puzzled

yeah I was raised doing tuf around Guru jis paintings ? But yeah, that's the thing, they just need an object in front of them to worship! they just can't go with out it.

What do you mean? they lock Gurdware in the US ? They do that in India and its so saddening to see that.

Been thinking about this for some time now. Can Indians, including Sikhs, ever get past idolatry? I've been India/Punjab several times, and they are idolaters, that's the culture and the way of life in that country. They worship statues, ancestral tombs, graves, animals, trees/plants, humans, everything! People from Sikh backgrounds are mainly idolaters as well. The Gurdwara in my dads pind is open during the morning and then they lock it up till 6pm for Rehras Sahib and then lock it again till the next morning! Why? because no one is interested. On the other hand the local jaggas/tombs etc are always busy. Where my parents are from the busiest religious place is a tomb. If you go to this tomb on a Sunday then you have to stand in the queue for at least half an hour! that's how busy it is. Visit a Gurdwara on Sunday, no one there! Its as if people in that country, including Sikhs, need something in front of them to worship, an idol, tree, human, they just need something there. Sitting there and doing simran, does not satisfy them! For some idols are not enough so they become a member of a dera! and the baba becomes a living idol! Because of my families beliefs in India, I've bowed down to very strange looking idols, Muslims graves, Tree/plants, and goats and so many other things! Can Indians ever get past idolatry? its very much part of the culture and everyday life there, it has been for 1000s of years, Its deeply imbedded in them. Separating Indians and idolatry is like separating sand from salt! It reminds of the sakhi of when many people became Singhs but they continued believing in superstitions and idols, so guru Gobind Singh ji challenged them and told them to make a devi appear before them, no devi appeared before them! So even before Guru ji before them in physical form, they still believed in idols and superstitions.

He has no choice but to support the kisaans. Singers very well know that it's the public that makes you and it's the public that destroys you. Look at Gurdas Maan, he was chased off the stage in Canada, and wasn't allowed to talk at the kisaan morcha. He was lucky he had his men around him otherwise they would have done a lot more than just stop him from talking! People like Jazzy B know very well that they have to be supportive otherwise people will turn against him. Theres female Pubjabi singers and celebs that dance around half naked on stage that have decided to show their faces at these protests, draped in shawls, head covered, calling themselves daughters of Mai Bhago.

I'm pretty sure Hukkah, Hajaamat, Haram and Halal as major sins are mentioned in the same line. Haram is sexual sin, Hajaamat is obviously cutting hair. Mentioned together as sins, means cutting hair for a Sikh is just as bad as a sikh committing fornication, adultry, rape. Though yes I agree, sangat is for everyone.

She always looks high, Dharmendra must have introduced her too dode, lol.

Its actually getting annoying now! ? I think mods should allow links/videos to be uploaded straightaway without approval being needed, but if they feel the video/link is inappropriate then they can remove it.

My family come from Baba Vadbagh Singhs family, not sure how, but we are linked to him. So my family go to the dera sahib gurdwara in Himachal pradesh! Whenever a baby is born they take it there and whenever a new bride comes into the family they take her there. I've been there myself and I wasn't very fond of it! A lot of anti-gurmat things happen there! He has some followers, many are Hindus as well. Not sure if they worship him, but they are like followers. Baba ji helped people who were tormented by evil demons, and I believe he also made a demon into a Sikh! The demon used to torment the people high up in the forests in the Himalayas, and baba ji gave the demon Sikhi. He did a lot of parchaar. But a lot of his followers have made it into like a cult! a lot of anti-gurmat stuff happens there.

He didn't have Singh in his name, neither did his father Sawan Mal. So its possible they were Hindus. By the time of the Sikh empire, 19th century, every Sikh man used Singh. For a lot of Khatris the line between Sikh and Hindu is quite blurred. So he probably was a Khatri Hindu but took part in Sikh practices as well.

I guess the "Hindi" is meant to be "Hindu" LiteratureG. A. Baird, Private Letters of the Marquess of Dalhousie, Edinburgh 1910, p. 25a.Diwan Mulraj Chopra (1814-1851) was born into a Hindi Punjabi Khatri family and succeeded his father Sawan Mal as the Diwan of Multan. This title was conferred on Sawan Mal by Maharajah Ranjit Singh after he captured Multan from the Afghans. Mulraj Chopra led the rebellion against the British in the Second Anglo-Sikh war, instigated due to an increase in taxation. The increased taxation caused widespread resentment, especially in Multan, where Mulraj had remained steadfastly loyal to Ranjit Singh and his family. British officials attempted to replace Mulraj with Sardar Khan Singh, an offical from the court of Lahore who was more sympathetic to their interests. Mulraj defied the orders and battle ensued. He surrendered on 22 January 1849 along with 550 of his men. He was placed on trial and eventually sentenced to death, later changed to exile for life, for the murders of Liutenant William Anderson and Patrick Vans Agnew of the Bengal Civil Service. Whilst awaiting trial, Mulraj was placed in John Spencer Login's custody (more famously the guardian of Maharajah Duleep Singh), who is known to have remarked to his wife that Mulraj did not appear to be the bloodthirsty despot described in the papers. He died enroute to Buxar jail after a short illness in August 1851. His body was cremated on the banks of the Ganges by some of his loyal servants.

According to wiki and a few other sites he was a Punjabi Hindu Khatri. Hindus who served under the Sikh empire were encouraged to keep their kes as well.

Its not about what my stance is or what anyone's stance is. Our gurus have clearly demonstrated what the family structure and order should be. All I said is that the bride gets married into the grooms family and the children take the name of their fathers family, as our gurus have set example. No where have I said that kids shouldn't interact with their mothers family. In fact Guru Gobind Singh ji learnt shastar vidhiya from his mothers brother. I myself have always been more close to my mothers family, I don't even know my fathers family that well. But I take my fathers families name, because that's the family I was born into and that's the name I will give my kids. The bride gets married into the grooms family, and the kids take the fathers name. Just like Guru Gobind Singh ji did and just like Guru Nanak Dev ji did. Unless you feel the Gurus did it wrong? But as our Gurus have said, in Kalyug, the opposite will start happening. People will cross all moral boundaries and the order/structure of society will fall apart. Our Gurus have said in Kalyug men will forget their parents and start running around after their wives. So it won't be surprising if in the near future men will take their wife's name, move into their wife's house and kids will take their mother's name. I'm sure Sikh women are looking forward to the the development of Kalyug. What we see as progression in society, is actually kalyug spreading its tentacles.

Is it the links and videos? I think everyones links have to be approved.

It literally looks like those apocalyptic movies, but its real! Its sad, I feel for these people ... Is this what the future will look like ? the more we go into Kalyug.

Well at least you're trying! Many people don't even bother trying or even recognise that they are doing wrong. Just keep trying, Its an old habit so it won't go fast ... Perhaps read up on the p*rn industry? It might put you off. Many people involved in that industry are actually mentally unstable and abused, a lot of them are depressed and suicidal. A lot of the girls take drugs before the shooting so they don't feel pain during the rough scenes. So most of the girls that people watch in those videos are actually drugged ... and they are not having "fun" Two days ago I watched a documentary on netflix about a p*rn star, after the "performance" one of the girls started crying, and when they asked her why she crying, she replied saying that she is in pain but its not her body which is in pain. That was quite hard hitting ... People basically j4ck off to drugged up, mentally unstable, vulnerable women ...

Waris Shah fought in the army of Shahnawaz, who was the son of Zakhariya Khan ... Quite stupid of Sikhs to praise Waris Shah ...

I'm pretty sure it was Waris Shah who called the rise of the Sikh misls "doomsday" lol Waris Shah was also a fan of the Mughals. He fought in the Mughal army against the Afghans. Later when he retired and the Mughals defeated the Afghans in some battle he wrote a poem praising the Mughals. Unfortunately Sikhs praise and sing poems written by poets like Waris Shah.

The Babbar Akalis.

Shaheed Avtar Singh Brahma. Shot down an Indian helicopter. Shaheed Surinder Singh Sodhi Shaheed Bhai Anokh Singh Babbar Saheed Gurjant Singh Budhsinghwala

@intrigued In the painting, the singh standing is Bhai Maharaj Singh. Not sure who the Singh sitting behind him is, it possibly could be Diwab Mulraj.

The photo is of Diwan Mulraj Chopra, I think he was a Hindu. It's one of the earliest Sikh photos. But yeah the painting is of Bhai Maharaj Singh.

A tractor from 1938! hopefully they keep these things, its a part of the history of the land.

The problem is we get everything muddled up. Of course Guru ji is not discriminating, but he is also very real with us. There is nothing politically correct about Guru ji. Bani mentions men peaking through windows and looking at the wives of other men, why? because men do that! They did that centuries ago, and they still do it. But does guru ji love all men, of course he does. Guru ji gives a lot of respect to women in bani, but, do women cause problems in families, yes! but does Guru ji still love them? yes he does. Guru ji is very real. Bani calls men every name under the sun, but we don't have a problem with that. The reason we thinks its discrimination when Guru ji says men will forget their parents and follow their wives around is because we live in the politically correct west, where its illegal to say anything against women, but its fine to say anything about men. We need to stop seeing it like this. There is nothing discriminating about Guru ji saying that men will forget their parents and follow their wives instead, its a fact, that's why guru ji said it. Look at how many Punjabi families break apart because the women are constantly squabbling. If we start analysing Sikhi through the western politically correct model then a lot of things will appear wrong and outdated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVRCyELQnSw

I take Kalki Avtaar bani literally, because the things described in it, as frightful as they are, are actually happening now. For example, Kalki Avtaar talks about incestuous relationships between siblings, and parent and children, how would you interpret that? because those sickening relationships are actually happening. As for the wife controlling men, and men forgetting their parents and running around after their wives, well, that's happening everywhere lol