gadget

To everyone on SIkh Sikh sangat the way in which to destroy a culture explained :- In order to change the structure and power of a group to win favour and to bring that group into your control a number of steps must be undertaken Depending on the group size and the pride of a group the only way to change it is with in as established groups resent any outsider stepping in and trying to change them (and damn right to) as a group always assumes it is correct in its philosophy So the action that hindus or anybody who wants to change that group takes is it finds bright spots with in the group. The bright spots are literally people with in that group that hold qualities that the regime or hindu nation or muslim nation wants to change so in the case of sikhs it would be sikhs that doubt the authenticity of the Adi Granth or Guru Granth Sahib and can be changed easily through subtle manipulation through others already established in that group (which in our case would be the bhai spreading sarbloh granth etc) At first only two or three members of the group that they want to change have to agree (our group in this case sikh sangat) once a group rapport is established (everyone is cool with it) then others in the group (sikh sangat akj etc) accept that the concept introduced (sarbloh) is indeed on par with their current thinking the group then spreads this like wildfire throughout the group the enemy or hindus in our case leave the group which dissolves into the new structure from within and because the new manipulated group think matches the enemies in small degrees they keep on making these small changes until their thining is aligned and merged into the bigger group (hindus)

I do not believe for one moment that Guru Gobind Singh Ji would ask us to do Havan and adorn Tilak this is RSS propaganda it will not work

I support every sikh against congress and for a seperate sikh homeland and none that speak against any sikh organisation that has the power to help us get to power in Punjab/Pakistan/Delhi

The person who slandered Sant Ji who was a very very holy man will no doubt suffer their idiotic comments. Back to the matter at hand Daljeet SIngh Bittu will be a lot stronger if he joins Akali Dal and doesnt try to scare the Bhaia in Punjab who will if given the chance join Sikhi and save generations of their families from the hell they are born into. I feel house to house awareness is the way to go like Sant Jarnail Singh Ji said and when the movement gathers momentum and all parties are aligned then we march and remember the holocaust even in Delhi. But the holocause should only be a small part of the march and more of it should be a celebration of our gurus our resistance and bravery in the face of tyrrany and the fact we are the strongest world force as warrior mystics that will strengthen the Sikhs more than constantly showing pictures that scare small children and women from fighting the Indian goverment. Why is it we only see Bittu marching and never doing gurdwara seva or seva to help the poor or the widows of Delhi first he needs to prove his credibility as a puratan gursikh Sant Jarnail Singh Jee spent many many years doing Katha and spreading the word of sikhism if these singhs want to be a voice for Khalistan they first need to Khalsa

Any SGPC basher is very very dangerous in my opinion to our religion because it is clear even if they are wrong (some of the members) it is for Sikhs to discuss in a closed forum. These attack's on them are exactly the same attacks that Ghandi made against the Akali's By the late nineteenth century, both Hindus and Sikhs elites had embarked upon competing religious revivals, making communal lines sharper and more antagonistic. The Arya Samaj (Aryan Society) movement developed among urban Hindus in northern India and the Singh Sabha movement (1870-1919) among Sikhs. The former was not overtly political – focusing largely on linking Hindu religious values with modern life – but it spread anti-Sikh propaganda in the late 1880s and later formed the basis for radical Hindu parties like the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP). The Singh Sabha (the most important of a series of similar groups) focused on weeding out remnants of Hinduism from Sikhism. Young, educated Sikhs found themselves disillusioned with the Arya Samaj (which at first had seemed compatible with Sikhism) and wanted to re-evaluate Sikh identity. The movement took up issues such as mass education, reform of social customs, women’s rights, economic development, and theology, including through the establishment of educational institutions and newspapers. Despite differences of opinion about specific issues among Sikh reformers, their main thrust “was about clear demarcation of Sikh communal boundaries and the defence of the Sikh religion from attacks by other religions” (Deol 2000: 73). The question of Sikh identity had become a controversial legal and public issue by 1880s, especially in light of challenges to the Sikh faith by the Arya Samaj. In the meantime, new, vernacular print media (for instance, using the Gumukhi script in Punjabi printing presses) further elaborated group consciousness and ethnic boundaries. Part of the aim of Sikh reformists was to retain control of religious practices and institutions. The Akali Dal formed in 1914 to take over control of Sikh shrines. Since the 1920s, the Akali Dal has presented itself as sole representative of the Khalsa Panth, arguing that the religious and political interests of Sikhs are inseparable, that one’s identity as Sikh transcends all other identities, and that Sikhs’ loyalty to the central state must be contingent upon the state’s recognition of the community as a collective group with historic “theopolitical status.” A period of nonviolent noncooperation against colonial authorities by Sikhs peaked with the Jallianwallah Bagh massacre of 13 April 1919, when troops opened fire on a peaceful gathering. The incident prompted a restructuring of the management of the Golden Temple. Tensions between Akali activists seeking control of Sikh shrines and local government resulted in recurring conflicts and culminated in a massacre at the Nankana shrine. These struggles put strains on the generally amicable Anglo-Sikh relationship and helped consolidate the relationship between Akalis and Indian nationalists. Concerned with the escalating controversy over control of Sikh shrines, the colonial government instituted the Sikh Gurudwaras and Shrines Act of 1925, which conceded management and control of all Sikh religious institutions to the community. The government handed over management of Sikh gurdwaras (temples) and shrines to the Akalicontrolled Shiromani Gurudwara Prabahandak Committee (SGPC), formed in December 1920 by orthodox Sikhs. The SGPC holds regular elections which are almost always won by the Akali Dal. The SGPC controls significant material, institutional, human, and moral resources. Akalis’ ties with the politically-important SGPC has allowed them to help shape Sikh identity through intermediate institutions, historic shrines, schools, and missions, including the promulgation of Sikh heroes, honorifics, holidays, symbols, and so forth rather than Indian “national” ones. The Akali Dal thus emerged as an important political party with the 1925 act (Tatla 1999:30-4; Telford 1992:973-4) I am Absolutely amazed that any Sikh in their right mind would speak out against our highest authority the stupidity of it amazes me In past Panth time programs a number of Rhamgaria have got up and said the names of the gurdwara need to be changed how ever panel members took a stance that do you know who Jasaa Singh Rhamgharia was see what my Rhamgaria brothers must understand is to have Ekta one you must first merge into mainstream sikhism because you cant have one role for yourselves and another for the rest of the community if your not with us its obvious your against us. There is a very very small handful of Rhamgaria who support Khalistan this is very very obvious in Punjab and the UK they prefer the friendship of India and are very very pro India We cannot place Jassa Singh Rhamgaria on an equal footing of our Guru's who were God's form sent down to earth see what you must understand is if we name a gurdwara Rhamgaria then tommorow we will name a gurdwara after other Sikh soldiers which is just not on. I agree with the Rhamgaria community and will say he is a great hero but then tommorow will we name a gurdwara against the avengers of Ghandi there is no way we can have a satwant singh gurdwara then tommorow more heros of the cause come forward and they will want the gurdwara named after them. So by first distancing themselves from the SGPC whilst pretending to be friends of the Sikhs yet playing undercover anti Akali role the very people which saved the gurdwaras from central goverment control are being attacked by a community who wants nothing to do with the SGPC and yet name their gurdwaras against to conduct of most SIkh gurdwaras in the world The Rhamgari need to get their house in order before attacking the caste debate they name their very gurdwaras by their caste name I have yet to see one gurdwara named Kumar gurdwara or Jatt Gurdwara or Chamar gurdwara there are a lot of double standards here that need to be tackled by the community. The Akali Dal came forward at a very important time in Sikh history to claim back our shrines as they saw the goverment design to intgrate them into hinduism by splitting them. What you see in Harayana is dive and rule what you see in Delhi is divide and rule what you are now seeing in the West by the Rhamgaria community is divide and rule. What I suggest is that no Sikh attack another Sikh in a public forum where it weakens our image as a quam and instead we meet to discuss our issues and put them forward to SGPC and the Akali Party who have more Khesdari Amritdhari Sikhs in their party than anywhere. Beware of anyone splitting their name image or attacking established sikh institutions these people are the enemy within it is obvious from history that anything that serves to divide us by renaming your gurdwaras and attacking established Sikh shrines has a stink about it. I have yet to see any muslim attack their leaders in favour of another nations leaders no quamm is that stupid that they would embarras themselves on the world stage. Another issue that needs to be tackled is the Rhamgaria gurdwaras insistence to have party halls that serve alcohol and beer next to their gurdwaras. Why is it nobody is questioning the Rhamgaria community that you do not want to be under control of the Akal Thakhat yet you want to establish a european SIkh lobby yet you dont support our main headquaters I do not understand this and I am sure that many of our forum member do not ither. What I suggest is all Rhamgaria readers on this forum go and ask their gurdwara commitees why they are not under the authority of the SGPC the emporal seat of Sikhs and ahy they have chosen to name their gurdwaras under their caste name Once this is established and tackled we can then move forward and even think about having any of the Rhamgaria gurdwaras as a voice of worldwide sikhs Any gurdwara that names itself on caste whether Jatt Chammar Rhamgaria Saini needs to be sorted out only when we wipe out these idiotic caste issues can we move forward as a panth Even the SIkh channel admitted they were wrong about the SGPC hence the meeting with the leadership which put their minds to rest so why after meeting with the SIngh Sahiban they still played clips where Bhindrawale attacks Akalis I just dont understand Visit the SGPC website and make up your own minds - LINK 1 THE AKALIS ARE CLEARLY WRONG IN SERVING ALCOHOL TO GET VOTES BUT THE HINDU AND BHAIIA POPULATION OF PUNJAB IS SO GREAT IF WE DO NOT GET THEM TO VOTE FOR THE AKALIS WE LOSE PUNJAB IF WE LOSE PUNJAB WE SLOWLY LOSE GURDWARA AND LANGUAGE CONTROL EVERYTIME THERE HAS BEEN A CONGRESS GOVT THEY HAVE PUSHED HINDI AND ENGLISH ONLY THE AKALIS ARE PRESERVING PUNJABI THEN WHEN WE LOSE PUNJABI WE LOSE IDENTITY LOSE IDENTITY WE SLOWLY CONFUSE OUR YOUTH IF WE CONFUSE OUR YOUTH WITH MANY GURDWARAS NAMES AFTER CASTE WE LOSE THEIR RESPECT FOR OUR RELIGION WE LOSE THAT WE EVENTUALLY LOSE SIKHI

Can we please have the names of the commitee members who are the ones keeping the hall open for drinkking etc so we can write to them directly to voice our concerns

The Guru Granth Sahib that is placed and read in the harmandir sahib is the only oe that needs to be dsicussed because that is the granth that got us so far and growing year by year by all means read it discuss it but we only have one guru and that will and can never change

We have Amritsar airport which allowed Sikhs to visit their temporal seat in the world they have effectively tried to stop all of these Sikhs that would have otherwise visited the Golden temple and donated money to help schools and hospitals and gurdwaras get stronger Dont use the airport stick with Amritsar they could have used that money to strengthen the Amritsar airport highway but no they had to open a new one on the other side of punjab as far away from harmandir sahib as possible bloody idiots

Very very Anti Sikh person he is at the forefront of splitting all sikh support for the SGPC and has split delhi and also harayana from Sikh control He is also a supporter of the current Sikh channel family who have used their community trust to forward Sarnas plan to split all Sikhs from our central headqauters in Amritsar and then step in to clean up the mess and gain control of more gurdwaras across India and the world. ALl that we need to do to beat Sarna is support only Sikh partie's do you think any muslim in their right mind or hindu for that matter will vote for another religions party in their own country Keep supporting the SGPC and Akalis we will weed out the corruption from them eventually but if we stop supporting them we cut off our voice in India and Punjab then there will be no chance of regaining a Sikh homeland which is precisley what Sarna wants Just watch the Sikh Channel and you will see they are speaking the exact same language as Sarna against the SGPC and the Akalis and they are trying to do the exact same thing and split all european gurdwaras from the SGPC Open your eyes people

After some rather heated debate's on this forum regarding a new Sikh channel for the panth I must humbly apologise and agree it will be a good idea for the whole panth in the long run to have a choice of channels and if they do try to deceive the panth we will recognise the attack's. So why the sudden change well initially I thought the Sikh channel was a god send and still do as it has kick started a mass media movement which in turn spreads sikhism to the world where it should be and allows many millions of people to join the Sikh fold which is inevitable but I and some other very puratan gursikh's noticed some very very worrying contradiction's in their broadcasting - in one of the broadcasts's from a delhi gurdwara it had the Sarna brother's names in the end credit's - the ramgharia community are trying to set up control of all european gurdwaras rather sadly under their control whilst promoting ekta one but splitting us with Punjab and SGPC - the ramgharia community although sikhs have suddenly changed their stance on Jassa SIngh Ramgharia and will not change the name of the gurdwaras to our true gurus names in order to join with the SGPC (temporal seat of the Sikhs) they have explained this off by saying he was a warrior - they openly attack the Akali's and try to weaken Sikh support for them in the West (a congress trick) - many of their panel members are pro-congress (how I know I will reveal later) - The khalistan discussion whilst promoting Khalistan debate was actually a ploy because of the two people brought in from India tried rather cleverly to say that first we need gursikhi in every sikh household and that khalistan would not work (disinformation) - by discounting the hundred's of thousand's of Monay sikhs they are effectively saying if you are not amritdhari you dont have a right to expect Khalistan which is a load of rubbish and in fact wipe's out half of our support. The sikh brother (hair cut) on the right of the panel corrected them - whilst trying to effectively wipe out the caste debate the ramgharia are trying to assume moral priority over all communities in the West - there is a rather worrying anti jatt stance by the channel which can be seen when there was a debate on newspaper advertisement for potential marriage partners and the panel laughed when they mentioned an advert and most of these were jatt that clean shaven jatt required (surely we need to be bringing all castes into the fold and not making jokes about them) - There is nothing attractive that they have shown to bring the youth into Sikhi and just wasted airtime the people they have chosen obviously hand picked arent doing a very good job and some of the presenters cant even speak Punjabi The channel has in my opinion tried its absoloute hardest rather cunningly to split all support in the West of the SGPC and the Akali party which in my opinion are much much better for us than congress who attacked Sikhisms holy place and killed many Sikhs. Like I have mentioned before support of the Akalis is vital as they are the only Sikhs that are close to power in the Punjab and by splitting us from them and the SGPC no matter how much they may be corrupt they are effectively wiping all of the remaining power the Sikhs have out and making us much weaker. The reason I am sure there is something strange going on in the channel is, there are many many more attacks on akali than any other party so this leads me to think that perhaps the channel is using its power as the first sikh channel to gain control and split all support for all sikh institutions in the West they even mentioned on one show that we should call our relatives in the Punjab and not support Akalis in the Punjab. The voice of the SIkh channel is slowly changing from an all Sikh voice to a puppet of the Sarna brother's in Delhi and the voice of Rhamgaria of which over 60% secretly support congress and will do anything to break control of all Sikh gurdwaras by the SGPC. What the readers of this site must accept is that all Sikh's monay Jatt Tharkhan Kumar all come under one banner which is what the Sikh channel should have promoted but slowly and surely they are changing and its becoming obvious they are breaking communities whilst not admitting it and also splitting all support from the Punjab communtities surely if we want to make Khalistan we need the support of Sikhs in Punjab but by splitting us with the only power we have in Punjab whether right or wrong they are effectively destroying the support of Khalistan. Any Sikh channel staff reading this please mention to the family running this channel after the Jarnail SIngh video stunt by playing only the parts that will further split Sikhs you have effectively brought yourselves into the open about your actual intentions. I hope the next channel does better WJKKWJKF And why is our support of the Akal Takht so vital well I will leave you with an article by a prominent Sikh to explain THIS IS WHY HINDUS AND UNDERCOVER SARNA BROTHER WANT TO SPLIT WESTERN SIKHS WITH SGPC :- The word is "akal" and what we are celebrating today is in memory of the Akal Takhat. Takhat means "Tirath". Tirath means that which has the base and which ultimately means sovereign. Takhat means throne. Throne was a place which was thrown away from God. So word is Akal Takhat. Timelessness. Throne of timelessness. Depressed, emotional values and hopeless and useless confinement. These are the American values given to me today. In some people their egos and their emotions get together to the extent that they are worse than animals; they are beasts. When creativity becomes destructive, man is then lower than the animal. Because in the animal, sex is only controlled by the environmental time, and that is when the animal is in heat and then only they can create a sex. But humans have a direction, a mental direction, and have absolutely no time and space. Therefore the human creativity is based on a mental direction, not on time. So as a creature we have been given timelessness to begin with, as a matter of biological science, as a fundamental creativity in our consciousness. Barring that, our biological and our physical circumstances have been ingrained in timelessness rather than the animal. That's the difference. That's why we are considered superior and that the man and woman are created in a superiority of God's image. So basically, when we have an instinct to be distinct from that what is not and what is, it is called commitment and character and consciousness and intelligence. So when the magnetic psyche conflicts with the time, energy and containment of the magnetic psyche into the relevancy of that creativity, it stimulates the entire organism into the being and the creative self is so creative that the intelligence and the discipline is not at that moment in a position to beat out the impulsiveness. Then the human mind becomes destructive, insensitive and very active and it very, very effectively creates a hysteria of expelling the energy and commotional and neurotic satisfaction. This is nothing but an interlock of the most beautiful human energy into lower-than-animal nature. It's called "beast" in the Western language - the beast which is forceful and effectively an onslaught of damage. So what I'm explaining here today is that in Sikh Dharma we have a place we call Akal Takhat. It is the nerve center of the planet's psyche. It is the fundamental focal point of the planet's psyche and its sovereignty. It is a throne of timelessness. All of our life we meditate to attach ourself to earth, deeper and deeper. And when we have to quit the body, this shell drops. All our other nine bodies are so interwoven that we cannot leave this earth. Millions die but they cannot leave the magnetic field of this earth. Their souls cannot leave the magnetic field of the earth which a human in an airplane can bang right through. It is a most shocking miracle to surprisingly see it. A human with absolutely no meditative power can sit in a human-made airplane and bang through the magnetic field of the earth. But the soul cannot, because there's no penetrating creative spirit left. There's no mental attachment or mental projection to create us with a basic Infinity when it was in physical being. So to uplift that that characteristic... uplift that being... Guru Hargobind found out this nerve center, this focal point of the planet's psyche and built a throne for the entire mankind. And he made the Sikhs the servants and the guardians of it. We as Sikhs don't own that Takhat. We serve that Takhat. We are the guardians of that Takhat. And our job and our devotion and our dedication to that Takhat is that of a man of God, not of a particular religion, but of a man or woman of reality who shall serve and guard that Takhat - the Akal Takhat - the throne of timelessness. Exactly so, in the world of karma, to which you all belong, you can be timeless. When you focus and project and understand the inner being of the situation whether Mahatma Ghandi was real or non-real, you'll find the peace movement gave timelessness to him. In the history of the universe he is one man who, upon his death, all the flags of all the countries flew at half-mast. Why? Because basically in the inner being of the being for the time being or all the time, there's one desire to live in harmony, to live in peace, live in tranquility, to understand. Because that is the creative nature of God. And if you do not know the creative nature of God, you can never know the ultimate nature of God. Therefore a woman who does not know the creative nature of the man shall always be divorced and kicked out. If Prakirti does not know the fundamental of the Purkha, combination of union will never take place. It will be only a commotional, neurotic relationship. So long you do not admire and understand the timelessness of the teacher, you can never understand to be a timeless student. As long as this intercourse of understanding and cohabition of the psyche does not understand, there shall be duality and doubt. And whenever there's a duality and doubt, unisonness will not exist. So the very respectful reverence and understanding between a human of today and human of yesterday which can give you the experience of tomorrow, so that tomorrow you don't have to learn the hard way, so that the sophisticated softness of your life can penetrate your few miles of life further in peace and tranquility and harmony, does not exist. You all learn through hardness. And when you learn through the hardness of time and space, your entire sensitivity becomes bitter. That's why you're all bitter. You are the most beautiful apple of God, but you have worms in you. So that is why Guru Hargobind made the Akal Takhat. A throne of timelessness in which beauty in its own duty becomes the infinity through consciousness and through experience. Where man should hesitate and will hesitate to deceive his tomorrow. I don't think you do anything wrong or rotten. I think you are the emeralds, the "rattans". You're most beautiful. What you do is very funny. You betray your tomorrow, and you are angry at your today, and you abuse your yesterday. And then you want to be respected? Now how can that be? Mankind went through that era when man and his dignity, man and his self-respect, man and his creativity was just considered nothing. India was ruled by the Mogul empire then, and the orders were, "If a human beings sits on a place higher than the emperor by two and a half feet, his head should be chopped off or he should be picked up for meat to be fed to the emperor's game." That was the punishment. You became meat for the emperor's game. When you are for the emperor's game, you were taken to a prison where you were incarcerated and then one morning you were bled, and your blood was given to the game and your meat was chopped off to be eaten. All that was left of you was a dead body for the animals to tear apart. At that moment, Guru Hargobind found this focal point of energy, the nerve center of the psyche of this planet. In the longitude and latitude he found a spot - that spot which was the hub of temporal and spiritual foundation of psyche - and he built a throne there. And he said, "It is thrown from the timelessness. So it is called Akal Takhat." "Taa-khat". "Taa" means the base, the fundamental. "Khat" means the line. So it means the fundamental baseline of that Infinity, of that timelessness. That's why it is called Akal Takhat. That is spirituality. Guru Nanak is not here in his physical body, as you and I can see. But we can feel him, we can experience him, we can understand him, we can listen to him, we can know him, we can walk by his sayings, we can produce ourselves to be like him. That is the timelessness. That is the Akal. And the seal of this Akal Takhat says, "Akal Sahai." Let the timelessness support you. Out of the circle of 8.4 million lifecycles, there's one spot which does not subject itself to timelessness. And it does not subject itself to zigzags. It subjects itself to elevation. And that soul which commands that elevation is subjected to enjoy the sovereignty of that timelessness of the Akal Takhat. And that is the pure one, that is the Khalsa. Therefore the Akal Takaht dominates a domain of simple purity in Infinity. It doesn't belong to Sikhs. They have the privilege to serve it. It does not belong to the Khalsa. They have the privilege to guard it. Humanity doesn't own it. It is owned by the owner of its own Self, which is timelessness. And that is Para-Parbrahm Parmatma. Symbolically they destroyed a building and they declared their victory in doing so. But they caused their own defeat here and hereafter forever. And the entire Indian community which is the land of the Gurus, sages and saints, avtars, blessed ones, complete ones, graceful ones, will now die slowly. Because when there's a purity to the extent of Infinity and in it's own sovereignty, and that is destroyed, when the aorta is cut, man cannot live. When the psyche is destroyed, humanity cannot exist. And what will happen, time will record. It will be a part of history. We in America who are in love with the Guru's house, who are trying to understand the reality of our purpose of our human life, who understand timelessness, may not experience it, may not practice it, or may be intending to walk on that path. We have the privilege today to sit here in the Guru's Court to celebrate the memory, to commemorate the memory. Not in sadness and not in anger, but in meditation and prayer. And to remember that Akal Takhat is in our hearts. We have come here today to bow our heads to that grace, that light, that Infinity, that purity, that truthfulness which is in our heart. And we have come to bow our physical head. People say if the Akal Takhat is the throne of timelessness, why did it get destroyed? No, it didn't get destroyed. It sacrificed itself. It sacrificed itself as Guru Arjan did. The personified God, Guru Arjan, sacrificed himself. Guru Teg Bahadur sacrificed himself. The sons of Guru Gobind Singh sacrificed themselves. Guru Gobind Singh sacrificed himself. You have to sacrifice something to get something, to be something. There is nothing which can be created in timelessness without sacrifice. That is the Infinite law. And at this time, to save the humanity and the people and to awaken their dead souls, the Akal Takhat sacrificed itself. Look at this! The government tried to inject its B-complex in everything else and build it up and raised it. The resurrection took place. It again got destroyed by those who were supposed to serve and guard it. It got raised all right - not with that purity and prayer -- but with money and with power. Maya. In the true sense it was understood how a building can have a personality to inject and project a reality which only a man with consciousness can understand. It is not for the stone-heads. And we who are sitting thousands and thousands of miles away, have created a long infinite link. And with that link we live and we celebrate. And we commemorate. And we have the understanding. I pay my homage to this place of Infinite Divinity in the name of the entire humanity with peace and tranquility, and ask you all to do the same. Irrespective of what your faith is, what your color is, what your caste is, what your creed is, what your religion is, what your belief is, what your dimension is, what your size is, what your nationality is or what your reality is. But if you have a sense of the aorta, to understand what timelessness and sovereignty mean, then you can start right now paying your homage and respectfully attaching yourself to the very lotus feet of the One who gave us the Akal Takhat. Hargobind... "the Infinite God which sustains us all." That is the literal meaning of "Hargobind"... Guru Hargobind, who took us from the bondage of insanity, commotionalism, neurosis and egotistical attitude and gave us something which is most beautiful in the entire world, for all to remember to be, to visit, to play, to have thought of, to have a memory of, or to look forward to seeing. Wahe Guru Ji Ka Khalsa, Wahe Guru Ji Ki Fateh!

Sant Ji's speeches no attacking Akali and other Sikh organisations in order to split the UK sangat from them. No casteism biased towards one caste All gurdwaras covered in the UK regardless of their castes No family to have ownership and final say in Sikh matters More money sikhs to be involved SOme decent Sikh female representatives that are representative of all Sikhs of the UK and not just certain groups No GOI agents on any of our shows (yes we know who you are TSC) :ph34r: No use of the channel as a tool to stop the Sikhs uniting and asking for Khalistan in conjunction with SGPC & Akali which the current channel is trying to split us with (divide and rule) No (undercover) partnership with the Sarna brothers like the current owners of TSC (yes we know that too) :ph34r: Biographies of the gurus lives

When a Sikh is voted to any heights of power or are about to gain power have you noticed how these hindus jump all over it and try to defame them The exact same thing happened in Southall with Mr Singh who stood for the conservatives even leicester MP's drove down to LOndon to defame his character to make sure he didnt get voted in These Brahmin/Hindus are S******* themselves as even they now know its only a matter of time before loads of Sikhs stand for parliment then their days of manipulation are numbered They continue to plant the bad seeds of their Karma which like I said before is spinning back round slowly but surely to slap them where it hurts Its pathetic their attempt at defaming us so much so its actually laughable now that they think we havent noticed what will they try to do shut down the internet next to stop Sikhs Get the message you idiots we will get our hijacked land back you commited a genocide on us like the nazis did the Jews we are just as determined as the Jews and believe or not just as intelligent if not moreso :lol:

THE BIGGEST LOAD OF FABRICATED RUBBISH I HAVE EVER READ COME ON GUYS YOUVE GOTO DO BETTER THAN THAT THE SIKHS ARENT THAT STUPID

It's not a paranoia issue hindu and turk's like the guru's mentioned are not to be trusted. Whatever doesnt kill you serves to make you stronger just look at the puratan Sikhs now that the hindu nazi terrorist regime created by killing young children raping girls in front of their fathers and murdering the elderly and throwing their bodies onto trucks to be burnt on mass bonfires. I think the positive aspect that has come out of 1984 is how weak these hindus are and how afraid they are of Sikhs they know we are much more powerful than them so they resorted to mob violence and tried to strike fear into our hearts By wahegurus kirpa the sikhs understand theis and by trying to start mass hysteria and weaken the sikhs what they have shown is like hitler and the muslim terrorists these hindu terrorists will be beaten by goodnes truth and determination. We are similar to the Americans that we stand up to tyrrany and the British and AMericans loved the SIkhs for this simple reason . Here is a article on India being placed on a list with muslim terrorists - LINK 1 Hindu extremist organisation gather momentum -Link 2 Here hindus crticise Sikh PM -Link 3 which proves if you join them they still wont like you Hindus welcoming terrorists -Link 4 How the hindus murdered sikhs recently yet there are people on this board who trust them LINK 4

Where theres a will theres a way the jews did it the cubans did it Im sure we can do it All of these naysayers are using the argument of financially the only people who are going to be hurt financially are the lalas and the cheating loan sharks the farmers most of them sikh the infrastructure doesnt get any central goverment support anyway and we could do less of the poisoned foodstuffs and alcohol and sweets they are pushing on the punjab children Your arguments are totally flawed you are new account holders and your validity is nil

This gurdwara hall and all other gurdwara halls need to be closed and used for community projects and not to line the pockets of these devious evil people the moghuls did the same at amritsar and we slaughtered them. I dont give a rats <banned word filter activated> about the grays community can take their wives and daughters to a pub and leave the gurdwara altogether and of course there are mandirs and mosques that will accept them .....oh sorry I retract that mandirs and mosques never allow alcohol on their premises These people are scum stupid and blatantly taking the p*** in our gurdwaras what would bhindranwale say about this why are you sikhs so ashamed in grays of confronting this scum Protest if they dont listen then the akal takht will get involved as soon as they issue an edict against the main culprits their families will be banished from sikhi im sure they ancestors in their next life will be proud of them for getting themselves banished from the greatest religious family in the world What I propose is some coaches get together and form a protest outside the gurdwara with the sikh channel present for the entire UK sangat to see the beadbi going on preferably on the day of a wedding with the main culprits in attendance so 10's of thousands of sikhs around europe can see the EXACT families making a mokery of sikhism as the moghuls and the congress paerty does as does the bollywood media if that doesnt make them ashamed enough that they are fighting the defenders of our religion for a cause the gurus believed in then we go onto PLAN B which is the lawful route and get thousands of sangat from across the UK to caste a vote and get a new commitee elected if they disagree to stop the alcohol we take away our guru to a closer gurdwara who will respect us as sikhs

As sikhs we are loyal to the truth ans whether that be sikhs being persecuted or christians and jews being persecuted we are going to speak up about it. As canadians we are loyal to canada So who are these journalists loyal to it sure isnt Canada because the journalists constantly attacking the sikhs are loyal to the dollar that they are receiving in exchange for attacking the sikhs through the media but taking bribes THE MORE THESE JOURNALISTS ATTACK THE SIKHS THE MORE CLEAR IT IS BECOMING THAT EITHER THEY ARE BEING BLACKMAILED BY THE GOI OR THEY ARE LOYAL AND TAING BRIBES FROM THE GOI The intelligence in Canada needs to monitor these journalists as they are stirring up internal trouble between the minority groups in Canada which indirectly is attacking their own country by promoting inner civil conflict You canadian sikhs need to write to all mps and make a lists of these journalists and your concerns that they are being bribed or blackmailed and they are not impartial as journalists which all journalists swear to If their not loyal to canada they are threat to peace and must be kept a check on by authorities

ooooh Ive hit a spot why the aggression if you were a hardcore khalistani with xray vision you would see the importance of this thread. As bhindrawale saw that a vision for the youth was the most important concept of getting khalistan it is precisely why you are a million miles away whether you do 1000 jaapjis or not you require the love of God in your heart and prayer is not a chore where you count your paath its a feeling of oneness with akaal purakh which is why you will never understand the concept of a solid vision which is what even countries like the USA were built upon look at the american constitution

I refuse to be intimadated by one naysayer as discussed on the first post he is welcome not to participate why is it that when anything of immense value is presented here on SIkh Sangat 5-10 disinformation or naysayers try to stop the thread what are you all afraid of THE WHEELS ARE IN MOTION THE FEW WILL NOT BE SILENCED AND WE WILL GET IT IT IS IN OUR ARDAS AND EVERY REAL SIKH YOUTH ACKNOWLEDGES THIS

I do not do prayer math and pajji I simply will not argue with you all I have asked of the sangat is what they would require of an ideal Khalistan what part hurt's your sentiments about this please refrain from trying to hijack this thread I am sure you are very afraid of the consequences of a shared vision of a group of people Do not be afraid you do not have to visit the homeland you are free to remain where you are now.

Without a vision you cannot and will not achieve anything I am very aware that you may not have heard about it before but theres thousands of sangat that are required to discuss the importance and have a vision to carry forward. If you do not agree you are welcome not to join this thread. With out plans you will never build a house and by arguing you are blatantly showing your support is not with us just dont read this thread its a free country I will finish with a very dfamous quote “We are limited, not by our abilities, but by our vision.” “Hell begins on the day when God grants us a clear vision of all that we might have achieved, of all the gifts which we have wasted, of all that we might have done which we did not do” “The most pathetic person in the world is someone who has sight, but has no vision.” “Effective leaders help others to understand the necessity of change and to accept a common vision of the desired outcome.” “With vision there is no room to be frightened., No reason for intimidation. It's time to march forward! Let's be confident and positive!”

I would like the sangat to participate and give me your feedback on what an ideal Khalistan would look like for you PLEASE NOTE THIS THREAD IS NOT FOR NAYSAYERS AND INDIAN DISINFORMATION GOVERMENT OR HINDUTVA OFFICIALS THIS IS FOR OUR VISION ONLY MODS PLEASE MONITOR THIS THREAD I would like to ask what you would like to see in terms of education, schools infrastructure etc I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR ABOUT CORRUPTION OR WHAT NEEDS TO BE CLEARED UP WE HAVE ENOUGH OF THAT ON OTHER THREADS. I will start off with alcohol controlled zones mainly on the border of India that will be placed in Chandigarh for visiting tourists All main gurdwaras to be zoned off from cities with maintenance of them a priority and meat and alcohol ban in Harmandir Sahib Amritsar and at least 2 miles around Shops around the gurdwara to be controlled by volunteers of which all profits go to schools and hospitals around the country (khalistan) Women as well as men police officers picked from their respective areas by the locals and sent for training in Ludhiana

I agree as foeticide and interracial marriages are widening there is a requirement by Sikh's to understand the true vaule of our daughter's In the future finding a puratan Sikh woman will become more difficult for the youth So by valuing them now in schools colleges etc they will be more open for marriage to Sikhs I have observed that the young sikhs almost chant a mantra Sikhs are with muslims over and over again so much that they start believing it The reality of the situation as there are 5 muslims to every sikh you are going to notice it more when a sikh girl elopes but the reality is a lot (I mean huge amounts) of muslims girls are eloping but its hidden When a muslim sees a muslim girl with a sikh he doesnt confront they use friendship and try to make her understand the value of muslim companionship All that we Sikhs have to do is lose the macho talking down to women mentality and try to value and understand them more

It's actually not that bad it's mainly that's your focus There are group's that help females with family trouble's here in London as a matter of fact the most affected are the hindu girl's almost 3 to 1 as compared to the Sikh girls this is because over the last decade or so the education has tripled in SIkh household's to stop the problem A new trend which has risen over 1000% is muslim girl's eloping with blacks and indians as it is a taboo they feel exihilrated when they do something against their families who often keep them from going out and mixing in gerneral Another massive trend is young gay hindu and mulslim males coming out and on a much samller scale sikhs This was due to in a report published massive abuse in the hindu community especially of young mandir going hindus by priests here are some stories 1 - gay hindu priest leicester - Link 1 2 - the boy he abused was finally caught - Link 2 3 - how he blackmailed boys - Link 3 4 - massive gay hindu community in Delhi and aids -Link 4 5 - Muslim girl runs away with indu - Link 5 6 - 3000 hindu girls eloped with muslims - Link 6 7 - Muslims rape hindu girl and elope - Link 7 8 - RSS hindu eloped with muslim girl - Link 8 9 - Muslims with hindu women - Link 9 There are many more reports but I estimate as there is a much larger population of muslims in the UK than SIkhs and they have kept their women locked up for a long time the rebbelion has just begun and there are many girls who drink have taken up hindu white and black lovers its a massive problem in the islamist community which their keeping under the veil so to speak The problem with hindu girls is much much larger largely because they are modernist With sikh awareness at an all time high its mainly the hindus on these message boards who come on to incite trouble with the muslims as they are too cowardly to face their own problems The hindu community in the UK is crmbling Whereas if you look around at the sikh revival its amazing so many young sikh women taking up amrit Sikhs have always been progressive with a sense of pride in their history we are a very stubborn race and the few girls that do elope come from very weak families or are blackmailed raped etc So its not as much of a problem as the sangat thinks EDUCATE EDUCATE EDUCATE refer the girls you know to the threads that make them aware of the extremist muslims in our society and the extremist hindus the rest will take care of itself

A lot of these brahmin and pro rss hindus are jus S*** Stirrers just look at them to tell they are self depreciated weak scum and their statures and build show the more cunning you are the weaker your body (proven fact) due to hormones released by the brain and bodies endoctrine system Dont believe me look at any famous hindu trouble maker there isnt a bhadar shere like the sikhs amongst them They are weak minded and weak bodied even more the hatred for sikhs is pitiable Even their women are drawn to Sikhs hence the constant attacks by them in the Hindu media as they are very very afaris of the Sikh womens population difference that its inevitable the all of the hindu women are fgoing to go for the available Sikh men in future All we have to make sure is the SIkhs due foeticide in Punjab stick with their religion Why do you think they promote this mass emigration in songs and try to potray a life abroad as happier than being a free person in your own country with your own land and labour 50-75% of their women are going to leave with muslims and the other 25% with sikhs They are S******* themselves Karma is a B****