Jaggaa

Rubbish, don't wait out for handouts. If you want something then go get it, destiny was you being gifted this all-powerful human birth. Now go and use it. Being lazy and giving the responsibility to someone else is a delay in the inevitable.

1 hour ago, RajKaregaKhalsa1 said:

I mean you said it like that so...l

Yes of course he had a body but he was divine. The Bani he wrote is Dhur Ki Baani/ Ilaahi Bani, the words from God.

Would you have bowed to your head if the Guru wrote "this isn't divine bani but bani from my heart and soul"?
or would the Sikhs have taken care and preserved the Guru Granth Sahib if before the 10th Gurus departure he had instructed us to treat the Guru Granth Sahib as if it was a living Guru?

@mahandulai - it's like you go to school every day, but I suppose if you don't go to school on the Saturday/Sunday and instead focus on something else but go back on Monday, maybe it's not so bad but you will have missed out on the weekend - just a thought please don't shoot me down, I'm not saying DON'T do nitenem every day.

Why do you care just keep reading the "No's" and moving on to the "Next" reply, who knows you might get something back that you can take something from.

21 hours ago, RajKaregaKhalsa1 said:

Lol it kinda is though, when your doing Rakhiya De Shabad along with Sohila Sahib e.g. when we read "man meh chitvo chitvanee, udam Karo uth neet. Har Kirtan Ka Aaharo, har deho Naanak kai meet.

Like I don't know what "thinking" about Sikhi entails, it's too vague. Ideally I don't want to be thinking about anything!

21 hours ago, jkvlondon said:

gungi write out 10 lines and then calls her self gungi

It's hard to pin it down to any one of those points, I'd say it encompasses most if not all of them.

Excluding

" The last thing you think of before going to sleep "

I'm not against the practice it self. For all I care, you can adore the darbar with all the flowers, candles and whatever else floats your boat. It's the attaching these tradition based sentiments to the Guru and his message,  creating rituals that the rest of the congregation must subscribe to.

Unfortunately I have seen far worse take place in the Darbar Sahib but that doesn't mean just because there are diseases such as Cancer you start ignoring Chicken Pox (or something else less fatal).

This is perhaps off-topic but in my opinion the Guru and the panth was started where leaders could come together, regardless of their own individual differences and meet in a place where they could all agree on one thing - the Guru. Instead, we have a bunch of validation seeking sheep who are manipulating the sangat in to their own acquired ideologies/rituals and putting Guru jee on the backseat.

@Amit12 Lighting dive and throwing flowers at the Gurdwara is a practice in complete contradiction to the message of Gurbani. It's an upward battle though because your discussion isn't with people who are able to think beyond the walls of their own existence. It's like showing a mirror to aboriginals.

The fact this type of practice originates from dharmic faiths such as hinduism is actually irrelevant. If it was a good practice for us to take advantage of then I'd be all for it, but the fact is - it is equatable to throwing water to the sun so that it reaches those that have passed. If somebody with the message of Guru Nanak was to arrive today then the majority of mainstream Sikhs would reject him/her and if he/she suggested that these practices had no place in the Gurdwara they would find a way to create humiliation for such a person.

People seem to be able to justify almost ANYTHING and EVERYTHING at WILL. They are hellbent on pushing their own narrative on to those around them. I see the current state of Sikhs especially here in the UK no more than a flavour of the month, weird cringe fashion show circus collective of people who lack self-confidence and only join the faith to "belong" somewhere. The end.

Wrong question, how do you free yourself from hell

@ADMIN

Can you please delete this topic, not just archive but remove it completely because the topic itself and the discussion level is a very child like reflection on a NON issue. It's the wrong question and the comments that people are coming out with are clearly their own insecurity.  When a non-sikh/new-sikh comes here and see's this he/she will be put off by the idea of what we're about. This kind of behaviour should not be allowed to be representative of the voice of "Sikh youth".

"horrible, disgusting and shameful deed "

Relax dude, they're still people. You don't think twice before accepting help from non-sikhs, you don't measure/judge then so why start now. The hospital staff that treat you, the restaurant cooks who feed you and the coorperate professionals who provide you water are more than likely to be non-sikhs.

Sikhi isn't owned by anyone, anyone can come, take what they want, how they want and when they want. This applies to most things in life, you can choose what you want to be a part of and when you want to part ways. If Guru Nanak Dev jee's father wanted to force the brahmin faith on him then you wouldn't have discovered this beautiful faith we have now.

Someone is bound to quote my post and write something impulsive such as "if we all start thinking this way then the Sikh faith will diminish and we will keep losing people". If it's worth keeping, provides value to people, gives them peace - then it will remain. This is the law of nature, you can't FORCE anything.

@Amit12 - you're giving his post far too much credit, it's not really a "soch" (thought) because there is absolutely NO thought behind it, this is an innocent ramble fueled by emotions.

I think you two need to have a live debate for us to watch.

Well thought out video my man, well done. Clicked some of your other videos - one I came across was I think you're in town and asking people if they know what religion you're from. That was fun to watch.

I clicked one video and the intro-music blew my speakers up and people around me giving me the look of <banned word filter activated> are you doing

8 hours ago, jkvlondon said:

have you never heard sakhian when Guru ji gave sabash to his children(Sikhs) for Jobs well done including following sikhi in spirit ? Stop with the downplaying of the role of support of good things , kids need confidence they are doing well in the face of the constant tearing down of the world … this tides them over until they realise their internal strength  and can deflect the nonsense of others . We encourage kids even adults (who are spiritually at children level) when they do good so they repeat that behaviour and move on further .

The dastaar isn't a toy, it isn't a fashion accessory, not a hobby but an indication of duty and responsibility. If you're spiritually at a child level should you really be adorning yourself with what represents such responsibility? I never said KIDS don't need confidence but this is a completely different topic. Encourage your kids in whatever they do and whatever you want them to do Please continue but I'm done with this topic, it's been derailed so hard.

@chatanga1 - I don't quite know but judging by the ongoing discussion and the back and forward from people like that Jas in that video - it really just seems that they're just a bunch of uneducated, hot headed, agressive and quite frankly illiterate baffoons. From the way they carry themselves and communicate their view can you really blame one for not being able to take them seriously?

Even if Daddrianwale is wrong, they are doing absolutely no favour to their arguments by the way they behave and present their case.

I don't really listen to everything Daddrianwale says, but I've heard some of his videos where he talks about some of his concepts. I don't know, maybe I'm filtering out things I don't think make sense and just taking in the positive. You or anyone tarnishing him with other people such as Ram Rahim isn't really going to make any difference either. You can paint him with whatever brush you want, it's not the man that's important - it's the Gurus message.

I do want to add one thing though, that NKJ guy has really lit a torpedo towards Daddrianwales effort. I have to say that this guy in the UK needs to step down.

@mahandulai - if you do read their biographies/books just take the content with a pinch of salt. They have obviously been written by their followers and with a certain bias and an agenda to promote "lineage" most of the time. The only real productive part is to extract the humanistic values and ethic. You'll get no where trying to debate if someone has powers or not, it's the most pointless discussion as I find people believe what they want to believe and fair play to them - they are entitled to do so.

2 hours ago, mahandulai said:

lol exactly. bs feminism

not quite sure what it is, feminism or something else but it certainly isn't a value of Sikhi where a person requires EXTRA encouragement on the way they choose to appear. It must mean that the said person is not confident in themselves to start off with. A Sikh does not seek external validation, that's in direct contrast to the point some of the posters here are making. On one side they are saying "don't seek validation, dont go on instagram and all this and that" and on the other they want those wearing dastaars to be validated by others?

On 11/11/2018 at 7:21 PM, GuestKaur2 said:

Thats so sad, girls should recieve extra encouragement and praise for wearing a dastar.

Why should they receive extra encouragement and praise?

@mahandulai - something worth talking about might be the way hierarchy was. Islamic rulers/monarchs (much like Saudi today) not only mistreated the kaffir but also many from their own community. If you're going in with fiction, it would be nice to paint a vivid image of a child being brought up in an average working class home being witness to a world that fortunately we are no longer a part of.

@Singhballer thanks - I'll check that video out. I know where you're coming from. I appreciate the time you've put in to your post.

@jkvlondon

Perhaps you have misunderstood my reference to what I'm regarding as truth as to me when referring to truth in Gurbani, it's not just about something as simple as "what goes up, must come down" so sayeth the Guru and it won't change. To elaborate, concepts such as duty, truthful living, virtues and acceptance to me are all part of the truth that I'm farming framing Gurbani in and what I'm regarding as "truth".

Guru Nanak Dev jee challenged those of his time and presented his truth. However there were plenty of other pre-existing granths but at no point did he or is successors name them as "jhoot/perishable".

Do you not think that in a thousand years time we may know something we don't currently know ? If Guru Nanak Dev jee was to come again (hypothetically) would he challenge the society and its issues with what he challenged the brahmins with in the 1500s? Would he still be talking about the narrative of Ram and Ravan?

" please do not frame gurbani in the second category " Please don't bring your emotion in to this as this is supposed to a forum of discussion and I assure you that I do not have any ill intentions towards Gurbani. Everyone holds the right to think for themselves. There's no perfect answer, it's a discussion for us to take something away and not always as black and white as it may seem.

@jkvlondon I wish you best of luck in the future and that you no longer face such an undeserving experience to life and that others including myself can take advantage of the faith bestowed to us by Gurbani.

Coming back to the OP's question. It seems like this isn't the place or time to be asking such questions @mahandulai

However to offer some form of hope, the answer is simple. Just like the weather, truth changes, history is retold and with it so do the principles and understanding of humanistic knowledge to be able to behave beyond our animalistic nature. Who's to say that in another thousand years there won't be a more relevant Granth for us to aspire to but for now our eternal Guru has given us a ray of hope, especially during a time where there was nothing but darkness.