Not2Cool2Argue

When we went to pakistan, the Muslim driver, told us that the the Pakistan Gurudwara Comittee can't do much as it does get enough funds. The granthis cover the Pakistan Gurdwara Comittee's golak, and put their own golak in the front. And as far as I could tell, it was true. There were two golaks, but one was always covered or put to the side. But then again the driver was MUslim.....

After sun drying, fold it immediately, then no need to iron and is ready to use. If u bundle it up, then ur gonna have to iron it, which will take a loooong time. Whether it affects material:no idea

Some refer to your conscience (u know the little voice that tells u when ur doing something wrong) as God's voice

Ive heard that god is samdarsi (literally: same gaze) that he looks at everyone with the same emotion, treats everyone similarily. He doesn't hate the sinner or like the one who does good deeds. (of course he has a system in place to deal with the sinners/good ppl) but he is not personally involved. However, when/if someone prays to him, god listens and becomes personally involved. God is conscious energy, so he can care and love, though usually he is veparvah(careless, worryless?)

A reference from Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji on violence It could mean that violence isn't bad as long as it's not tyranny(strong against the weak): : jy skqw skqy kau mwry qw min rosu n hoeI ]1] rhwau ] jae sakathaa sakathae ko maarae thaa man ros n hoee ||1|| rehaao || If some powerful man strikes out against another man, then no one feels any grief in their mind. ||1||Pause|| skqw sIhu mwry pY vgY KsmY sw pursweI ] sakathaa seehu maarae pai vagai khasamai saa purasaaee || But if a powerful tiger attacks a flock of sheep and kills them, then its master must answer for it. This Shabad is by Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Raag Aasaa on Pannaa 360 The whole shabad: http://www.sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=1408

Wow, u managed to explain a very complicated topic very simply. And with new insights and everything. I really liked your view about why Dasam Granth was not added into Guru Granth sahib Ji, it has been implied before, but not so clearly articulated. Your view about the khalsa being a 'difficult responsiblitity of supporting a paradocical state of existence' seems supported by the fact that a khalsa is a saint-soldier, which is a contradiction of sorts. Also non-violence vs. violence has been debated here before. I tried looking for the thread for the past hour, but couldn't find it. It was about what are Sikhs supposed to follow when they get hit: PrIdw jo qY mwrin mukIAW iqn@w n mwry GuMim ] fareedhaa jo thai maaran mukeeaaa(n) thinhaa n maarae ghu(n)m || Fareed, do not turn around and strike those who strike you with their fists. AwpnVY Gir jweIAY pYr iqn@w dy cuMim ]7] aapanarrai ghar jaaeeai pair thinhaa dhae chu(n)m ||7|| Kiss their feet, and return to your own home. ||7|| or When all else fails, it is permitted to take the sword in to ones hand . As far as I remember, they reached the conclusion that for personal matters, the above should be the case, and for matters that have greater consequences the bottom should be. There is also history. I forget, but a girl was forcibly picked up by Mughals ( I think) and Singhs took a hukamnama at Akaal Takhat and it was Basant Ki Vaar. the singhs took the pangtis (lines) "Panjay badhe mahabali kar sacha dhooa" or "i bound the five strong ones by support of the true one" as permission to go to her rescue. Also I found another thread that states: in the modern world - where the spreading of peace & democracy through warfare seem to be the exclusive preserve of the United States and it's allies - does glorifying violent causes and wars (even if they ARE permissable from a moral and religious (Sikhi) standpoint) and in-fact approving of it's methods and ends - be something Sikhs should not be ashamed to do? Should we compromise our core beliefs and remain anonymous in order not to be tarred with the "extremist brush" OR should we say "To hell with that! I'm not distorting my faith and it's ideals because it makes a few hypocritical politicians and arm-chair pundits feel uncomfortable"? the thread link:

So if u guys do want to protest or stop this marriage ( I would advice against it) then focus on the wrongdoers: the gurudwara prabandhaks. Leave the girl and boy alone, Tell the gurudwara leaders, that if u let this marriage happen, then ..... well fill in the blanks(protests, death threats, boycotts) ....I mean that's the only thing u can do to stop 'em right?

Everyone goes around sayin things like if God is all loving why is there suffering. Or why do we get punished for going after maya when god created it. It's not like god's just waiting for u to commit a crime and then he'll jump on you and say ha that guy did wrong, punish him. It's more like God created life/universe with rules, u break them, u pay the consequences. And we have free choice. You can't have it both ways: tell the parents i don't want to follow any rules and then say why didn't u protect me? If u touch fire, u burn. If you stay in maya, u suffer. Maya is suffering, to break away from pain, got to go back to ur origins.

IMHO, you can wear additional shaastars, but remember kirpaan is kakaar.

Check out lack of awareness and educate about Sikhi on http://www.reddit.co...of_all_who_are/

I just spent the last three hours reading the whole thread Most ppl on reddit seems like atheists and one of them said after ppl kept on bringing up the airline attacks and stuff: "I actually thought this time it was going to be a genuinely good religion, well back to hating all religions" And another thing i noticed is that ppl tend to judge the religion sikhi based on individual sikhs they meet. so remember all u sikhs are representatives. But then again the thread was started with this quote: A Sikh must "defend the rights of all who are wrongfully oppressed or persecuted irrespective of religion, colour, caste or creed." (en.wikipedia.org) And since we aren't too active in that respect, well the opinion was bound to go down.

Yes profesional help is needed. to me it sound like schizoprania, especially because you wish for bad things to happen. Schizopranics have thoughts where they wish to hurt themselves or others.

I did hear that one of the granthis/prachaaraks tried to rush the gunman, but the granthi got shot in the back. And one of the suggestions at our gurudwara meeting(of course its in the US, but maybe ppl worldwide shud be taking notice and preparing) that if any person walks in with a weapon, ppl shud rush him/her, yeah a few ppl might die, but its better than the person holdin the whole gurudwara hostage. and some ppl were sayin the reason the granthi couldn't disarm the gunman because nobody followed his lead. someone shud've supported him. at the meeting i was just waiting for the conversation to detoriate to 'we need to do more parchaar' but what if the gunning had nothing to with mistaken identity? what if he was white supremist or what if ppl try to break in to steal the gholak, or desecrate the gurudwara. cause especially in the US, gurudwara's tend to be huge, and that makes them targets of hate/jeaolosy and greed. so we do need pahreydaar. guards. ............. but the hardest thing will to continue with it............... our gurudwara is tryin to register ppl with weapons and assign them on guard duty. ....but there were many warnings of only the guard should have weapons b/c otherwise sikhs might turn on themselves and accidently shoot each other in anger....THAT was the saddest thing of all Also there were 5 chaupai sahib paath and ardaas done at the gurudwara and the hukamnama was "nanak mitha laagai bhaana"

Start (& complete) a sehaj paath, do chandi di vaar de paath (for warrior spirit) Sirmran, play paath/kirtan all the time It's not only the wife...who should be doing everything...u can do the sehaj paath... Sant Sunder Singh Khalsa Bhindranwale's mom did 2 nitnems when she was pregnant: her own and her son's and until sant ji was five years old, and able to do his nitnem, his father did 2 nitnem de paath: one for himself and one for his son. So never a day passed in Sant Ji's life when his nitnem was not done Do the whole seva, simran, bani, bana, kirtan, katha, And start reading on Sikh history so ur ready to tell sakhis, bed time stories, and perfect ur punjabi.........

I agree. to avoid all the embarrasement/awkwardness involved with love/arranged marriages, I'm avoiding marriage as well. Good step! Singles 4ever!! I don't know why women are even for marriage, they get nothing out of it......

The more the better...right? But it depends, go with what your panj pyare say...if they didn't specify then it's your choice btw this is based on the 'is keski a kakaar' controversy...if u believe it is, then you have a small dastaar(called keski) tied on at all times...you treat it like a kakaar. So dastaar goes on top of keski. if u don't believe keski is a kakaar then one dastaar is fine.

Well there is that Sakhi about Guru Nanak Dev Ji going to the masjad to do nawaaz, but guru ji didn't speak along because the qazi and the nawaab were thinking of other things, and guru ji said that your prayer was not accepted at God's door. And most brahmgiani talk about how they could only do one paath of japji sahib a day because the meaning are so deep and profound they would go into samaadhi of waheguru's wowness after each pangti. so understanding is better, but its also good to be doing paath while walking,working when your concentration is somewhere else but your mind keeps doing it out of habit

The movie does not mention how the British army tried to force the Sikhs to take off the turban and wear hats. Sikhs were beaten, court martial-ed, whipped to try them to give up their turbans. Finally the army had to give up (as WWI had started) and allow them to wear the turban.

A lot of ppl have problems believing that God is kind and compassionate despite the fact that every religion says that he is. Most ppl say if God was so kind why is there suffering in this world? Well the answer to that is karma, everybody suffers because of their deeds. Then some ppl (like OP) says, "I mean none of our karma goes unpaid , right ? so he doesn't spare us , though he can if he wished to" So now ppl want Waheguru to erase our karms too. But ppl forget that not only is God kind and loving but the full of Justice. If someone committed murder, and they never got caught by the authorities, that person won't escape God's justice. So part of being kind is also being Fair and punishing those people that did bad things. Other ppl say that since we can't remember what we did wrong in our past life, we shouldn't be punished for it in this life. But would u set a murderer free, if he lost his memory? The fact that we don't remember our past life, is a kindness, it allows us to start over. If you want God to be forgiving, mankind has to be forgiving. If someone kidnapped and killed your child, you would pray and hope for vengeance your whole life, and if God were just to forgive that person, would you be glad?

we set on the floor because It's about equal humility .....it's about HUMILITY and EQUALITY

I agree 100% with samosasingh. It seems so pointless to be distinct when we're after the same things degrees, careers, money as normal, worldly ppl and stuck in maya along with them. But I think instead of changing our bana we need to change our attitude and have a more unique attitude like accept bhana, be more thankful, try to remember vaheguru as much as we can. I really respect the tapobani singhs because they take distinctness and uniqueness to another level. Their motto is everything about us our food, clothes, thinking, lifestyle, should be different than the worldly ppl. Their bibek rehit ensures this distinctness. ...

This Sakhi is not about Bhai Gurdas Ji that was wrote the vaaran and did the seva of writing Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. First of all, the Bhai Gurdas Ji that wrote vaaran was at the time of Guru Arjan Dev ji and Gur Hargobind Sahib ji. There is another Sakhi about Bhai Gurdas Ji and his vaaran. How he wrote in his vaaran that when guru ji tests a Sikh, the Sikh should not waver. The SixthGuru Ji asked him about this and questioned it, but bhai gurdas ji stood firm. Then Guru Ji sent him to Kabal to get horses and also sent along a chest full of payment for the horses. After he had chosen the horses, he went to get the payment/money/gold from the chest but it was empty. He panicked and thought that the horsetraders will think I was trying to cheat them and I will be humilated and possibly killed. So he sneaked away from the back side of the tent, went to Agra did katha for a king and was much beloved. then guru ji sent singhs to bring him back, saying he is my thief bring him with hands tied. Bhai Gurdas himself made sure his hands were tied the whole way to guru ji. Then guru ji asked him about the "sikh should not waver when guru ji tests him" pangti. Bhai Gurdas Ji changed it to "If guru ji test a Sikh, what can the poor sikh do," ANYWAY in the link it says that the Father of Bhai Kirtiya served Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib Ji who became Guru in 1664, while bhai Gurdas JI did akaal chalana in 1636. IT IS NOT THE SAME BHAI GURDAAS JI that wrote SGGS and the vaaran. Bhai Sahib's vaaran are the kunji to SGGS, how could they have been reincarnated into a bear?

It seva of shoes. You put them in a line (organize them), wipe shoes off with a cloth or tissue paper. and/or polish the shoes. Usually done at the gurudwara. Then later you are supposed to wipe your forehead with the cloth or tissue paper(could be from regular paper roll) to get the dust of the sangat's feet.

If you wait for sgpc or akaal takhat to do something, it's going to be a looooooooooong wait, why don't the canadian ppl do something? Maybe invite a journalist like we invite the dignitaries(mayors, senators, etc) and show them around. Show them hospitality and the 'good things' going on.. Contact news media....we called ABC news during the Darshan protests, and we always have cameramen filming the yuba city nagar kirtan..you can even say, "We would like a chance to show a nagar kirtan from our point of view, and why we do it and what it means."

As this thread is getting too full of arguments and personal attacks. I will take the task to bring us back on topic. There were three things raised in this topic: whether the buddhist is a brahmgiani? I think everyone agrees he is not..and the one person who did think he was (N30S1NGH Ji) has taken back the word. And I doubt any of us is a brahmgiani so we can't know. Is this suicide or shaheedi? Well that depends. Shaheed is an arabic word and Muslims even use it to suicide bombers.It is a synonym of martyr which means one who suffers for the sake of principle. Therefore the Buddhist is a shaheed and did not commit suicide. Whether the shaheedi is aligned with Gurmat, I don't know. Because I have even heard of people who say that we never used peaceful protests until the 1900s(Jaito da Morcha, Guru Ke Baag da Morcha, Nanakana Sahib da Morcha) and they were invented by the Sikhs of the time and were never used before in Sikhi. I guess each time calls for its own weapons, and the protests did have an effect on the British govt. And like Kaljugi said in another post, the West doesn't help anyone unless they're true victims, and certainly not if they fight back against the oppressor. So the Buddhist Monk was acting on the right strategy if he wants help from the West. Does the Buddhist have kamaii? yes, it takes a really long time and a lot of ghall kamaii to do so much meditation that one is able to control the mind. And this amazing monk had not just controlled his mind but also his indrians so he didn't feel any pain. Whether this kamaii counts in gurmat, i don't know. In guru nanak dev ji 's time the sidhs had gotten a lot of ridhaian sidhian from controlling their mind and sat in cold water in winter and in/near fire in the summer. But what the Buddhist Monk is Amazing like someone above said, to be able to do do much bhagti in kaljug! I get Only five's view, because we have naam simran our avatha's should have been so high, that what the Buddhist monk did should seem a paltry trick. But since we are so behind in that respect that we are awed and shocked and amazed by the monk's self control like the rest of the world.