 'fanatics' after the invasion of the country by US-led coalition forces, a top leader said on Friday. Iraqi National Congress chief Ahmed Chalabi, one of Iraq's prominent leaders, who drove down through the desolate streets of Baghdad to the sacred Sikh site last night under heavy military protection, said 'it has unfortunately been wiped out by fanatics because they thought it was against Islam'. "It's shameful they cannot respect someone who has millions of followers," he said at the gurdwara site along the river Tigris. Iraqi officials escorting Chalabi informed him about the original design of the gurdwara that was built alongside the tomb of a Muslim religious leader, which has suffered no damage. "We will rebuild it," Chalabi said even as he admitted he did not know that a Sikh shrine had ever existed in Baghdad, which houses the Indian embassy. The Iraqi leader, seen as close to the Bush administration, ruled out the possibility of the gurdwara being destroyed in military fire. "It was a mortar attack by some fanatic," he said, adding he believed it would have happened after the fall of Saddam Hussein. News reports during the Iraq war had suggested the gurdwara had suffered damage in the attack, but there has been no official confirmation until now from Iraq about its condition. The visit to the site revealed complete destruction of the shrine. Chalabi, who broke the lock at the gate of the shrine's compound to inspect the site, pointed out that the shrine's marble floor had been pulled out and its roof razed to the ground. Indian spiritual leader Sri Sri Ravi Shankar, who accompanied him, also requested immediate rebuilding of the gurdwara. According to Sikh history, Guru Nanak, the founder of the faith, visited Baghdad and had a discourse with Bahlol Dana, a sufi teacher. The gurdwara commemorating the Guru's visit lies near what is now a devastated railway station in Baghdad. "The Sikh community has contributed a lot to Iraq. They have worked here in railways, construction and a lot of other activities. We respect them and will see to it that this is rebuilt," Chalabi said.

This is very very bad!!!! did he ask for 5 heads?

Alot of people had forgotten the sacrifices of the sikhs and when we were persecuted we reminded the others of how they are indebted to us, well I think we need to spare a thought for the sacrifices of the naamdharees during the british raj, may all people flourish, Badal is correct, if the rss are openly fascist then the government needs to deal with this and if they fail then launch another agitation, but dont criticise these groups because they have no need to be loyal to sikhs cos they are not sikhs if they are rss then rss is still the problem.

this guys dad got struck of the medical registrar for the illegal transfer of body organs to western patients.

What role does akj have in sikhism?

I used to think this way but not anymore, i remember years ago they used to say bhai chibbar singh rehat was biased against muslims i disagree i think he was spot on, that does not mean we have any hate, call a spade a spade.

it does not matter wot a persons done death penalty is wrong PERIOD, I sometimes think that what can you do when youre own conscience is more awake to zulm than others how will you make others understand the sorrow :sady:

well what have we learned? I dont care about the money or the protests or even the lie, WHAT HAVE WE LEARNED????????? My mother had a sister who married my dads brother she never wanted to get married to him but feared for her life, so she made a plan, she knew that there was no way she could get out of the marriage ceremony so she got married in front of 800 people, 2 days later she went to work and nobody saw her after a month was up she came back with half of scotland yard our street was teeming with cops, who basically escorted her into our house whilst she got her passport and her belongings, why did she not go to the cops before the marriage?, she put herself in the public eye shamed our whole family and was protected for the rest of her life, she is now one of the richest women in the uk because she set herself free, but none of our family talk to her not even my parents, why? - FILTHY PRIDE!!!!!!! "Life put me in an ugly situation, they say the land does not exist beneath my feet, and when I walk the whole world acknowledges me, but will you ever admit your mistake?" I hope people understand my quote, Indy

Asikh homeland would work but i would be against the name "khalistan" it has too much stigma now.

This was a very poor response, all your huffing and puffing when it comes down to the real issues that divide us which is caste then you all shut your mouths, your a disgrace!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - and thats why you find it hard to respond i suggest sikhism be liberated from people like you.