40 day japs

[N30S1NGH]

Consciousness veer its all perception and stage based - sikhi caters to all jiagaso(student) of low bibek buddhi to high bibek buddhi to stage of advait.

The reason you cannot feed raw - advait parchar to begineer such as

Sohang So jaa ko hai jaap ||

jaa ko lipath n hoe pu(n)n ar paap ||6||

Sabh Gobind hai Sabh Gobind hai >

Because individual antish karam is still dirty/effected with five vikars (kam, krodh, lob, moh, ahankar, ego) antish karan needs to be blean(clean) with naam/bhagti/gyan together...gurmat is very fine path if one automatically starts the journey of sikhi with gyan aspect in sikhi..its quite dangerous.. its very slipperly slope, one gets trapped/whirlpool in sukhsham humaie where only guru maharaj can help out to get individual out of it.!!

[N30S1NGH]

So why do u think there is still a separation and hence two? If you know there is ek onkar, who is the phd student and high school kid. Realisation is for everyone, irrespective of age. sants will keep you japping until u are on your death bed and still have no gyan whatsoever. So what u waiting for, for your next life? Know now that this body/mind isn't you and its actions are god's.

Well bhagat kabir is stating his start of journey of tu tu karta with an duality and at start jaaping naam with duality but at the end he declares mujh mein rha na hoon jab aapa par ka mitt gya , jat dekhaan tat tu" with non duality perception. There was never any individual kabir ji, but rather it always been only and only - iKongkar- nirgun chaitan bhram....!!!!

[N30S1NGH]

Yes, others may need duality at first to understand the concepts but you cannot deny that gurbani is non dual all the time if looked deeper into.

gurbani is non dual all the time if looked deeper into.

totally agreed..!!

[Consciousness]

Consciousness veer its all perception and stage based - sikhi caters to all jiagaso(student) of low bibek buddhi to high bibek buddhi to stage of advait.

The reason you cannot feed raw - advait parchar to begineer such as

<Sohang So jaa ko hai jaap ||

jaa ko lipath n hoe pu(n)n ar paap ||6||

Sabh Gobind hai Sabh Gobind hai >

Because individual antish karam is still dirty/effected with five vikars (kam, krodh, lob, moh, ahankar, ego) antish karan needs to be blean(clean) with naam/bhagti/gyan together...gurmat is very fine path if one automatically starts the journey of sikhi with gyan aspect in sikhi..its quite dangerous.. its very slipperly slope, one gets trapped/whirlpool in sukhsham humaie where only guru maharaj can help out to get individual out of it.!!

Veer Ji I humbly disagree with you if the sukhsham haumie i.e. false sense of ego can be pinpointed with the aid of gyan and experience then even the jagaso can use this little amount of knowledge to avoid the trap of falling for this ego - if obviously informed and guided.

Well, it does help if one's antish karan is clean i.e one's state of mind is attuned to a satoguni nature. But Gurbani and even the upanshids and the advait geeta reject the theory of one needs to totally clean himself inside and out to realise the lord. It helps having a steady mind but not a neccesity for realisation.

[Consciousness]

Well bhagat kabir is stating his start of journey of tu tu karta with an duality and at start jaaping naam with duality but at the end he declares mujh mein rha na hoon jab aapa par ka mitt gya , jat dekhaan tat tu" with non duality perception. There was never any individual kabir ji, but rather it always been only and only - iKongkar- nirgun chaitan bhram....!!!!

It's not duality if looked in from a non durmat perspective - both parts of the same tuk don't necessarily mean stages but an understanding an acknowledgement from the ego. Bhagat kabir negates himself in the tuk but only through gian although even if looked from a perspective of an agani still he apperceives duality but still he is also one. The question then become who has caused the ignorance?

Namo andkarai - and the source is still one and the same - no duality. Of course in sargun the mind perceives duality also even for a gyani his/her mind is still dual when conscious but he knows his inner nature and the one light behind the illusion.

[N30S1NGH]

Veer Ji I humbly disagree with you if the sukhsham haumie i.e. false sense of ego can be pinpointed with the aid of gyan and experience then even the jagaso can use this little amount of knowledge to avoid the trap of falling for this ego - if obviously informed and guided.

There are two types of gyani- parkosh gyani and aparkosh gyani.

Parkosh gyani is the one is who is still doing abhyas of advait- ikongkar- with an forceful effort.

Aparkosh Gyani is bhramgyani who does not need to do any abhyas of advait- ikongkar, its a natural spontaneous flow of self-realization.

There is a big difference between the two. One can argue parkosh gyani just have to do abhyas of advait- ikongkar and one day will get to bhramgyan..that might be true but according to tat gurmat- naam, bhagti and gyan are blended into one to prevent any pit falls that advait vedantis not all but some have fell into web of sukhsham humaie..!!

[Consciousness]

There are two types of gyani- parkosh gyani and aparkosh gyani.

Parkosh gyani is the one is who is still doing abhyas of advait- ikongkar- with an forceful effort.

Aparkosh Gyani is bhramgyani who does not need to do any abhyas of advait- ikongkar, its a natural spontaneous flow of self-realization.

There is a big difference between the two. One can argue parkosh gyani just have to do abhyas of advait- ikongkar and one day will get to bhramgyan..that might be true but according to tat gurmat- naam, bhagti and gyan are blended into one to prevent any pit falls that advait vedantis not all but some have fell into web of sukhsham humaie..!!

Yes, that can be the case if one doesn't understand the difference between the ego and the true I 'God' then yes there can be a downfall. But like I said through guidence and experience then one can avoid this. The same goes with a bhagat that does mantar repetition saying that 'he' is doing it and by doing more japping of it 'I' will get there (sachkand). So here it also is another downfall of ego - a pitfall is still created as the durmat bhagat considers himself to be a devotee and God as the goal. Both ways can be dangerous.

[N30S1NGH]

What you saying does make sense from gyan advait gurmat perspective. However In gurmat according to ikongkar to athara das bees tak sri guru granth sahib ji - the full milaap is done between bhagti, gyan and Shabad Surat (Naam). Shabad Surat, Gyan and Bhagti Marg are blended together in one. Gyan, Bhakti, Shabad surat marg are together in Gurmat not separate. Khalsa incorporates all of them in their daily life, because there are concept of Shabad Surat bhagti, gyan, advait(non duality of mind), sargun vahiguroo- our guru sahib, prem, seva, guru kirpa, nirgun, bairaag, gyan , hakum, raza, naam(shabad gyan), gyan (atma-paratma), all listed in Gurbani...how can a beginner seperate them?

[Consciousness]

What you saying does make sense from gyan advait gurmat perspective. However In gurmat according to ikongkar to athara das bees tak sri guru granth sahib ji - the full milaap is done between bhagti, gyan and Shabad Surat (Naam). Shabad Surat, Gyan and Bhagti Marg are blended together in one. Gyan, Bhakti, Shabad surat marg are together in Gurmat not separate. Khalsa incorporates all of them in their daily life, because there are concept of Shabad Surat bhagti, gyan, advait(non duality of mind), sargun vahiguroo- our guru sahib, prem, seva, guru kirpa, nirgun, bairaag, gyan , hakum, raza, naam(shabad gyan), gyan (atma-paratma), all listed in Gurbani...how can a beginner seperate them?

I agree with what you are talking about which is sargun (duality) and nirgun (non duality) but everyone pretty much knows the sargun aspect but getting to the immortal route deathless nirgun path not many know and this can only be done by knowing your non dual self. To get to the non dual self you must disappear; annihilation of the ego/self and this requires the ultimate knowledge and no stage process or practice will get you there - because it in itself is pathless/ experience less/ perceiver-less.

So teaching other stages or some sort of practice becomes a hurdle in this acknowledgement of nirgun. Yes you are right that sargun and nirgun are two aspects of god anyway they appear to be two because of consciousness.