Science N Meat

[randip singh]

I agree with Palminder to an extent!

However, don't forget that many Pirs and holy men have been born in what is today considered Pakistan (most notably Guru Nanak).

Physicak strength is to do with diet however, mostly to do with how you prepare your food.

If you steam your vegetable's and meat, they reatian more nutrients.

Also note that the Indian selection proceedure for cricketers are weighted against having too many Punjabi's in the team. If there were more Punjabi's I am sure there would be at least one fast bowler.

The REAL Sikh and unbiased perspective on meat is at http://www.sikhs.org/meat.htm.

[Harmeet Singh]

ang 1103

jee-a baDhahu so Dharam kar thaapahu aDhram kahhu kat bhaa-ee

You kill living beings, and call it a righteous action. Tell me, brother, what would you call an unrighteous action?

aapas ka-o munivar kar thaapahu kaa ka-o kahhu kasaa-ee. ||2||

tussi apne app nu wade rishi muni akhvande ho te dasso fer ksai kina to kehne ho?

although we cant understand gurbani by taking it as a prose. We need to understand it by heart. According to me kabir sahib is exposing the hypocrisy of brahmins and also saying that if killing Jiaa(beings with heart/emotions or feeling not plants) for God is righteous then what is unreighteous? So I think killing such beings for eating is not righteous

[randip singh]

ang 1103

jee-a baDhahu so Dharam kar thaapahu aDhram kahhu kat bhaa-ee

You kill living beings, and call it a righteous action. Tell me, brother, what would you call an unrighteous action?

aapas ka-o munivar kar thaapahu kaa ka-o kahhu kasaa-ee. ||2||

tussi apne app nu wade rishi muni akhvande ho te dasso fer ksai kina to kehne ho?

although we cant understand gurbani by taking it as a prose. We need to understand it by heart. According to me kabir sahib is exposing the hypocrisy of brahmins and also saying that if killing Jiaa(beings with heart/emotions or feeling not plants) for God is righteous then what is unreighteous? So I think killing  such beings for eating is not righteous

133853[/snapback]

brother....with all due respect, if you want the sikh perpective on meat then consult http://www.sikhs.org/meat.htm.

we are discussing the scientific perpective! :TH:

[Harmeet Singh]

I have been thru that article it doesn't discusses the deeper meaning. it is taking gurbani as a law code which is completly twisting the meaning.

You cannnot traslate the guru granth sahib into english and get its meaning. Understand in the language it is written in.

take for example one shabd traslated as

"What can be achieved by eating and what by dressing, so long as that True Lord abides not in the man's mind? What is fruit, what clarified butter and sweet molasses, what fine flour and what meat?

WRONG!! Guru sahib is saying what is use of fruit, butter, meat etc when God doesn't adibe in heart, the traslated version says something else.

same goes for others. the article says plants feel the pain and are same as animals that is unconceivable.

lets take an example. Everytime in gurbani it is written we eat what we sow. We eat our harvest, we eat the plant out of it... Very good analogy to explain the fact of life.

aap beej aapay hee khaavay.

Now if we eat meat is it our harvest? why is eating meat not used as analogy to something really good? Guru sahib says Having our life and what we acheive is analogous to sowing seeds and eating plants.

So eating plants is the natural traslation of law of karm for our understanding.

It really matters if we want to or not.

[randip singh]

I have been thru that article it doesn't discusses the deeper meaning. it is taking gurbani as a law code which is completly twisting the meaning.

You cannnot traslate the guru granth sahib into english and get its meaning. Understand in the language it is written in.

take for example one shabd traslated as

"What can be achieved by eating and what by dressing, so long as that True Lord abides not in the man's mind? What is fruit, what clarified butter and sweet molasses, what fine flour and what meat?

WRONG!! Guru sahib is saying what is use of fruit, butter, meat etc when God doesn't adibe in heart, the traslated version says something else.

same goes for others. the article says plants feel the pain and are same as animals that is unconceivable.

lets take an example. Everytime in gurbani it is written we eat what we sow. We eat our harvest, we eat the plant out of it... Very good analogy to explain the fact of life.

aap beej aapay hee khaavay.

Now if we eat meat is it our harvest? why is eating meat not used as analogy to something really good? Guru sahib says Having our life and what we acheive is analogous to sowing seeds and eating plants.

So eating plants is the natural traslation of law of karm for our understanding.

It really matters if we want to or not.

134037[/snapback]

Yeah right :lol: @

read some real scholars interpretation now at http://www.sikhs.org/meat.htm.

[Akaal Purakh Di Fauj]

The subject relating to the nutritional value of the non-vegetarian foods falls into a sphere of medical science. The Medical views in this respect are varied. Some doctors are of the opinion that flesh of animals has more of A-class proteins and thus their intake helps in bringing strength to the body. As contrary to it, the other medical view is that the flesh as food is unnatrual for the human body. Its consumption by humans leads to the deterioration of their gums, digestive system and blood pressure. Here are a few similar medical opinions:

1.) "Meat is an unnatural food. Its consumption leads to a number of diseases e.g. fistula, tb etc. At the moment meat-eating is known to be the cause of 99% of the diseases of the world." Dr Joseph Old Field

2.)"Meat eating leads to headache, constipation, heart lesion, loss of vitality and a number of other disorders." Dr W.H.L Chen

3.) A Fistula specialist Dr. Well writes in his book that every year about 255 million peole in the whole world die of fistula. Their number in england and wales is as much as 30,000. And the major reason behind this is their habit of flesh eating

However, medical opinions keep changing everyday. In practice we can see that neither all the flesh eater are fit and healthy nor all the vegetarians are unhealthy. The truth is that flesh eaters may look more fleshy and plump but the non flesh eaters have been observed to possess greater strength of body and mind to encounter adversities.

To some extent it is essential to accept and adopt the medical advise for the maintenance of the health of the body. However, only this earthen vessel is not the body. The real body is a component of five material elements with the divine soul dwelling in it. And this soul is the top most important part of the body. Without it the body cannot exist. Whereas it is essential to maintain health and strength of the outward body, it is simultaneously the basic responsibility of man to maintain strength of his soul. Thus only that type of food deserves to be classed as nutritional which strengthens body and mind or soul both.

The research and knowledge of the medical science is limited to the earthen body only. They have no knowledge of the soul. Thus their recommendations pertain only to outward material part of the body. To get the flesh food the killing of animated beings is inherent. This barbarous action results in depriving the mind of its divine and noble qualities and hence it becomes weak and timid. The body with a timid mind is worthless in spite of its robust physical nature.

[Harmeet Singh]

randip veerji

I have been talking about that article, it is biased and absolutly misleading. Gurbani has deeper meanings and it doesn't needs scholars for explanation.

Please read recent reasearchs on how eating flesh gives gums and teeth a bad shape.

I know vegan people can become deficient in iron and Vit b12 but if they drink milk and green vegetables it would be all fine...

[randip singh]

randip veerji

I have been talking about that article, it is biased and absolutly misleading. Gurbani has deeper meanings and it doesn't needs scholars for explanation.

Please read recent reasearchs on how eating flesh gives gums and teeth a bad shape.

I know vegan people can become deficient in iron and Vit b12 but if they drink milk and green vegetables it would be all fine...

134197[/snapback]

However, what is wrong with a Vegan diet Brother?

A lot of vegetarians frown on a vegeatarian diet, and vegans frown on vegetarian diet saying taking milk from a cows udder is cruel! Both frown on meat eaters, and meat eaters frown on them.

I will end this by saying I am neother for nor against eating vegetables only. I am neither for nor against eating meat.

Do what is good for your mind and body and what your conscience tells YOU is OK! To try and impose a ceatain diet on someone is pure egotism and munmookee!

We could argue and counter argue what Bani says on this issue, and we will come to no conclusion, because Bani is not an a-la-carte menu.

For me, I do not hold any food as particularly in reverence, but I must say My taste buds love the taste of "Chittay Channay/Chollay". My favourite dish! I also love sweetcorn saabjee, and Peas with potatoes and button mushrooms. Occaisionally I eat meat. For me, my Guru tells me that is OK. For you, it may not be.

Lets leave it at that!

[Raju]

Eating both vegan and meat diet has its plusses and minuses. One can't solely be a non-vegetarian. Even Lion, and tigers eat just once in a week and inbetween they nibble on grass, natural herbs etc to help in digestion even though they are naturally blessed with strong gastric acids.

When we consume a vegetarian diet, we should remember to cook in the right medium. The most important is the medium of cooking like cooking oil, which should be changed every once in a while, like one must always use a veriety of oils like

Corn Oil

Olive Oil

Groundnut Oil

Mustard Oil

Safflower Oil

Sesame Oil

and not just stick with cooking with refined Sunflower Oil most of the time just because it is widely available as many people are wont to do. Mustard Oil, Groundnut Oil and Olive Oil have Omega-3 acids that have very high rate of what is known as 'Good cholestrol' which many a times vegetarians do not get in normal cooking. That is the reason you hear 'vegetarians' die of heart attacks and strokes etc.

If you eat a non-vegetarian diet then the meat itself has natural oils to a certain extent that are beneficial.

[Raju]

Someone asked the question of 'fast bowlers' and 'natural athletes' and connected it to non-vegetarian diet.

Well IMO there was a study conducted on African-americans in sports a few eons ago to understand why they excelled in athletics. Study found out that there is something important for performing in athletics called 'Fast-twitch muscle' which connects a ligament to the bone and seemingly more african-americans in athletics have that 'fast-twitch muscle' than any other race.

So also in 'fast bowling' requires a 'Fast-twitch musle' in your arms and wrist that can generate more pace when you are in your run up and about to deliver the ball. And all the fastest bowlers in the world have been blessed with that muscle.

Now there is probably something in a non-vegetarian diet and the natural oil that are derived from animals that helps in developing that 'fast-twitch muscle' in your youth, though to be on safe side no study has yet conclusively proved that. Non-vegetarians also have a higher-metabolism rate and narrower intestinal walls with presence of stronger acids to digest meats.