chatanga1

What offer did she make?

http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/17474-sri-charitropakhyan-sahib-jee-series-charitar-3/?page=4 Read a more accurate translation in the link above. About halfway down page. I had already posted this link for your learning.

Sure. If you agree to the same. Well lets come to something more simple like the "Singh" in your name, Gavin Singh. Why didn't Guru Sahib write a clear rahit about this? Or is it written in SGGS to keep "Singh" in your name Gavin Singh? Kaam for your info, is the most powerful of the 5 chors and has brought mighty men to their knees. In Kalyug, kaam is the most powerful obstacle in the path of humans. If Guru Sahib wrote about it in a volume that reflected it's seriousness, why is that wrong? Ok, but what about the lines in SGGS that contain the words "<banned word filter activated>/semen/breasts..." Would you be able to talk about these to your parents/siblings/children? If not, why not? Or should we think that Guru Sahib has made a mistake and we must correct those mistakes? Well statistically all the Gurus, Bhagats and authors of SGGS were men. Does that mean that Guru Arjan Sahib didn't trust women were worthy enough to make any contribution to SGGS? Statistically men are more likely to die in wars, in workplace accidents, in road accidents etc. What does it mean?.

Well there is only one way forward from this misunderstanding. What are the issues according to your own understanding? "all but by bit"? I have been studying the charitars in detail for about 2 years and have still only got to around 100. Now if the 80% is one side, there is still 20% on the other side isn't there? And if Guru Sahib (re)wrote even ONE charitar about the bravery/intelligence of women, then even that would be enough for a Sikh. Like in Guru Granth Sahib there is only ONE shabad "so kiou manda akhiye ...." Isn't that ONE occurence enough for a Sikh? Thats no way near the truth. There are several reasons for the charitars. No of them involve castigating eternally a gender. Guru Sahib performed his duty as ordered by Akal Purkh. But Guru Sahib is not responsible for your or my learning and perception. That is up to you and I. If you say that "women are percieved as tricksters" it is because YOU percieve them as tricksters. I haven't percieved "women as tricksters" after reading Sri CharitroPakhyan Granth because I don't perceive them as such. Well to be fair, everything in learning is miniscule in comparison to SGGS. I mean you went to school, learnt english and maths and science yes? But these subjects are miniscule in comparison to SGGS aren't they? So does that mean you will start a thread on how we should abandon Maths, english and science as the learning is miniscule compared to SGGS and we should concentrate on SGGS study only?

Good to see you haven't run away for another two years. Who was harnam Singh to give anyone a siropao in 1992. That was the duty only of Baba Thakur Singh. When Gill went to Mehta did he ask to see Harnam Singh or Baba Thakur Singh? What is ethical about lying and calling yourself "akalifauj" ? The Taksal had already split over the jathedari. How did badal cause any further divisions with his siropao to Ram Singh?

There is your first mistake. You have read the translation and RELIED on them to be 100% accurate. Because of your wholesale reliance on somebody else's opinion you are now doubting a scripture of great standing in the Sikh Panth. What do you think is the way to correct this? Pritpal SIngh Bindra has done these translations but they are at times wildly inaccurate. I have read these and was confused by it as well. I thought I should actually do my own research into the charitars. I soon realised that Bindra, as a known opponent of Sri Dasme Patshah's Granth would have an axe to grind. I feel sorry for anyone who has read bindras book book. It is nothing but misinformation. Anyone who understands the missionaries can understand why they clutch to it. "Everyone" ? When did you take this survey and question all ALL the members of the Sikh Panth? Global sikh studies is a missonary outfit and they have been giving out misinformation on Sri Dasme Patshah's Granth for some years now. They do not understand the granth I believe. Here I disagree with you. It's not pornographic. Pornography is intended to sexually stimulate the mind and body. Sri CharitroPakhyan granth absolutely does nothing of the kind. (2nd bolded) - I beleive that you have not read all the charitars in detail if you claim this. Who says they are? Sri CharitroPakhyan Granth certainly doesn't make any such claims. @GavinSingh here are two links which you should read for your further understanding: http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/17474-sri-charitropakhyan-sahib-jee-series-charitar-3/ this above link will make the charitar more clear. bindra has only given a weak translation of it. He has not analysed any charitar. This is what the above link attempts to do. You are welcome to give your opinions there. http://www.sikhawareness.com/forum/48-sri-dasam-granth-sahib/ In this above link, we have been looking at Sri CharitroPakhyan Granth in greater detail. Try reading some of the topic in the above link and see if you can discard the english translations, like others participants and myself did some years ago.

I'm sure you will remember the question I asked you when you claimed this some years ago. The question that you still have not been able to answer. But for the information of the original poster I will ask it again so the OP doesn't get caught up in your lies : "Why did badal give siropao to Bhai Ram Singh as head of the Taksal rather than Harnam Singh?"

India has never gotten over its humiliationg military defeat at the hands of china. Many other nations have gone through the same. Yes they have. But what is so bravehearted about killing people in false encounters in Panjab, Kashmir, Bodo land, Naga Land etc? What is so bravehearted about about raping women?

Don't "bro" me. I am no bro to liars or missionary supporters. So you wouldn't have done anything different to the Taksalis then. Big surprise. Remember what I said about engaging your brain before opening your mouth? If you had bothered to do any background checks into this you would know that this happened last year where the cow-owners were given a last warning after it had happened before. But why would you, someone obviously with prejudices bother to do some research? look at these photos.

Ladakh was taken in 1834 when Maharaja Ranjit Singh was still alive. And that's not even important here. The army that took Ladakh was Dogra led by a Hindu.

It is the first video in my post. What sabar is there when a person would be walking into your house into your kitchen and throwing all the things out of your cupboards and fridge onto the floor? You tell me.

If you think that anyone who says that Guru Nanak Dev Ji ate halal meat in Mecca is a sikh then I don't even accept you as a sikh. Why are you siding with such people? Next you will be saying that Sant Jarnail Singh should have been jailed for killing of lala jagat Narain. It was his nephew after all and a taksal student to carried out the act. Does the Guru advise YOU to speak on matters of which you have no or little knowledge?

AGAIN! Again you show your ignorance! It's like you do no reading, no research but have to have an opinion on everything. General Zorawar Singh who captured Ladakh for the Sikh kingdom was a hindu. The force that captured it was Dogra. It was even rumoured that the Sikh governor of Kashmir unhappy at Zorawars conquests tried to set him up in a trap in Ladakh hut Zorawar was too astute. Can you please stop just adding false information on this board? I hope you are not like this with your family.

Don't drag Guru Nanak Dev Ji into your stupidity. The nihangs did the same thing last year but they were warned about doing it again. They pushed their luck and this time the outcome was not the same. You rely on "hindustan news for your funny? No wonder you make an imbecile of yourself here time and time again.

Watch for yourself. jkv, you should watch as well and learn something. Stop making an ignoramus of yourself. Look at all these cows in their hundreds in other peoples fields. Would you like your house ransacked like this ? Listen to their excuses here:

Yes Baba Harnam Singh is Jathedar of a faction of Damdami Taksal. The Taksal students attacked the Nihangs because the Nihangs had let tens of their cows in the fields belonging to the Taksal and they cows had destroyed their crops, which are there for the maintenance of the students of Taksal. Kinda like if someone came to your house and went into your ktichen and starting throwing all the food from your cupboards and fridge onto the floor. You wouldn't allow this would you? I certainly wouldn't. So stop complaining. Bolded is correct. Baba Thakur Singh was asked to choose next mukhi but Baba Ji always maintained that he is only a caretaker in the absence of Sant Jarnail Singh and that Sant Jarnail Singh would return to claim his place. However to say that Baba Harnam Singh is self-appointed is an outright lie. The students from amongst the Taksal including Bhai Amrik Singh chose Baba Harnam Singh to be mukhi. Your username is "Raj kaarega khalsa" but khalsa raaj won't come around through lies brother. In the one sentence you say "Daas doesn't know much about Damdami Taksal" and then further on you say "Therefore Harnaam Singh Dhumma is not Jathedar and I think he is just self appointed." ..... Correct. You have a habit of not engaging your brain when talking don't you? If you feel that taksal students were wrong then either : Provide their food for them so they don't need to maintain fields for their meals or Buy a field for the Nihangs so they can feed the cows in their Gau-shala. Seriously.

The conflict started in 1948 and has continued up to today. There has been three outright wars but continuing skirmishes in between. Then in 1984 there has been outright rebellion. How can taking away the last pillar of support the Kashmeris had bring about everlasting peace? Because India's record of extrajudicial killings and rapes will be exposed to the world. At the moment they maintain it being an "internal matter" so they don't have to be exposed. Also there is the very strong possibility that india will be deemed to denying the Kashmeris their right to self-determination which is upheld in the Basic Charter of Human Rights as enshrined in the UN. I didn't read anything else after this line in your post. Next you will say that Aurangzeb treated Guru Tegh Bahahadur Ji with respect and Wazir Khan treated Sahibzadas with respect. I can't believe that Sikhs have thinking like this at this time when the ease of information is at our fingertips. I don't know why, but whenever you open your mouth it seems like you haven't engaged your brain. I mean, like, ALL the time. What is wrong with you? These are not Sikhs lands. SIkhs took them in battle and conquest like they took Peshawar and Khyber. Do you seriously count Peshawar and Khyber as greater Sikh lands? Why are you spreading misonformation on this board?

If you look up the meaning of the word "corrupt" I dont think it will apply here. Harnam Singh is seen as "corrupt" by those who disagree with his alliance with badal dal. But look at the positives. This alliance has one MAJOR advantage for the Panth. it has removed the missionary parasites from ALL the major gurdwaras in India. This can never be a bad thing. The attackers said that they acted on their own initiative. So please tell what information/evidence you have that shows otherwise. Would you consider a missionary parasite as "a sikh brother" ?

The killing of innocent lives is mainly done by the indian army against kashmiris. False encounters. Like what they did in Panjab. By scrapping 370, it will only harden the resolve of Kashmiris to end indian rule there. When resolves harden, violence goes up. This will not finally resolve the Kashmir issue. They have been fighting for 70 years. That HAS to tell us all something. The biggest moral and military support to terrorists comes from Indian govt, supporting their forces there. Not only there but in north-east india, where the indian army carried out mass rapes to demoralise the rebels there. What does killing civilians help with? How does raping thousands of women help the indian govt and India?

He didn't "decide" to. Maharaja Hari Singh was forced to, by circumstances/events out of his control. It was a case of "choosing between two evils" and he chose the lesser. It's not as simple as that. Ever since the first "Pakistan" plan came out in 1928 Kashmir was to be a part of Pakistan. They always saw it as such. But 20 years later, the british gave the Princely states the option to join either india or pakistan. Maharaja Hari Singh delayed his choice in the hope that he could sit it out. But it backfired. The stupid pakistanis invaded and once he saw that his forces could not hold off the invading force he sent for help from india. Nehru only sent help once the "instrument of accession" had been signed. The pakistanis were devasted by this as they had always seen it as a natural part of Pakistan with it being a overwhelming muslim majority. Reverse the dynamics and see if you can understand what they feel. After the 1948 war over Kashmir, the UN intervened to bring an agreement between both countries. Pakistan was to withdraw its forces to 1947 borders, and India was to hold a plebiscite for the future of Kashmir. Nehru knew that India would lose Kashmir if he undertook this exercise and as such did anything he could to undermine the UN plan. Even if there was such a plebiscite today , we all know what the outcome would be. India, as a country would be better off releasing their hold on Kashmir. Bullets and death only last for so long. Have a read of this if you have time: http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/18477-five-villages-for-peace-and-prosperity/

Thats not proof though is it?

Don't let them get away with it.

What proof do you have of this?

In katha of this episode, after the shaheedi of Guru Arjan Dev Ji, Guru Sahib said that "ਚੰਦੂ ਦੇ ਨੱਕ ਵਿਚ ਨਕੇਲ ਪਾਉਣਾ " and this frightened the Sikhs who complained to Mata Ganga about Guru Sahibs words. Chandu was given as a prisoner to the Sikhs after some time and then killed in Lahore. Have a read of this: http://punjabipedia.org/topic.aspx?txt=ਚੰਦੂ ਸ਼ਾਹ

It's just a rehash of already known sources. I'm always wary of videos like this which start with "the sangat have been fed lies upto now and I am here to tell the truth..." This video is just this Singh's own opinion based on some textuao evidence. There are one or two things in the video which need looking at, the first of which the Singh refers to Guru Sahib's shaheedi as being at the Beas River, when it was at the Ravi river. The other thing that the Singh says is that Guru Arjan Dev Ji lfet his body at the bank of the river. But if this was true there would have been a chikka where Guru Sahin was cremated. Guru Sahib's body has no such place. Gurdwara Dehra Sahib is where Guru Sahib was tortured. But not the place of jyoti jyoy. As my vidia Guru Told me Guru Sahib requested for ishnaan in the river but was washed away in the river, having undergone days of extreme torture. In 2005 I was in Panjab and passing through Sirhind passed across mujadidi's mausoleum. I asked the caretaker there whether he knew about mujadidi's role in the shaheedi of Guru Arjan Dev Ji. he totally denied it. Anyway the mausoleum is still there. There were Sikhs there when I went in as well.