Hindu Scriptures in Gurbani

[mehar singh]

I wanted someone to reply so we can finish this up. There are so many references to different religions and spirituality and they have been mentioned to show us the path of Truth. Gurbani is all about truth and if there is need of Puranas/Vedas/Quran to be mentioned to show us that truth of God then Gurbani mentions them.

Regards.

[Kharkoo4Life]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

I'm quite confused at the moment, I know that we are not Hindu's in any shape or form, I understand the differences. . .

I was wondering could someone (or many of you) please help me understand the references to the Vedas, Puranas, Devs, Devtia's etc in Gurbani??? Are we supposed to know what they say? Are we supposed to believe in any part of them?

99822[/snapback]

It is not a silly question at all. In fact it is questions such as the one you pose above that define a Sikh (a life long learner). We pray to Waheguru Ji everyday in our Ardaas to bless us with the boon of critical thinking ('Bibaik Dhaan') and just as important as the rehmat of Guru ji is blessing us with this faculty, equally important is our own effort in acquiring knolwedge and becoming analytical thinkers.

One the one hand Guru Nanak was strictly opposed to idol worship, fasts, rituals, piligrames etc yet on the ohter hand there is repeated mention and reference to the Hindu writings (vedas, puranas) throughout gurbani. On initial glance this could easily be the basis for confusion and uncertainty amongst the novice reader of Gurbani. But Guru Ji was aware of this that is why he made it ABSOLUTELY CLEAR his underlying message in the opening words of Guru Granth Sahib: i.e. what is commonly referred to as the 'mool mantar' or succint summary of gurbani's message. In the mool mantar guru ji has clearly stated that there is ONE god, who is eternal, formless, transcending and omnipresent throughout His creation AND He is realized through the remembrance of his Name and the grace of the benovlent Guru/Waheguru himself.

Thus becoming familiar, reciting, believing, or even following the instructions of the Vedas, Puranas etc is both unneccesary and in fact strict prohibition for any Guru Ka Sikh. Then the question arises why did the Guru mention them in Gurbani. To understand this it is important to realize that Gurbani is not written in any longwinded, dull academian essay form. Rather it is written in the form of beautiful elegant poetry. And as in any poetry, the use of metaphors and analogies is essential to convey the message of the writer. And that is exactly what Guru Ji has done in gurbani. They have used an enormous array of examples, particularly those which were prevelent in the daily lives of the poeple of the time, to help them be able to relate and incorporate the message of Sikhi into their lives.

Majority of Indians then, as now, were familiar the the 'stories, history' of the Hindu mythology. Rather than create new characters, new stories, the Guru Ji in their infinite wisdom employed already preexisiting stories, characters, which had been passed down for centuries amongst the people, in order to help drive home the message of equality, love and sacrifice. Using them strictly as EXAMPLES, for purposes of understanding which the average person cud relate to, references were thus made from the hindu ( as well as islamic texts).

So in short, we are not supposed to believe or follow the hindu/islam texts in any shape or form. We have only one text to follow and seek guidance from, and that is our living, eternal guru, Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. And with the underlying thought in mind, that Gurbani being poetry, cannot be taken in a literal word for word from but rather the whole verse in its entirity should be understood for its common underpinning theme, then we will begin to realize the true message of the Guru.

I hope this somewhat helps answer your question.

Fateh

p.s. i apologize for not using specific quotaions from Gurbani as i was in a rush this morning in writing this reply.

[GursimranSingh]

Waheguroo ji ka khalsa

Waheguroo ji ki fateh

SSA everyone :

Well...to begin with the reference you all are talking to are not well understood to you all....

The time when gurunanak dev ji start spreading his teachings,,, at that time the world was keeping itself in the darkness of hindu teachings...folllowing 33 crore devi devtees... believing in ridhi-sidhiyaas....and following the so called PANDITS(brahmans).... at that time he wrote these things to show their hypocricy and their belief are just eluding.

let me clear some things.... these were the times when thee were two main religions in the society known and HINDUS and MUSLIMS. the verses in the gurbani talks about the hindu and their teachings just to show their falsification. here are some examples:

Vel Na paya Pandati, Je likhey ved Puran

vakhat na payo kadiya je liken lekh kuran.

This means that even pudits & kajis( At that time these two were supeream forces) dont know the mystery of Akal Purakh.

Many hindus says( even sings in Jagratas) that there is a Pauri in Japji Sahib thats is

Eka Mai Jugat Viai,

Tin chele parvan,

ik sansari ik bhandari,

ik lai diban.

Its tru that these lines refers to Shakti and three devs Brahma, Vishnu Shiv

But then they refers the god in these verses, as

Jiv tis bhave tive chlave jiv hove furman.

Oh vekhe onha nadar na aave, bahuta eh vidan.

That means , all the above stuff abt devi and devtas are created and functioning only under the control of One Single Almighty.

THE MAIN OBJECTIVE OF A SIKH IS TO WORSHIP ONLY ONE.

NOT ANY OTHER DEVI, DEVTA, PUNDIT, SO CALLED BABAS, SANTS.

REMEMBER, THESE BABAS AND SANTS ARE JUST TELLING U THE WAY TO REACH GOD. BUT U CAN ALSO DO THAT URSELF BY STUDING GURU GRANTH SAHIB.

ONE SINCERE REQUEST TO ALL THE MEMBERS.... STOP ASKING THESE REALLY NONSENSE QUSTIONS.... I AM REFERRING TO QUESTION FEW DAYS BEFORE REEGARDING THE COLORS ALLOWED IN SIKHISM...IT REALLY HURTS... IF STILL YOU REALLY WANT TO ASK THESE QYESTIONS THEN YAHOO OR SIKHNET CHATTING IS BETTER PLACE

RATHER YOU GUYS SHOILD TAK THE BEST WAYS TO MAKE THER WORLD AND EACH AND EVERY PERSON AWARE OF THE SIKHS AND SIKHISM.....

I HAVE COME TO MISSISSIPPI STATE UNIVERSITY....WE ARE IN PROCESS OF MAKING SIKH STUDENT FEDERATION (SSF) HERE...

THE BETTER THING HERE WOULD BE IF ALL THE SANGAT SHOULD ENGAGE EFFECTIVELY IN TAKING STEPS IN MAKING PEOPLE AWARTE OF SIKHISM.....

LET US KNOWTHE VARIOUS SSF'S ,,,, ALSO LET US KNOW IF SOMEBODY IS PART OF ANY SSF ANYWHERE IN US ...

THAT WILL BE NICE... SO TRY TO TALK SENSIBLE AND SOMETHING FRUITFUL.

FATEH

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

I'm quite confused at the moment, I know that we are not Hindu's in any shape or form, I understand the differences. . .

I was wondering could someone (or many of you) please help me understand the references to the Vedas, Puranas, Devs, Devtia's etc in Gurbani??? Are we supposed to know what they say? Are we supposed to believe in any part of them?

99822[/snapback]

It is not a silly question at all. In fact it is questions such as the one you pose above that define a Sikh (a life long learner). We pray to Waheguru Ji everyday in our Ardaas to bless us with the boon of critical thinking ('Bibaik Dhaan') and just as important as the rehmat of Guru ji is blessing us with this faculty, equally important is our own effort in acquiring knolwedge and becoming analytical thinkers.

One the one hand Guru Nanak was strictly opposed to idol worship, fasts, rituals, piligrames etc yet on the ohter hand there is repeated mention and reference to the Hindu writings (vedas, puranas) throughout gurbani. On initial glance this could easily be the basis for confusion and uncertainty amongst the novice reader of Gurbani. But Guru Ji was aware of this that is why he made it ABSOLUTELY CLEAR his underlying message in the opening words of Guru Granth Sahib: i.e. what is commonly referred to as the 'mool mantar' or succint summary of gurbani's message. In the mool mantar guru ji has clearly stated that there is ONE god, who is eternal, formless, transcending and omnipresent throughout His creation AND He is realized through the remembrance of his Name and the grace of the benovlent Guru/Waheguru himself.

Thus becoming familiar, reciting, believing, or even following the instructions of the Vedas, Puranas etc is both unneccesary and in fact strict prohibition for any Guru Ka Sikh. Then the question arises why did the Guru mention them in Gurbani. To understand this it is important to realize that Gurbani is not written in any longwinded, dull academian essay form. Rather it is written in the form of beautiful elegant poetry. And as in any poetry, the use of metaphors and analogies is essential to convey the message of the writer. And that is exactly what Guru Ji has done in gurbani. They have used an enormous array of examples, particularly those which were prevelent in the daily lives of the poeple of the time, to help them be able to relate and incorporate the message of Sikhi into their lives.

Majority of Indians then, as now, were familiar the the 'stories, history' of the Hindu mythology. Rather than create new characters, new stories, the Guru Ji in their infinite wisdom employed already preexisiting stories, characters, which had been passed down for centuries amongst the people, in order to help drive home the message of equality, love and sacrifice. Using them strictly as EXAMPLES, for purposes of understanding which the average person cud relate to, references were thus made from the hindu ( as well as islamic texts).

So in short, we are not supposed to believe or follow the hindu/islam texts in any shape or form. We have only one text to follow and seek guidance from, and that is our living, eternal guru, Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. And with the underlying thought in mind, that Gurbani being poetry, cannot be taken in a literal word for word from but rather the whole verse in its entirity should be understood for its common underpinning theme, then we will begin to realize the true message of the Guru.

I hope this somewhat helps answer your question.

Fateh

p.s. i apologize for not using specific quotaions from Gurbani as i was in a rush this morning in writing this reply.

100416[/snapback]

[Kharkoo4Life]

Waheguroo ji ka khalsa

Waheguroo ji ki fateh

ONE SINCERE REQUEST TO ALL THE MEMBERS.... STOP ASKING THESE REALLY NONSENSE QUSTIONS.... I AM REFERRING TO QUESTION FEW DAYS BEFORE REEGARDING THE COLORS ALLOWED IN SIKHISM...IT REALLY HURTS... IF STILL YOU REALLY WANT TO ASK THESE QYESTIONS THEN YAHOO OR SIKHNET CHATTING IS BETTER PLACE

Fateh Veer ji,

I would like to thank you for sharing your vichaar on this topic. All vichaar which are given with humility and kindness to help educate and enlighten another should be openly embraced and listened to. The onus then lies on listener himself/herself to decide wether to accept, refute or inquire further clarification about the shared vichaar.

It is good and heartwarming to see that you are able to understand and recite lines from the Guru Granth Sahib in support of your vichaar. Something every Sikh should use as the basis for any argument/poirnt they wish to discuss. However, it must also be understood that there are those among us who have only recently set on the path of the Sikhi jeevan. Who are unfamiliar, and not fully understaning of the basic Sikh principles and ideology. Therefore, it is our duty as Sikhs, pariticularly those who have already acquired some knowledge and understanding of Gurbani to exhibit the highest level of patience and tolerance towards those who are striving to walk on the same path.

After all, every person who became a Sikh during the Guru's times became a Sikh through their own understanding and own speed under the blessing and support of the Guru ofcourse. The Gurus never used force, or spoke harshly towards those who caem to them with a sincere and genuine desire to learn more about and try to understand the Sikh faith. They ALWAYS showed patience, tolerance and humlity when discusing any matter or answering any question of their followers. These are quailities which Sikhs today are sadly lacking. Many a Sikh after attaining even some Gyan thru gurbani, develops a sense of ego (haumay), and it is this ego which devleops rifts and hate mongering amongst his fellow sikhs. For this reason, Guru ji warned us in gurbani, that beware teh egocomplex which one tries to rid themselves via naam simran, can actually become even stronger and more dangerous as they move up the ladder of Sikhi. Therefore always remain humble and courteoius to ur fellow brotheren even if they may seem lost, confused over a topic which appears striaghtforward and commense sense to us.

RATHER YOU GUYS SHOILD TAK THE BEST WAYS TO MAKE THER WORLD AND EACH AND EVERY PERSON AWARE OF THE SIKHS AND SIKHISM.....

and with regards to the best way to make the world aware of Sikhism. Why not follow the method the Gurus themselves employed. Become True Sikhs ourselves and teach others through the examples of our own lives. And if ppl come towards us with questions, let us handle and answer each question with the same care and compassion that the Gurus showed towards even their staunchest and most aggressive oppressors.

May waheguru bless us all with gurmat and dhaya.

Fateh